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Summer Transfer Window

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6 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Fair enough. I feel at times that youngsters performance are bigged up or if negative, dismissed purely because they are young. But I cannot argue with your post.

Issues also occur with former youth players who are now first team players at the club. Nyambe, Travis and Lenihan for example are all protected BIG TIME by the supporter base. Huge mistakes go un-berated, but mistakes from a Rothwell or a Bell are simply not acceptable.

Trav was completely at fault for Leeds' first goal at Ewood recently, barely a word was spoken. Lenihan had a shocker against Reading IMO, especially their second goal, but again practically un-noted by the general consensus of the fans. Nyambe can't cross a football and seems dizzy when he enters the final third, but nobody seems to really care - some seem to think that he's a Premier League right back... Bell has very similar flaws but is constantly lambasted online and in the stands.

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8 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

Already explain the reasons why I unsure on him having a contract next season. 

You basically said what we've all said - that he played well pre lockdown and poor post lockdown. Then you said we'd have to see how he performs 'next' season!! 

So, go on, form an opinion on whether we should give him a deal rather than waiting to agree with whatever the club decides.

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Posted (edited)
4 minutes ago, JoeH said:

Issues also occur with former youth players who are now first team players at the club. Nyambe, Travis and Lenihan for example are all protected BIG TIME by the supporter base. Huge mistakes go un-berated, but mistakes from a Rothwell or a Bell are simply not acceptable.

Trav was completely at fault for Leeds' first goal at Ewood recently, barely a word was spoken. Lenihan had a shocker against Reading IMO, especially their second goal, but again practically un-noted by the general consensus of the fans. Nyambe can't cross a football and seems dizzy when he enters the final third, but nobody seems to really care - some seem to think that he's a Premier League right back... Bell has very similar flaws but is constantly lambasted online and in the stands.

Bullshit.

Individual mistakes like you have mentioned are weighed together with overall performances. Travis, Lenihan and Nyambe as a collective have given far more positive performances than mistakes. Bell on the other hand simply hasn't shown enough good performances to outweigh his mistakes.

Just because people are not quick to jump on here and throw shade similar to your view on Nyambe doesn't mean they don't recognise the mistakes.

It's a very weird movement on here at the moment that sees the need to round on any individual error with full gusto, and then moan when others don't do the same.

Edited by Dreams of 1995

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Just now, JoeH said:

Issues also occur with former youth players who are now first team players at the club. Nyambe, Travis and Lenihan for example are all protected BIG TIME by the supporter base. Huge mistakes go un-berated, but mistakes from a Rothwell or a Bell are simply not acceptable.

Trav was completely at fault for Leeds' first goal at Ewood recently, barely a word was spoken. Lenihan had a shocker against Reading IMO, especially their second goal, but again practically un-noted by the general consensus of the fans. Nyambe can't cross a football and seems dizzy when he enters the final third, but nobody seems to really care - some seem to think that he's a Premier League right back... Bell has very similar flaws but is constantly lambasted online and in the stands.

This is totally fair I think. But there is a logic behind it. Nyambe has had a lot more good games than Bell, and Travis and Lenihan have had a lot more good games than Rothwell.

It kind of works like a bank account. Players build up their credit by having good performances. Then you can "afford" a few bad ones.

When you go deep in the red (like say Brereton) you have a hell of lot to do to recover.

It changes over time as well. Look at this forum three years ago and everyone was generally very positive about Bennett. Now he is a pariah increasingly disliked by the fan base for his poor performances.  Not really his fault - he's getting on and played absurdly out of his position - but there it is. Such is life. 

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Just now, Dreams of 1995 said:

Bullshit.

How elegantly worded :) Just my opinion dude.

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Just now, JoeH said:

How elegantly worded :) Just my opinion dude.

So was mine

Bullshit isn't meant to be an elegant word, but just what men say to each other in conversations if they disagree on something

No insult, no harm done, just a word

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People have a natural confirmation bias. There is an element of fairness there based on judging players on their overall performances throughout the season, but of course an unfairness in that it is more difficult to judge players on the individual game that the topic relates to.

For example, if Nyambe and Bell both had poor games, the reason that Bell may suffer more criticism is that Bell is poor more often than not, and Nyambe is good more often than not.

