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Just now, Paul said:

I don't know. Has it?

Yes. All matchday prices went up by £3 and STs were frozen.

Based on Riverside

£19 is now £22

£22 is now £25

Then there was the creation of the rip off A+ which is a massive £36 or £40 in the BBE.

The emphasis is on improving the value for money of the ST, now worth 10 free games.

 

https://www.rovers.co.uk/news/2019/july/matchday-prices-2019-20/

 

But if you still can't afford a ST or you will miss lots of games so don't find it worthwhile, it doesn't address the 20K empty seats. That's why sales didn't improve.

 

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4 hours ago, OldEwoodBlue said:

But do you both accept you may be in the minority amongst our ST holders ?

And as we are fundamentally discussing ways to increase attendances...

Do you think there are people who would buy if they could pay over 12 months or are you not assed as long as you are personally OK ?

It's a question which can't be answered either way. Those who pay upfront may be the majority.

I see no problem with people paying over twelve months. I'm sure there would be people who buy in those circumstances.

My only issue with any iniative is it should be equally shared amongst all supporters. That is where the difficulty lays with many ideas. There is no reason why I as an existing, long-standing ST holder should not receive the same benefits.

If for example match day prices drop to £20 I expect my ST price to drop pro rata. This is the difficulty. Dropping match day prices requires a massive uplift in sales just to replace the lost value of STs. With walk ons there is no guarantee how often they will attend thus making the calculation of how many are needed to compensate for lost ST revenue almost impossible to calculate.

Edited by Paul

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Just now, JoeH said:

1,100 people didn't renew season tickets this year. I'd hazard a guess to say that over 75% of those people probably put that down to financial and personal issues. 

700 NEW people bought season tickets this year. If we didn't lose those 1,100, we'd have gained 700 ST holders from last year.

A loyalty scheme would help retain current ST holders, whilst allowing us to bring in new ST holders.

You might find quite a few of them died. 

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Just now, Paul said:

It's a question which can't be answered either way. Those who pay upfront may be the majority.

I see no problem with people paying over twelve months. I'm sure there would be people who buy in those circumstances.

My only issue with any iniative is it should be equally shared amongst all supporters. That is where the difficulty lays with many ideas. There is no reason why I as an existing, long-standing ST holder should not receive the same benefits.

If for example match day prices drop to £20 I expect my ST price to drop pro rata. This is the difficulty. Dropping match day prices requires a massive uplift in sales just to replace the lost value of STs. With walk ons there is no guarantee how often they will attend thus making the calculation of how many are needed to compensate for lost ST revenue almost impossible to calculate.

The ultimate answer to increasing attendances is not in the walk ons. It is in getting regular ST holder numbers up.

We have 8600 ST holders and 2000-3000 walk ons.

e.g. Huddersfield have 18000 ST holders and only 2000 matchday tickets available.

The fact that their walk on tickets are limited ensures they are in demand and often sell out.

We need to be aiming for these exact numbers.

 

ST holders should generally be supportive of every effort to get more bodies in the ground and improve the experience you get for your ST money ?

i.e. the value for money of your ST goes up pro rata if the ground is full and has a great atmosphere ?

It isn't a race to the bottom Paul.

 

 

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1 hour ago, OldEwoodBlue said:

The ultimate answer to increasing attendances is not in the walk ons. It is in getting regular ST holder numbers up.

We have 8600 ST holders and 2000-3000 walk ons.

e.g. Huddersfield have 18000 ST holders and only 2000 matchday tickets available.

The fact that their walk on tickets are limited ensures they are in demand and often sell out.

We need to be aiming for these exact numbers.

 

ST holders should generally be supportive of every effort to get more bodies in the ground and improve the experience you get for your ST money ?

i.e. the value for money of your ST goes up pro rata if the ground is full and has a great atmosphere ?

It isn't a race to the bottom Paul.

 

 

And they started it all by slashing prices across the board although i don't know what they charge now but it worked initially.

Average sized northern working class town, small but solid hardcore with thousands more in the woodwork because of many lean years, ring any bells ?

An ambitious thinking out the box managerial recruitment with a nice brand of football helped and vice versa i'd wager with big crowds helping drive them to the Prem.

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6 hours ago, OldEwoodBlue said:

The ultimate answer to increasing attendances is not in the walk ons. It is in getting regular ST holder numbers up.

We have 8600 ST holders and 2000-3000 walk ons.

e.g. Huddersfield have 18000 ST holders and only 2000 matchday tickets available.

