[Archived] Right Wing..

[Bobby G]

Cant believe SWP will be 27...Thought he is still 24-25.

Milner is nowhere worth near that amount and I personally dont rate him as anything more than a solid, and inconsistent player. Way over-rated.

[kieran84]

Cant believe SWP will be 27...Thought he is still 24-25.

Milner is nowhere worth near that amount and I personally dont rate him as anything more than a solid, and inconsistent player. Way over-rated.

Its not about what they are really worth anymore its about what the selling club wants and who is willing to pay it,But i think he is a young player who will grow into a 10 million pound player.

[Veevs]

Cant believe SWP will be 27...Thought he is still 24-25.

Milner is nowhere worth near that amount and I personally dont rate him as anything more than a solid, and inconsistent player. Way over-rated.

SWP (26 soon 27) is one of those nearly men like Pennant (25).. been around quite a few years and always seem to be close to becoming good players but never quite getting there.

Milner has the chance to get there as he is still young.. hence his value.. I would rather pay 9m for Milner (for potential) or Joaquin (who has made it) than 6-9m for someone who never really quite made it.

Pennant cost 6.7m only a few years ago (I dont think given his limited matches he would of got to the full 8m) there was also a 25% sell on clause involved then so Birmingham only rated him at 5-6m tops, so even then we will be paying what he has been worth for the last 3 years.

Allot of people keep quoting Joaquins lack of form.. he is a traditional winger who has been stuck playing in an attacking midfield role (much more central) so he has not exactly had the chance to do what he does best which is hug the byline, skin the fullback and whip in cross after cross... also he has been one of the top three players (top according to some Valencia polls by their fans) in a Valencia side that has suffered badly due to morale.

Sure he may not succeed in the EPL, but then again SWP/Pennant/Lennon have not exactly played a massive number of games and always seem to be close but not close enough to becoming great (Sure we see match highlights and they have their moments of skill, but in a full 90mins?) in the last few years.. Blimey Rafa i searching for a right winger, and playing a team with limited width because he really does not rate Pennant that highly.

[Sparky Marky]

SWP (26 soon 27) is one of those nearly men like Pennant (25).. been around quite a few years and always seem to be close to becoming good players but never quite getting there.

You don't think that playing for Chelsea and Liverpool amounts to being a good player. ...I say that to even get to play for them clubs they have "got there"(Pennant had a great game in the Champions League Final against Milan)......Both of these would be great signings for rovers...especially SWP.....

In reality SWP wouldn't consider rovers as we're not big enough....I'd say he'll end up at City/Everton....Pennant maybe would.

[Cally]

You have hit the nail on the head there. So who is coming in with this offer at over £3.5m?

Clubs have had all summer to come in and get him, yet nobody has. He is worth what interested clubs will pay and you will accept. Rafa wants Riera and needs to sell to buy. We aren't going to pay over the top just to help you out, we obviously value him at less than your willing to accept yet. So he sits on the bench waiting for a game until January or next Summer, a great use of an asset.

We could probably sell him to Stoke (and others) tommorrow for 6/7 million quid, but obviously if the player doesn't want to go there then there's nothing we can do.

He'll just have to sit out in the reserves. His, and any other interested parties, loss.

[modes98]

We could probably sell him to Stoke (and others) tommorrow for 6/7 million quid, but obviously if the player doesn't want to go there then there's nothing we can do.

So you can't sell him for that amount then can you? I'm sure you could get plenty of championship clubs willing to pay higher prices to get premiership quality players but they won't go.

The situation is that he doesn't want to leave you, I would guess because of the money. No European clubs are interested so you either take an offer from us for less than you want or keep him.

[rover6]

SWP (26 soon 27) is one of those nearly men like Pennant (25).. been around quite a few years and always seem to be close to becoming good players but never quite getting there.

Ignorant crap.

Do you realise how good SWP was at Man City? The guy was a one man team. He's goal record for City, I'm pretty sure, is as good as the revered goalscoring heroics of Gamst. This was achieved playing for not the best side under not the best manager. Do you remember his twenty-five yard left foot thunderbolt against Villa which left Sorensen frozen in disbelief? Do you remember his first goal for England - an exciting run and finish.

