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12 hours ago, roverandout said:

Agree completely but I'm sure the players were playing within themselves.  

I'm sure Germany were too....they won 7-0 ☹

Edited by Sparks Rover
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On 07/06/2021 at 13:28, RoverDom said:

Can't disagree with any of that roversfan. Henderson I think is so underated, I know he's not had minutes but he has trained a lot and he's got the mentality to not need a few games to get his brain up to speed I don't think it's a massive risk starting him but even if we didn't start him he's a grant option to bring on for the last 30mins together a but of composure. 

Id have coady instead of mings but not sure that's what Southgate is thinking. 

I couldn't call who out of Mount foden and grealish will start. I think he'll go with Mount and then one of Foden and Grealish, either of those off the bench is a hell of an option to have but I think Mount is a more well rounded player. 

 

The options up top are so strong. Kane is a given but then you've got a pick of Mount, foden, Grealish, sancho, sterling, rashford. There's a balance to be struck between those who like to come deep for the ball and those who like to run in behind. I'd probably choose rashford for that role with sterling as an option off the bench (could easily win a penalty against tired legs) sancho wasn't doing enough running behind for me last night. 

I guess you said that because we are going to go 343.... If we went 433 or 4231 we could play all of them. 

It's a terrible situation that because our defence is so poor we look like we will have to drop a top attacker for an extra mediocre defender. I can see why Southgates is doing it, but if results go badly he's going to get slaughtered.

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On 07/06/2021 at 13:17, roversfan99 said:

 

You say last 4, do you think that, assuming that we top a poor group which I would expect us to do, that a Gareth Southgate led England with Mings at CB would overcome France/Portugal/Germany then possibly Spain?

I think our squad is miles better than even 2018 and there is plenty to build around but I think that the draw is against us this year when it was perfect last time. We have some real talent but v France or Portugal we would not be favourites.

Is Mings going to be starting if Maguire isn't fit or will Coady or White play instead? Shame Gomez is injured. Mings was excellent for Villa so can't complain at his selection in squad. 

I think our squad is very good and more than capable of beating France or Portugal for me given out attacking talent and strength. 

 

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9 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

Is Mings going to be starting if Maguire isn't fit or will Coady or White play instead? Shame Gomez is injured. Mings was excellent for Villa so can't complain at his selection in squad. 

I think our squad is very good and more than capable of beating France or Portugal for me given out attacking talent and strength. 

 

Not much “ attacking talent and strength “ on show in the last two games. We were very lucky to come away with two streaky 1-0 wins.

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10 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

Is Mings going to be starting if Maguire isn't fit or will Coady or White play instead? Shame Gomez is injured. Mings was excellent for Villa so can't complain at his selection in squad. 

I think our squad is very good and more than capable of beating France or Portugal for me given out attacking talent and strength. 

 

I definitely think that in the final third, our attacking players both in our first team and the variety of options are competitive with anyone in the tournament, without doubt. There is so much to be excited about there.

I would say that our first choice team beneath that might be competitive without injuries. If that was the case, I have always felt that we have never had a top class central midfield and I think even if we come across an Italy, a Spain, a Germany or maybe even Croatia who are a bit off what they once was, I think we will struggle to get much of the ball, never mind v France. Rice has a lot of hype but I think hes very limited on the ball, Henderson clearly isnt fully fit either and beyond that, Phillips is nothing more than average and nothing too different standard wise to even players like McGinn and Soucek within much weaker opposition within the group stages. 

Defensively, a first choice of say Walker, Stones, Maguire and Shaw I think is perhaps workable but that centre is so weak beyond them and Gomez who I had forgotten about. I think Gomez and Stones are both players who have been made to look better at club level by dominant partners in Van Dijk and Dias. Mings is a million miles away from these players though, I wouldnt agree with the description as "excellent" and indeed for Villa too he always looks shaky and like he has an error in him. Coady has had a poor season especially in a central 2 and White is a late call up from the blue. Potentially changing our system to try and protect this weakness is a problem within itself and Pickford is due an international blunder.

