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JoeH

Wigan Athletic (A) - Saturday 27th June (3pm)

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If Mowbray wants to send out a message he has to drop Walton, Bennett and Gallagher for the next game. I don't care if Leutwiler and the rest of the replacements are just as shite, you cannot play as those 3 did yesterday and get picked regardless.

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5 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

And Sheff Wednesday have their 3rd choice keeper in goal today. Made a very good save from a header

I would give Hilton a chance. I have seen him several times and is commanding of his area, has a presence and really good reflexes.

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7 minutes ago, arbitro said:

I would give Hilton a chance. I have seen him several times and is commanding of his area, has a presence and really good reflexes.

When we are mathematically out of the running id do the same. Nothing lost. Might be a good number two who could learn off an experienced number one

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40 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

Mowbray questions Walton's decision making 

https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/18546751.walton-claims-foul-rovers-boss-questions-decision-making/

He deffo wasn't foul for first goal. He hit Tosin Adarabioyo..

The LT claims Mowbray was questioning Walton's decision making but if you actually analyse what he says he doesn't. He merely bemoans the fact that the team as a whole didn't lump the ball up to Graham when he came on and let's Walton off the hook by pretending he didn't see what happened leading up to the first goal and bizarrely insinuates that where we went wrong was that because we had a goal wrongly chalked off last week we were unfortunate not to see the opposition have another good goal wrongly chalked off this week!

Utter cobblers from Mowbray but that's nothing new. However whilst he continues to insult our intelligence with drivel like this as opposed to criticising players for not doing their job, there seems little chance of anyone under performing being replaced or any change in the cycle of the team failing to perform whenever we get into a half decent position.

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41 minutes ago, LDRover said:

If Mowbray wants to send out a message he has to drop Walton, Bennett and Gallagher for the next game. I don't care if Leutwiler and the rest of the replacements are just as shite, you cannot play as those 3 did yesterday and get picked regardless.

Spot on. 

We all know that's what should happen but probably won't. Looking back on yesterday's sorry display as a whole the most disappointing thing was the lack of urgency and desire. 

Get the ball in a promising position to break then turn around and pass backwards and sideways until the opposition have had time to get back in position. If that was a team desperately battling for a play off spot, you could have fooled me.

Many of us have been saying the same thing about the manager and his comfort zone for a while. I can't see anything changing until he goes. The players are on easy street and as long as they do enough to keep us out of trouble that will do for Mowbray and their places are secure.

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As soon as Lewis Travis went off I felt we would lose. 

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1 hour ago, arbitro said:

I would give Hilton a chance. I have seen him several times and is commanding of his area, has a presence and really good reflexes.

I was impressed by Hilton the 1st time I watched him for under 21's and have been since them. 

I believe Rovers and Mowbray would like to loan him next season to play 1st team football at league 1 or 2 clubs. 

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I would give Buckley and Rankin-Costello starts until the end of season. 

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8 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

I was impressed by Hilton the 1st time I watched him for under 21's and have been since them. 

I believe Rovers and Mowbray would like to loan him next season to play 1st team football at league 1 or 2 clubs. 

You may well be right but if he does he will be nearly 22 when the next season starts. Mowbray has opted for a cheap, second rate keeper in Leutwiler who simply isn't able to challenge Walton. He badly failed his audition at the end of last season when he was given a chance but still got another year. Hilton should be back up next season whilst still playing for the under 23's in my view.

 

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1 minute ago, arbitro said:

You may well be right but if he does he will be nearly 22 when the next season starts. Mowbray has opted for a cheap, second rate keeper in Leutwiler who simply isn't able to challenge Walton. He badly failed his audition at the end of last season when he was given a chance but still got another year. Hilton should be back up next season whilst still playing for the under 23's in my view.

 

Would Hilton benefit more from a season of playing regular 1st team at league 1 or 2 level or being number 2 here

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How fecking frustrating man. Every time we get within touching distance we go and make a right pigs ear of the next game. 
 

Time to get rid of players like Bennett, he’s simply not good enough to fill any position in our team if we are serious about promotion. 
 

