The struggle for the soul of the club commenced on day one. There were about thirty clubs in the town when John Lewis decided to form a new one. Reasoning that money was the key he invited the sons of the mill owners and tradesmen to become the first members. In doing so he was taught a swift lesson as those he had invited voted to keep him from the office he wanted, secretary. He soon got his wish because the wealthy elite found the job demanding and tiresome. Lewis lost control of the club in 1897 when it became a limited company and the purchase of most of the shares by the mill owning families gave control to Richard Birtwistle, Lewis attempted to galvanise the small shareholders (shop keepers and clerks in the town) to help him re-gain control but he was easily defeated and resigned his directorship. From then there has been little change. A consortium of wealthy industrialists and tradesmen have controlled the club. After the First War there were attempts to change the voting rights to give the small shareholders (IE supporters) a say but they were quickly crushed. Before the Second War Alderman Critchley attempted to organise a place on the board for a small shareholders representative but he was defeated every time. The power of the board was so great that they could conspire to remove from office Blackburn's greatest son, Bob Crompton, whose greatest offence was to be recognised as the club's leading light. After the war nothing changed. Many of the directors of the club were openly contemptuous of the fans which led to the fiasco of the Final tickets in 1960, a consequence of which the club lost 30% of its fans overnight. The levels of attendance of 1959 and 1960 have never returned. Even so the club was slow to respond and it was not until Bill Bancroft took over that the importance of the fans' view was recognised. The appointment of one of the unsung heroes, Keith Cafferty, brought a voice close to the fans whose views Bancroft more often than not listened to. Since that time the club has slowly moved to listen to the fans. It is a red herring to assume that control of the club by one man, Jack Walker, changed the dynamics of the situation. Walker knew well the necessity of crowd support which is why he replaced the popular Terry Ibbotson with John Williams, a man who had trained in giving the public what they want. That changed overnight when Venky's took over. In their defence Indian friends inform me that considering the views of supporters is unknown in the country. Which can be the only explanation behind utterances such as "a few people generating thousands of mails" and the generally recognised smear campaign against the fans. There are signs that the club has realised that they have been misdirected and the appointment of Myers and Waggott can be interpreted as recognition of the fact but this has been a very small step. Stuart is one hundred per cent correct and history supports him. Protest has an effect. I doubt Bancroft, the most opinionated and curmudgeonly of men would have appointed a commercial manager if he had not seen that fans were staying away. As a follower of the club since 1952 and a season ticket holder since 1960 I can only applaud those who still struggle to try and ensure that the club is aware of the importance of the fans and do not simply accept the status quo.

It's amazing how quickly people forget just how good of a manager he was here and how good a fit he was for the club like Mowbray himself has been a good fit but his failings and mixed up approach to stuff on the pitch seems to have finally caught up with him again just as it did at Boro & Cov. He was more of a busted flush than Hughes before he came here that's for sure but you only have to look at the coaching set up Hughes brings and their ethos to see it would be a step in the right direction.

Hughes lasted five years at Stoke, 2013 to 2018. Three 9th placed finishes and then 13th. Went awry in his last season, but then many managers do have a shelf-life. Unfairly maligned in my opinion.

I'd be actively looking to offload: Gladwin (out of contract), Hart (inexplicably given an extension recently but certainly not a first team contender), Nuttall (season long loan or sale if the opportunity arises), Williams (sale), Conway (release), Leutwiler (release), Samuel (sale or season long loan). I wouldn't have a particularly strong view on Smallwood - if he wants to play every week then I'd move him on, if he's happy to accept that he isn't going to be in the team every week he might be ok on the bench. Rodwell - if a deal can be done that is sensible then I wouldn't be against him staying. Reed - looks like he's being phased out as he won't be here next season. Big shame as his versatility and energy has been important to us this season but I doubt our ambitions align with his and our budget won't stretch to buying him outright. Dack - clearly the aim should be to keep and build around but once again we're seeing the foundations being laid for a sale with the manager suggesting he might sell to raise funds - I don't trust them on that front. Bennett - probably similar story to Smallwood. Good pro to have around and useful at times but we probably need to move away from him being 1st name on the teamsheet every week - probably the least likely to be moved out. Lenihan - another one like Dack we should be retaining and building around but another one who the money men might fancy selling off for a few million. Mulgrew - probably the toughest decision of the lot as to what we do there but Mowbray is going to have to do something or it will cost him his job. He will either need to replace him or find a way of defending much better with him.

Very disappointing to hear negative comments about Rothwell only to then read gushing guff like this: https://www.rovers.co.uk/news/2019/march/versatile-bennett-so-handy-to-have/ I reckon I could count the decent ‘balls into the box’ TM refers to on one hand during his time here. He’s had one heck of a mediocre season but let’s shower him with praise, Tony - he’s been quality.