To say that SWP never "made it" is stupid. That's like saying that Chris Sutton and Damien Duff never made it because they failed at Chelsea. That's the stupid ignorant, arrogant attitude I'd expect from a big club myopic supporter. Sutton, SWP and Duff all, for whatever reason, didn't hit the heights at Chelsea. I think Duff did better than the other two. Whilst, I agree that SWP's career has stagnated and one cannot be certain if he can emulate his City form, I believe that a move to smaller club with less pressure and more starts would revitilise the man.

Milner has the chance to get there as he is still young.. hence his value.. I would rather pay 9m for Milner (for potential) or Joaquin (who has made it) than 6-9m for someone who never really quite made it.

I think Milner has also stagnated at Newcastle Circus. He's probably lucky he hasn't quite capitulated like Darren Ambrose. However, he is a very good player and would be well worth signing if he wants to come.

As for the people who don't rate Pennant, Lennon and SWP. I dread to think what you think of Gamst. Why aren't you calling for the immediate sale of our pedestrian, boy band escapee?

[Sparky Marky]

Totally Agree...

[joey_big_nose]

Interesting how the whole Lennon-SWP-Pennant debate. All have pace, all have problems with their crossing! Personally I would go for Pennant, for me he has the most all round class, he is a worker, he can cut in and go outside, great technique, likes to run at players.

Lennon for me is very one dimensional, plays quite narrow, almost like an inside right. Spurs will want a fortune for him, and although he is decent he really really lacks imagination, essentially looks to run people down.

SWP on the other hand lacks the physical side of Pennant as far as I can see, although he does have a bit more imagination and guile. Not technically as good as the Liverpool player, and again - due to playing further up the pitch - does not do the business in midfield in terms of tracking back and getting stuck in.

I would take Joaquin over any of them but for me if we do go English Pennant is the best option. We would need to work on his attitude, work rate and crossing but he can be a great player imo if give the games to flourish. Just a shame he is such a tool.

[Veevs]

Ignorant crap.

Do you realise how good SWP was at Man City? The guy was a one man team. He's goal record for City, I'm pretty sure, is as good as the revered goalscoring heroics of Gamst. This was achieved playing for not the best side under not the best manager. Do you remember his twenty-five yard left foot thunderbolt against Villa which left Sorensen frozen in disbelief? Do you remember his first goal for England - an exciting run and finish.

To say that SWP never "made it" is stupid. That's like saying that Chris Sutton and Damien Duff never made it because they failed at Chelsea. That's the stupid ignorant, arrogant attitude I'd expect from a big club myopic supporter. Sutton, SWP and Duff all, for whatever reason, didn't hit the heights at Chelsea. I think Duff did better than the other two. Whilst, I agree that SWP's career has stagnated and one cannot be certain if he can emulate his City form, I believe that a move to smaller club with less pressure and more starts would revitilise the man.

I think Milner has also stagnated at Newcastle Circus. He's probably lucky he hasn't quite capitulated like Darren Ambrose. However, he is a very good player and would be well worth signing if he wants to come.

As for the people who don't rate Pennant, Lennon and SWP. I dread to think what you think of Gamst. Why aren't you calling for the immediate sale of our pedestrian, boy band escapee?

Thanks for your comments "Ignorant crap" and "That's the stupid ignorant, arrogant attitude I'd expect from a big club myopic supporter".. much appreciated, I guess no one is allowed their own opinions.. I never rated him as a top class player thats just my opinion.

Could you explain to me what happened to Duff, sutton (that happens to be the tip of an icebergs worth of players) et al after they left Chelsea? Did they rediscover lost form?

Fact is SWP has played 81 games in 3 seasons.. scoring 4 goals.. dropped out of the national side and is now almost 27 years old and has only really had 2 good seasons in his 9 year career

At man city, ok he did very well, 153 games and 23 goals in 6 seasons (1 goal in every 6.7 games or 4 goals a season).. and he may regain that form at some point.. but what I am trying to say is Value wise is he worth 9-10m considering his acheivements in the last 3 seasons (national and club). Sure I remember his great moments.. I also remember his poor games for England/Chelsea/ManC as well...

