Summer transfer window 2021.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

Just now, roversfan99 said:

People are happy to accept incompetence I tend to find under the line that "hes fine as a squad player."

Even if hes cheap, its no good if he cant do a job when needed, and over numerous years, we know that Bell isnt close to being up to it.

On top of this, we dont even know if Pickering will come in and be a competent performer himself.

In all the time I’ve been watching Rovers I can’t recall a left back less capable of keeping a winger quiet than Bell. He just watches his opponent cross the ball in as though it’s nothing to do with him.

[RoversClitheroe]

12 minutes ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

In all the time I’ve been watching Rovers I can’t recall a left back less capable of keeping a winger quiet than Bell. He just watches his opponent cross the ball in as though it’s nothing to do with him.

I give you Barry Douglas.

I do think Bell is better than Douglas, I do think the fundamental problem is Bell never ever seems interested or plays at 50% or more. 

Edited May 4, 2021 by RoversClitheroe

[Bigdoggsteel]

14 minutes ago, RoversClitheroe said:

I give you Barry Douglas.

I do think Bell is better than Douglas, I do think the fundamental problem is Bell never ever seems interested or plays at 50% or more. 

He honesty isn't. Even allowing for the fact Douglas is past it. Bells 50% is his best, that's it. Can you remind me of any occasion where he reached this 100% you allude to? 

[Tom]

Never warmed to Douglas, better crosser than Bell but potentially a worse defender and cost us several goals.

Agree with the petulant comment I recall 2 or 3 times he’s attempted to kick a free kick at an opponent, missed and just given them the ball back

[Tom]

20 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

He honesty isn't. Even allowing for the fact Douglas is past it. Bells 50% is his best, that's it. Can you remind me of any occasion where he reached this 100% you allude to? 

He had an Amoruso of a debut after coming on as an early sub 

[roversfan99]

45 minutes ago, RoversClitheroe said:

I give you Barry Douglas.

I do think Bell is better than Douglas, I do think the fundamental problem is Bell never ever seems interested or plays at 50% or more. 

I think thats a misconception simply based on his natural style. Some players just naturally appear more languid than others but I dont doubt that Bell tries his best, its not as if there have been a few games whereby his style has noticeably changed to suggest more effort.

Douglas has been a massive dissapointment, I think especially with a couple of injury ravaged seasons recently and his age have caught up with him, plus when he was at Wolves he didnt play as a full back. But hes still better than Bell. Technically he is much tighter as Bell needs more time and touches to get the ball under control, Douglas has better delivery and he is better defensively. He made a couple of glaring mistakes (one v Reading when it unfortunately bounced off his heel and Pears had gone walkabouts) but Bells continious defensive incompetence is perhaps more subtle. When he plays, the chances tend to mainly stem from his side, Huddersfields first goal and at the weekend when they got in and Nyambe prevented them getting a tap in were perhaps not mistakes that would stand out but just 2 recent examples of how passive and weak he is at stopping crosses.

[dallydally]

Bell is a League One player at best

[tomphil]

2 minutes ago, dallydally said:

Bell is a League One player at best

If they let him go on a free that's where he'll end up again no doubts, like a few others we've carried too long.

[bluebruce]

40 minutes ago, Meesh said:

My suspicion is that he'll be in the starting XI at the beginning of next season because "it's a big step up for Harry", and "Harry needs to learn from somebody more experienced at this level".

Anyway, both Bell and Douglas have been failures. Those failures belong to Mowbray. Two failures to add to a long list that goes totally unscrutinised and unpunished by our owners.

Mowbray has sounded extremely positive about Pickering, and he is one of few players we are likely to spend on this year. My suspicion is we are more likely to have the opposite problem - that even if Pickering turns out to be shit he will be kept in to justify the spend.

Yes we spent something similar on Bell, but that was in League One and he has had years to prove his worth.

[RoversClitheroe]

23 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Douglas has better delivery and he is better defensively. He made a couple of glaring mistakes (one v Reading when it unfortunately bounced off his heel and Pears had gone walkabouts) but Bells continious defensive incompetence is perhaps more subtle.

I can't agree with this, Douglas has been at fault for a lot of goals this season's for glaringly obvious errors. Yes Bell allows crosses in but Douglas in his year has been at fault for more goals than Bell has in his Rovers career.

[riverholmes]

In mitigation of our full backs, who have struggled greatly, we are playing a 4-3-3 formation that leaves their frailties exposed. Recently, Gallagher and Brereton, the "wing forwards" have been tracking back more, it seems, but, at times, the protection has been woeful this season.

I think Bell is a better option than Douglas, though, both are weak. If Bell stays, I suppose it means our reserve LB, Lewis Thompson, will leave? He was a regular in a well-drilled side but, presumably, got a serious injury, as he has not featured in the latter part of the season.

My preference would be to have a young player with some potential to compete with Pickering because Bell's career is on a downwards trajectory, it seems and this is only being accelerated by intermittent appearances in the matchday squad. Perhaps, he'll get a run till the end of the season and show a bit more.

 

Edited May 4, 2021 by riverholmes

[roversfan99]

15 minutes ago, RoversClitheroe said:

I can't agree with this, Douglas has been at fault for a lot of goals this season's for glaringly obvious errors. Yes Bell allows crosses in but Douglas in his year has been at fault for more goals than Bell has in his Rovers career.

