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9 minutes ago, broadsword said:

You have to wonder how much money these disaster capitalists need. The misery they're causing is hard to really appreciate. I grew up in the seventies and eighties and part of the reason I've pushed myself so hard on life is because I've ended up thinking I can't rely on anyone but myself, because I remember just how screwed some people were during the eighties. The tories just don't care, and this epidemic is just more proof 

Once Jeff bezos has filtered down a few trillion to the governments who want it what does he spend the rest on ? 

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I know it's just mental. I've got my running medals, bond movies, a few books and a signed photo of britt ekland. Don't need anything else, just a ready supply of sweets, crisps and lucozade. 

 

They're sat on a pile of treasure that gets bigger every day. Far from being something to venerate or aspire to, I think it's weak

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59 minutes ago, jim mk2 said:

The current tiering system is a waste of time, as Whitty made clear when it was announced. Tier 1 inevitably leads to Tier 2 which inevitably leads to Tier 3. The restrictions are so mild as to be useless.

Far better would be 2-week full lockdowns whenever we need them. Compliance would be easy to police. They could be announced  a week or two in advance so that people and businesses can plan around them. And they would work. 

The longer we wait the higher the infection rate when we start so the longer it takes to get under control - so more bodies and worse impact on economy  and other aspects of health. So a re-run of March. Well done Boris, full marks for consistency. 

I agree Jim, the longer this goes on the worse it gets. Just wait for notice that we'll face a full lockdown on about 18th December for a month and that University students aren't allowed to return home.

The shit will really hit the fan then!

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1 hour ago, Inglorious basturk said:

I wouldn’t lock down those who aren’t under constant care or are able to make a sound decision themselves , that would be unfair on many bright capable elderly folk 

I’m struggling to follow your argument here IB.

so you’re NOT wanting to protect all the vulnerable people?

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https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/oct/29/national-lockdowns-should-be-backup-plan-on-covid-says-who-envoy

The circuit breaker lockdowns should be a reserve according to WHO.

Jenrick there claiming the tiers are localised and proportionate but evidently they aren't. If they were you wouldn't be seeing 100+ uni students confined into a tiny dorm room in Dundee. Can't take anything that chubby pillock says seriously after he just held his hands up to his corruption............and got away with it! If you are going to try it at least have the courtesy to do a good job of it. He has a real sinister look in his eyes too. You can just tell he will screw you over if he had half the chance. Just like that picture of Hancock playing footy - get this bloke on a football pitch or a boxing ring and I'd happily take lumps out of him. Have you ever seen a more embarrassing header of the ball than Matt Hancock?!?!?!?!?!?! Seriously man, you are meant to be English and Northern.

 

Edited by Dreams of 1995

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9 minutes ago, den said:

I’m struggling to follow your argument here IB.

so you’re NOT wanting to protect all the vulnerable people?

If you are disabled , unable to look after yourself and need 24 hour care , quite often on a home , irrespective of age  default really suggests you are getting high level care and being ring  fenced . You are very vulnerable .

if you are for example 80 society may deem you vulnerable, however  you consider yourself to be fit active capable etc despite your years then I would place the onus on the individual to decide how far they wish to shield themselves.  They have earned that right .  

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8 minutes ago, Inglorious basturk said:

If you are disabled , unable to look after yourself and need 24 hour care , quite often on a home , irrespective of age  default really suggests you are getting high level care and being ring  fenced . You are very vulnerable .

if you are for example 80 society may deem you vulnerable, however  you consider yourself to be fit active capable etc despite your years then I would place the onus on the individual to decide how far they wish to shield themselves.  They have earned that right .  

This is just rubbish IB. It will do nothing to stop the spread of the virus, which to be fair you’ve never wanted anyway.

Ill leave this particular discussion there.

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4 minutes ago, den said:

This is just rubbish IB. It will do nothing to stop the spread of the virus, which to be fair you’ve never wanted anyway.

Ill leave this particular discussion there.

Which bit is rubbish ?  That I don’t think that you are automatically vulnerable based on age ?  An age cut off point would demonise a lot of people for no reason 

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The problem is that the government would set an arbitrary age for shielding cut off and then I'd probably be the wrong side of it and would be stuck either breaking the law or complying with rules i dont think I should be included in. I'm not by nature a rule breaker so that would be a hard choice but I'd go crackers locked down for weeks

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Just now, gumboots said:

The problem is that the government would set an arbitrary age for shielding cut off and then I'd probably be the wrong side of it and would be stuck either breaking the law or complying with rules i dont think I should be included in. I'm not by nature a rule breaker so that would be a hard choice but I'd go crackers locked down for weeks

Hence my suggestion that it would be dictated by circumstances rather than age 

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At 80 years old one might be faced with the prospect of a final Christmas. If that Christmas is taken from you for the fear of an unknown (a flu could be deadly at that age too) then it really isn't fair.

These thoughts should be considered by the government very, very carefully. I think unfortunately a lockdown is becoming inevitable. There's nothing we can do about it now. It should never have got to this point again. However, with all my opposition to a lockdown now, if this government delays the inevitable - or doesn't have a plan to prevent a lockdown - then does so over the Christmas holidays I will be absolutely livid. It would be the death knell to the Tory party in my opinion and probably the reason why it will not happen.