Mowbray dropped another clanger yesterday. I have been his most fervent supporter since our promotion and always look to try and defend him and our players because I do think he’s been a brilliant manager for us. I’m far more proud of my club than I was when he took over. We are in a far better state that’s for sure. With that said, I am getting sick to the back teeth of our inconsistency. Some games we play I think we would be able to mix it in the Premier League with a few additions, then I watch that shite and realise we are where we deserve to be. 
 

For me TM has next season to sort this problem out. Another season like this and it would then be time for a change. We cannot miss our opportunity again. 

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1 hour ago, Oldgregg86 said:

When we are mathematically out of the running id do the same. Nothing lost. Might be a good number two who could learn off an experienced number one

but what possible benefit is there from persisting with Walton, and him costing us week after week?

How could Fisher be any worse?

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2 minutes ago, Dreams of 1995 said:


 

For me TM has next season to sort this problem out. Another season like this and it would then be time for a change. We cannot miss our opportunity again. 

Yeah he has next season to get it right for me. Needs to make some hard decisions over the summer, really not far away. Replacing Walton, Tosin and getting a new Left Back will be the priorities.
Play full strength against Barnsley, but I want to see the youngsters in as soon as we are realistically out of the race for playoffs. Guessing that will be after Leeds next Sat.

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Just now, chaddyrovers said:

Would Hilton benefit more from a season of playing regular 1st team at league 1 or 2 level or being number 2 here

Personally I would have him here playing in cup games and under 23's. We need two keepers and bringing in two from outside would unnecessarily eat into the budget when we already have one of great promise.

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Tricky one in the keeper department, I see no point playing Leutwiler, we know about him and he’s never going to be anything more than average, he did the job he was brought in to do, sit on the bench and get a couple of games postponed.

Walton is a standard mid championship keeper, capable of being solid on his day yet he’s been at fault on all 3 goals since the restart. 

Whilst we still have an outside shot of top 6 (I know it’s remote but on paper 4 points off with 7 games to play) I think I’d just about stick with him then bring in the best prospect we have in the academy.

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Another bad performance against Wigan. Mowbray can't figure out how to deal with them. 

2 goals conceded in the last 10 minutes too. How many does that now make for the season? I thought that fitness had improved.

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2 minutes ago, Tom said:

Tricky one in the keeper department, I see no point playing Leutwiler, we know about him and he’s never going to be anything more than average, he did the job he was brought in to do, sit on the bench and get a couple of games postponed.

I see no point in playing either Walton or Leutwiler. We know already they're both absolute garbage. Walton definitely won't be here next season and I've lost track of when Leutwiler is contracted to but he definitely shouldn't be here either.

Give Fisher a chance and see what he can do. Worst case scenario is he's no better than the other two but it's fairly unlikely he will be significantly worse. If he's not up to it either then so be it, we're not really any worse off and we've learnt something valuable going forward.

On the plus side he might be considerably better. Persisting with Walton is like keep taking a boat with a hole in it out and hoping the hole will miraculously repair itself and the boat wont sink this time.

(Ditto playing Bennett at LB or Gallagher on the right wing and expecting them to play well)

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All the adverse comments about Walton have been pretty much on the mark but with what we have available I suspect that we will stick with him for the next few games, if we are clearly not in with a shout then definitely give Hilton a run out.  Leutweiler hasn't been the pressure needed by a number two wanting to grab first choice spot.

Our left back depth is a real problem, Bennett is not an answer for that position and it is tough to berate him for his lack of ability as a left-back.  He seems to be the sticking plaster solution to any position needing cover - wouldn't be surprised if TM asked him to take over in goal.  He has been a good servant in blue and white and maybe he looks worse because he is so often moved about to cover gaps in the squad but perhaps it is time to move on.

