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Stuart

Goalkeepers

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Just now, Dreams of 1995 said:

Bloody hell. You must be an observational guy.

You have managed to determine a blokes character, determination and the respect he has from others by watching him perform some pre-match drills.

Was it the way he threw the cones down that had you deduce he had no personality?

When you go to football matches anywhere, whether it be Brockhall, Ewood, Leyland etc, you look to see what's going on.

You don't need to be Einstein to see which managers / coaches fizz and which fall into the mogadon category.  Look at the drills, how innovative, how sparky, how do the players respond. 

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4 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

and Raya's mistake on Saturday cost Brentford the win. He has made other mistakes aswell this season so dont keep overlooking them. I still remember his mistake against Birmingham at Ewood Park which allowed them a chance back into the game cos they werent coming back until that penalty. 

Well no they arent connected cos Walton wasn't Mowbray 1st 2 choices to replace as we know. if we got them then we wouldn't have gone Walton. I have said that Walton has been poor this season. Not played good enough all season. 

I am fully aware of what Mowbray has said since I was the one who posted the link. Yes Mowbray mention 5 or 6 loans. We need to wait and see

I didn't mention Venkys which you are obsess with instead of listening to exactly what Mowbray said about players agents wanting to wait and see due to the current climate.

I havent overlooked Rayas mistakes. I didnt see the Stoke game but from all accounts he made a bad error. I also recall one he did v Hull in a 5-1 win and he was responsible for giving us a penalty (which possibly was unfair) but still showed he has that rashness.

My point was from the games I have seen from him, he looks better than he did. I never felt totally confident with him in goal here, I dont think he progressed much and he was very error prone especially last year. I feel that some over rate him. BUT I have seen him a few times for Brentford who are often on TV and he seems much more assured. Is getting more plaudits, is conceded far fewer goals and seemingly making less mistakes. I still think hes probably a goalkeeper who may always have that element of fear instilled in the fans of the team he plays for but he seems to have improved far more this season.

In comparison, Walton has made a number of mistakes into double figures and is a big reason why we have again conceded into the 60s, despite an upgrade at CB. He is worse than Raya and youve been quite complimentary of him until very recently, constantly echoing (with implied knowledge) that Brighton really rate him. Its no good withholding judgement because Mowbray also had other targets, you judge him on what he did do, he sold a young but flawed goalkeeper to fund a striker to play out of position, and plugged the hole that it left with a inferior loanee.

The main point I am making is that, with a highly rated goalkeeping coach that has since been poached as well as a manager who can set up a defence, it seems that Raya has really progressed as a goalkeeper more so than he did here. The errors are still there but not as common and he is conceding less and getting more praise.

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Just now, darrenrover said:

He probably doesn't but he should be able to put a case together for a decision to be sanctioned by the owners, including a potential list of replacements.

The issue is, Mowbray may be achieving, or even overachieving the goals stipulated by the owners, as far as we know. If that's the case, as I suspect it well may be, Mowbray's going nowhere unless he jacks.

Is it in Waggott's remit of his job description to judge Manager's performance? Cos I don't think he got any sort of power or remit from the owners

Yet again we don't know what the owners set the target for Mowbray this season?

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Posted (edited)

Whilst folk are critical of Raya, he'll be Spain's number 1 before too long if the competition is currently in goal for United. De Gea in the £80 million bracket and on £13 million a year!

Edited by darrenrover

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Just now, chaddyrovers said:

Is it in Waggott's remit of his job description to judge Manager's performance? Cos I don't think he got any sort of power or remit from the owners

Yet again we don't know what the owners set the target for Mowbray this season?

It probably isn't chaddy but it should be, don't you think? It certainly can't be the owners either because they haven't been near the place for 6 years. Who does it then, Agents? Nobody?

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1 minute ago, roversfan99 said:

I havent overlooked Rayas mistakes. I didnt see the Stoke game but he did made a bad error. (change that abit for you)

I also recall one he did v Hull in a 5-1 win and he was responsible for giving us a penalty (which possibly was unfair) but still showed he has that rashness.

