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And now time for the bi-annual stuff that we can't afford to change manager and coaching staff, shouldn't question how the club is run, should be grateful for Venkys or that surviving in the Championship is an accomplishment, or we'd be Bury without them.

 

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£200000000+ to take a football club from an established Premier League outfit to this rusting shell. Bravo to all involved  👏

If only they had tuned up on day one and told John Williams and Tom Finn that they were going to invest £250 million pounds over the next 7 years (in addition to all the TV income) and charged them wi

Stuart is right.  This is like what happened with Bolton, we are not in debt to any financial institution but we are in debt to Venky's and if they decide to recall that debt then we will be in big tr

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On 11/02/2021 at 06:56, Mattyblue said:

The war’s over lads, the sage of football finance, Kieran Maguire, has stated on the Price of Football podcast that the ‘owners have completely won the fans around’.

Two fingered salute to Kieran Maguire.

The war has only just started imo.

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2 hours ago, SIMON GARNERS 194 said:

Two fingered salute to Kieran Maguire.

The war has only just started imo.

"The war’s over lads, the sage of football finance, Kieran Maguire, has stated on the Price of Football podcast that the ‘owners have completely won the fans around’."

Presumably, this is in a parallel universe where Venkys changed nothing and we're about to win our fifth straight Premier League title and going for a hattrick of successive Champions League titles. 

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21 minutes ago, RoverCanada said:

PDF has now been uploaded.

Took a glance and it's generally the same old story as recent years. Important to note that these accounts only go up to the end of March 2020, so they won't fully incorporate pandemic impacts. The more interesting set of accounts will be BRFC accounts, which should run until the end of June 2020. I would think the BRFC accounts are the more 'relevant' figures too.

Some quick observations/notes:

- Turnover up from £14.9m to £15.8m due to increased media revenue. Commercial approx. flat at £4.9m (still relatively high for our 'stature'). Matchday down to £3m from £3.6m, likely reflecting losing 2-3 home games due to the pandemic, plus attendance pre-pandemic being a bit lower.

- Wages up from £19.6m to £21.9m. So, an increase, but still below-average for the Championship.

- 'Other' operating expenses up from £12.3m to £14.1m. These continue to be high in comparison to other Championship clubs of our 'stature', likely reflecting the academy and other facilities (and hence likely a motivation for savings with the Brockhall STC proposal...). These numbers tend to bounce around a lot, as well as generally being a couple million lower in the BRFC accounts. Perhaps reflects some overheads for VLL that aren't relevant to BRFC (and hence the BRFC accounts are usually a 'touch' rosier!)

- Profit on player trading of £3.2m. So, largely Raya + Nuttall - amortisation of Gallagher fee, but that doesn't quite add up by my quick math, so maybe also reflects some other add-ons that we're activated that I can't think of (e.g. maybe Mahoney sell-on?)

- Overall losses up from £19.5m to £20.8m. Operating losses up £3m due to increased wages/other costs outstripping turnover growth (wages/turnover rising from 154% to 158%), partially offset by the increased player trading profits

 

March to now will make grim reading 

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What overheads could VLL have that isn't relevant to Rovers accounts ?

Supposedly it's just a shell company to own and fund Rovers via the VH group/Venkys

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16 minutes ago, tomphil said:

What overheads could VLL have that isn't relevant to Rovers accounts ?

Supposedly it's just a shell company to own and fund Rovers via the VH group/Venkys

I was honestly just guessing there!

To add some more context to what I mean, here are the previous 5 years comparing 'other' operating expenses for the VLL and BRFC accounts:

2019-20: VLL £14.1m; BRFC ?

2018-19: VLL £12.3m; BRFC £10.4m

2017-18: VLL £10.2m; BRFC £8.9m

2016-17: VLL £11.5m; BRFC £5.9m

2015-16: VLL £12.4m; BRFC £10.7m

2014-15: VLL £13.8m; BRFC £11.6m

Maybe BRFC reflects a subtraction from grants/subsidies for academy costs, etc. I don't know! Just thought it was worth pointing out that the BRFC accounts tend to be a bit 'better', partly due to that line item (particularly in 16-17!)

Our 'other expenses' are certainly high by 'below average size' Championship club standards, but it tends to go without comment in the accounts. I'm not surprised it's high due to the extent of our facilities, but it is curious.

Edited by RoverCanada
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1 hour ago, tomphil said:

What overheads could VLL have that isn't relevant to Rovers accounts ?

Supposedly it's just a shell company to own and fund Rovers via the VH group/Venkys

It could be the cost of the regular audits of Blackburn Rovers, plus the cost to prepare VLL accounts.

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28 minutes ago, Richard Oakley said:

It could be the cost of the regular audits of Blackburn Rovers, plus the cost to prepare VLL accounts.

It seems to go beyond a few hundred grand per year though.

Just wondering if there might be some on the VLL payroll drawing money out of it that way. Or they are funding other stuff through VLL and that might explain a few things. Iv'e often wondered does ALL the money they send over to VLL find its way into the club or is there something else at play.

Wonder what happened to the 3 million they invested in Acons venture ?

Edited by tomphil
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27 minutes ago, perthblue02 said:

“But fast forward 10 years from the outset of anti-Venkys sentiment and a poll of Rovers fans by local media outlet Lancashire Live showed that only five per cent would not welcome Venky’s back”.

Pitiful propaganda. Or maybe they mean 5% of the original fanbase because that’s all that’s left.

