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1 hour ago, ben_the_beast said:

It's been pretty much the same injury to his back the majority of his time out though hasn't it? Not promising to get a back injury so early in your career but a little harsh to write him off.

If you get a chronic disc problem certain occupations aren't for you. I would have thought playing pro football was one of them. I did my back at work in my early thirties. We used to play 5 a side for an hour once a week after I'd get " better " and after about 45 minutes I was seizing up.

I hope I'm wrong because the lad looked to have a good future.

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4 hours ago, ben_the_beast said:

It's been pretty much the same injury to his back the majority of his time out though hasn't it? Not promising to get a back injury so early in your career but a little harsh to write him off.

It would be harsh if I was telling him.

I'm not writing him off per se, anyway, I'm just not holding out a great deal of hope he will be able to beat his injury issues. He looks an exciting player, I'm just not going to expect anything as that looks very likely to lead to disappointment. I think he has had something else minor in between (but you will after a long layoff, see Dack), but the fact it's mostly been his back makes it less likely, not more, that he will move past it. Very troublesome area like Tyrone says. Best of luck to him though and it will be great if I'm wrong.

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On 24/11/2020 at 11:13, RV Blue said:

Yes I thought the same. Wonder what the reason or for the change is. Wasted as a left back? Not athletic enough? Two left backs in the same squad and you can’t leave either out the 11?

He's playing central for the 23's as Lewis Thompson starts ahead of him in the left-back role

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1 hour ago, bluebruce said:

It would be harsh if I was telling him.

I'm not writing him off per se, anyway, I'm just not holding out a great deal of hope he will be able to beat his injury issues. He looks an exciting player, I'm just not going to expect anything as that looks very likely to lead to disappointment. I think he has had something else minor in between (but you will after a long layoff, see Dack), but the fact it's mostly been his back makes it less likely, not more, that he will move past it. Very troublesome area like Tyrone says. Best of luck to him though and it will be great if I'm wrong.

I know a bit about disc problems having had one for the last 40 years. As my Osteopath said at the time.  " You could have a friend for life ", Well he was right.

I'd play 60 minutes on a Wednesday night in the Gym. I'd go home after the game and I had my own tractioning device that consisting of a board with a harness  that I put on the stairs. I'd hang off the board for about 1/2 hr using the weight of my lower body. Next day I'd be really stiff, getting shoes and socks on was a struggle, Friday was a bit better. By Monday I'd be Ok, ready to do it all again on Wednesday.

You really need your back to be in perfect condition to play football. The guy who looked after me had been consulted by Alan Gilliver when he was at Rovers and he told me Gilliver had a disc fusion. Not as much pain but a real loss of flexibility. That was 50 years ago now but I'm not sure things have improved that much with backs over the years.

I do remember going to our local Infirmary for treatment. The physio at the time was also the physio for Wigan Rugby League club. I sat down and looked around the waiting room and who should be opposite me but Ellery Hanley, the Wigan and GB captain. He'd come for treatment on his back also. Believe it believe it not but this was on the Thursday before he was due to play in the Challenge Cup Final at Wembley the Saturday !

I thought, " He's no chance of playing ".

Of course he turned out on the Saturday and had a brilliant game as usual.

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Got a feeling this is going to be a bigger point than many 3 points will be this season. 

Belief must be surging around Ewood after that display.

So much got validated- the strength and depth of the squad and the sheer resilience of every player in it. All the subs were outstanding including the much maligned Bell and Buckley. Delighted for Davenport.

Gallagher was outstanding throughout and how many positions did Elliott play throughout the game?

Brentford's level dropped appreciably when their subs came on which suggests they are not going to have the resilience to come through this most demanding of seasons.

Really sad for Scott Wharton. He rightly got the start but Ayala's performance was really solid in replacing him.

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1 hour ago, philipl said:

Got a feeling this is going to be a bigger point than many 3 points will be this season. 

Belief must be surging around Ewood after that display.

So much got validated- the strength and depth of the squad and the sheer resilience of every player in it. All the subs were outstanding including the much maligned Bell and Buckley. Delighted for Davenport.

Gallagher was outstanding throughout and how many positions did Elliott play throughout the game?

Brentford's level dropped appreciably when their subs came on which suggests they are not going to have the resilience to come through this most demanding of seasons.

Really sad for Scott Wharton. He rightly got the start but Ayala's performance was really solid in replacing him.