The fact that their walk on tickets are limited ensures they are in demand and often sell out.

We need to be aiming for these exact numbers.

 

ST holders should generally be supportive of every effort to get more bodies in the ground and improve the experience you get for your ST money ?

i.e. the value for money of your ST goes up pro rata if the ground is full and has a great atmosphere ?

It isn't a race to the bottom Paul.

 

 

I've had a brief look at the Huddersfield website re tickets. It looks very positive and well marketed. The difference between an ST at £10.49/game and a match day ticket at £30 is massive. At £249 the ST is a no brainer. If the object is simply to fill the ground it has worked.

There doesn't appear to be any differential pricing by stand. If Rovers did the same thing all I can say is not a single fan would have the right to complain - at all. Would we do it? I just don't know but I do wonder if it would bring in another 8-10,000 fans. I feel the reasons people stay away go much deeper than price.

I don't accept your argument re improving my match day experience because there are more fans in the ground. I'm supportive of anything Rovers do to increase sales. Yes more fans would improve the atmosphere. I cannot be expected to pay for that.

However I cannot see any reason why as an ST holder of 37+ years who has stuck with the club throughout the last ten years I should not receive a good deal pro rata with the ticket pricing. There has been plenty of chat on here about Rovers upsetting fans by moving them etc. If the club want to upset me then cutting prices and failing to pro rata that to ST holders will do it. I am not prepared to pay more, pro rata, to effectively subsidise those who have chosen to stay away for ten years.

If the club had a similar policy to Huddersfield and every ST holder got in for, say, £10 I could happily live with that. £10 would be a slight price increase for me. As a senior my ST is £215 but my lad pays £349.

Edited by Paul

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Just now, Paul said:

I've had a brief look at the Huddersfield website re tickets. It looks very positive and well marketed. The difference between an ST £10.49/game and a match day ticket at £30 is massive. At £249 the ST is a no brainer. If the object is simply to fill the ground it has worked.

There doesn't appear to be any differential pricing by stand. If Rovers did the same thing all I can say is not a single fan would have the right to complain - at all. Would we do it? I just don't know but I do wonder if it would bring in another 8-10,000 fans. I feel the reasons people stay away go much deeper than price.

I don't accept your argument re improving my match day experience because there are more fans in the ground. I'm supportive of anything Rovers do to increase sales. Yes more fans would improve the atmosphere.

However I cannot see any reason why as an ST holder of 37+ years who has stuck with the club throughout the last ten years I should not receive a good deal pro rata with the ticket pricing. There has been plenty of chat on here about Rovers upsetting fans by moving them etc. If the club want to upset me then cutting prices and failing to pro rata that to ST holders will do it. I am not prepared to pay more, pro rata, to effectively subsidise those who have chosen to stay away for ten years.

If the club had a similar policy to Huddersfield and every ST holder got in for, say, £10 I could happily live with that. £10 would be a slight price increase for me. As a senior my ST is £215 but my lad pays £349.

Sorry Paul but that’s such a one-eyed view.

I would absolutely support a pricing regime that all adult STs were £249.

Why would you think it’s ok for someone to pay £399, an excess of £150 and subsidising 70% of your £215 ticket, but you’d begrudge them (and more importantly new and returning fans) paying £150 less because you had to pay £44 more subsidising them by less than 20%?

Time now you and your lad cost £564. Under such a scheme you’d pay £498. Talk about cutting off your nose to spite you face!

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@Stuart I think you are taking the sentence you have highlighted and applied it to the following paragraph.

To be clear my position is this. If the club were to cut the price of match day tickets then as an ST holder I would expect my ST to reduce pro rata. I have yet to read an argument which justifies long-standing ST holders not benefitting to the same Ievel as other fans.

If the club decide to sell ALL season tickets at £249 I have no problem with that even though I would be paying £34 more than I do today.

I'm afraid I don't follow your maths in the second paragraph. In the JWL a full ST is £349 and a senior £215. I'm not sure what your other figures are saying.

Seniors receiving lower prices is embedded in our society. I get a discount at the barbers, on the train, cinema, everywhere. It's not a subsidy it's what businesses chose to do.

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Just now, OldEwoodBlue said:

Nothing more to add yer honour

😃😃😃

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Just now, Paul said:

@Stuart I think you are taking the sentence you have highlighted and applied it to the following paragraph.