The one against us was a penalty all day long. 

3 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

In comparison, Walton has made a number of mistakes into double figures and is a big reason why we have again conceded into the 60s

Nowhere has said he hasn't made a number of mistakes especially since the restart. He hasn't been good enough as I have said a number of times. Any more times did you want me to say it. 

 

5 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Brighton really rate him

Brighton do rate him highly as been show by the comments made by the club. Can you argue to say they haven't said this? 

 

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Just now, chaddyrovers said:

The one against us was a penalty all day long. 

Nowhere has said he hasn't made a number of mistakes especially since the restart. He hasn't been good enough as I have said a number of times. Any more times did you want me to say it. 

 

Brighton do rate him highly as been show by the comments made by the club. Can you argue to say they haven't said this? 

 

A bit like if you're looking to sell a car, you don't say it runs like a bag of nails, suspension's a bit dodgy and it's ok if you drive in a straight line but veer to the left or right and you're in bother.

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Just now, darrenrover said:

It probably isn't chaddy but it should be, don't you think? It certainly can't be the owners either because they haven't been near the place for 6 years. Who does it then, Agents? Nobody?

If I was the owner of the club it would be my decision. So I can understand that its their decision. 

The owners make decisions from India. not ideal way to run our club as it would be great if they spend more time over in the UK running the club and attending games. 

Didn't Coyle say he met Balaji before he got the job? 

 

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1 minute ago, chaddyrovers said:

If I was the owner of the club it would be my decision. So I can understand that its their decision. 

The owners make decisions from India. not ideal way to run our club as it would be great if they spend more time over in the UK running the club and attending games. 

Didn't Coyle say he met Balaji before he got the job? 

 

I've no idea regarding Coyle.

We all know how the club ought to be run and probably most agree and accept that the owners would wish to be part of the process in the recruitment of key personnel.

What irks me is there has been nobody in a position of influence at the club for years who truly cares and knows what makes our supporter base tick.

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28 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

Is it in Waggott's remit of his job description to judge Manager's performance? Cos I don't think he got any sort of power or remit from the owners

Yet again we don't know what the owners set the target for Mowbray this season?

Which shouldn't be used to excuse TM, a terrible keeper or be happy about  the current situation. 

That said I'm fairly confident that the target, even with our lunatic owners, didn't include wasting £12 million on strikers or more pertenent to the discussion a keeper who drops so many clangers. 

Simply put if Walton is here next season we know that winning is not in the remit of the manager or owners. We would be using a proven failure who over the course of the season has demonstrated he isn't good enough. If we sign him it can only be for non footballing reasons.. 

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25 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

If I was the owner of the club it would be my decision. So I can understand that its their decision. 

The owners make decisions from India. not ideal way to run our club as it would be great if they spend more time over in the UK running the club and attending games. 

 

 

So Waggott’s a liar then?


“I have the authority and I make all the calls within the club. So it is me who is responsible

“Suhail has a role still, as a representative of the owners, but that’s purely to advise me sometimes, so I use him as an advisory role sometimes.

“But the decisions are made by me”

https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/16311127.decision-making-process-rovers-much-improved---waggott/

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37 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

The one against us was a penalty all day long. 

Nowhere has said he hasn't made a number of mistakes especially since the restart. He hasn't been good enough as I have said a number of times. Any more times did you want me to say it. 

 

Brighton do rate him highly as been show by the comments made by the club. Can you argue to say they haven't said this? 

 

My point is that, from what I have seen and also read about Raya, he HAS progressed as a goalkeeper. Goalkeepers make errors, it is how many that defines their performances. Raya made plenty here, he has made some this year but seemingly far fewer, has let in far fewer goals and has received plaudits. He has improved. Therefore it IS fair to question the role of a goalkeeping coach who has very questionable credentials and hasnt seen any real improvements with the goalkeepers.

The decision to sell a mistake prone, young goalkeeper, loan an inferior goalkeeper who makes MORE mistakes and then spend the Raya money (and a bit more) on a striker to play out wide was all a big mistake. Either sell Raya and get a better goalkeeper, or keep him.

