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Honestly I'm at a point where I just can't get excited about new signings as long as Mowbray is in charge. Even if the signee appears impressive I already know his impact will be neutered by Mowbray's

Hi all. Would like to thank anyone and everyone who has given my work a read over the last few days. As you can probably tell it took a very long time to do and a lot of late nights around my full tim

Fast forwards 12 months.... 'We lost the quality of Holtby and the goals of Armstrong last summer along with the regular right back and the experience of Johnson.  It's a sad day for the club but

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3 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

 

Ashley Fletcher, a striker from Boro. Out of contract this summer

 

I suggested him last summer and you said he was shit. Why is he good when you suggest him?

And you said Whatnore was shit when I said we should take a punt on him when he was at Sunderland. 

🙄

Edited by Sparks Rover
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52 minutes ago, bluebruce said:

Most important recruitment for the new season? That's obvious. New manager.

Yep.

Need a new manager.

Until that happens talk of player recruitment is almost irrelevant.

 

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14 hours ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Do you honestly believe the part in bold? Anyway, even if they are looking at players. Why would it be for a manager who won't be here? Why is he even talking about transfers? 1 win in 13 and none of us would be surprised if he is still here game one next season. It's a shambles. 

That's the way recruitment departments work. They will scout players every week. Have you ever heard of Wyscout? Rovers recruitment department used Wyscout tool to scout players from around the world and invest massively in making sure we have the latest tools and in Data analysis. 

Here is how clubs used Wyscout to sign players. Interviews with Burnley Technical director Mike Rigg, Wolves's Head of recruitment John Marshall and Leeds Sporting Director Victor Orta

(667) SCOUTING WITH WYSCOUT | PLAYER ANALYSIS IN THE MODERN GAME - YouTube

(667) Wyscout Talks: Wolves’ Head of Recruitment, John Marshall - YouTube

(667) Wyscout Talks: Leeds United's Director of Football, Victor Orta - YouTube

We don't know if Mowbray will be here or not next season. I hope he isn't. His target was top 6 this season as he said before the season started and he has failed to achieved that. 

Why is he talking transfers? Cos he is trying to communicate with the owners cos he doesn't speak to the owners anymore and communicate with Pasha only as he said a few weeks ago. This is similar situation to when Bowyer was here and communications with the owners stop. 

14 hours ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

On the recruitment piece. Kaminski was good, but apart from that last summer was awfully poor. Now the head of the department is gone.

Well thats the manager to blame as he decide who we sign. His signings didn't match how he wanted to play style or tactically. If @philipost is correct and that the recruitment recommended we sign Goode and Pickering and Mowbray want against that and went for Ayala and Douglas. Also Mowbray's comments at the Supporters Consultation meeting thats he had his summer transfers targets lined up were wrong. These were comments to a fan he was talking one on one

I don't blame Stuart Harvey leaving Rovers for Sunderland. Sunderland looks like they will be back in the Championship next season and if he was head hunted by their Sporting Director Speakman then clearly he liked the role and involved he would have in the recruitment side there. 

14 hours ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Of the potential players you mention, I don't know anything about the first 3. Lundstram is surely out of our wage structure. Reach is useless, the odd screamer, that's it. Fletcher, absolutely useless, worse than Gallagher. Hugill,probably out of our price range, not a Mowbray type striker and for all we know he will still be managing the team next season.

I don't see Lundstram being on massive wages there. 

Why is Hugill out of price range considering he would be loan signing? My suggestion of him was based on Mowbray not being here. 

14 hours ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

There is a huge amount to be done.

Yes there is huge amount of work to be done. Especially if we have new manager who will able to build his own team/squad from day one due to so many players out of contract. It will be attractive job for that reasons as well as our facilities and stadium 

14 hours ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

I don't share your optimism currently.

Optimism currently? I dont think I am. If we have a new manager/head coach for next season then I will look forward to the season. 

 

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14 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

Rankin Costello is made of glass and soon to be out of contract, Nyambe is out of contract and seems destined to leave, Buckley and Dolan have not really done anything certainly to be "built around" and Pickering hasnt kicked a ball here yet.