I don’t think it helps who was in the picture to be honest, of all the players in the squad we had the most woefully under performing player of the season and a fantastic player that fans feel doesn’t have the right attitude to make good of his undoubted talent. Had the picture been of say Danny Graham, id personally think he has busted his balls all season and deserves a break. Footballers are spoilt babies and cancelling this break would have been counterproductive and if anything would have been seen as “giving into the fans” by players. I regularly listen to the John Parkin and Chris Brown podcasts and they talk of the mentality of players and fans relationship to time off and going out drinking , if you are winning it’s team building if you are losing it’s taking the piss but it’s the same players having the same down time win or lose.

Haven’t the last seven years taught you anything about what’s wrong with our club? You post 50 times a day moaning about Mowbray as though he is the only issue in an otherwise well-run, normal club. Mowbray, a washed-up bloke on the dole nearing retirement age, was getting calls from people in the game saying he was mad to come here. The one time we got an actual current manager he walked. The one time we seemed likely to get an actual current successful manager, someone, we know not who, nixed it and parachuted in Coyle. Mowbray will get fired when it suits the agenda of whoever decides these things, which will have nothing to do with what the fans think or want, nor how our results are going.

We'll have to figure out how to play Mulgrew as he's the club captain and he's someone who contributes a lot when on song, and I think Bell is a player who can be developed over time. Williams needs to go though, hopefully someone will be daft enough to give us a few grand. Also we should cut short the deal talks with Rodwell, and focus the budget on genuine defenders. We don't need anything fancy. Just a couple of guys who can head the ball, have a bit of pace, and can sense danger and react.

Does ok keeping stable Prem clubs stable but flounders at the more ambitious ones it seems but I think here he could build a team again in the mould of the last one on modest funds. Of course it would be a shadow of his side here last time but he brings everything that's missing at the moment like the tactics of a solid settled side with some physical presence both ends and some graft in the middle dotted about with a bit of pace and quality who can go toe to toe and grind out results and also play a bit when he lets them off the leash. Players would be coached for and signed for specific jobs within the team although not sure how he'd cope with an Indian middle man maybe dumping players on him he didn't want and telling him others were un-dropable - hypothetically of course.

Needs a scan for ability. And a full x-ray to find an ounce of desire.

Sure there’ll be a split consensus on this, but I’d keep Rodwell providing it was a sensible wage & the intention was for him to play central midfield, although I can’t see that happening from what we’ve heard previously from Mowbray. Shame for me as he could be a tidy centre mid at this level when kept fit, he undoubtedly has quality and experience that would be useful next to Travis. Reed likely won’t be here next season too so would make him a handier signing.

His bird looks remarkably like Williams.

I think you've got the dubious pleasure K-Hod! I'll bet he argues about the weather!

I've just seen on the LT website that in our four of our last five away games we have scored two in each but have garnered one point. That summarises exactly were we are.

I don't think Waggott's appointment has got anything to do with appeasing supporters or keeping them in the loop. It's more to do with the fact that Cheston was struggling to cope with running the operation on his own and my belief is Mowbray told the owners that additional support was essential and so recommended someone who he had worked with recently who was looking for a job. Waggott's role at the club seems to be almost entirely to try and increase revenues whilst cutting costs and I suspect that will be the sole criteria he is judged on. Clearly keeping supporters happy and buying stuff contributes towards that. Unfortunately in his 12 months or so at the club he has jacked prices of tickets up and closed another home area down, and publicly admitted falling short of his sales target. I eagerly await news of next years season ticket information but the mere fact we're already playing catch up to many Championship clubs on the sales window is just further evidence of the dysfunctional nature of the operation here. Any club or CEO so concerned about income and crowds would be moving heaven and earth to get such an important element of income on sale asap, yet no doubt when we do get news in April or May and we've missed 3 months of potential sales that rivals have enjoyed it will be a question of commitment of the fans, rather than any acceptance that Rovers' own performance is well short of what is needed.

By "actual current manager" I take it you mean Lambert. I'm pretty sure that like Mowbray he was not a "current manager" but out of work when we appiinted him. Talk of Hughes is interesting. I have no idea about whether he still has "it" but what he would do, like when he took over from Souness, would be to revise expectations for the better. There'd be no more talk about survival or maintaining our position as there was under Souness or nonsense about slow burns and gradual improvement as there is under Mowbray. He would set the target for success i.e. promotion as soon as possible and players wouldn't be able to turn up at half time or reach relative safety and clock off for the rest of the season. Whether he can achieve his targets these days obviously would be a bit of a gamble. Would take him over Mowbray though.

