Attendances

[Paul]

1 hour ago, blueboy3333 said:

If fans on the fans forum don't represent the fans it needs disbanding. I'm not sure I could personally stomach being in the presence of a fan arguing against price cuts. 

The Fans Forum was set up as a sounding board and discussion forum not to represent the fans. It's very difficult for the FF to claim to represent the fans as it is an unelected body. The moment such claims are made supporters would be up in arms saying the FF don't represent me. Its happened in the past and would happen again.

It boils down to this. You're happy to criticise from the sidelines but don't actually care enough to stand up and do something. If you disagree with o2g the obvious thing to do is to be present at the FF meetings and argue the opposing case. Or would that require more effort than sitting at a keyboard? From my recollection o2g has been giving up his time to the FF for 16 years.........and you?

 

[blueboy3333]

Just now, Paul said:

It boils down to this. You're happy to criticise from the sidelines but don't actually care enough to stand up and do something. If you disagree with o2g the obvious thing to do is to be present at the FF meetings and argue the opposing case. Or would that require more effort than sitting at a keyboard? From my recollection o2g has been giving up his time to the FF for 16 years.........and you?

Silly argument. I'm criticising his views not the length of time he has been doing something.

You know this is a forum right, where the views he posted on THIS forum can be criticised? 

[Paul]

46 minutes ago, Franky said:

What is the point of asking ST holders what they think ?

They have already proclaimed they will renew no matter what.

 

Try asking lapsed ST holders like myself why they are not going back.

Isn’t the thread about how to increase attendances ?

The argument is Rovers should reduce walk on prices. If the club do this to a significant level, it appears £15-20 is the expected price, this has the potential to upset ST holders. Therefore the obvious thing to do is ask season ticket holders what benefits they would like to receive. If a walk on price reduced to £15-20 I would expect my ST price to reduce to around £10 unless the club give me something else.

Why aren't you going back? You've clearly created an account just to discuss this, so what are your reasons for not buying an ST?

[Paul]

1 minute ago, blueboy3333 said:

Silly argument. I'm criticising his views not the length of time he has been doing something.

You know this is a forum right, where the views he posted on THIS forum can be criticised? 

Scroll up the thread and review the arguments you have put forward this evening. If you believe something is wrong and you care sufficiently about it then get involved. People who sit on the sidelines and snipe "I'm not sure I could personally stomach being in the presence of a fan arguing against price cuts. " need to get involved or be quiet.

[blueboy3333]

Just now, Paul said:

Scroll up the thread and review the arguments you have put forward this evening. If you believe something is wrong and you care sufficiently about it then get involved. People who sit on the sidelines and snipe "I'm not sure I could personally stomach being in the presence of a fan arguing against price cuts. " need to get involved or be quiet.

Nope, people who write on a forum need to be prepared to be responded to. Trying to shut down debate is very Trump-esque. You need to accept other opinions or be quiet.

[DeeCee]

There's no need to cut ST prices dramatically, combine a marketing campaign of promotion of all things Ewood, connect with the local and not so local fan base, aggressive, dynamic, passionate marketing should be used imo, people at the club should already be doing this. If there are any that fit the spec?

[47er]

3 hours ago, Paul said:

The Fans Forum was set up as a sounding board and discussion forum not to represent the fans. It's very difficult for the FF to claim to represent the fans as it is an unelected body. The moment such claims are made supporters would be up in arms saying the FF don't represent me. Its happened in the past and would happen again.

It boils down to this. You're happy to criticise from the sidelines but don't actually care enough to stand up and do something. If you disagree with o2g the obvious thing to do is to be present at the FF meetings and argue the opposing case. Or would that require more effort than sitting at a keyboard? From my recollection o2g has been giving up his time to the FF for 16 years.........and you?

 

So its called the Fans Forum but it does not represent the fans? Who does it represent then?

[tomphil]

Personally I understand it from both sides, club and fans, we all want the same thing - bigger gates but we all want good enough revenue to help run the club.

Right now i'd look at the walk on prices just for certain games with the aim being fan re-engagement in some biggies rather than just maximising takings from those one offs.