Wrong thread I think Phillip.

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3 hours ago, philipl said:

Got a feeling this is going to be a bigger point than many 3 points will be this season. 

Belief must be surging around Ewood after that display.

So much got validated- the strength and depth of the squad and the sheer resilience of every player in it. All the subs were outstanding including the much maligned Bell and Buckley. Delighted for Davenport.

Gallagher was outstanding throughout and how many positions did Elliott play throughout the game?

Brentford's level dropped appreciably when their subs came on which suggests they are not going to have the resilience to come through this most demanding of seasons.

Really sad for Scott Wharton. He rightly got the start but Ayala's performance was really solid in replacing him.

Wrong thread Phil but Buckley was terrible. Not his fault, not where he plays and he has none of the attributes for the role, but in no way was he outstanding.

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6 hours ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

Wrong thread I think Phillip.

Thanks.

Don't know how that happened.

But I will support Buckley.

He was run round for their second (so were others) bit otherwise made several ball winning interceptions and all round contribution was good.

The fact he made me feel nervous seeing him at RB doesn't mean he was poor there.

 

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13 hours ago, philipl said:

Thanks.

Don't know how that happened.

But I will support Buckley.

He was run round for their second (so were others) bit otherwise made several ball winning interceptions and all round contribution was good.

The fact he made me feel nervous seeing him at RB doesn't mean he was poor there.

 

He made himself feel nervous at RB. You could tell from his body language. He was poor there. He tried but he was very rocky indeed. Even several misplaced passes, which isn't really like him usually. I try to avoid saying this kind of thing normally, but if you think he was outstanding as anything other than a very generous kindness on account of him being out of position, I don't know what game you were watching. Or at the very least you weren't paying him much attention (I'm guilty of this sometimes with some players, as I focus more on the way we are working as a team, but I was specifically watching out for what Buckley did because it had me very worried that he was even tried there). But, opinions, I guess.

The stats say he made one interception and one tackle. Not 'several ball winning interceptions'. His pass completion rate was only 50%, which is terrible considering how tidy he normally is. May he never play there again as far as I'm concerned. Hell for me the jury is out on how good he is in his actual position, but I've seen enough to think he can develop into a fine technical player there. But almost nothing about his game suits him to being a fullback, and it showed.

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He made two tackles in rapid succession on the near touchline- won it, passed, receiving player lost it, won it back again. Plus at least one other tackle and some serious shepherding. I spotted the howling on here when he came on as right back so watched him closely.

For their 2nd goal, Buckley, Armstrong and Rothwell were all beaten.

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Whether Pike's ready or not he may well get his chance soon. I would expect him to be at least on the bench on Wednesday and if Lenihan's ban is not overturned he might have to play if Nyambe is needed at centre back. As long as he doesn't tell anyone his name he should be OK.

Whatever you feel about Buckley (and there seem to be some wildly differing opinions), I can't see any justification for being really hard on him for yesterday. Surely no one believes he's the ideal right back and I'm sure he won't have asked to play there but been told.

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To be fair, I am not sure that anyone has been "really hard" on Buckley, indeed there has been a common and consistent understanding that he was played in an alien position that didnt suit him and in which he struggled in. The question was more as to whether he amidst undoubtedly minimal choices was the most natural player to be put at right back.

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4 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

Who else come you have played there yesterday?.

Once Lenihan went off, my assumption was that Bell was going to come on and slot in, although with Douglas going off soon after it would have needed a further change anyway. Probably someone with more defensive nous and experience, maybe Trybull.

Buckley seemed a particularly weak option and obviously was really poor for the second goal.

I certainly would prefer not to see Buckley at RB again, to be honest I suspect that Mowbray thinks likewise ie that we always have a senior option available.

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3 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Once Lenihan went off, my assumption was that Bell was going to come on and slot in, although with Douglas going off soon after it would have needed a further change anyway. Probably someone with more defensive nous and experience, maybe Trybull.

Buckley seemed a particularly weak option and obviously was really poor for the second goal.

I certainly would prefer not to see Buckley at RB again, to be honest I suspect that Mowbray thinks likewise ie that we always have a senior option available.

Bell at right back? 

Wasnt Douglas on a yellow so taking him off was right call. 

Buckley was probably the best option from the options we had available. I can see Dan Pike being on bench if not starting on Wednesday night

But has Trybull ever play there? 