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11 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

I definitely think that in the final third, our attacking players both in our first team and the variety of options are competitive with anyone in the tournament, without doubt. There is so much to be excited about there.

I would say that our first choice team beneath that might be competitive without injuries. If that was the case, I have always felt that we have never had a top class central midfield and I think even if we come across an Italy, a Spain, a Germany or maybe even Croatia who are a bit off what they once was, I think we will struggle to get much of the ball, never mind v France. Rice has a lot of hype but I think hes very limited on the ball, Henderson clearly isnt fully fit either and beyond that, Phillips is nothing more than average and nothing too different standard wise to even players like McGinn and Soucek within much weaker opposition within the group stages. 

Defensively, a first choice of say Walker, Stones, Maguire and Shaw I think is perhaps workable but that centre is so weak beyond them and Gomez who I had forgotten about. I think Gomez and Stones are both players who have been made to look better at club level by dominant partners in Van Dijk and Dias. Mings is a million miles away from these players though, I wouldnt agree with the description as "excellent" and indeed for Villa too he always looks shaky and like he has an error in him. Coady has had a poor season especially in a central 2 and White is a late call up from the blue. Potentially changing our system to try and protect this weakness is a problem within itself and Pickford is due an international blunder.

 

I'm still fairly optimistic for the reasons you touched upon at the start, but I can't argue with any of that really. 

I think with a lot of the (understandable) attention paid to the emergence of Foden, Mount, Grealish etc. there's a risk to miss how other teams have developed too. Italy, on the quiet, have actually got a very decent side all of a sudden after a few years of mediocrity. Portugal too have a genuinely excellent starting XI, not just Ronaldo and pals. Not massively convinced by Spain or Germany compared to their recent past, but they still have players in the middle of the park who are used to dictating games more than anybody we have in that area. Nice to know that we have options with so much pace alongside Foden & Grealish, because we might well need them against the better sides.

Having said all that, the only team I'd confidently put above England at the moment is France. They look so strong all over the pitch, you could even make an argument that a combined Anglo-French XI would just be the French team (although there would be a couple of very close calls in there, and you'd probably have Kane over Benzema). 

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1 hour ago, Admiral Nelsen said:

 

I'm still fairly optimistic for the reasons you touched upon at the start, but I can't argue with any of that really. 

I think with a lot of the (understandable) attention paid to the emergence of Foden, Mount, Grealish etc. there's a risk to miss how other teams have developed too. Italy, on the quiet, have actually got a very decent side all of a sudden after a few years of mediocrity. Portugal too have a genuinely excellent starting XI, not just Ronaldo and pals. Not massively convinced by Spain or Germany compared to their recent past, but they still have players in the middle of the park who are used to dictating games more than anybody we have in that area. Nice to know that we have options with so much pace alongside Foden & Grealish, because we might well need them against the better sides.

Having said all that, the only team I'd confidently put above England at the moment is France. They look so strong all over the pitch, you could even make an argument that a combined Anglo-French XI would just be the French team (although there would be a couple of very close calls in there, and you'd probably have Kane over Benzema). 

Remember Agincourt. It's how the person in charge deploys his assets, with a bit of luck thrown in.

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12 hours ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

Not much “ attacking talent and strength “ on show in the last two games. We were very lucky to come away with two streaky 1-0 wins.

Has Foden, Sterling, Mount, Kane played in these games? 

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11 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

 

I would say that our first choice team beneath that might be competitive without injuries. If that was the case, I have always felt that we have never had a top class central midfield and I think even if we come across an Italy, a Spain, a Germany or maybe even Croatia who are a bit off what they once was, I think we will struggle to get much of the ball, never mind v France. Rice has a lot of hype but I think hes very limited on the ball, Henderson clearly isnt fully fit either and beyond that, Phillips is nothing more than average and nothing too different standard wise to even players like McGinn and Soucek within much weaker opposition within the group stages. 

Rice is there to protect the back 4.

Against Scotland I would play Mount next to either Rice or Henderson in midfield allowing Foden into the 10 role with Grealish or Sterling to play wide right. 

I think Phillips is a good player and only getting better under Bielsa at Leeds. Playing against better players will only develop him. 

