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1 hour ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

Reading between the lines it appeared to me that a batch of one of the vaccines had arrived out of the blue and they'd just vaccinated people who just happened to be in the infirmary that day and happened to fit the age bracket ! 

From what I've heard at times theres very little notice, surgeries can just be dumped with vaccines that they need to use up. One of my friends mum got a call from a lady in her choir who works at a health centre at about 6pm one day "we've got spare vaccines get down now" 

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At the moment there is plenty of capacity at centres but not enough vaccine getting through. My wife's surgery centre has had two lots of Pfizer vaccines in the last two weeks, (975 in each *) but nothing this week. They can comfortably do that every week and at a push could probably do double. Anecdotally I have heard the same from other areas and the Government admitted today that vaccine supply is the current blockage. They are making the right sounds about this being sorted very soon but we've heard this sort of thing before.

* The Pfizer vaccine comes in a block of 975 vaccines, but that was assuming that there were 5 shots in each of the 195 vials. When they are diluted they are finding they can get 6 shots out of pretty much every vial but they don't know how many more they've got until they have diluted them all.

In my wife's case they are taking 3 days to get through a batch, so at the beginning of the last day they are totting up how many "extra" shots they have and then ringing up some more patients to come in on the same day. Nadhim Zahawi, who is in charge of the vaccine rollout said today that the Government had expected 10% wastage with the vaccines but they are hardly getting any and have the bonus of the extra shots. This is easily managed by GP surgeries because they can very quickly react to finding extra vaccines or getting others to replace no-shows and the patients all live very locally.

The mass testing centres are presumably using the Oxford vaccine - they can easily store large numbers and just keep on going. 

Tyrone - your Mum has got one of the letters sent to all the over 80s who had not been vaccinated (at the time of sending the letters obviously). She will have been invited to one of the mass centres and could no doubt have gone to the Etihad to get vaccinated. But she can wait to get one more locally if she wants. She should be getting called by her GP very soon - I might be tempted to give the surgery a ring to see where they are. My wife's centre is already doing the over 75s.

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UPDATE: A grim set of official figures today on deaths means my estimate of the number of people in the UK who have died since mid March linked to coronavirus is 97,700 After a recent acceleration, UK is on course to hit 100,000 by Saturday 1/
 
 
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As time goes by it seems more and more that this Government is determined to make a shambles out of a good plan with vaccinations. Mass vaccination centres just seem to be getting in the way, sucking in vaccines that could easily be locally delivered across the country. They might have a place in large cities where it might be difficult for GP surgeries and pharmacies to find enough space to set up centres but that really doesn't apply elsewhere.

If local centres could have had enough vaccines they would be well on the way to having vaccinated all the most vulnerable by now. But vaccines are being diverted to the mass centres as the Government can't afford to have them not being well used. This has resulted in elderly vulnerable people being brought out in mid Winter to travel miles and then stand outside in queues and be in close proximity to other elderly vulnerable people. Presumably some of those people have used public transport to get there. No doubt the trams into the Etihad are full of old folk who would be better at home.

Over 80s round us in Preston have had letters inviting them to go to the Etihad, despite there being two centres available which are walkable from my house and 8 in the local area. Whilst the letters say that they can wait for a more local appointment I'm sure plenty will have gone into Manchester as they want to get the vaccine asap and will be concerned that they will get missed if they don't.

It does seem that vaccination numbers overall are rising but the Government seem to be making it unnecessarily complicated. A more cynical man than me might be thinking that someone somewhere is making money out of the mass centres.

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15 minutes ago, only2garners said:

As time goes by it seems more and more that this Government is determined to make a shambles out of a good plan with vaccinations. Mass vaccination centres just seem to be getting in the way, sucking in vaccines that could easily be locally delivered across the country. They might have a place in large cities where it might be difficult for GP surgeries and pharmacies to find enough space to set up centres but that really doesn't apply elsewhere.

If local centres could have had enough vaccines they would be well on the way to having vaccinated all the most vulnerable by now. But vaccines are being diverted to the mass centres as the Government can't afford to have them not being well used. This has resulted in elderly vulnerable people being brought out in mid Winter to travel miles and then stand outside in queues and be in close proximity to other elderly vulnerable people. Presumably some of those people have used public transport to get there. No doubt the trams into the Etihad are full of old folk who would be better at home.

Over 80s round us in Preston have had letters inviting them to go to the Etihad, despite there being two centres available which are walkable from my house and 8 in the local area. Whilst the letters say that they can wait for a more local appointment I'm sure plenty will have gone into Manchester as they want to get the vaccine asap and will be concerned that they will get missed if they don't.

It does seem that vaccination numbers overall are rising but the Government seem to be making it unnecessarily complicated. A more cynical man than me might be thinking that someone somewhere is making money out of the mass centres.

A generous interpretation is we are ramping up and up so aiming to get up to around 500k per day (not sure if we could do that without the big centres) and maybe we need a lot of huge centres to cover that?

