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Summer Transfer Window

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2 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

The squad isnt identical, theyve signed 3 players to improve their first team. 

And ultimately that comparison doesnt factor that Mowbray has had 3 years and 20m pound extra to mould his squad compared to Warnock.

They've lost players too... Clayton, gone. Nmecha, gone. Patrick Roberts, gone. George Friend, gone. Daniel Ayala, gone. Ravel Morrison, gone. Ryan Shotton, gone. Rudy Gestede, gone. 11 players left from 2019/20.

Three players in to replace that many out is basically the same as our transfer business... So how are they getting it right but we're getting it wrong? Sounds like double standards to me.

Bottom line I don't understand. My argument isn't that Warnock is a poor manager, or that Mowbray is a great one, it's simply that Boro aren't going to improve by an extra 10 points with a very similar level squad.

Edited by JoeH

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I notice Ayala hasn't played since  1st Jan. Has he been injured ? 

Initially looked up Ruben Ayala who hasn't played since 1984!

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2 minutes ago, JoeH said:

They've lost players too... Clayton, gone. Nmecha, gone. Patrick Roberts, gone. George Friend, gone. Daniel Ayala, gone. Ravel Morrison, gone. Ryan Shotton, gone. Rudy Gestede, gone. 11 players left from 2019/20.

Three players in to replace that many out is basically the same as our transfer business... So how are they getting it right but we're getting it wrong? Sounds like double standards to me.

Bottom line I don't understand. My argument isn't that Warnock is a poor manager, or that Mowbray is a great one, it's simply that Boro aren't going to improve by an extra 10 points with a very similar level squad.

No I know but you said the squad was identical, so I was just correcting you on that. 

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7 minutes ago, 1864roverite said:

Well been fishing caught a shed full of carp and perch as well as the odd roach and still no progressive news on a signing!

Where you go fishing 😂? After somewhere decent to go 

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2 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

No I know but you said the squad was identical, so I was just correcting you on that. 

You said they'd signed players to "improve the squad". 11 out and 3 in is not an improvement.

R. Gestede
P. Roberts
A. Clayton
G. Friend
L. Nmecha
R. Shotton
R. Morrison
D. Ayala
& more...

for

S. Morsy
G. Hall
M. Bettinelli (loan)

Simply isn't an improvement.

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10 minutes ago, JoeH said:

1) is Warnock's nous alone worth an extra ten points with an identical squad to last season?

Quite possibly yes I think it is. But it is not an identical squad he has already signed 3 players and some have left. And you are also assuming that we will get the same amount of points this season.

11 minutes ago, JoeH said:

2) how can you call our manager a hindrance and say he lacks nous when we're in a significantly better position than Boro in a lot of categories? It's baffling.

I can say he is because I believe it having seen how Mowbray has operated the last few years. What categories are we in a significantly better positions in?

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Just now, Ewood Ace said:

What categories are we in a significantly better positions in?

ROVERS:
Better League Position
Better First XI
Higher Market Value
Better Young Players
Higher Youth Ranking / Facilities

BORO:
Better Manager

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I see the rumours circulating about Ayala deal being revisited. I hope to god that’s true. If anyone watches other teams a lot he’s been probably the best CB at this level for consistency for a good few years. Bit of a nasty bastard/wind up merchant too. Surprised me that Tony went in for him at all!

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Just now, Mellor Rover said:

I see the rumours circulating about Ayala deal being revisited. I hope to god that’s true. If anyone watches other teams a lot he’s been probably the best CB at this level for consistency for a good few years. Bit of a nasty bastard/wind up merchant too. Surprised me that Tony went in for him at all!

Agreed, if both Ayala and Cunningham come here, with Kaminski thrown in too, it's one of our better windows in recent history. Big IFS though.

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3 minutes ago, JoeH said:

Agreed, if both Ayala and Cunningham come here, with Kaminski thrown in too, it's one of our better windows in recent history. Big IFS though.

And still need another centre half for me. Lenihan will miss 25% of games probably through injury/suspension.

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18 minutes ago, Crimpshrine said:

I notice Ayala hasn't played since  1st Jan. Has he been injured ? 