Little things like trying to get say the Wigan game back to 15 quid at both grounds, try something like £20 in the BBE lower and Roverside for the Bolton/PNE fixtures. Target the games people want to go to most and where a big crowd would be guaranteed.  22k+ potential at those two with a bit of imagination  even if we all aren't doing that great.  Can't see PNE filling it this season as it is and Bolton might be as little as 2k visitors so get the place filled up for some proper derbys again these games sell themselves at the right price.

[old darwen blue]

Or give us Darren Enders our seats back?

[Mattyblue]

I get the impression that ship’s sailed for the foreseeable, even if promoted, as you’d imagine Waggott would be rubbing his hands at the potential away followings.....

[Stuart]

The benefit I would appreciate as a ST holds is stop lazily putting the price up by £50 every year. Even worse telling me that I’m benefiting in some way if I buy early.

If the argument is that lower prices won’t bring many in then, by logical extension, higher prices won’t put many off. So why not just keep squeezing and squeezing  until people stop buying then look at reducing them again. That must be in Waggott’s head given the behaviours so far. Fans of THIS club have stuck by it through some very bad times and as soon as we turn a corner - hammer their wallets. Some even think this is the right time to do it!! It’s a two way street, lest some forget.

Hugely disappointing if members of the FF are suggesting to, or even agreeing with, the club on not lowering prices. They aren’t going to be innovative if they aren’t put under any pressure.

I don’t agree with the “if you don’t like it, step up” statements either. That should not be an excuse to not be held accountable. And if a fans forum aren’t accountable the fellow fans then who are they accountable to? It’s a fan committee not a club committee - or at least that is the perception.

Poor show.

[47er]

The Fan's Forum has an ideal opportunity to relate to fans over pricing. There have been plenty of good ideas to take forward.

But, they hardly seem to be champing at the bit do they, judging from comments on here?

[JBiz]

1 hour ago, Stuart said:

The benefit I would appreciate as a ST holds is stop lazily putting the price up by £50 every year. Even worse telling me that I’m benefiting in some way if I buy early.

If the argument is that lower prices won’t bring many in then, by logical extension, higher prices won’t put many off. So why not just keep squeezing and squeezing  until people stop buying then look at reducing them again. That must be in Waggott’s head given the behaviours so far. Fans of THIS club have stuck by it through some very bad times and as soon as we turn a corner - hammer their wallets. Some even think this is the right time to do it!! It’s a two way street, lest some forget.

Hugely disappointing if members of the FF are suggesting to, or even agreeing with, the club on not lowering prices. They aren’t going to be innovative if they aren’t put under any pressure.

I don’t agree with the “if you don’t like it, step up” statements either. That should not be an excuse to not be held accountable. And if a fans forum aren’t accountable the fellow fans then who are they accountable to? It’s a fan committee not a club committee - or at least that is the perception.

Poor show.

Are on on the FF? 

[JHRover]

On ‎27‎/‎10‎/‎2018 at 23:19, tomphil said:

Personally I understand it from both sides, club and fans, we all want the same thing - bigger gates but we all want good enough revenue to help run the club.

Right now i'd look at the walk on prices just for certain games with the aim being fan re-engagement in some biggies rather than just maximising takings from those one offs.

Little things like trying to get say the Wigan game back to 15 quid at both grounds, try something like £20 in the BBE lower and Roverside for the Bolton/PNE fixtures. Target the games people want to go to most and where a big crowd would be guaranteed.  22k+ potential at those two with a bit of imagination  even if we all aren't doing that great.  Can't see PNE filling it this season as it is and Bolton might be as little as 2k visitors so get the place filled up for some proper derbys again these games sell themselves at the right price.

 

Encouraging people to turn up en masse for a derby game v Preston or Bolton would likely send the coppers and staff at Rovers into panic mode and meltdown. I bet if they did something like make these games the local promotions and offer tickets at £10 or £15 a person the immediate response would be to move kick off forward. For some reason the prospect of an above average crowd sends the club, council, police etc. into meltdown with warnings issued via the Telegraph etc.

I'm afraid it is the priority of most people involved in the process not to get as many people as possible into the ground but to ensure the game passes without any issues or difficulties. Throwing the doors open to potentially thousands of walk on fans many of whom would be considered 'unsavoury' types out for a day on the beer or to hurl abuse at the away team isn't what the powers-that-be want. They want everything to be predictable and run smoothly.

