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Goalkeeper and central defence.... crucial weak links in the England team and the potential for silly mistakes. Quarter-finals at best. 

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Just play less internationals full stop, then you don’t have to make up a convoluted competition to replace friendlies. All you need is Qualifiers, a few warm up games before a tournament and the tour

Originally had four right backs in the squad, so the final game before the tournament... GS plays a centre half there. 😐 He been meeting up with TM for tactical masterclasses or what?

Elgar's Land of Hope and Glory is far superior to the dirgy GSTQ, more upbeat and a better celebration of "Englishness".  Elgar was a football fan too - a Wolves supporter - which makes it perfec

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I want to see this 

Pickford 

Chilwell stones white james 

            Rice

Bellingham mount

Rashford kane grealish/foden 

 

We have players like grealish/foden saka sancho sterling dcl to try and change the game.  We've never had so many attacking options 

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1 minute ago, jim mk2 said:

Goalkeeper and central defence.... crucial weak links in the England team and the potential for silly mistakes. Quarter-finals at best. 

Pickford has always been solid for England.  Never made a mistake.  Hes also played well for Everton lately.  Stones has eradicated his mistakes mostly.  We have pace at fullback to cover any defensive flaws

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4 minutes ago, roverandout said:

Pickford has always been solid for England.  Never made a mistake.  Hes also played well for Everton lately.  Stones has eradicated his mistakes mostly.  We have pace at fullback to cover any defensive flaws

Been watching England nearly 60 years....we've reached one final of a major tournament in our history. England always find a way to lose. We're hopeless, and it won't be any different this time. Trust me

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I get the feeling Southgate probably knows if he messes up the tournament he's most likely out as coach so i can only see him going ultra conservative and trying to scrape his way through to the final.

I think we'll get out of the group then the first team we come up against with a class forward we'll lose as they make mincemeat of our defence,nothing more i'd like to see that us win something if only for the boost for the country after the shit we've gone through the last year.I hope i'm wrong but thats the way i see it going.

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29 minutes ago, roverandout said:

I want to see this 

Pickford 

Chilwell stones white james 

            Rice

Bellingham mount

Rashford kane grealish/foden 

 

We have players like grealish/foden saka sancho sterling dcl to try and change the game.  We've never had so many attacking options 

That's probably the team when we play 433, except Walker instead of James I'm sure. After Mings' stinkers I can see White being dropped in.

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Posted (edited)
7 hours ago, Darrenbot said:

I get the feeling Southgate probably knows if he messes up the tournament he's most likely out as coach so i can only see him going ultra conservative and trying to scrape his way through to the final.

I think we'll get out of the group then the first team we come up against with a class forward we'll lose as they make mincemeat of our defence,nothing more i'd like to see that us win something if only for the boost for the country after the shit we've gone through the last year.I hope i'm wrong but thats the way i see it going.

Unless he messes up Hodgson v Iceland style, not sure he will go anywhere with a World Cup less than 18 months away.

His corporate management speak, his creation of ‘inclusive environments’ etc has the modern day press who are terrified of being labelled the bullies they once were (this article a prime example, is his priority results or ‘creating a culture’ ?https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/57377547 ) eating out of his hands.

Plus an FA that loves a clean cut blazer type means he stays. So unless disaster he’s going to Qatar.

Edited by Mattyblue
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Hes done a fine job so far. Hes got rid of the deadwood.  Brought in youth. Hes got the second best win percentage of any England manager behind capello.  Not including Allardyce.  He just needs tactical help

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7 hours ago, roverandout said:

I'm more confident.  Im scared of France but I see no reason to fear Portugal or Germany.  We have just as good players 

We're England,we always choke when we play anyone half decent.

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Posted (edited)
27 minutes ago, roverandout said:

Hes done a fine job so far. Hes got rid of the deadwood.  Brought in youth. Hes got the second best win percentage of any England manager behind capello.  Not including Allardyce.  He just needs tactical help

Tournaments are what matter, matches the WC and reaches at least a semi final, then that’s fair enough. Though shouldn’t England be finally reaching a final after all these decades?

If we don’t, then for me that’s a poor showing after five years in charge and with this group of players.

Edited by Mattyblue
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Just now, Mattyblue said:

Tournaments are what matter, matches the WC and reaches at least a semi final, then that’s fair enough. Though shouldn’t England be finally reaching a final after all these decades?

If we don’t, then for me that’s a poor showing after five years in charge and with this group of players.

We have some good attacking players but this team isn't a patch on previous England teams of the last 30 years. The defence and CM are rank average. 

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Not as good as Euro 96/WC98, obviously. Or on paper the ‘golden generation’, though they achieved bugger all, but surely better than some of the other teams that we’ve seen over the past 30 years? Stank out Euro 92 and 2000, didn’t even qualify for WC94 or Euro 2008. The 2010s largely forgettable.

I’d say he could have easily put a solid back line together, but like a certain other individual that has spent a lot of time on Teesside, constantly chopping and changing personnel and systems means we’ve never seen it.

Edited by Mattyblue
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Just now, Mattyblue said:

Not as good as Euro 96/WC98, obviously. Or on paper the ‘golden generation’, though they achieved bugger all, but surely better than some of the other teams that we’ve seen over the past 15 years?

I’d say he could have easily put a solid back line together, but like a certain other individual that has spent a lot of time on Teesside, constantly chopping and changing personnel and systems means we’ve never seen it.

Exactly, they won bugger all, and yet they were far better than this shower. Then you add in the manager factor, Venables and Hoddle were both good coaches. Venables was exceptional. 

Who would be in that 'solid' defence? And there isn't an ounce of creativity in that midfield. 

As usual when it comes to England  average players are being vastly overrated. 