As for Pennant.. his fans don't rate him, his crossing is poor, his workrate is poor and his goals to games ratio is awful... if you can point out when he proved himself bar naming single games (lots of players have wonder games that they never seem to be able to repeat) and the fact he signed for Liverpool.. thats like saying just because he signed for a big club he must be good (quite a few utterly awful players have signed for Liverpool in recent years).. he had one decent season for birmingham and they didnt rate him higher than a 5-6m valuation, so why should we spend that on a player who can't replicate that form that often. The simple fact is Pennant has had 1 1/2 good (but not brilliant) seasons in his 5 year career..

I just think that these players are overrated.. this is my opinion and based on fact rather than ignorance... still I am not argueing that they would not make better right wingers than Emerton, I just feel they are too costly for what they offer.

Both of these players where bought for their potential and none of them have followed through on that potential in the last 2-3 seasons, sure they are exciting to watch and a couple of their matches will make end of season highlights on BBC/Sky sports.. but do they do that kind of thing consistently?

As for Gamst, I like the lad... and if you look at the stastics.. the little muppet may be pedestrian and not exciting.. but..

2007/2008 - 46 games, 6 goals

2006/2007 - 49 games, 8 goals

Overall 32 goals in 164 games.. or 1 in 5.25 games (allot better than SWP and Pennant)..

he also is pretty decent at defensive duties.. something that you would never see from Pennant, Lennon or SWP

[The Harwood Yankee]

SSN are reporting that James Milner has handed in a transfer request at Newcastle - Milner wants out

Got to be worth an offer at least with less than a week of the transfer window left, they won't want to keep a wantaway player like that and we still havent replaced Bentley. Come on Ince - here's your chance to make one decent signing!

[LeChuck]

As for Pennant.. his fans don't rate him, his crossing is poor, his workrate is poor

If you're going to try and defend yourself, at least get your facts right. Most Liverpool fans think Pennant is okay, but they're looking for someone who can get them to challenge for the title. His crossing isn't poor, that's Lennon you're thinking of. Fair enough, it's not in Bentley's league, but then few in the Premiership are.

And finally...his work rate is one of his strengths, he does work bloody hard. It's one of the main reasons I think he's the best option for us at present.

His main drawback is that he's a bit of a tool. I don't think he's caused in trouble whilst he's been at Liverpool though, all the incidents involving him seem to be from his younger days, so maybe he's sorted himself out.

[J*B]

If Bentleys worth 17m, or whatever we got, I'd say Pennant is worth 5.5.

Lets sign the guy up sharpish, we have the money, we need a right midfielder, liverpool dont need him, stop pussyfooting around.

[BRFC1995]

QUOTE (J*B @ Aug 27 2008, 17:06 ) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

If Bentleys worth 17m, or whatever we got, I'd say Pennant is worth 5.5.

Lets sign the guy up sharpish, we have the money, we need a right midfielder, liverpool dont need him, stop pussyfooting around.

liverpool payed around 6.5m and there is no way in hell he's done anything for his value to go up, rather in hindsight liverpool payed massively over the odds simply because the guys english. 3.5m tops is the guys worth. its not a fair comparison with bentley as bentleys so, so much better.

[Mozzer]

liverpool payed around 6.5m and there is no way in hell he's done anything for his value to go up, rather in hindsight liverpool payed massively over the odds simply because the guys english. 3.5m tops is the guys worth. its not a fair comparison with bentley as bentleys so, so much better.

jermaine pennant is worth more then 3.5million..hes better then what some people think-he has pace, a decent cross on him and can take players on-hes played in champions league, and im sure if we signed him he would probably get in the england squad-for me all he needs is games..

i think 5.5million is worth it to be honest..

[modes98]

hes better then what some people think-he has pace, a decent cross on him and can take players on

hes played in champions league,

and im sure if we signed him he would probably get in the england squad-for me all he needs is games..

He doesn't have raw pace, he has a spurt. Which is ok but nothing ahead of most players in the league. His crossing is awful, worse accuracy in the league when he had his full season in the PL with Birmingham.