I went last weekend against Vallecano. Insane experience and fantastic to witness the genius in the flesh. Only shame was you could sense that they all had Lyon on their minds so took their foot off the gas once they’d scored the 3rd. If they’d wanted to they could have spanked them. I returned unscathed from Las Ramblas - so a successful trip all round!

Why get worked up ? They're supposed to be pro athletes with a bit of pride in themselves and the shirt. I bloody hated losing, after losing a game like that I'd have to lie down in a darkened room to calm down. There's nothing beating under that badge and it's been like that for ages. When that Dingle got on the pitch at the Turf years ago our lads faced him down, this lot would have run away.

Sat here in later January the world was a fantastic view. No surprise, considering the last few years that we have challenges on the pitch, but that's what happen to clubs from time to time. All managers make mistakes and we are in tough run, but with the young players coming through and some prudent signings and outgoing we should do well next season.

Who does everybody want gone in a hypothetical summer clear out? Assuming we can shift them off the books? For me: Dominic Samuel Ben Gladwin Craig Conway Derek Williams Charlie Mulgrew Jason Leutwiler One of Richie Smallwood or Corry Evans not particularly bothered which one Paul Downing Sam Hart (I'd keep Bell as 2nd choice left back)

Venkys

Every wide player in the world has defensive responsibilities. I like Rothwell, but if he consistently finds himself robbed down blind alleys and we’re being countered, should we not at least expect the effort to get back?

I don't think either keeper is good enough, but keep either as back up to a new keeper. Both Bell and Williams should be instantly on the chopping board, 2 terrible players. Would keep Lenihan and Nyambe, Mulgrew potentially as a 4th choice centre back, but we need an overhaul in defence as an urgent priority. In midfield, I would sign Rodwell up for an extra year or two solely as a midfielder, Travis is a very good prospect, Reed I would like to get on loan again but I don't think he can be considered a big enough priority to spend a chunk of our budget on. Evans I would keep as a squad player, I think he's had a pretty decent season. Smallwood, Bennett and Conway I would thank and move on, Gladwin I would just move on. In attacking positions, build around Dack, give a new contract if we can. Armstrong, Rothwell, Chapman all can play big parts going forward. Graham still has a huge part to play, otherwise up front we are short. Samuel has got better to some people by not playing and needs discarding, I don't think Nuttall is or will ever be good enough, and Brereton has looked woefully short and I would loan out ideally. So yeah, a big overhaul and one that wont happen!

Probably for the best

Are you Derek Bentley lol?

It's a fair question. I'd keep him. If he had come though our youth ranks then we would be happy to let him develop in the u23s. He has more potential than nuttall who I believe has hit his ceiling so on that basis I'd keep him. On the flip side if he had come through the youth ranks and he was released I can't see many losing much sleep

£7 million aside - which I appreciate is a.factor, as are the undercurrents of who brought him and why - but on ability alone would anyone really want Bereton to stay?

PNE are run properly - we aren't. I'd bet that their owner and board will have a budget ready for the summer and a plan for what players they will be going for. We won't have a clue until our lot fly out to India and Madame finds time to speak to them.

Alex Neill is doing ok at PNE and he's built a team on £5m and low wages. It's the manager that is the most important piece of the jigsaw.

Personally to start things off, I would try to get two center-halves, and a left back. Other positions would be nice, but until the defence is sorted it would be a waste of time. Sorry wrong thread.

I'm not worried by that. Mowbray knows what we need in the summer. Hopefully that work is ongoing right now nope! enjoying life nope! just enjoying time away from the messageboard. Been busy with other things and don't need to be on here every single day. I wont be coming on every single day anymore. Don't need too clearly you forget how Hughes struggle at Southampton and Stoke defensively and getting them keeping clean sheets there. The Hughes now is miles away from the Hughes we had.

You can forget about getting a fee for any of them. I suppose it depends what sort of wages they are on. If Mulgrew is on £15k a week at Rovers then even that's too much for most scottish teams outside of Rangers and Celtic and he ain't going to either of those. Same with Williams if he on close to £10k a week, are a top half league 1 club going to pay that? I think someone would sign Smallwood on a free, not as sure about Evans but probably. Bell would find another club and with his ages might demand a small fee. So your into the territory of paying a chunk of their wages for them to play somewhere else. A complete pay off is out of the question for me. Wages are the problem we've got when signing players, like with the Brereton signing you get the feeling that the money is there for the transfers but not for wages. We've actually done quite well to lower the wage bill but then Mowbray has given pay rises and longer contracts to players who we now know aren't up to it and have no resale value. This is going to limit the scope of the changes we can make in the summer. What we desperately need is £5million or so being spent on a commanding centre back. You look at say Leeds and Norwich for all the football they play they each have a very dominant centre back in Pontus Jansson and Timm Klose and if we had that it would be a big part towards us becoming a stronger defensive unit, won;t be cheap though.