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39 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

Who else come you have played there yesterday?.

Simon Garner on Radio Lancashire thought that Trybull should have gone to RB. But I do believe that Buckley has played in that position before. He is definitely not a RB.

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Buckley at right back was dreadful yesterday, he desperately needs a loan in January he is not even close to being ready to play at this level.

So many times they got past him like he wasn't there including for the second goal where his defensive effort was pitiful. Thankfully Frank took pity on him and took off Canos and Henry and focused on attacking down the other flank which allowed us back into the game.

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21 minutes ago, Ewood Ace said:

Buckley at right back was dreadful yesterday, he desperately needs a loan in January he is not even close to being ready to play at this level.

So many times they got past him like he wasn't there including for the second goal where his defensive effort was pitiful. Thankfully Frank took pity on him and took off Canos and Henry and focused on attacking down the other flank which allowed us back into the game.

Bit harsh , Buckley isn't a RB and only play's there in training to make up the numbers, plus only option left in game. Seeing how BB ,JR, SJ  and others are now first team level , I hope Buckley & co will soon come of age . patience

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8 minutes ago, slowmo said:

Bit harsh , Buckley isn't a RB and only play's there in training to make up the numbers, plus only option left in game. Seeing how BB ,JR, SJ  and others are now first team level , I hope Buckley & co will soon come of age . patience

He'll be playing in the lower leagues if not non league in a few years. There are a lot of players like him down at that level good on the ball but unable to handle the physicality of the game and ends up getting bullied. Yesterday the Brentford lads down the left were going past him like he wasn't there.

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1 minute ago, Ewood Ace said:

He'll be playing in the lower leagues if not non league in a few years. There are a lot of players like him down at that level good on the ball but unable to handle the physicality of the game and ends up getting bullied. Yesterday the Brentford lads down the left were going past him like he wasn't there.

Game of opinions, but I would be absolutely amazed if it turns out like that. Genuinely shocked. 

I can't agree that he's nowhere near ready either. He's only doing it in flashes at the moment, but when he gets it right he can already see passes which nobody else in the side can, perhaps Holtby at an absolute push. Even yesterday he showed some lovely touches with the ball at his feet.

He's a bit lightweight and inconsistent, I'll grant you. Patience with this lad will be rewarded by the bucketload. 

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10 minutes ago, Ewood Ace said:

He'll be playing in the lower leagues if not non league in a few years. There are a lot of players like him down at that level good on the ball but unable to handle the physicality of the game and ends up getting bullied. Yesterday the Brentford lads down the left were going past him like he wasn't there.

I predict you will be wrong about Buckley.Only a few months ago Brereton was destined for a career in the lower leagues according to you.

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No point judging buckley on his performance at right back. He gave it a go that's all you can ask he obviously has no future there.

I must say I was surprised when he came on and even with knowing it all worked out okayish in the end I'd have gone for Trybull. He is smooth in possession and is a much better defender than buckley as a midfielder so I'd have just moved him back there. 

Tbf to Mowbray he came out and explained his rationale. That in training 10 v10 games buckley slots in at right back a lot as he we have so many midfielders. So the logic is he knows the angles better, fair enough? Think downing might have worked better though, intelligent player and their left winger was coming inside onto downings stronger foot

I would rather give Pike a go on Wednesday over carter should it come to it. I'd rather carry a right back who isnt upto standard yet than a centre half.

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29 minutes ago, islander200 said:

I predict you will be wrong about Buckley.Only a few months ago Brereton was destined for a career in the lower leagues according to you.

I still think that is where he will end up. He's had a few decent performances this season but nothing outstanding and like with the team as a hole his best performances have come against 10 men.

 

34 minutes ago, Admiral Nelsen said:

Game of opinions, but I would be absolutely amazed if it turns out like that. Genuinely shocked. 

I can't agree that he's nowhere near ready either. He's only doing it in flashes at the moment, but when he gets it right he can already see passes which nobody else in the side can, perhaps Holtby at an absolute push. Even yesterday he showed some lovely touches with the ball at his feet.

He's a bit lightweight and inconsistent, I'll grant you. Patience with this lad will be rewarded by the bucketload. 

Technically there is no doubting him but physically he is just not cut out for this level of football. If he was 17-18 then I would say fair enough he's only young and growing but he's already 21 and he had the same problem ever since he got into the first team which is that he is too lightweight.

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