Initially looked up Ruben Ayala who hasn't played since 1984!

By all accounts he was injured early in the year, fit after the Covid restart, but they didn’t play him as they knew he was off.

I didn’t realise that Ayala initially joined Boro having been ‘scouted’ by Mowbray, but then signed by Venus who was in the caretaker capacity.

Edited by Gavlar Somerset Rover!

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19 minutes ago, Crimpshrine said:

I notice Ayala hasn't played since  1st Jan. Has he been injured ? 

Initially looked up Ruben Ayala who hasn't played since 1984!

He refused to sign a disclaimer without a new contract that would have left him screwed signing for a new club after his contract with Boro expired.

They basically wanted him to play with no protection should he be injured playing for them.

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4 minutes ago, JoeH said:

ROVERS:
Better League Position
Better First XI
Higher Market Value
Better Young Players
Higher Youth Ranking / Facilities

BORO:
Better Manager

Better first 11 in your opinion. I'd say it's pretty even

Higher market value in your opinion but no one can say for certain unless the players are sold, as a player is only worth what a club are willing to pay.

Better league position is academic now as the season has ended, but I don't think that finishing above them by 6 positions for the first time in years classes as being in a significantly better position. 

It depends what you define as a young player? I'd define a young player as 21 and under in which case again I would say it is even. But if you class 22-23 year olds like Nyambe, Travis and Armstrong as youngsters then I would say we do have the slight edge.

 Middlesbrough's academy like ours is category one so they are both on a par. Although Middlesbrough have certainly made more in player sales from their academy than we have in recent years. They got £15 Million for Gibson 2 years ago it been nearly a decade since we got that sort of money for a player from our academy.  In fact since we sold Jones we haven't made £15 Million altogether on academy players never mind just one. 

One thing is for certain in no area are we in a significantly better position than Middlesbrough and one plus you forgot to add for them was that they have a sensible and reliable owner.

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Very true on their academy. They have the likes of Wing, Fry, Spence, Pears, Tavernier all regularly in the first team picture. 

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1 minute ago, roversfan99 said:

Very true on their academy. They have the likes of Wing, Fry, Spence, Pears, Tavernier all regularly in the first team picture. 

We have Lenihan, Travis, Buckley, Costello and Nyambe.

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2 minutes ago, RovingRover said:

We have Lenihan, Travis, Buckley, Costello and Nyambe.

No i know, I was just backing up Ewood Ace regarding his comments on the comparison. Boro have a good academy too although I would probably favour our graduates at this moment. Buckley and Rankin Costello have not really established themself in the starting 11 at any point but hopefully will at some stage and the other 3 are very important to us.

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Sadly Mike E my Father died of MND in May. The Conservatives don’t seem to see this as a terminal illness. They are cutting back on so much. I totally get your concern. 

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47 minutes ago, Mike E said:

I'm deaf myself :) Deaf services have been stripped to the bone by Conservative austerity policy, with Deaf and SEN Schools closing, and even the century+ old East Lancs Deaf Society closing its doors last year.

Deaf children need help now more than ever, lest they get left behind by lack of access to education.

/preach

Great cause. Shame it won't make any money out of this board membership though, as I'm with JoeH!

I'll chip in a fiver though too at the end of the season if Boro finish above us. In return, can you agree likewise for Alzheimer's Society? No worries if not as I realise it's likely to get expensive for you!!

😉

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54 minutes ago, Mike E said:

I'm deaf myself :) Deaf services have been stripped to the bone by Conservative austerity policy, with Deaf and SEN Schools closing, and even the century+ old East Lancs Deaf Society closing its doors last year.

Deaf children need help now more than ever, lest they get left behind by lack of access to education.

/preach

Brilliant, I think I'll make a donation now. Bet still on though matey! :) 

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Whilst brought in for the U23s, doesnt Dolan count as a summer transfer, given the impact he has already made on the first team squad?

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1 minute ago, alex l said:

Whilst brought in for the U23s, doesnt Dolan count as a summer transfer, given the impact he has already made on the first team squad?

given TM admitted he’d never seen the player play or heard his name, it would be very generous to let it count

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