[Archived] Paul Ince

[Amo]

Interesting what people say about Avram Grant. Do you consider Mourinho and Scolari to be overrated then because they managed Chelsea? Grant has got a pretty good record elsewhere, you know.

[RibbleValleyRover]

Interesting what people say about Avram Grant. Do you consider Mourinho and Scolari to be overrated then because they managed Chelsea? Grant has got a pretty good record elsewhere, you know.

Not a fan of Grant. I honestly think the Chelsea team had so many leaders and such quality that it pretty much managed itself. His tactical knowledge is also questionable, his substitutions lost them the League Cup against Spurs.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

I thought the correct timescale to judge Ince on was about fifteen games and it is starting to look as though his appointment might be an extremely bold gamble which didn't pay off.

Whilst he has been unfortunate in some respects, results haven't been good enough recently and whilst I would give him a bit more time, (maybe five or six games) ultimately he has to live or die by those results.

I can't see the point in giving him that amount of time. We'd probably still struggle with in new guy in change for those games but at least he would be getting his feet under the table, we need somebody who can sort out the wheat from the chaff and that time would be invaluable for the new manager. It may be the difference when it comes to the end of the season.

[Bobby G]

5 or 6 more games and could be bottom by Christmas...

Do you see the confidence in this team to recover from that?

[Amo]

When you think what Ince quipped during his press conference 'not yet anyway[in the bottom three]', it makes our position even more embarrassing. Even more so from his point of view.

[Jordan]

In my opinion anyone who thinks that 1) Signing Fowler would improve our team 2) Bringing a defensive coach, Winterburn, who no one wanted to employ for 4 years and 3) Signs League 2 players to play in the first team of a premier league team, needs their heads checking.

Was not keen on the Ince appointment at the beginning and that certainly has not changed. It is just an amature set up with the management and you can tell that on the pitch with the poor substitutions and by playing players out of position. It really does remind me of when Souness was in his last few months as manager.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

Another thing that bothers me- he must watch these players in training everyday - by now he should know his best 11 yet he's continually switching the team around like he,s only just arrived.

[Majiball]

No he will not split the fans so much anymore. In the summer it would have been a divisive signing it is true but Ince´s short reign has taken the sting out of it. Now I suspect many of those initially set against BFS would rather have anyone than Ince.

Get in BFS. While he carries a lot of baggage and it might not be pretty it is the natural choice.

I'm not so sure. He hardly did a decent job at Newcastle, weren't the players revolting? We'd be stuck with him, and while I can to a point see his benefits at this moment in time, I don't in the future. We'll play 451 and hit long balls up to RSC, I'm sure I've seen that somewhere before.

Would big Sam inspire players? he didn't at Newcastle when confronted with big name players. Could he do it to ours, RSC, MPG, Benni, Robinson, Samba, Emerton, Warnock all the players we now need to get us up the league, I have serious reservations. We're going to need some players in, and whilst we need battlers (which is what we would get with BFS) what we lack is pace and creativity. We have enough work horses we need some class, I don't see BFS snaring what we need.

We are currently playing a lot of long balls, I've seen it for a while now we look to hit the front man at every opportunity (Robbo you have the option to throw). Would BFS just not do the same?

[Bobby G]

And we cant keep on chopping and changing the lineup each and every week with the same players playing in different positions. Thats exactly like the nonesense Souness was doing in the crisis era at the end of his reign.

[Majiball]

When you think what Ince quipped during his press conference 'not yet anyway[in the bottom three]', it makes our position even more embarrassing. Even more so from his point of view.

Its a conspiracy!!!

Ferguson helped Ince get the job with the intent of exacting revenge for our league triumph and refusal to sell him Shearer. He recommended Knox, Simpson and we all that Fergie never forgets nor forgives.

[Amo]

At least that would make sense.

[gillibrand]

And there in lies the dilemma!

Does anyone on here really think BFS is the answer then your wrong. He may have relegation experience and have worked in similiar circumstances to those at Rovers, but he will split the fans more than Ince ever did. Curbishley, does not inspire nor will it get bums back on seats. There are some good eggs out there, Brown at Hull has impressed. Would Advocaat leave Zenith? Laudrup only has 14 months left on his contract. Deschamps? Christ I'd even take Keegan over BFS.

If Ince cannot pull it round we have to think big. If that means the board dipping in they'll have too, relegation will cost then even more. I'm sure I've read it cost them over 20M last time, spending 5-10M to avoid it on top of what we already have makes sense.

YES!

[roverfanuk]

Grant - would love it but wont happen in a million years.

Shearer - cant afford another one like ince, but wouldent surprise me.

Curbs - More realistic, good option.

Fat Sam - still no thanks.