Rankin-Costello and Nyambe have 12 months club options. So don't seems destined to leave Roversfan99. Also if we have a new manager in place then they might sign new contracts. 

On Buckley and Dolan should be starting regular next season and Buckley would be my playmaker. 

You constantly talk down Pickering at every opportunity you get but you wont do any research on him or even watched highlights of Crewe games or match reports 

14 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

I dont really understand why you seem to think that the club is fine aside from the management, as if the owners are interested, that Pasha has the authority and competence to sack Mowbray, that the scouting network is running to perfection.

Have I ever said everything is fine? That Pasha can sack Mowbray? No I haven't at all so god know why you mentioned. 

But the owners have provided 20 million pounds to the manager to spend on players plus the wages of signings for the 3 years. So can Mowbray really say he hasn't been backed Financially? Do you not agree he has been financially and should have achieved a top 6 spot by now? He hasn't had to sell any major players so far. 

Also what is your issue with our recruitment department/data analysis department? I seen your comments last week arguing about data analysis in Football and I found your comments out of touch. Have you even look at how clubs use Wyscout as scouting tool? maybe watched the 3 videos I posted and how clubs use them. Rovers will be using it similar. 

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13 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

Buckley would be my playmaker. 

Have you even look at how clubs use Wyscout as scouting tool? 

You probably never even heard of it until today, and what do you think it would say about Buckley...? If it has any stats on him.at all based on his low starting numbers.

You contradict yourself constantly. Mowbray was your man 3 months ago and now everything thats wrong with the club his his fault......😄😄

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1 hour ago, chaddyrovers said:

That's the way recruitment departments work. They will scout players every week. Have you ever heard of Wyscout? Rovers recruitment department used Wyscout tool to scout players from around the world and invest massively in making sure we have the latest tools and in Data analysis. 

Here is how clubs used Wyscout to sign players. Interviews with Burnley Technical director Mike Rigg, Wolves's Head of recruitment John Marshall and Leeds Sporting Director Victor Orta

(667) SCOUTING WITH WYSCOUT | PLAYER ANALYSIS IN THE MODERN GAME - YouTube

(667) Wyscout Talks: Wolves’ Head of Recruitment, John Marshall - YouTube

(667) Wyscout Talks: Leeds United's Director of Football, Victor Orta - YouTube

We don't know if Mowbray will be here or not next season. I hope he isn't. His target was top 6 this season as he said before the season started and he has failed to achieved that. 

Why is he talking transfers? Cos he is trying to communicate with the owners cos he doesn't speak to the owners anymore and communicate with Pasha only as he said a few weeks ago. This is similar situation to when Bowyer was here and communications with the owners stop. 

Well thats the manager to blame as he decide who we sign. His signings didn't match how he wanted to play style or tactically. If @philipost is correct and that the recruitment recommended we sign Goode and Pickering and Mowbray want against that and went for Ayala and Douglas. Also Mowbray's comments at the Supporters Consultation meeting thats he had his summer transfers targets lined up were wrong. These were comments to a fan he was talking one on one

I don't blame Stuart Harvey leaving Rovers for Sunderland. Sunderland looks like they will be back in the Championship next season and if he was head hunted by their Sporting Director Speakman then clearly he liked the role and involved he would have in the recruitment side there. 

I don't see Lundstram being on massive wages there. 

Why is Hugill out of price range considering he would be loan signing? My suggestion of him was based on Mowbray not being here. 

Yes there is huge amount of work to be done. Especially if we have new manager who will able to build his own team/squad from day one due to so many players out of contract. It will be attractive job for that reasons as well as our facilities and stadium 

Optimism currently? I dont think I am. If we have a new manager/head coach for next season then I will look forward to the season. 

 

A lot of fair points there. 

No, I have never heard of wyscout. The club's you mention there, we have a long way to go to be used in the same context as them. Kaminski was a good signing. Other than that, since this recruitment department was set up and lauded by Mowbray, he has signed more lads from Boro than Europe. I get the feeling it's just for show as far as Mowbray is concerned. Like a lot of things, he talks about it like we are serious / a proper run club, but the reality is we aren't. Hence the current situation. 