If Bennett gives a penalty away, he has done so many times before so it will be further proof that he is a liability in that regard. If Nyambe or Travis did, it is more uncommon and not a common theme.

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7 minutes ago, JoeH said:

Issues also occur with former youth players who are now first team players at the club. Nyambe, Travis and Lenihan for example are all protected BIG TIME by the supporter base. Huge mistakes go un-berated, but mistakes from a Rothwell or a Bell are simply not acceptable.

Trav was completely at fault for Leeds' first goal at Ewood recently, barely a word was spoken. Lenihan had a shocker against Reading IMO, especially their second goal, but again practically un-noted by the general consensus of the fans. Nyambe can't cross a football and seems dizzy when he enters the final third, but nobody seems to really care - some seem to think that he's a Premier League right back... Bell has very similar flaws but is constantly lambasted online and in the stands.

I know it's not addressed at me, but personally I don't even think about the fact that Nyambe, Lenihan and Travis are from our academy most of the time. Only when we talk about players coming from our academy. They're undeniably three of our best players, consistent most of the time, and that's why they get more slack for their mistakes than Bell, Rothwell, Bennett. (Rothwell is a bit of a funny one, as he blows hot and cold for now. I only tire of his mistakes when they're happening in a bad patch, the rest of the time it's just the risk you take with that kind of player). They make a lot less, so we are more patient when they make them. I think that's fair. With Bell or Bennett it's just 'oh ffs not again'. I'm sure the academy angle comes into it with some fans, but it doesn't with me, and I appear to hold similar views on these players and their mistakes. There are some people who seem to give Rothwell full rein with his mistakes btw, and that'll be because he's exciting and has the potential to change a game.

Travis was NOT completely at fault for Leeds' first goal, he was completely fouled for Leeds' first goal. I don't feel like going over that again but it was clear as day for me. Even the Leeds fan at work agreed with me. Lenihan was caught out aerially for Reading's goal, yep. But that's unlike him, so I can see why he didn't catch a ton of flak for it. Plus we won. The stats show we are a lot stronger with him at the back.

There have been a TON of posts on here about Nyambe's weakness with crossing. Bell doesnt just have similar flaws. He has similar flaws and is ALSO horrible at the back, which Nyambe isn't. He shows less application, doesn't charge us halfway up the pitch all the time (which as I've said before often creates attacks even if he isn't the one with the final ball), and is a general accident waiting to happen. He is a little better at the final product part of things, albeit inconsistent with it, but not sufficiently better to compensate for his numerous other shortcomings. At best he is backup and a first choice needs to come in. Nyambe is fine as first choice and just needs competition. If you honestly think the two of them are of a similar level then I don't know what else to tell you.

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Just now, bluebruce said:

Travis was NOT completely at fault for Leeds' first goal, he was completely fouled for Leeds' first goal.

It's not a foul in my opinion, nor the referees. But foul or not, he shouldn't have been in that situation in the first place. He'd already made his first mistake there to be honest. I'm not trying to criticise him too heavily, he's my favourite player at the club right now - but I do personally find that Travis, Nyambe, a few others, are very frustratingly protected. It never seems to be their fault with most people.

You know, like if Bell or Bennett or Evans had given the ball away in the lead up to that goal as Travis did, you wouldn't have people defending the player saying "bloody referees", you'd have people going mad about the ridiculous decision making to end up under that kind of pressure in that situation. 

Look at Reading's third goal at Ewood, Travis COMPLETELY and without a shadow of a doubt at fault for that goal, but it was barely acknowledged from my viewing online. A different player and its an unforgivable mistake. 

 

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17 minutes ago, JoeH said:

It's not a foul in my opinion, nor the referees. But foul or not, he shouldn't have been in that situation in the first place. He'd already made his first mistake there to be honest. I'm not trying to criticise him too heavily, he's my favourite player at the club right now - but I do personally find that Travis, Nyambe, a few others, are very frustratingly protected. It never seems to be their fault with most people.

You know, like if Bell or Bennett or Evans had given the ball away in the lead up to that goal as Travis did, you wouldn't have people defending the player saying "bloody referees", you'd have people going mad about the ridiculous decision making to end up under that kind of pressure in that situation. 