Stranglers - Golden Brown

Red Hot Chilli Peppers - Blood Sugar Sex Magik

Which is why The Taffia never be appointed. Venky’s have never paid for a back room setup like that, always make do and mend on that front.

Messi has nothing to prove by only having played in Spain. He'd immediately be the best current and also the best ever player in the PL if he ever played here.

My missus is both a lip reader and a Spanish speaker. When Messi notched that hat trick goal last night she swears he said “Estas viendo Stuart?”

Anyone who thinks that would be mad. Probably the same people who say that PSG and Bayern can't win the CL because their league is uncompetitive in terms of a title race. It can't work both ways..... Re. Ruben, I don't think Michael Appleton and Gary Bowyer not knowing what to do with a player with very good technical ability a bit rough round the edges means one league is stronger than the other. You could say that King wasn't good enough for us in the Championship yet he banged in 16 in the PL the other year and probably isn't far off this season. But there are loads of factors that come into play with things like that - such as a quality manager in Hughes (as he was then at least) being able to get the best out of Samba from Hertha Berlin reserves. All world class players play for teams good enough to have other world class players. It would be bizarre if that wasn't the case. So if he moves to Juventus in summer, a team with other world class players who've just won their eighth title in a row and scores say 25+, you'd think more highly of him? He's got zero to prove.

I bet it happens every break, they just got caught by a selfie doorstepper this time...

You're not the type who comes on here to post provocative comments that wind people up so I have to take it that you are serious with this comment. Messi is a genius, pure and simple. One of the most gifted footballers ever. He's made everyone he's played against look silly. If you don't want my opinion search what any player, former player, manager, or pundit has to say about him. Or YouTube some of his highlights. There are plenty so I'll not post any on here.

With the dreadful run of form were hitting, the availability of Red button or streamed games, ridiculous and unnecessary changes to KO times, the awful atmosphere caused partly by the club insisting on alienating fans by shutting stands, I really think Mr Waggot and Co could well be in for a real shock this summer in terms of season ticket sales.

If this current run was at the start of the season and we sat bottom of the league on 4 points after 9 matches I don't think anyone would be defending the manger. If we were a normal club with a competent board made up of people who understand football I would say now is the perfect time to change the manager - International break for him to settle in and then 8 games to assess the current playing staff. Then recruit over the summer ready for next season. However, we are not a normal club. VO.

I think Hughes and Allardyce liked taking the squad away for some disciplined warm weather training. This looks like a jolly up for two under performing players.

They really just don't get it do they? Put prices up, put season tickets on sale late, shut home areas, move people around, move kick offs away from 3pm, surcharges, database only tickets, red button tv games, dreadful atmosphere at Ewood and mind-numbingly dull football. There you go - I've come up with just 10 reasons why crowds may be poor that could all quickly be reversed by Rovers if they were so bothered about it. Yet here we are, nothing happening, groundhog day stuff. It will be the same dull stuff against Stoke in a few weeks.

The Jam - Just Who Is The 5 O'Clock Hero

The Stranglers - Who Wants the World

Another poopy performance. To be fair I thought we looked good going forward at times, and with Rothwell in the mix perhaps we have two game changers on the field at once. Not sure if he has ruffled the feathers within the Ewood Park brotherhood. But if he has he better kiss and make up as he was a wee bit fancy out there. I was listening to Sheffield Wednesday (uber biased commentary) and they liked the look of Rothwell. Once I know we are secure for next season I will like Mowbray to become the tinker man, play some more kids, give Rothwell a go, perhaps even the Mountie between the sticks. Different formation, perhaps Rodwell in midfield, see what we have under the hood. Our league 1 formation did us well for so long, now lets mix it up a bit. Thoughts from the fans, the gaffa and more.

Everyone forgets the elephant in the room. Venkys. We are no-where near a normal run football club with these (still) clueless owners. I hate to think who would replace Tony if he were to leave us. Maybe it's better the devil you know. Don't want to jump out of the frying pan into the fire.

Unconfined joy at Bloomfield Road today by all accounts. Not because of the 2-2 draw with Southend but because the fans' sense of belonging has returned. They have got their club back and can celebrate as one. Who knows what the future holds but they have got something to believe in again. I'm jealous.

I will never forget or forgive Jim white for the shite he spouted before the fa cup game against united I met him when Wigan played united in the Carling cup final and he seemed like a nice guy, probably is, but the venkys where coming for you claptrap really stuck in my throat