 

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What's annoying me is Mowbray is using Covid as his get out of jail free card for everything

Form-covid 

Hard to do deals - Covid 

Not achieving his targets -covid 

He is being allowed to do it by the media though. The owners might even accept it. It's a load of shite. 

 

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2 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

Rankin-Costello and Nyambe have 12 months club options. So don't seems destined to leave Roversfan99. Also if we have a new manager in place then they might sign new contracts. 

On Buckley and Dolan should be starting regular next season and Buckley would be my playmaker. 

You constantly talk down Pickering at every opportunity you get but you wont do any research on him or even watched highlights of Crewe games or match reports 

Have I ever said everything is fine? That Pasha can sack Mowbray? No I haven't at all so god know why you mentioned. 

But the owners have provided 20 million pounds to the manager to spend on players plus the wages of signings for the 3 years. So can Mowbray really say he hasn't been backed Financially? Do you not agree he has been financially and should have achieved a top 6 spot by now? He hasn't had to sell any major players so far. 

Also what is your issue with our recruitment department/data analysis department? I seen your comments last week arguing about data analysis in Football and I found your comments out of touch. Have you even look at how clubs use Wyscout as scouting tool? maybe watched the 3 videos I posted and how clubs use them. Rovers will be using it similar. 

This isnt me denying or indeed dismissing the use of data analysis, im sure that like all clubs we use it some degree. My opinions on the limitations of data firstly do not mean that I dont think it has any use, and has no relevance to the point I was making. I dont think that at Rovers, we have the organisation or indeed competence to have everything in place whereby a new manager just comes in and has a ready made list of fully researched and scouting players for each position, or indeed would be willing to sign those players necessarily anyway. We may use data, but that automatically doesnt mean that we use it well, and was not the point I was making.

I dont see how suggesting that Pickering hasnt kicked a ball for us it putting him down, like me saying that Rankin Costello is injury prone, both are facts. My opinion on Dolan and Buckley certainly isnt that they can or should be starting every week, I do not see them as regular Championship players at this stage, especially for a team who should be in the top 6 as you believe we can.

I dont get why you think I am defending Mowbray, you have just recently decided that you want him out and seem to think now that I dont. Obviously his recruitment has been shocking, hence why with Dack out and Armstrong gone most likely next season, whoever the manager is, I feel like avoiding relegation is the first priority, top 6 seems a world away. Obviously it is a terrible representation on Mowbray that the squad is quite as bad as it is.

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I know it’s been posted on this site somewhere but I cannot find it. Does anyone have a list of the players who are out of contract this summer

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2 minutes ago, matt83 said:

I know it’s been posted on this site somewhere but I cannot find it. Does anyone have a list of the players who are out of contract this summer

 

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20 minutes ago, matt83 said:

I know it’s been posted on this site somewhere but I cannot find it. Does anyone have a list of the players who are out of contract this summer

Nyambe (one year option)

JRC

Bennett

Bell

Evans

Johnson

Downing

Holtby 

Rothwell (one year option)

Chapman (one year option)

Plus Elliot, Trybull, Douglas, THB, Branthwaite all go back to there parent clubs.

Doesn't leave a great deal left.

 

 

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1 minute ago, MarkBRFC said:

Nyambe (one year option)

JRC

Bennett

Bell

Evans

Johnson

Downing

Holtby 

Rothwell (one year option)

Chapman (one year option)

Plus Elliot, Trybull, Douglas, THB, Branthwaite all go back to there parent clubs.

Doesn't leave a great deal left.

 

 

Or alternatively you could look at it that it's a lot of shite gone. The only one there I would be upset about would be Nyambe and he has a 1 year option. 

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I wouldn't disagree with that and in some ways it could be a godsend.

I don't trust the current management to adequately replace them though.

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It's a dangerous game at any club to have such a turnover in players in one window. Assuming all or most of those players leave then it is going to be a massive job. Even at organised clubs, with proper structures, interested owners and substantial cash to spend it would be difficult to bring in 15 players in one window ready for a new season.

At our micky mouse operation it is going to be nigh on impossible. Whatever budget is provided by the owners will only be authorised when the owners can be bothered reviewing things. I expect we are reaching cutback time after 3 years of reasonable backing and no sales yet regression on the pitch. 