Playing in the CL is no reason to sign a player. A lot of very average players have played in the CL (Phil Neville, Bruno Cheyrou).

I doubt he would get in the England team ahead of Bentley and Beckham! Not to mention Lennon and SWP, who are on the same level as him, in fact both have played more than he has this season.

[Mozzer]

clearly a right winger is needed-joaquin i would love, but is he going come-would we even pay over 10million for player??

realistically modes-who would you like to see us buy??

[joey_big_nose]

He doesn't have raw pace, he has a spurt. Which is ok but nothing ahead of most players in the league. His crossing is awful, worse accuracy in the league when he had his full season in the PL with Birmingham.

Playing in the CL is no reason to sign a player. A lot of very average players have played in the CL (Phil Neville, Bruno Cheyrou).

I doubt he would get in the England team ahead of Bentley and Beckham! Not to mention Lennon and SWP, who are on the same level as him, in fact both have played more than he has this season.

I'm not sure I agree with that. He does have pace - not Lennon or Bellamy pace but much faster than anyone in our squad. I agree his crossing is weak. He was Liverpools best player in 2007 CL final. In the last five games or so last season he got a run in the side due to injuries and looked excellent, especially against Birmingham.

[Kai]

Very bored today and just for a bit of fun. I must stress that this is purely my own opinion, but feel free to criticise:

James Milner

Still young and is technically a better player than Lennon. He can play on both flanks which is a plus (although some might say he's equally bad with either foot). The slowest of all in terms of pace. However, he has a terrific attitude to the game and works very hard which makes up for a lot in my opinion. He too is quite expensive at £9m but he has some potential to get better.

Aaron Lennon

Can't cross. Can't shoot. However, Lennon is still young and might be able to improve on this somehow, but it's unlikely. Gives us extreme pace, but little else. However at just 21 he will probably present the least risk of all potential mentioned signings here in terms of being able to recoup money if he flops. His price is average and he's not on mega wages unlike the others. He's also originally from up North (Leeds) so would probably not mind moving back.

Joaquín

A terrific player and is very different to all other wingers. He can play up front if need be. However his age goes against him, but in theory should be at or near his peak. However he's had absolutely no form for two years now. Was dropped from the Spanish team due to loss of form and question marks about his attitude (likes partying). Unproven in the Premiership and a very expensive package overall, again unlikely to recoup much if he flops. In the worst case scenario, it would backfire spectacularly if Jaoquin doesn't adapt and play as well as everyone knows he can. However, if he does recover his form it would pay off very handsomely.

Jermaine Pennant

Showed good promise as a youngster and he's not exactly old at 25. Pennant probably represents the best compromise in terms of all-round package. However, his attitude is very poor and well publicised. It is also unknown if he has the desire to improve himself anymore as he has it easy where he is right now. In my opinion he's also slightly over valued. Again, rotation policy has hampered his game a lot.

Shaun Wright-Phillips

Can't cross, and an expensive package overall. At 27 years old, it's unlikely we'd be able to recoup much money if he flops. He was a good player 3/4 years ago and is proven to be able to play at this level. The bench has not been kind to him at Chelsea.

Again, in my opinion, and looking at the ratings I've given myself, it's hard to see who we should go for, they all have their drawbacks. I personally think that Joaquín is out of our reach, especially in financial terms. It would also go against everything that we've done for the last few years in terms of our prudence in the transfer market. Unless we can somehow persuade Valencia to sell for around £7m, it's not going to happen. This is never mind the fact that it's an extremely risky signing. Don't get me wrong, I'd absolutely love it if he came in, but if he flopped, it'd be an absolute disaster. (Think Grabbi, Peacock, Ashley Ward and Nathan Blake all coupled together and playing again for us!)

This also makes me think that if we are even looking at Joaquín, then we'd probably consider Shaun Wright-Phillips (SWP) first anyway. He'd cost around the same, but would present less risk as we already know that he's capable enough to play in the Premiership.

So that leaves us with 3...