To be clear my position is this. If the club were to cut the price of match day tickets then as an ST holder I would expect my ST to reduce pro rata. I have yet to read an argument which justifies long-standing ST holders not benefitting to the same Ievel as other fans.

If the club decide to sell ALL season tickets at £249 I have no problem with that even though I would be paying £34 more than I do today.

I'm afraid I don't follow your maths in the second paragraph. In the JWL a full ST is £349 and a senior £215. I'm not sure what your other figures are saying.

Seniors receiving lower prices is embedded in our society. I get a discount at the barbers, on the train, cinema, everywhere. It's not a subsidy it's what businesses chose to do.

It wasn’t clear that your pro rata was as a senior citizen just a long-standing season ticket holder.

But in any case, should seniors automatically get a discount on luxury items which a ST is? You don’t get a cheaper price on a smart phone. This goes back to days when senior citizens were scraping by on meagre state pensions. More and more pensioners are now on very good private pensions and have enough cash to go on month long holidays several times a year. My Facebook feed is full of them.

But I digress.

The maths was to compare the subsidy you would pay at a flat ‘cheap’ adult price compared to the subsidy others are already paying towards your lower cost ticket today.

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Just now, Stuart said:

It wasn’t clear that your pro rata was as a senior citizen just a long-standing season ticket holder.

But in any case, should seniors automatically get a discount on luxury items which a ST is? You don’t get a cheaper price on a smart phone. This goes back to days when senior citizens were scraping by on meagre state pensions. More and more pensioners are now on very good private pensions and have enough cash to go on month long holidays several times a year. My Facebook feed is full of them.

But I digress.

The maths was to compare the subsidy you would pay at a flat ‘cheap’ adult price compared to the subsidy others are already paying towards your lower cost ticket today.

Whether or not seniors should get a discount on luxury items is not relevant and nothing to do with me. I don't ask for it, the club offers and I accept. Yes you're right it does go back a long way.

I'm afraid I still don't follow your maths. It's often complicated and whether I follow it or not doesn't really matter. The key point is no other fan is subsidising me or any other senior. We pay what the club asks of us. My point is simple it is wrong if the club reduces prices to attract returning fans and does not pass on the same reduction to existing ST holders. Can you justify this? I cannot think of a single reason why someone coming back after 10 years, for example, should get a better deal than the thousands who have stood by the club in that time.

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Just now, Paul said:

My point is simple it is wrong if the club reduces prices to attract returning fans and does not pass on the same reduction to existing ST holders. Can you justify this? I cannot think of a single reason why someone coming back after 10 years, for example, should get a better deal than the thousands who have stood by the club in that time.

We are possibly at cross-purposes - I’m not sure.

If the club were to introduce a flat £249 ST, this should be for all fans - new and existing including long-standing. I would not expect long-standing fans to pay £200 as some kind of loyalty discount. Although that would be grand, I would not expect it.

If you think I am advocating us exist ST holders to pay £399 and new buys to be £249, for instance, then no that’s not what I’m saying at all.

We need to get new fans into the ground but it needs to be a strategy that offers the same price for everyone.

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8 minutes ago, pk1875 said:

The twelve payment debate, would it have made me renew our tickets? quite probably yes.

Playing attractive attacking football would it make me renew my ticket ? Definitely.

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On 09/10/2019 at 09:23, rigger said:

Playing attractive attacking football would it make me renew my ticket ? Definitely.

And this, in a nutshell, is my biggest issue as well. I have to travel a 500 mile round trip to home games but the last 4 or 5 years have really disheartened me. Its like groundhog day every time. 

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Just now, oldjamfan1 said:

And this, in a nutshell, is my biggest issue as well. I have to travel a 500 mile round trip to home games but the last 4 or 5 years have really disheartened me. Its like groundhog day every time. 

My biggest issue is.......driving along Livesey Branch knowing, just knowing that this task is way beyond Tony. Just knowing that game after game it’s square pegs in round holes, play that is far too slow and a plan ?? ....what plan. 
I drive home thoroughly depressed...knowing, just knowing that his interview will say “ we got positives from that ,and, we go again next week” 

Tony, we get nothing positive from you or the boys “ on the grass” ....more depressing by the week. Don’t tell me I’m after glorious promotion...Im after a manager who I can believe in. Lovely man....job too big.....season tickets will continue to decline

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People dont mind being bored if they're winning. The 3 points mitigates the boredom. The problem is that it's not only boring; its losing or at best drawing football, so the boredom is what you remember. 

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