 

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Posted (edited)

Yet the GG didn’t ever get to a semi final like Mr Blazer, so perhaps these players do have something, and I don’t think it’s a worse squad than 2018?

To be honest, I’m probably out of my depth here as outside tournaments I barely give the national team a second glance. Club over country man (well I’m getting close to being neither these days).

My helicopter view is decent set of players when compared to the 2010s, a better manager could get more of a tune out of them.

I’ll probably leave the thread to the likes of rovernout who seem far more into the weeds than me!

Edited by Mattyblue
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6 minutes ago, Hoochie Bloochie Mama said:

Exactly, they won bugger all, and yet they were far better than this shower. Then you add in the manager factor, Venables and Hoddle were both good coaches. Venables was exceptional. 

Who would be in that 'solid' defence? And there isn't an ounce of creativity in that midfield. 

As usual when it comes to England  average players are being vastly overrated. 

 

Grealish is exceptional, an outstanding talent. But the fact Southgate doesn’t always start him says it all. 

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Posted (edited)
25 minutes ago, Hoochie Bloochie Mama said:

We have some good attacking players but this team isn't a patch on previous England teams of the last 30 years. The defence and CM are rank average. 

Defence is pretty decent.  I wouldn’t call rice philips Henderson Bellingham rank average.  All pretty good or outstanding young players 

Edited by roverandout
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Posted (edited)
52 minutes ago, roverandout said:

Defence is pretty decent.  I wouldn’t call rice philips Henderson Bellingham rank average.  All pretty good or outstanding young players 

In international terms Rice and Henderson are very average, Philips wouldn’t be in a top country’s squad and Bellingham has potential but that’s all. And the defence has obvious weaknesses

Edited by jim mk2
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1 hour ago, Hoochie Bloochie Mama said:

We have some good attacking players but this team isn't a patch on previous England teams of the last 30 years. The defence and CM are rank average. 

Id say it's a better team than 2014- 2018, probs on a par with 2008-2012, worse that 1996-2006. It's very weird that probably the worst squad we've had in decades, 2018, made it to the semis!

Id say par for this team would be quarter finals. There's two teams (Belgium and France) who are clearly a lot better than us, and four or so teams we are on a level with (Italy, Spain, Germany, Portugal).

With a fair wind we could make semis. Wouldn't be shocked if we went out earlier. That's what makes football so exciting.

It's a shame that it all comes down really poor centre backs. Never been worse set of options for England in my memory. Absolutely shocking.

Personally in centre mid I think Rice, Bellingham, Mount is a really strong group.

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Our problem lies in the route we have to take. We draw either Portugal, Germany or France in the first knockout round. If you want to win you have to beat the best.

I think this team is good. I would start Ben White over Tyrone Mings personally but that won't happen. Mings is a pretty bad footballer in my eyes but has done well off the field. Out of the Villa back line he has easily been the worst this season yet is the only one included in the England squad. Go figure.

To make up for our defensive weakness I have decided I would play 5 at the back. Problem being Southgate has tried to shoe-horn players in to a 4-2-3-1 for a while now, meaning we have no experience playing a formation which served us well last tournament.

For me:

                    Henderson

          James Stones White

Trippier                              Shaw

                Rice Bellingham

          Grealish Kane Rashford 

 

Switch Grealish for Foden, Rashford for Sancho / Sterling and you have some real impact subs.

Henderson would play over Bellingham if fit.

Walker is James' back up. Maguire when fit comes in for Ben White. 

And I know that Southgate will pick Pickford but personally Dean Henderson is a better goalie and would play for me every time. 

I personally think that squad above could beat France and really that is the team we need to beat. 

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I have a weird feeling that Southgate is going to 'trust' his old guard a bit (Rashford and Sterling) and start them over Foden and Grealish. Think that would be a big mistake personally. 

Very excited to watch though, just hoping our attacking players turn up cause that back line is very shaky, and of course that we don't play too negative

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1 hour ago, roverandout said:

Defence is pretty decent.  I wouldn’t call rice philips Henderson Bellingham rank average.  All pretty good or outstanding young players 

Pretty good isn't going to win you a tournament. Bellingham is/will be quality, watching the others is like watching the Smallwood/Bennett 'pivot'...but without the flair😉

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12 minutes ago, joey_big_nose said:

Id say it's a better team than 2014- 2018, probs on a par with 2008-2012, worse that 1996-2006. It's very weird that probably the worst squad we've had in decades, 2018, made it to the semis!

I think that was down to who we played to get there. As soon as we played a half decent team we were out. 

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39 minutes ago, Hoochie Bloochie Mama said:

I think that was down to who we played to get there. As soon as we played a half decent team we were out. 

 Most of the big nations out, a kind semi-final against one of the "minnows" and we still blew it. It's pathetic and this tournament won't be different. Who is going to be 2020's Iceland? 

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29 minutes ago, jim mk2 said:

 Most of the big nations out, a kind semi-final against one of the "minnows" and we still blew it. It's pathetic and this tournament won't be different. Who is going to be 2020's Iceland? 

Hope it's not the Jocks 😪

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2 hours ago, Hoochie Bloochie Mama said:

Pretty good isn't going to win you a tournament. Bellingham is/will be quality, watching the others is like watching the Smallwood/Bennett 'pivot'...but without the flair😉

Rice has been superb this season and has improved significant for England.  I would say he's very good. Henderson is Henderson.  A born leader. Phillips has done ok. Hes been a huge positive for Leeds. His passing is superb. I dont think Italys midfield for example is anything to write home about.  Jorginho and veratti. Neither are that special.  Portugal midfield isn't anything outstanding.  Germany midfield is alot better than ours . So is france's.  Dutch midfield is pretty good. Spanish midfield pretty good. My point is aside from France.  No team stands out in midfield.  That gives us some hope 

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