But let's not distract from the overall performance by concentrating on Walton and Bennett, if the team as a whole had performed with more vigour and application we wshould still have had enough to push Wigan more.  I thought Wigan were more up for the challenge and always looked more threatening, 2-0 didn't flatter them. They seem capable of bullying too many of our players, for example Downing never looked settled and I wonder how many of them remembered how Morsy kicked lumps off them(and Dack) last time out.  Nasty piece of work but we could do with a player like him in our team.

Very, very frustrating.

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16 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

and Elliott Bennett will remain as captain.

If anybody other than Darragh Lenihan is club captain in 2020/21 then I'll be so frustrated.

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Posted (edited)
30 minutes ago, RevidgeBlue said:

but what possible benefit is there from persisting with Walton, and him costing us week after week?

How could Fisher be any worse?

Most people on here know that I'm a very big advocate for giving youth players game time, and often it's the source of many a debate for myself with other posters. But here I'd have to disagree. Walton was clattered (by whoever, our man or theirs) for the goal against Wigan - maybe a foul, maybe not. The team in general had played shit enough anyway though. Their goal was coming no matter what form it came in.

Fisher is a good shot stopper, but like Raya he's 5ft 11" (if that) and has literally ZERO first team Championship experience. So to answer the question "How Could Fisher Be Any Worse" I say, quite easily. My question would be, is there any evidence whatsoever to say he'd be better?

We've paid for Walton til the end of the season so we'd better get our use out of him. Fisher won't start next season so giving him minutes doesn't benefit us either.

Edited by JoeH

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Just now, JoeH said:

If anybody other than Darragh Lenihan is club captain in 2020/21 then I'll be so frustrated.

Unless Bennett was sold, which he wont be, then he wouldnt be stripped of the captaincy, no chance.

If his game time waned which again im not convinced by, then Lenihan would just naturally be captain in his absence.

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Just now, JoeH said:

If anybody other than Darragh Lenihan is club captain in 2020/21 then I'll be so frustrated.

We might be lucky if he's still at the Club next season.

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Just now, JoeH said:

Most people on here know that I'm a very big advocate for giving youth players game time, and often it's the source of many a debate for myself with other posters. But here I'd have to disagree. Walton was clatter (by whoever, our man or theirs) for the goal against Wigan, and the team in general had played shit enough anyway. Their goal was coming no matter what form it came in.

Fisher is a good shot stopper, but like Raya he's 5ft 11" (if that) and has literally ZERO first team Championship experience. So to answer the question "How Could Fisher Be Any Worse" I say, quite easily. My question would be, is there any evidence whatsoever to say he'd be better?

We've paid for Walton til the end of the season so we'd better get our use out of him. Fisher won't start next season so giving him minutes doesn't benefit us either.

Definitely agree that there is no point chucking in someone who wont be first or second choice next season. But your logic regarding the first goal is very flawed, it was his fault that he clattered into his own player, and the performance of the team is irrelevant in the fact that he made an absolute howler that probably cost us a point. (Plus could have done better for the second)

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Just now, roversfan99 said:

But your logic regarding the first goal is very flawed, it was his fault that he clattered into his own player, and the performance of the team is irrelevant in the fact that he made an absolute howler that probably cost us a point. (Plus could have done better for the second)

I don't think Walton could've saved us points in that game. We were getting hammered for large parts of that second half and the goal had been coming. I don't neccessarily blame him for the first goal, but he could've done better in many a game this season of course.

I just resign to giving up hope with it and with him. He's obviously not going to be here next season, we're obviously not going up this season.

I just find the sentiment of "stick Fisher in then" a bit odd. 

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Just now, JoeH said:

We've paid for Walton til the end of the season so we'd better get our use out of him. Fisher won't start next season so giving him minutes doesn't benefit us either.

I've never understood the argument in favour of playing a player who you know for a fact is crap ahead of a younger one because the former has "experience" and the younger one hasn't been handed a chance yet. Everyone has to start sometime and until they're given a chance you'll never know what they are capable of.

I'm not sure either how Walton dropping clanger after clanger is us getting value for money out of him regardless of whether we've extended his deal to the end of the season or not.

By that argument you might as well make Smallwood an automatic starter for the remainder of the season.

 

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