Of course serious owners would realise that the blame for that lies with Mowbray and his staff, replace them and back a better manager. But Venkys are too clever for that, and instead will keep Mowbray but slash his budget or at best get rid of Mowbray but cut costs so much that no decent manager would come in and replace him.

With or without Mowbray I really fear for our future. Say what you like about getting rid of the 'deadwood' but they are here and know this level. When they are gone we need to replace them and that won't be easy or quick. Not with our planning and operation.

I also expect that Mowbray is pinning his hopes on a club bidding big for Armstrong. This would vindicate his recruitment approach and earn him credit with the finance men in India, and also enable him to request a portion of the cash back for new signings. 

We know from experience that any sale will be later on in the window, leaving minimal time to do anything about it, and the money will disappear.

We've effectively become a modern day Accy Stanley or Blackpool when they were run by the Oystons. Short term contracts, half a squad out at the end of a season, reliant on heavily subsidised loans and favours from the big boys.

Unacceptable at Blackburn Rovers. I don't have the stomach to watch the car crash unfold and to go into League One again, but I expect that is what will happen unless we get our act together quickly.

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1 hour ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

What's annoying me is Mowbray is using Covid as his get out of jail free card for everything

Form-covid 

Hard to do deals - Covid 

Not achieving his targets -covid 

He is being allowed to do it by the media though. The owners might even accept it. It's a load of shite. 

 

It's the last resort now that he has used every other excuse:

'Dack and Travis are big misses'

'we've got defenders out injured'

'We're only 20 games into our journey',

'We've had to change our style of play and move on from Danny Graham'

'The condition of the pitch isn't helping our game'

'The ball isn't falling for us in the final third'

I wonder how much longer the owners will keep on falling for all of this crap for. He is the manager that Balaji deserves, but sadly it affects all of the rest of us too.

 

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4 hours ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

A lot of fair points there. 

No, I have never heard of wyscout. The club's you mention there, we have a long way to go to be used in the same context as them. Kaminski was a good signing. Other than that, since this recruitment department was set up and lauded by Mowbray, he has signed more lads from Boro than Europe. I get the feeling it's just for show as far as Mowbray is concerned. Like a lot of things, he talks about it like we are serious / a proper run club, but the reality is we aren't. Hence the current situation. 

 

Firstly, thanks. 

I heard about Wyscout about 4 years ago as teams starting using it. 

Yes I was surprised last summer that we didn't sign more players from Europe than 2 players we did. I surprise we didn't sign an European centre back and left back at least aswell as a centre midfielder. But why didnt we tho? Did Mowbray rejected suggestions/recommendations from the recruitment department last summer. 

The owners have invested heavily in this recruitment and data analysis department so I expected they want results. If I was owner of the club I would be asking Mowbray why did we sign Ayala, Douglas and Downing last summer? 

What do you mean we aren't a proper run club? 

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5 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

If I was owner of the club I would be asking Mowbray why did we sign Ayala, Douglas and Downing last summer? 

As a supporter why weren't you questioning it at the time like a lot of people on here....you were backing him.

You are rewriting history every post Chaddy

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13 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

Firstly, thanks. 

I heard about Wyscout about 4 years ago as teams starting using it. 

Yes I was surprised last summer that we didn't sign more players from Europe than 2 players we did. I surprise we didn't sign an European centre back and left back at least aswell as a centre midfielder. But why didnt we tho? Did Mowbray rejected suggestions/recommendations from the recruitment department last summer. 

The owners have invested heavily in this recruitment and data analysis department so I expected they want results. If I was owner of the club I would be asking Mowbray why did we sign Ayala, Douglas and Downing last summer? 

What do you mean we aren't a proper run club? 

I heard about before they started using it 5 years ago so na

Funny that in your history for last 4 years, you have never mentioned it once in a single post except the last week (4 times). You now mention it all the time but knew about it for years...ok.

You just heard of it and making up stories.

Edited by JacknOry
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14 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

Firstly, thanks. 

I heard about Wyscout about 4 years ago as teams starting using it. 