Direction of travel does seem good. Up to 270k a day on Wednesday. Hopefully broke 300k yesterday.

But agree making loads of over 80s travel a long way doesn't seem smart.

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@only2garnersthere was a bloke on tv the other day, in his 80's I presume. He'd gone to a drive-thru vaccination centre and ended up sat in his car for 4 hours waiting. He saw other people pull up and walk into the building instead so he did the same. Stood in line and was vaccinated in 45 mins. Shambles really and made him have unnecessary contact with other people whilst queueing. 

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8 minutes ago, joey_big_nose said:

A generous interpretation is we are ramping up and up so aiming to get up to around 500k per day (not sure if we could do that without the big centres) and maybe we need a lot of huge centres to cover that?

Direction of travel does seem good. Up to 270k a day on Wednesday. Hopefully broke 300k yesterday.

But agree making loads of over 80s travel a long way doesn't seem smart.

It makes sense that the mass vaccination centres will be able to ramp up the vac rate, however, this is only reasonably feasible once we start getting to the lower age brackets where more people are likely to drive.

In the higher age groups, less have cars either due to cost, failing health or they just don't feel safe on the roads these days. At this stage, regular supplies of vaccines must be sent to local GP surgeries & clinics as a priority to assist those in the most vulnerable groups to get their jabs.

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5 minutes ago, joey_big_nose said:

A generous interpretation is we are ramping up and up so aiming to get up to around 500k per day (not sure if we could do that without the big centres) and maybe we need a lot of huge centres to cover that?

Direction of travel does seem good. Up to 270k a day on Wednesday. Hopefully broke 300k yesterday.

But agree making loads of over 80s travel a long way doesn't seem smart.

Joey - all the vaccination centres round here, based on GP surgeries are at best being used 50% of the time. My wife's surgery has been up and running since 29th December and could handle 2,000 vaccinations a week. They have had 2,000 and none since last Thursday (7th).

As I said they might need the bigger centres n the big urban centres - I can see the point of the Excel in London and the Etihad in Manchester. They could concentrate on vaccinating local people in the inner cities, but there is absolutely no need in dragging people miles and miles to queue for hours, apart from it seemingly breaking several of the rules that have been set up for people to stay local, stay at home and don't mix as far as humanly possible.

HBM - there aren't any drive through centres - you need to park up and go into a centre, as you need to wait under supervision for 15 minutes after your jab in case of an adverse reaction I suspect that the bloke on your report didn't realise that.

I've seen a few reports by people saying how wonderful it was that they got vaccinated inside 45 minutes. When we got our jabs it took us a maximum of 25 minutes including the 15 minute waiting time, maybe nearer 20. There have been no queues at all at that centre or at the one by us that I've walked past a few times.

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Spoke to my GP this morning. He says 5000 people in Leyland have been vaccinated so far. However he reckons we are out of vaccine until Monday now. He says we might well recieve a letter inviting us to go to Manchester for the jab before we gat offered the local one. According to him it isn’t entirely clear in that letter that you can just wait for a local appointment if you don’t want to travel.

Bottom line to us was that if you can, get the jab as soon as you can - meaning if you can get to Manchester, go. 

Edited by den
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Den - the letters do now make it clear that you can wait for a jab at your local centre if you don't want to go into Manchester. Apparently the first draft didn't and they had to reprint 500,000 of them, hence the confusion. I think some of the original draft made their way into the media.

Personally I would wait and get mine done locally - easier and quicker and probably only a matter of days difference. But I appreciate that I'm writing as someone who has already had the jab, so can see why you would want to go if you got a letter.

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We are just finding things very frustrating Den. We're ready here wanting to get on and deliver vaccines to people right where they live quickly and efficiently. The Government seem to want to drag people from far and wide into large centres, putting more cars on the road and creating unnecessary queues.

It wouldn't be so bad if there were more of them, so that journeys were shorter. I know they are planning more but why they can't send vaccines to centres ready and waiting when these other centres aren't there is beyond me. I know Rovers have offered Ewood Park as a mass centre but so far have got nowhere. The concourses at either end of the ground would be ideal - lots of parking, a number of doorways so one-way operation would be easy, plenty of space for people for their 15 minute waits, all at ground level so accessible.

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@only2garners from what I've heard from my missus who works at a GPs I have to agree with your take on this. At GP level its able to be rolled out quickly. 

In my town it's being centralised at the local hospital so all the GPs in the town and surrounding villages have a slot at the local hospital. There are also a limited supply being deliver at the surgery itself. This works because the current age group being vaccinated are largely able to get to the GP / hospital but would be stumped if it was say manchester. 

 

It's very crude, disorganised (wrong word I think), maybe scatter gun approach? But highly effective. I cant think of the right word for it. Essentially it sounds like the local health bods get told theres vaccines incoming in x days time. What happens then is people like my missus get asked to work an extra half day, get a list of patients aged 80+ and told to "get ringing booking them in for next week, if they cant do it pop them on a list for the next batch" 

 

I'd agree i think mass vaccine centres are going to get in the way. Also part of me thinks that the fact that NHS systems are so poor and not joined up that it's going to be a nightmare trying to figure out who has / hasnt had one if these vaccine centres start picking things up. 