Aaron Lennon has literally gone backwards since his surprise England call up in 2006. Some say that our team is crying out for pace, but I disagree. Lennon would obviously give us that pace - he'd easily be the fastest guy in our team.. but what about everyone else? I mean who's going to be up there with him when he's tearing up the pitch? Technically he's very poor which would most likely mean that counter attacks would break down more often than not. However, Lennon has age on his side and possibly he might be able to improve his technique/skills. He's also probably the cheapest (rumoured) of all wingers I've listed.

Jermaine Pennant, I have serious reservations about his attitude and all the noises coming out of Anfield are that he doesn't fancy it. The problem is that we don't know just yet what Ince's man management skills are like. If Hughes was still in charge, I think I'd be more inclined to go for Pennant.

That leaves me with the player I would most like us to get: James Milner. I like his attitude and work rate. Technically sound too. He's young and has the potential to get better. He's also not on crazy money like most of the others, but he is looking for improved terms. He can play on both wings and he's just slapped in a transfer request today so he's definetely moving. Unfortunately his price is a little on the high side and going up against Villa for him won't help our cause. Yes he is not the fastest player in the world, but neither was Bentley and that didn't hamper us that much really.

Feel free to agree/disagree.

[joey_big_nose]

Just a note:

This is what 1864 said in the Grimsby match thread:

"Rovers are also in talks with a fellow Premiership outift for a right sided player and would you beleive it representatives of a player with the initials JP were sat just behind me in the JW Stand."

Plus it looks like Joaquin is being pursued by Madrid making that a vastly unlikely option for us. I think we will be seeing Pennant as a Rover as he is the only genuine right wing target who still seems to be live. Only other go-er is Ireland but he just seems to be too much of a narrow wide man to be of real use to us.

Pennant will give us something different.

Oh as for his "I don't want to come to Rovers, I want to stay at liverpool" - sounds awful familiar to one of our best players - Stephen Warnock.

[LeChuck]

Wouldn't it be great if we could get Pennant to take Bentley's place in the England squad.

[OJRovers]

I think realistically if any one of those players LENNON/SWP/JOAQUIN/PENNANT/MILNER were to come to Rovers then we should be very happy.

Hopefully the club are going after this sort of player, but getting them to join is going to be difficult with other clubs in the market too. They are big name players and we wouldn't be as attractive as other Prem clubs (villa,city,newcastle etc) thats just the reality of it.

[Veevs]

If you're going to try and defend yourself, at least get your facts right. Most Liverpool fans think Pennant is okay, but they're looking for someone who can get them to challenge for the title. His crossing isn't poor, that's Lennon you're thinking of. Fair enough, it's not in Bentley's league, but then few in the Premiership are.

And finally...his work rate is one of his strengths, he does work bloody hard. It's one of the main reasons I think he's the best option for us at present.

His main drawback is that he's a bit of a tool. I don't think he's caused in trouble whilst he's been at Liverpool though, all the incidents involving him seem to be from his younger days, so maybe he's sorted himself out.

I was prepared to eat humble pie here but had to check..

I had a chat to my liverpool mates in regards to what you said here because I based my opinion on the few times I had seen him play (match reviews, my mates and highlights from last season).. their opinion is that his biggest flaw is inconsistency.. when he is in a good mood he can cross and works hard.. when he isnt in a good more he is all over the place.

Overall they rate him as average.. a good all rounder (no lightening pace but not slow, ok at crossing, good work rate when he is up for it)

Sadly my opinion of him is clouded by chatting to my pals.. typical footy fans moaned about him quite allot last season while he was poor but never mentioned him when he did well as you said Pool like players who can win the championship for them and they dont feel he is good enough to fit into that bracket.... But I still have reservations especially at the sort of prices mentioned (SWP 9m, Zabelta 6.5m, Joaquin 9m.. Pennant 5.5m), plus lets remember he is a Liverpool fan if he can't be motivated to play well for the club he supports will he be able to for one he does not support?

[philo]

we need a new right winger or we will score no goals and i'll be angry

[J*B]

we need a new right winger or we will score no goals and i'll be angry

If philo's gonna get angry, Ince better pull his finger out!