Look at Reading's third goal at Ewood, Travis COMPLETELY and without a shadow of a doubt at fault for that goal, but it was barely acknowledged from my viewing online. A different player and its an unforgivable mistake. 

 

Obviously not in the referee's, but that makes zero difference to whether it was. As if we haven't all seen these refs making glaring mistakes on a weekly basis in this league. He had made the mistake in terms of not passing it off straight away to the defender nearby, yes, but someone was charging them down so he looked to the pass out wide instead. It was the wrong decision, but he might have managed it if the guy hadn't quite clearly bundled him over. I don't personally get where anyone is coming from with the notion it wasn't a foul. He was kicking the ball, and then he wasn't, because the guy clattered into him and sent him over. It's not the 90s anymore. But you're entitled to your opinion, I don't fancy going over it again. I was going to say though, if you want to blame him for a goal blame him for the Reading one, that was piss poor. Been a long season for Trav though, and he had that little ligament injury recently. I don't think he should even have been risked and clearly wasn't fully at the races.

As I and others have said, it's about trends of quality and mistakes with these players. We get angrier cos they've been crap for a while, or we cut them slack cos they've been great. Armstrong has been in hot form, so most of the fans have forgiven his occasional wayward shots, or striking when a pass was possibly better, etc. And he didn't come through our academy. I don't see much criticism of Dack's mistakes when he's in form either. Like I said, some people do extra bum the Academy lads a little (Jason Lowe certainly got too much credit with some) but for the most part it's about how good the player has been over a recent patch of form and in the past.

Bell and Bennett are just not up to scratch and we are sick of seeing it. So of course it's worse than one of our best players making the odd mistake and being human. To err is human, to err all the fucking time is Bennett.

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Posted (edited)

Apologies if already posted, but here's a list of the Prem players out of contract, who the article thinks might be available to Championship clubs.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.lancs.live/sport/football/transfer-news/premier-league-out-contract-players-18656870.amp

I don't watch any Prem anymore really with us not being in it, so a lot of the names are either unfamiliar to me or pretty old. One caught my eye when I was glancing just now though, Jordon Ibe. Still only 24, sold for 15 million four years ago. Probably a big wage job, but in this climate, could be interesting? Doesn't seem to have played much last season.

Not that I don't consider the defence and GK the absolute main priority.

Edited by bluebruce

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14 minutes ago, bluebruce said:

Apologies if already posted, but here's a list of the Prem players out of contract, who the article thinks might be available to Championship clubs.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.lancs.live/sport/football/transfer-news/premier-league-out-contract-players-18656870.amp

I don't watch any Prem anymore really with us not being in it, so a lot of the names are either unfamiliar to me or pretty old. One caught my eye when I was glancing just now though, Jordon Ibe. Still only 24, sold for 15 million four years ago. Probably a big wage job, but in this climate, could be interesting? Doesn't seem to have played much last season.

Not that I don't consider the defence and GK the absolute 

Sterry from Newcastle could be worth looking at, Be cheap and mates with Arma, Back up or could even try Nyambe in a CB position, 

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17 minutes ago, bluebruce said:

Apologies if already posted, but here's a list of the Prem players out of contract, who the article thinks might be available to Championship clubs.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.lancs.live/sport/football/transfer-news/premier-league-out-contract-players-18656870.amp

I don't watch any Prem anymore really with us not being in it, so a lot of the names are either unfamiliar to me or pretty old. One caught my eye when I was glancing just now though, Jordon Ibe. Still only 24, sold for 15 million four years ago. Probably a big wage job, but in this climate, could be interesting? Doesn't seem to have played much last season.

Not that I don't consider the defence and GK the absolute main priority.

I like the idea of Ibe we’d be the perfect club for him to rebuild his career. Wide right of Gallagher and Armstrong on the left as a front three would be terrifying at this level

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, tomphil said:

You were the one dragging Henry's private matters into it because of your notion that he was overrated which is ridiculous. You were also the one who decided to compare him to Berg when they were different types of players you'd never get Berg playing as a striker for a start.  

Big Col also got the treble in his top level swansong at Rangers which isn't bad. Just comes across as sour grapes from you towards him for some reason and a bit more than just a player opinion.