Yes I was surprised last summer that we didn't sign more players from Europe than 2 players we did. I surprise we didn't sign an European centre back and left back at least aswell as a centre midfielder. But why didnt we tho? Did Mowbray rejected suggestions/recommendations from the recruitment department last summer. 

The owners have invested heavily in this recruitment and data analysis department so I expected they want results. If I was owner of the club I would be asking Mowbray why did we sign Ayala, Douglas and Downing last summer? 

What do you mean we aren't a proper run club? 

Where do you want me to start? In a nutshell, the owners are incompetent and even if they put money in, they don't get football, the nuances of it. Corners have been cut in many areas. There is a long list of smaller,but better run club's who are ahead of us. That's the type of club we used to be. Now we look enviously at clubs like Brentford and Barnsley. 

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24 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

What do you mean we aren't a proper run club? 

Do you seriously need to ask that? Do you think Mowbray would still be in charge at any other club of our stature in this league?

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3 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

I dont think that at Rovers, we have the organisation or indeed competence to have everything in place whereby a new manager just comes in and has a ready made list of fully researched and scouting players for each position, or indeed would be willing to sign those players necessarily anyway.

That is what the owners have been investing in the past 2 years to make sure we have organisation, all the scouting tools and data analysis that is needed to make sure we have knowledge on the players we should be signing. 

Is Mowbray making use of this? IMO Mowbray hasn't be using it properly since He wanted this sort of recruitment department where it has all the tools needed to be up to date, finding this gems whether they play in England or Europe and this is one of the reasons I want him gone.

When you look at last season signings of Ayala, Douglas, Pears and Trybull and the season before signings of Downing, Johnson, Gallagher, Walton and Cunningham. I really wonder how many of them where recommendations from Stuart Harvey and our Recruitment department? I reckon at best 1 or 2 of them. So why isn't Mowbray listening to Stuart Harvey and our recruitment department?

3 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

My opinion on Dolan and Buckley certainly isnt that they can or should be starting every week, I do not see them as regular Championship players at this stage, especially for a team who should be in the top 6 as you believe we can.

Mowbray is the person who said he built a top 6 quality squad this season. His words. This is why the owners and some fans backed Mowbray slow build approach with this season getting top 6 and promotion. He hasn't come close to achieving this. 

On Buckley and Dolan, I would be building my starting 11 around a mixture of young talented players like Dolan, Buckley, Pickering, JRC and signing experience players like Jack Hunt, Sonny Bradley and Jordan Hugill(on loan) to add to the Kaminski and Lenihan then look for quality players from lower leagues and European leagues who can add quality and depth to the squad and the starting 11. Plus using some under 23's players like Pike, Carter and McBride in the 1st team squad. 

3 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

I dont get why you think I am defending Mowbray, you have just recently decided that you want him out and seem to think now that I dont. Obviously his recruitment has been shocking, hence why with Dack out and Armstrong gone most likely next season, whoever the manager is, I feel like avoiding relegation is the first priority, top 6 seems a world away.

Its was about 7 weeks/2 months ago I wanted him out. Since then I haven't change my view and from everything I've seen so far since then as endorsed my opinion he needs to go. 

If we have a change of manager and if we make a good appointment(Massive IF). Then we have a chance of top 6(within 2 seasons) depending on who the appointment is and who he recruits. 

If Mowbray is still here then staying up will be priority 

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3 hours ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Or alternatively you could look at it that it's a lot of shite gone. The only one there I would be upset about would be Nyambe and he has a 1 year option. 

I would look at it that way. The only player I would be upset about losing massively is Rankin Costello. I have watched his development at the club over the years. Always impressed me

14 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Where do you want me to start? In a nutshell, the owners are incompetent and even if they put money in, they don't get football, the nuances of it. Corners have been cut in many areas. There is a long list of smaller,but better run club's who are ahead of us. That's the type of club we used to be. Now we look enviously at clubs like Brentford and Barnsley. 

I agree that the owners don't understand Football and how you have to make quick decisions at times, 

If I had my way Waggott would be gone also. There is plenty of good footballing experience CEO's out there who could replace him. 

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