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13 hours ago, perthblue02 said:

If I had pound for every time someone used the they were badly advised excuse then I'd be able to buy the club myself. That really is a pitiful article.

Edited by Ewood Ace
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The tail well and truly wagging the dog... and of course, local journos paint it as totally normal.

“There has been hostility and anger, but now through Mowbray there has been a bridge. He has advised Venky’s on things, where investment is needed, and they’ve been happy to take it.”

Edited by Mattyblue
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On 15/04/2021 at 12:32, JHRover said:

And now time for the bi-annual stuff that we can't afford to change manager and coaching staff, shouldn't question how the club is run, should be grateful for Venkys or that surviving in the Championship is an accomplishment, or we'd be Bury without them.

 

With a decent management structure in place 10 years ago when Venkys put their name above the door, We’d be beholden to nobody. (Oh, did we once have one?...what happened to them?)

The fact that we are £200 million in debt means that Venkys should be unequivocally beholden to us Blackburn Rovers supporters, not the other way round. We were 10th in The Premier League and had a debt of £10 million in terms of an overdraft facility when this lot took ownership. The fact of where we are is totally down to them and their ludicrous  choice of Managers. 
 

Edited by darrenrover
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Add Sumner to the abject apologists list with Crook and the LT

In all honesty I do not know how they can write this sort of stuff and sleep easy at night.

 “They’ve taken a step back and have people working for them that they can trust, they advise them and know their way in football,” said Jaquob Crooke, a Blackburn Rovers reporter for Lancashire Live.

When did they ever take a step forward? - apart from Sky TV

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On 16/04/2021 at 12:01, RoverCanada said:

- Profit on player trading of £3.2m. So, largely Raya + Nuttall - amortisation of Gallagher fee, but that doesn't quite add up by my quick math, so maybe also reflects some other add-ons that were activated that I can't think of (e.g. maybe Mahoney sell-on?) or loan fees (probably minimal). I would also suspect Raya was more than the £3m often bandied about (particularly if appearances were a clause)

Was just thinking about this again and I mucked it up as Gallagher's fee won't factor into the 'intangible asset trading' profit. It'll show up in our rising amortisation costs. Nuttall was a free and whatever minimal fee Raya cost would've fully amortised, so fair to assume that the initial fees for Raya + Nuttall were about £3.2m. So, maybe £3m for Raya (and presumably rising!) and about £200k for Nuttall (not a bad deal!). Possible there are some minimal loan fees wrapped up in that number too (Rovers, like many clubs, don't split out fees from loans. Presumably most of our loans only include wage contributions anyway)

On the amortisation, worth noting that is rising given Gallagher + Brereton + Armstrong etc. Amortisation costs for 19-20 were £3.7m, compared to £1.3m in 18-19 and only £0.4m in 17-18.

On the point about doubling up on auditors between VLL and BRFC, it's possible there's some additional cost there, but the amount is minimal and clearly stated in the accounts: cost £19k in the latest VLL accounts.

On those 'other expenses' I mentioned above, I think I now realise that amortisation/depreciation/lease charges are bundled into that. (Whilst I work in a numbers-oriented field, I'm certainly not a qualified accountant!) I don't have the time to split it all out historically, but they amount to about £5.5m for 2019-20, so the remaining 'other expenses' are £8.6m. Doing the same for 2018-19 leaves 'other expenses' at £9.2m. So, such costs actually declined last year! The increase is due to our transfer spending starting to bite after our "austerity years".

Edited by RoverCanada
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Basically the owners have been underwriting the bills whilst still finding enough room to give this manager and his cronies some competitive wages and funds for transfers.

Now though with promotion still nowhere in sight it needs a big cash injection from somewhere above and beyond the millions put in just to get by. This is where Waggot and co have spotted their chance to cook up the training ground scheme.

We also need a management set up that maximizes what we do have compared to some others. Not one that cries about what we don't have continually and keeps implying he can deliver but only if he gets this/that/the gate post and the other, only to find something else to then blame his floundering on.

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10 hours ago, darrenrover said:

With a decent management structure in place 10 years ago when Venkys put their name above the door, We’d be beholden to nobody. (Oh, did we once have one?...what happened to them?)

The fact that we are £200 million in debt means that Venkys should be unequivocally beholden to us Blackburn Rovers supporters, not the other way round. We were 10th in The Premier League and had a debt of £10 million in terms of an overdraft facility when this lot took ownership. The fact of where we are is totally down to them and their ludicrous  choice of Managers. 
 

Spot on and the total disregard for anything sensible, in the early years and beyond, is unforgiveable.

They were sold a get even richer, even quicker scheme, saw the rupee signs and signed. This is the very reason the badly advised brigade, irritate me so much.

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1 hour ago, lraC said:

Spot on and the total disregard for anything sensible, in the early years and beyond, is unforgiveable.

They were sold a get even richer, even quicker scheme, saw the rupee signs and signed. This is the very reason the badly advised brigade, irritate me so much.

However, history is fact....it cannot be changed. What can be influenced by their wealth, pride and appropriately empowered government and management, is the present and the future.

No way will WE impose ourselves on anybody, least of all our owners out of respect. Any approach would have to come from them but should they condescend to do so, BRFC would have much to be excited about and every Lancastrian would want to be a part of.

WATR!!

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  • 1 month later...

The usual summer cash injection has just been announced at Companies House. £5.250 million into VLL ltd which will presumably be loaned to BRFC ltd as previously done. Total spend by the Rao's on their plaything now stands at £202 million!

There must be cheaper hobbies!

 

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