[only2garners]

On 27/10/2018 at 19:40, Paul said:

The Fans Forum was set up as a sounding board and discussion forum not to represent the fans. It's very difficult for the FF to claim to represent the fans as it is an unelected body. The moment such claims are made supporters would be up in arms saying the FF don't represent me. Its happened in the past and would happen again.

It boils down to this. You're happy to criticise from the sidelines but don't actually care enough to stand up and do something. If you disagree with o2g the obvious thing to do is to be present at the FF meetings and argue the opposing case. Or would that require more effort than sitting at a keyboard? From my recollection o2g has been giving up his time to the FF for 16 years.........and you?

 

It will be 12 years in January Paul.

As Paul says, the Forum can not be representative. I don't think there is a way to get a truly representative group of fans - there is no way to develop a true constituency from which to choose one.

But we do make efforts to try and represent what fans as a whole are thinking. A number of different groups have a rep on the Forum for example. I try and raise points even if I don't personally agree with them, if I believe that the point is widely held.

3 hours ago, Stuart said:

Hugely disappointing if members of the FF are suggesting to, or even agreeing with, the club on not lowering prices. They aren’t going to be innovative if they aren’t put under any pressure.

 

Who is suggesting that the Forum is agreeing with the club on not lowering prices? I made a point about the practicality of one extreme example of price reduction, which apart from Ozz's post, I don't think posters have been suggesting anyway. that doesn't mean that I, or anyone else on the Forum is opposed to price reductions.

I think what I would say is that the club have two factors that need to be taken into account when discussing admission prices. Firstly, they are not going to do anything that would significantly reduce total ticket revenue. Secondly any proposals need to make sure that the price promise for season ticket holders is not compromised i.e. that St holders will always have the cheapest tickets overall.

1 hour ago, 47er said:

The Fan's Forum has an ideal opportunity to relate to fans over pricing. There have been plenty of good ideas to take forward.

But, they hardly seem to be champing at the bit do they, judging from comments on here?

I don't understand this - what do you expect Forum members to do? The next meeting is two weeks tonight - what would you want me to be doing now?

We had a long discussion about attendances at the last meeting in September - before this thread was started.

[Mattyblue]

My season ticket was £349, let’s say an average match ticket is £24, x23 is £552, so plenty of slack there for a few offers.

[tomphil]

1 hour ago, JHRover said:

 

Encouraging people to turn up en masse for a derby game v Preston or Bolton would likely send the coppers and staff at Rovers into panic mode and meltdown. I bet if they did something like make these games the local promotions and offer tickets at £10 or £15 a person the immediate response would be to move kick off forward. For some reason the prospect of an above average crowd sends the club, council, police etc. into meltdown with warnings issued via the Telegraph etc.

I'm afraid it is the priority of most people involved in the process not to get as many people as possible into the ground but to ensure the game passes without any issues or difficulties. Throwing the doors open to potentially thousands of walk on fans many of whom would be considered 'unsavoury' types out for a day on the beer or to hurl abuse at the away team isn't what the powers-that-be want. They want everything to be predictable and run smoothly.

Very true the suits and coppers pick up the same wages whether the crowd is five thousand or twenty five thousand so why do they care ? The easier the better, this is what happens when you don't have a real driving force in upper office but i'm sure TM and the players would side with the fans on this so maybe Mowbray is the man to pitch it to at the FF and get him putting pressure on those above, Sam played his part in wanting crowds boosted when he was here.

As for all the logistics etc well it's all been done before many times without too much bother there's been a club there for over a hundred years and it's never had a rep for hooliganism really.  In fact the game v Bolton when we missed two pens was ten quid a ticket at 3pm with about 26k on and I don't recall any issues.

It's the idleness and penny pinching that ruins what should be major events for the club and town economy not any real threat of big trouble that's just their way of trying to justify it.

Edited October 29, 2018 by tomphil

[Stuart]

1 hour ago, only2garners said:

Who is suggesting that the Forum is agreeing with the club on not lowering prices? I made a point about the practicality of one extreme example of price reduction, which apart from Ozz's post, I don't think posters have been suggesting anyway. that doesn't mean that I, or anyone else on the Forum is opposed to price reductions.