Mancini - JW wouldent have the bottle to go for someone like that.

Tugay - player manager? - would love it, but not sure it would be the right option.

Boothroyd - no i dnt think he be good enough either.

Ramos - YES, one of the best options, just give him the money and ley him deciede the team, unlike spuds did.

Vialli - nope

King Kenny - that would be a story and a half, but nope

Tony Parkes - again would be a great story but no again.

Agree completely with that. However their were rumours going around that Grant was cold with his Chelsea team, and a manager who struggles with his team is exactly what we don't need at the moment.

Curbs, Mancini and Ramos would be at the top of my list. But i have a feeling Mancini's and Ramos's wages would be too high.

Quick question, considering Ince's 3 year deal. How much do people think his compensation would be if we game him the boot?

It's going to be somewhere in the region of 3-4 million isn't it?

Edit: Let me add, what we need now is a experienced manager, and not a trainee manager. We can't be gambling the clubs future in training new managers who when they get good, will soon be approached by other teams anyway!

[mattyboy6000]

What needs doing is self evident from the responses so far on this thread. note there's no vehement disputes, its pretty one sided

what we need desperately is a manager, which ince evidently isn't.

either sparky (iff citeh offload him) or BFS. I appreciate a lot of people's views on sam are coloured by his association with notlob, the miserable @#/? football they often played, and the corruption issue. but the bolton fans i know love him. he's well ahead of the game with the sports science, which looking at the players thesedays the current setup isn't. his man-management skills are tried and tested, the only question marks arising from the notoriously fickle, delusional perspective that is that of the newcastle fan. Sam's not perfect but I genuinely believe he is the man for the job (unless sparky becomes available)

the trustee who was running around in the summer saying "sam over my dead body" needs to make sure he doesn't get above his station.

[LDRover]

There's too many who I would consider intelligent people wanting the same thing for the majority opinion to be wrong.

The cull should be swift and decisive, every minute it doesn't happen is a wasted one.

[Majiball]

It's going to be somewhere in the region of 3-4 million isn't it?

Given we have a liking for contract clauses, I hope we put one in Ince's. I thought he was on 1.5M over three years, so about right 3-4M. Don't forget though we would also have compo for the ones who are booted out as well. I wouldn't be surprised if sacking Ince and co if thats where we end up costs about 5M+, thats a decent premiership player!

[DingleBaiter]

Martinez

Keegan

Grant

Shearer

Curbs

Fat Sam

Gullit

Mancini

Tugay - player manager?

Boothroyd

Ramos

Vialli

King Kenny

Tony Parkes

This really is a Catch 22 - if a manager is 'available' then it generally means he's out of work, clearly for a reason.

The crux of the matter was Rovers went for Ince supposedly with one eye on the future, especially with a mandate to bring youth through. Perhaps that - and the rumoured 'cheap option' - was influenced by curtailing future financial support? Anyways, we're now sadly at a point where we have to balance the future against the present.

The very fact we're now seriously contemplating potting a manager so soon and looking at a stop-gap solution to avoid relegation shows how alarming the situation truly is. We can't score, can't keep a clean sheet, have no bottle, no tactics of any sort, and we can't even pick players in the correct positions - why do we need a manager, the washer woman can do as bad a job as he is, based on yesterday?

I have grave concerns over any future that involves the Bolton Butcher at my club. However, I've now grave concerns over the present under Ince as I see our future being in the Championship, based on too many basics wrong yesterday.

Allardyce hasn't a great history apart from Bolton - he's taken two clubs down (one when he came late on) - so it's not a given he's a relegation battler. One look at his Newcastle tenure clearly shows the same faults Ince faces (injuries, players out of position, instant unpopularity with fans, unsettled dressing room, strange tactics, stubborness & lack of leadership) so it's nowhere near a given he'd be a solution.

So, do we be brave and try and select a manager we'd want in long-term to work within our present environment? Or do we get a firefighter? Or do we hope that it's a measure of the eccentricity of one game, and come back with some results and turn the corner?

The real worry IMO is we may be damned if we do, damned if we don't, as I can't think of a serious contender that will come anything close to ticking all the boxes. Let's not kid ourselves these supposed successful international coaches such as Ten Cate, Mancini, Laudrup, Advocaat etc. (even if we were lucky enough to be able to speak with them) would be able to come in and address the 'muck and bullets' we need, or - more tellingly - would want to? Wonderful if someone like Mancini was crackers enough to come here, but hardly one for the realists - doubt he would be interested, and doubt we'd be bold enough to.

I think there would be a tendency to be looking at British-type, industrial/agricultural managers who can motivate players and scrap, which may fit for the short-term and keep us up, but won't it prove ultimately limiting?