We will see how much Brighton rate Walton, not through soundbites (when do managers say "I am loaning him out because he is crap") but through what happens to him next year. if he is really pushing Ryan, I will be flabbergasted. I suspect that he will either be fobbed off elsewhere again or he will stagnate in the background.

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15 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

So Waggott’s a liar then?


“I have the authority and I make all the calls within the club. So it is me who is responsible

“Suhail has a role still, as a representative of the owners, but that’s purely to advise me sometimes, so I use him as an advisory role sometimes.

“But the decisions are made by me”

https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/16311127.decision-making-process-rovers-much-improved---waggott/

Does he have the authority to sack Mowbray? I don't he does. 

Waggott probably does have authority to make most calls within the club but not the one over manager future

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18 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

So Waggott’s a liar then?


“I have the authority and I make all the calls within the club. So it is me who is responsible

 

“Suhail has a role still, as a representative of the owners, but that’s purely to advise me sometimes, so I use him as an advisory role sometimes.

“But the decisions are made by me”

https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/16311127.decision-making-process-rovers-much-improved---waggott/

In a word, yes. 

The primary school milk monitor has more authority than Waggot. 

And even in best case scenario that he does have authority then there is the minor issue of conflict of interest as his mate got him the gig. 

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Just now, chaddyrovers said:

Does he have the authority to sack Mowbray? I don't he does. 

Waggott probably does have authority to make most calls within the club but not the one over manager future

And this is why we need Venkys out of the club and should be railing against such a terrible system. 

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2 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

Does he have the authority to sack Mowbray? I don't he does. 

Waggott probably does have authority to make most calls within the club but not the one over manager future

So he is a liar.

‘I make all the calls’

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Would people think Joe Hart would be good choice as our number 1? 

He's available, lives in North West so knows the area. 

It was reported that MLS sides were interested but I would think that's unlikely due to Covid-19 crisis over there. 

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I’d have Hart. Big presence, winning personality, can vocally organise. Good basics.

 

Just can’t save anything to his left. Be reyt.

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Just now, chaddyrovers said:

Would people think Joe Hart would be good choice as our number 1? 

He's available, lives in North West so knows the area. 

It was reported that MLS sides were interested but I would think that's unlikely due to Covid-19 crisis over there. 

I'd have him. Would expect Rovers management to do a full review on the personal side but as a keeper he would fit in well.

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4 minutes ago, Cherry Blue said:

I'd have him. Would expect Rovers management to do a full review on the personal side but as a keeper he would fit in well.

I would sign him , price and wages dependent.

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I would also look at Marcus Bettinelli from Fulham. Good keeper in my opinion

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Just now, chaddyrovers said:

I would also look at Marcus Bettinelli from Fulham. Good keeper in my opinion

Good shout this one.

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4 hours ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

I would take Walton at £1.5 million, no more. Get another keeper in then as proper competition on loan or a free. He is only 24, which is young for a keeper. Probably (just about) more bad than good this season. What strikes me about him is that he isn't massively athletic. He looks cumbersome and slow coming out, even a bit akward. Still that's not a deal breaker for a keeper if they are tall , handle the ball well, kick well and can command their area(all of which he can do at times to be fair). I can't see him starting for Brighton next season. He could easily go back and realise that pretty quickly, before being loaned again. Us signing him on loan again would be the worst possible outcome. 

I would like to see us sign a keeper 30 plus who has a played a lot of games at this level. How we let Wigan sign Marshall last summer, I do not know. Would have been ideal. 

Weren't we linked with a loan for the Arsenal keeper last summer? He looks the business. Good thing he stayed there! 

Yeah Martinez at Arsenal I would be all over. Been loaned to the championship before and shone. Rather get him permanently tho.

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35 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

Would people think Joe Hart would be good choice as our number 1? 

He's available, lives in North West so knows the area. 

It was reported that MLS sides were interested but I would think that's unlikely due to Covid-19 crisis over there. 

What do you think Chaddy? You were against him coming a few months ago.

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