@gumboots I sincerely hope it is photoshopped because if it isn't it is the single most embarrassing thing I have seen of a politician in recent times. He looks like a baby about to cry. 

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2 minutes ago, Dreams of 1995 said:

At 80 years old one might be faced with the prospect of a final Christmas. If that Christmas is taken from you for the fear of an unknown (a flu could be deadly at that age too) then it really isn't fair.

These thoughts should be considered by the government very, very carefully. I think unfortunately a lockdown is becoming inevitable. There's nothing we can do about it now. It should never have got to this point again. However, with all my opposition to a lockdown now, if this government delays the inevitable - or doesn't have a plan to prevent a lockdown - then does so over the Christmas holidays I will be absolutely livid. It would be the death knell to the Tory party in my opinion and probably the reason why it will not happen.

@gumboots I sincerely hope it is photoshopped because if it isn't it is the single most embarrassing thing I have seen of a politician in recent times. He looks like a baby about to cry. 

Style point.... Christmas isn't "holidays", which is a horrible American term

Festive season or Yuletide is fine. 

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The big problem is that if let's say there is a lockdown this weekend until January, with an exception of Christmas a lot of people will be tempted to go overboard and make up for lost time in that brief window. 

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Things are getting worse day by day, with London/South now seeing significant increases, as Hoochie said early, I wonder how long before a national lock down comes with Dom and Boris at risk :rock:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-54723962

Edited by Gav

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35 minutes ago, jim mk2 said:

Style point.... Christmas isn't "holidays", which is a horrible American term

Festive season or Yuletide is fine. 

It is genuine it’s from a press v Tory mps match , that twat from Nottingham Ben something in goal , bizarrely managed by John Barnes 

this is also real

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/video/news/video-1548619/Culture-minister-belts-Queen-anthem-Don-t-Stop-Now.html

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27 minutes ago, Dreams of 1995 said:

At 80 years old one might be faced with the prospect of a final Christmas. If that Christmas is taken from you for the fear of an unknown (a flu could be deadly at that age too) then it really isn't fair.

This feels quite topical for me. 

My Dad is 82, Mum 78. I've been implementing some rules for our large family (4 siblings, 6 grandkids) during visits, try and sheild them as much as possible during this 2nd wave. Just things like seperate visits, only using 1 room in the house, no hugging etc. 

My sister rang me last night to say Dad had been on phone and they won't live by my rules anymore. He said they probably only have 2 or 3 years left, and they refuse to spend them living like this. They are grown adults and can make their own choices in life. My sister pointed out how guilty a member of the family would feel if they brought the virus round and god forbid, the worst happened. His response was - "Well that will be on our heads, not yours. And we wish for you all to respect our decision."

Bit shocked tbh. But they are certainly not people you are ever going to get to change their mind once it's made up. So, I will be respecting that decision. They've earnt that much over the years. 

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4 minutes ago, Silas said:

This feels quite topical for me. 

My Dad is 82, Mum 78. I've been implementing some rules for our large family (4 siblings, 6 grandkids) during visits, try and sheild them as much as possible during this 2nd wave. Just things like seperate visits, only using 1 room in the house, no hugging etc. 

My sister rang me last night to say Dad had been on phone and they won't live by my rules anymore. He said they probably only have 2 or 3 years left, and they refuse to spend them living like this. They are grown adults and can make their own choices in life. My sister pointed out how guilty a member of the family would feel if they brought the virus round and god forbid, the worst happened. His response was - "Well that will be on our heads, not yours. And we wish for you all to respect our decision."

Bit shocked tbh. But they are certainly not people you are ever going to get to change their mind once it's made up. So, I will be respecting that decision. They've earnt that much over the years. 

That’s my dad exactly almost word for word and the exact same age, he lost his soul mate of 50 years 18 months ago , we are going to have a riot this Xmas and anyone who doesn’t like it can call the fucking police . Good on your folks 

Edited by Inglorious basturk

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25 minutes ago, Gav said:

lock down comes with Dom and Boris at risk

I don't have that kind of influence, sorry. 

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13 minutes ago, Inglorious basturk said:

Although I do respect why you have had your rules

I mean I didn't laminate them and stick them on the fridge or anything. 😀

Just went round and had a chat, positives massively going up in area including at my work and brother-in-laws work, and suggested we tighten things up for a while, don't let our guard slip.

Clearly, they have reached their threshold with it all. Who am I to tell them different. I haven't been trapped in a house for 6 months. I was barely in my house a week back in March.  

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Worth noting that the concept of 'lockdown compliance fatigue' was rubbished but I think we have all observed this happen in some way shape or form. 

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3 minutes ago, RoverDom said:

Worth noting that the concept of 'lockdown compliance fatigue' was rubbished but I think we have all observed this happen in some way shape or form. 

Good will replaced by resentment as they have taken the piss with ever changing rules and goalposts 

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5 minutes ago, RoverDom said:

Worth noting that the concept of 'lockdown compliance fatigue' was rubbished but I think we have all observed this happen in some way shape or form. 

I’m quite pleased with my dad to be honest , his instance that we keep up going for regular meals etc , a trip to Greece . Don’t think he would have coped if we hadn’t 

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