I would definitely disagree, when Bell plays, wingers have had a free pass at getting in behind him and getting crosses in down his side throughout his Rovers career.

The one thing I suspect we will agree on, if either is at the club next season, then it is a travesty.

[1864roverite]

Both are good at giving the ball away and causing havoc in our own defence!

Get rid

[bluebruce]

32 minutes ago, RoversClitheroe said:

I can't agree with this, Douglas has been at fault for a lot of goals this season's for glaringly obvious errors. Yes Bell allows crosses in but Douglas in his year has been at fault for more goals than Bell has in his Rovers career.

I wouldn't say in his Rovers career. Douglas this year is rather similar to Bell's first Championship season I think it was. Or second. Maybe it was both. Lad was an absolute liability. But I think based on this season he is currently better defensively than Douglas.

Of course, this is a bit like discussing who is the tallest midget.

[Bigdoggsteel]

49 minutes ago, RoversClitheroe said:

I can't agree with this, Douglas has been at fault for a lot of goals this season's for glaringly obvious errors. Yes Bell allows crosses in but Douglas in his year has been at fault for more goals than Bell has in his Rovers career.

I think you have focused a bit too much on Douglas's weaknesses after an early poor start. He has far more in his locker than Bell. 

Bell is pretty much unable to block crosses. He takes too many touches. He is weak on the ball. Frankly, he is dreadful. 

Can you tell me one game where he played consistently well? Or even 75% of it well. 

When I watch him, him doing something good or positive excites me, because it's such a rare occurrence 

[Bigdoggsteel]

17 minutes ago, bluebruce said:

I wouldn't say in his Rovers career. Douglas this year is rather similar to Bell's first Championship season I think it was. Or second. Maybe it was both. Lad was an absolute liability. But I think based on this season he is currently better defensively than Douglas.

Of course, this is a bit like discussing who is the tallest midget.

I think Bell being out of the side has inflated fans view of him. Douglas has been a disappointment, but he's still better than Bell. 

[bluebruce]

35 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

I think Bell being out of the side has inflated fans view of him. Douglas has been a disappointment, but he's still better than Bell. 

Thanks for telling me why I think things. But no, I just think he has mostly been a bit better this season when used. To be clear, I'm not a fan. I just think he has been better than the constant liability he was before. Actually played fairly well last game for the most part.

[Ulrich]

No mate I'm sorry but you are wrong, my turd is much better than yours as it is shiny. Oh my god how can you say that? Everyone knows a turds quality is in its smell and mine is far more pungent than yours, so it wins hands down 💩💩

 

[Theaxe15]

42 minutes ago, Ulrich said:

No mate I'm sorry but you are wrong, my turd is much better than yours as it is shiny. Oh my god how can you say that? Everyone knows a turds quality is in its smell and mine is far more pungent than yours, so it wins hands down 💩💩

 

....eh?

[DE.]

Bell is terrible. Douglas has proven over his career he has much more talent than Bell, but I don't think our style of play suits him at all. He's too slow and one of his primary attributes, crossing, is wasted here with our tallest strikers out on the wings and Armstrong in the middle. Just another muddled signing from TM that makes no sense.

[rigger]

2 minutes ago, DE. said:

Bell is terrible. Douglas has proven over his career he has much more talent than Bell, but I don't think our style of play suits him at all. He's too slow and one of his primary attributes, crossing, is wasted here with our tallest strikers out on the wings and Armstrong in the middle. Just another muddled signing from TM that makes no sense.

People are comparing the attributes of Bell and Douglas, which seem to be speed or crossing the ball. Personally I want my defenders primary asset, to be the ability to defend. Get rid of both. I hope/pray Pickering can defend.

[DE.]

Just now, rigger said:

People are comparing the attributes of Bell and Douglas, which seem to be speed or crossing the ball. Personally I want my defenders primary asset, to be the ability to defend. Get rid of both. I hope/pray Pickering can defend.

With the way Mowbray supposedly wants us to play, our fullbacks need to be athletic if not super speedy, so being slow is a problem. Crossing is irrelevent due to Armstrong being our focal point and Brereton/Gallagher rarely being in the box to get on the end of anything.

Defending ability would be nice but arguably pointless under a manager who has never in his entire career been able to set up a team to defend well. 

[tomphil]

9 minutes ago, rigger said:

People are comparing the attributes of Bell and Douglas, which seem to be speed or crossing the ball. Personally I want my defenders primary asset, to be the ability to defend. Get rid of both. I hope/pray Pickering can defend.

This.

What use is one without the other !  Being able to skin a man with pace going forwards or bang in good crosses and set pieces are just a bonus. Defending is the primary job and i'd be interested to see the stats on that between both. Doubt that's something Mowbray would crow about like he does the possession stuff.

[Wheelton Blue]

I've thought for a long time that our achilles heal is with the full backs not being able to defend balls into the box. 

Neither Bell nor Douglas - and to a degree Nyambe - are adept at blocking crosses, and never seem to bust a gut trying to do so.

It's probably also down to how the team is set up to defend as a whole.

[roversfan99]

34 minutes ago, rigger said:

People are comparing the attributes of Bell and Douglas, which seem to be speed or crossing the ball. Personally I want my defenders primary asset, to be the ability to defend. Get rid of both. I hope/pray Pickering can defend.

I must say that my worry is with everything I've heard about Pickering is how good he is going forward, I hope he can defend too.