The fella that I think I'd be looking at is Martin Jol (he's almost a Brit), has a good knowledge of the Prem and international football, has been consistent and managed big squads/players well. He's also 'nuts and bolts' enough to get in amongst a squad and get them to scrap. Second to that may be the Croatian manager, based on his time at West Ham & Everton and the spirit he clearly instills in his side, one game against England aside of course.

However, I'm still not 100% convinced, on one game only (IMO), sacking Ince is the solution. I'd like to hope (no matter how unrealistic) yesterday was just a 'bad day at the office' as someone else in his position said a few times last season (and we kept hold of him). That said, I've serious doubts if things can't improve somehow, and feel we're owed some intervention either from JW or Ince to apologise for that drivel and reassure us.

So, it's a 'stick' - for now ............

[Amo]

Damn. I'd forgotten all about Advocaat. The guy who was disappointed he didn't get the job last time, and still wants to manage in the Premiership.

[Majiball]

either sparky (iff citeh offload him) or BFS. I appreciate a lot of people's views on sam are coloured by his association with notlob, the miserable @#/? football they often played, and the corruption issue. but the bolton fans i know love him. he's well ahead of the game with the sports science, which looking at the players thesedays the current setup isn't. his man-management skills are tried and tested, the only question marks arising from the notoriously fickle, delusional perspective that is that of the newcastle fan. Sam's not perfect but I genuinely believe he is the man for the job (unless sparky becomes available)

the trustee who was running around in the summer saying "sam over my dead body" needs to make sure he doesn't get above his station.

Hughes will not come back. That bridge has been burnt given the stories in the press, one would assume. Miserable @#/? football and the corruption issue combined with his very public failure at Newcastle do not fill me with any hope. Just so you know I would never have said Sam was a the cutting edge of sports science he's a strong believer in it, but I think you'll Find his head of sports science at both Bolton and Newcastle is already on the books at Rovers, Mark Howard.

[roverfanuk]

This really is a Catch 22 - if a manager is 'available' then it generally means he's out of work, clearly for a reason.

Bearing in mind you have managers such as Curbs, Grant and Keagan who all got sacked for lame reasons. Ie, Curbs (lack of transfer funds - He didnt do badly with his team), Grant (Chelsea - Nuff said!) and Keagan (his hate for the clubs owner). Their are other managers who im sure would do a great job. Granted some of them are either still in a job or on expensive wages. Such as Bilic or Mancini!

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

Given we have a liking for contract clauses, I hope we put one in Ince's. I thought he was on 1.5M over three years, so about right 3-4M. Don't forget though we would also have compo for the ones who are booted out as well. I wouldn't be surprised if sacking Ince and co if thats where we end up costs about 5M+, thats a decent premiership player!

Scandalous,that amount of money to folk who have basically destroyed years of good work....well and truly taken to the cleaners.

What a horrible mess this is turning out to be.

[andrew92]

http://www.teamtalk.com/football/story/0,1...4499120,00.html

this shows how much of a pillok he is, he ounds like a prat (and looks like one in the picture), this is from before the sunderland game, it made me chuckle!

[joey_big_nose]

Another thing that bothers me- he must watch these players in training everyday - by now he should know his best 11 yet he's continually switching the team around like he,s only just arrived.

To be fair that is more to do with injuries than choice. I am pretty sure if he could this is the team he would put out and stick to:

--------------Cruz--McCarthy

Pedersen---------Dunn---------Emerton

-------------------Grella

Warnock---Nelsen---Samba---Simpson

------------------Robinson

Injuries have meant that he can't do that and has to pick a new team every game. That said dealing with injuries is part of the game. And Ince has not coped well- rushing players back and so on.

[Majiball]

Scandalous,that amount of money to folk who have basically destroyed years of good work....well and truly taken to the cleaners.

What a horrible mess this is turning out to be.

It is isn't it!

The same amount we got for Hughes! I'm still praying for contract clauses. If not and we decide he has to go, how big an impact will paying out that kind of cash have on our transfer budget? We all know we are a few players short, gates are dropping drastically, credit crunch and all that, the price always goes up in Jan as well. Bed of Roses.

Doesn't Ince's contract contain clauses with reference to his badges? he should be having an assessment soon, I wonder how much it would cost, to pre-arrange the grade he gets????

[Exiled in Toronto]

Some of the names being touted on this thread are seriously deluded. Take a look at who other clubs of our ilk managed to recruit when in dire straits:

Wigan - Brucey

Bolton - Megson

Mighty Newcastle - Kinnear

Even Top 4 next year Spurs went for their least exotic manager for yonks.

We had our chance to shop in Harrod's in the summer; now we're in Aldi. Beggars can't be choosers.