Someone else has said it but I think as it gets to the younger  and less urgent they could be useful. 

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1 hour ago, only2garners said:

Joey - all the vaccination centres round here, based on GP surgeries are at best being used 50% of the time. My wife's surgery has been up and running since 29th December and could handle 2,000 vaccinations a week. They have had 2,000 and none since last Thursday (7th).

As I said they might need the bigger centres n the big urban centres - I can see the point of the Excel in London and the Etihad in Manchester. They could concentrate on vaccinating local people in the inner cities, but there is absolutely no need in dragging people miles and miles to queue for hours, apart from it seemingly breaking several of the rules that have been set up for people to stay local, stay at home and don't mix as far as humanly possible.

HBM - there aren't any drive through centres - you need to park up and go into a centre, as you need to wait under supervision for 15 minutes after your jab in case of an adverse reaction I suspect that the bloke on your report didn't realise that.

I've seen a few reports by people saying how wonderful it was that they got vaccinated inside 45 minutes. When we got our jabs it took us a maximum of 25 minutes including the 15 minute waiting time, maybe nearer 20. There have been no queues at all at that centre or at the one by us that I've walked past a few times.

Fair enough - very insightful!

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So far my wife's surgery have been given about 2 days notice that they will get a batch of vaccines. Then it's all hands to the deck getting relevant appointments made. Each of the 3 practices involved sets up an appointment every 4 minutes so 3 people are arriving every 4 minutes over 12 hours. Then near the end you need to review how many you're got left taking into account some no-shows (inevitable) and how many more doses you have squeezed out when diluting.

With volunteers from the recently retired it's busy but doable. I've no doubt that the regular practice staff are doing overtime too.

Presumably as and when we get some bulk deliveries of the Oxford vaccine the time pressures will be a bit easier.

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1 minute ago, only2garners said:

So far my wife's surgery have been given about 2 days notice that they will get a batch of vaccines. Then it's all hands to the deck getting relevant appointments made. Each of the 3 practices involved sets up an appointment every 4 minutes so 3 people are arriving every 4 minutes over 12 hours. Then near the end you need to review how many you're got left taking into account some no-shows (inevitable) and how many more doses you have squeezed out when diluting.

With volunteers from the recently retired it's busy but doable. I've no doubt that the regular practice staff are doing overtime too.

Presumably as and when we get some bulk deliveries of the Oxford vaccine the time pressures will be a bit easier.

Is it all Pfizer you have had so far?

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Touch wood, it does seem like the government have finally got something right, with the current roll out of the vaccine leading the way compared to many place across the world and not just in Europe.

They're going to struggle with supplies, everyone understands that, but we seem to be making excellent progress.

The end is in sight, hopefully. 

https://www.politico.eu/article/8-reasons-why-uk-leads-europe-coronavirus-vaccination-race/

https://www.ft.com/content/818a5fcc-0b10-4cd1-8ed6-0ad06aabb9d0

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2 hours ago, joey_big_nose said:

Is it all Pfizer you have had so far?

Yes, but then the last delivery was on 7th and the Oxford vaccine only started proper bulk delivery this week. The surgery does have about 400 Oxford vaccines but they are being used to deal with care and nursing homes in the area.

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9 hours ago, only2garners said:

HBM - there aren't any drive through centres - you need to park up and go into a centre, as you need to wait under supervision for 15 minutes after your jab in case of an adverse reaction I suspect that the bloke on your report didn't realise that.

Like I said...

Drive-thru vaccine hub opens with priority patients getting jab behind the wheel - Mirror Online

Edited by Hoochie Bloochie Mama
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5 hours ago, Gav said:

Touch wood, it does seem like the government have finally got something right, with the current roll out of the vaccine leading the way compared to many place across the world and not just in Europe.

They're going to struggle with supplies, everyone understands that, but we seem to be making excellent progress.

The end is in sight, hopefully. 

https://www.politico.eu/article/8-reasons-why-uk-leads-europe-coronavirus-vaccination-race/

https://www.ft.com/content/818a5fcc-0b10-4cd1-8ed6-0ad06aabb9d0

Article states almost 3.7m had the vaccination in UK as at 14-01-21 yet Gov say 3.3m. Maybe difference has something to do with a second vaccine given out?? Either way important thing is they are getting on with.

Scottish Gov published vaccination estimated figures over coming months yesterday but UK Gov stepped in to delete information saying too much detail given out. Sky TV said tonight that based on this same projectory UK will easily achieve its goal of 15m by mid Feb and that the Gov could end up over achieving on their vaccine policy. What we don't want is information causing idiots to blow the progress made to date.

Fully expect to see a 24/7 rollout once the vaccine process gathers legs.

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