Bellingham is the other centre midfield option we could play. 

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8 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

Rice is there to protect the back 4.

Against Scotland I would play Mount next to either Rice or Henderson in midfield allowing Foden into the 10 role with Grealish or Sterling to play wide right. 

I think Phillips is a good player and only getting better under Bielsa at Leeds. Playing against better players will only develop him. 

Bellingham is the other centre midfield option we could play. 

Agree. Against teams where we will all likelihood dominate the ball, Mount alongside Rice would be my CM pair with foden and grealish also in the side. Mount also puts a shift in for chelsea and doesnt forget his defensive requirements. I think a lot of people have pigeonholed him as a no10 but he could do a job deeper. 

Had a look through all the Euro squads and other than France and Belgium theyre all much of a muchness. There are a lot of players in the Germany, Spain, Portugal squads that wouldnt make the England squad. Even Belgium have some average players. 

On paper England are right up there, just whether the players and manager have the balls to go out and perform. I suspect Southgate will go into a defensive 5 at the back shell. 

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3 hours ago, benhben said:

Agree. Against teams where we will all likelihood dominate the ball, Mount alongside Rice would be my CM pair with foden and grealish also in the side. Mount also puts a shift in for chelsea and doesnt forget his defensive requirements. I think a lot of people have pigeonholed him as a no10 but he could do a job deeper. 

Had a look through all the Euro squads and other than France and Belgium theyre all much of a muchness. There are a lot of players in the Germany, Spain, Portugal squads that wouldnt make the England squad. Even Belgium have some average players. 

On paper England are right up there, just whether the players and manager have the balls to go out and perform. I suspect Southgate will go into a defensive 5 at the back shell. 

Not one team is perfect. France have the most talented squad but I don't rate their keeper. Belgium's starting 11 is strong but an injury to one key player could really hurt them.

Spain, Germany, Italy all can have their days but aren't as strong as some of their previous teams.

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Midfield/forwards, I firmly believe England have the best all round squad in the tournament and if let loose could do serious damage.

However, at the back we look light and I suspect that will be where we come seriously unstuck. In a tight game against the top teams I can definitely see the lack of quality at CB and in goal costing us.

Edited by Displaced Rover
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3 hours ago, Displaced Rover said:

Midfield/forwards, I firmly believe England have the best all round squad in the tournament and if let loose could do serious damage.

However, at the back we look light and I suspect that will be where we come seriously unstuck. In a tight game against the top teams I can definitely see the lack of quality at CB and in goal costing us.

I think Ben White could be a star of the tournament if he plays. He looks so assured in possession.  

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3 hours ago, speeeeeeedie said:

Not one team is perfect. France have the most talented squad but I don't rate their keeper. Belgium's starting 11 is strong but an injury to one key player could really hurt them.

Spain, Germany, Italy all can have their days but aren't as strong as some of their previous teams.

They have a few players who don't play regularly at club level.  Giroud zouma rabiot tolisso. Lloris had a poor season.  Sissoko couldn't get in the spurs team. I also think Kimpembe looks like a disaster waiting to happen.  Lenglet has had a below par season.  Varane hasn't had a good season either. They do have plenty of world class players though 

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2 hours ago, roverandout said:

They have a few players who don't play regularly at club level.  Giroud zouma rabiot tolisso. Lloris had a poor season.  Sissoko couldn't get in the spurs team. I also think Kimpembe looks like a disaster waiting to happen.  Lenglet has had a below par season.  Varane hasn't had a good season either. They do have plenty of world class players though 

Meanwhile Giroud chips in with two goals against Bulgaria on Tuesday  and moves within five goals of Henrys France leading all time  goal scoring total ..

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12 hours ago, rigger said:

How do I send this quote to someone?

If you're on android, press & hold on the image, then select "share image" 

Edit: or "save image" & then share as you would usually with a photo.

Edited by windymiller7
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Colin Hendry gave me some stick on Facebook last night about using Carling and not Tennants - as if anyone cares where Carling is brewed, the joke was on the Scots it wasn't meant to be factually accurate :)

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