I think what I would say is that the club have two factors that need to be taken into account when discussing admission prices. Firstly, they are not going to do anything that would significantly reduce total ticket revenue. Secondly any proposals need to make sure that the price promise for season ticket holders is not compromised i.e. that St holders will always have the cheapest tickets overall.

Pleased to hear that. It would be a strange scenario, hence the ‘if’.

It’s great that STs will still be the cheaper option. I guess the downside is that means if ST prices continue to increase then walk-ones will become ridiculously expensive.

The quality on display isn’t a patch on what it was in Mark Hughes’ day. The calibre of player and opposition worse than even Allardyce’s time. Yet we are close to double the ST prices. Whatever the reasons that’s the way of it.

We are seeing commercial opportunities being taken - even the embarrassing vaping ads yet this isn’t being used to subsidise ticket prices.

If there is any hope of getting back to 18k+ ST holders, prices have to come down. Only the Oxford deal stands out in recent times of any attempt to encourage fans back. On the back of promotion the fans responded and reminded us all what a full stadium looks like. Since then, nothing.

[OldEwoodBlue]

single biggest disgrace is the matchday surcharge.

it has stopped me going to 3 games so far this season.

I don’t actually ever recall seeing an explanation for it.

 

why is there no cash turnstile on matchdays ?

or a contactless turnstile ?

 

the ground is empty

they want more people to attend... or they don’t

which is it ? Please ask them that at the next FF

 

[Sparks Rover]

Just now, Franky said:

single biggest disgrace is the matchday surcharge.

it has stopped me going to 3 games so far this season.

I don’t actually ever recall seeing an explanation for it

Ask Chaddy, he thinks it's a sound idea.

[JHRover]

13 minutes ago, Franky said:

single biggest disgrace is the matchday surcharge.

it has stopped me going to 3 games so far this season.

I don’t actually ever recall seeing an explanation for it.

 

why is there no cash turnstile on matchdays ?

or a contactless turnstile ?

 

the ground is empty

they want more people to attend... or they don’t

which is it ? Please ask them that at the next FF

 

The simple answer is that they want to force people into buying tickets in advance. It suits them that way as they get all your details on the database and know exactly how many are coming and where they are sitting.

They don't want large numbers turning up on the day because it introduces an element of uncertainty or unpredictability.

From a business point of view it probably makes sense the way they are doing it as they can more accurately predict how many staff and supplies are needed the week beforehand.

Unfortunately it hinges on the premise that all those who are interested in going are prepared to ring up or go online or go down to Ewood during the week before the game, commit to a ticket and stick to it. We all know that some people can't or won't make that sort of commitment, not at £25+ a head, and so will probably not bother with it. Some people decide depending on the weather, or if they get permission from their partner, or if their kid fancies going. The club need to realise that rather than forcibly changing people's buying habits they are actually making some people's minds up not to attend for them.

[gumboots]

Absolutely true especially if your partner and a couple of kids suddenly decide they would like to come with you afterall. £12 on the cost of the tickets. My son was so reluctant to attend his first match that he and his dad missed the early goal in the match, but he had a season ticket for years after that and was a walk on at many other matches. You need to get people in. I went free for several years with school parties but had at least 15 years as a season ticket holder. That's how I know making it as easy as possible for people to get into the habit is important

[Mattyblue]

I’ve noticed that Rotherham are saying their tickets for Ewood are in the DE upper.

https://www.themillers.co.uk/news/2018/october/tickets--details-v-blackburn-rovers/

Possibly a mistake at their end, but if not  are the club doing something with the lower tier? School tickets etc? 

Probably not, but hope springs eternal!

Edited October 29, 2018 by Mattyblue

[JHRover]

Just now, Mattyblue said:

I’ve noticed that Rotherham are saying their tickets for Ewood are in the DE upper.

https://www.themillers.co.uk/news/2018/october/tickets--details-v-blackburn-rovers/

Possibly a mistake at their end, but if not  are the club doing something with the lower tier? School tickets etc? 

Probably not, but hope springs eternal!

I've heard that starting Saturday v QPR that they will be allocating the upper tier first.

[Mattyblue]

That explains it then.

Part of me is glad they are up in the gods, but with a few hundred folk in the top corner of an enormous end won’t half make Ewood look a desolate place.