So yeah leave it there now the records straight... EH !!!

OK sweet cheeks💋 oh and by the way the records far from straight. I'm choosing to leave as its all opinion and its in the wrong thread anyway. 

Edited by Lucimo

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5 minutes ago, Jlee1984 said:

Sterry from Newcastle could be worth looking at, Be cheap and mates with Arma, Back up or could even try Nyambe in a CB position, 

Hmm don't know him but CV looks a bit Sam Hart ish. 24 years old, 25 in November, with only 3 appearances at Championship or above, and the rest in League One or League Two as loans. He actually has less career games than Hart, at a year older. But like I say, don't know him. Presumably would be very cheap, and I'll take someone who is actually an RB as cover over Bennett, assuming that thought even enters TM's mind. The Hart deal actually makes me think this might be the type of thing TM would look at if the budget is low.

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Just now, bluebruce said:

Hmm don't know him but CV looks a bit Sam Hart ish. 24 years old, 25 in November, with only 3 appearances at Championship or above, and the rest in League One or League Two as loans. He actually has less career games than Hart, at a year older. But like I say, don't know him. Presumably would be very cheap, and I'll take someone who is actually an RB as cover over Bennett, assuming that thought even enters TM's mind. The Hart deal actually makes me think this might be the type of thing TM would look at if the budget is low.

When we played them in the cup Xmas 18 he was man of the match I think since then I’ve heard nothing about him

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2 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

My point is more that I think some (not aiming this at yourself) seem to see "being patient" as unwilling to accept any doubts, any criticism of individual performances from specific games, even if it is done constructively. 

I am bias in my opinion after watching them from under 18's into under 23's then first team, so I far less critical of their performance as I am not expecting them to be Phil Jones or David Dunn quality. I will admit that to you. 

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4 hours ago, Swanson said:

He hasn't just read this masterpiece of an article ?

https://the72.co.uk/182030/five-players-tony-mowbray-could-target-for-blackburn-rovers/

One of the players suggest there is Chris Brunt. (and Jason Steele 😬)

Can you imagine if Steele came back!! 

Dear God there would be uproar!

I'd take Murphy and Gibson from that list.

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Jason Steele? That better be a joke. And it’s not a good one. I’d sooner have Jayson resigned.

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22 hours ago, AJW said:

Don’t disagree with that but it’s strange how us fans determine the rules for being a legend take Tugay for example , nobody would argue his legendary status but (without double checking the facts) my guess is Sherwood played more , scored more goals and Captained the championship winning team but is not considered a legend presumably because of the way he left

But Tugay had much more 'flair' in his game than Sherwood. And that, for me, would qualify him as a 'Tier 1' Rovers' legend, ahead of Sherwood.

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12 hours ago, Wegerleswiggle said:

He was that wanker that saved a penalty against Antonsson, and started laughing at us. 

No thank you!!

You're a true Rovers' fan imo; Wegerleswiggle!! I love having someone who I can hate for something like that!

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It's a no from me about Ibe. He's obviously a legend in his own lunchtime guy more interested in getting more points on his driving licence than appearances and goals. Talented, but is never going to amount to anything.

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7 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

Lenihan played 37 games last season missing 6 games due to injury, 2 games due to suspension and 1 game due to his wife giving birth to his 1st child. So hardly alot of games is it? and the season before !?!>

Mowbray didn't need to answer the question.

if Travis is sold? hinting at there Mercer?  Why the supposed interest in Whiteman then when we have other huge priorities like 2 goalies and 2 centre backs !?!?

I think Davenport has been decent enough for the under 23's when I've watched. Not on the level of Travis who stood out in the games I've watched in the under 23's games in 17/18 season. Why he got his chance in first team before his sending off at Portsmouth.  IMO, will never, ever be Championship material.

 

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So Raya being linked with a £10m move to the prem by skysports. 

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5 hours ago, Paul Mani said:

Fair enough. Like I said, once you mentioned it I took it completely on face value. Why would you lie.

Its interesting though. Says to me that there is money to spend.

IMO, looking at cheaper replacements for players to be sold!

Think there's a good chance Travis is off if we are looking at Whiteman - would net Rovers a couple of £million or so.

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