I’m assuming this is just personal opinion because the facts don’t support that assertion at all. Facts collated in july 2019 points collected in the premier league blackburn rovers 11th most successful Number of seasons spent in the premiership blackburn rovers 12th in the table average points per game in the premiership blackburn rovers 1.39 8th most successful. One of only a handful of premiership winners. The facts suggest we are more than capable of holding our own and I havent even started on the long roll call of our history. Not least the 7th most successful club decade on decade. The way out of this league is by getting the right manager, not one way but the only way. I’m sick of hearing about this club being big and that club being a giant in comparison to us. We are has good has anyone in this league and has big if not bigger in terms of success but we need to start believing that. Unfortunately the guy at the helm appears to want us to believe that mediocrity should be acceptable. Well it’s not.

Lets get back to what a crap job TM is doing. i hope Middlesbrough come calling soon

You ever get the sense that some clubs are just 'broken'? Probably something of an understatement with our clowns in charge, I know. In recent years, other clubs like Sunderland and Stoke have all appointed experienced, bright managers who turned everything they touched to dust. This is in no way an attempt to absolve Mowbray of responsibility, especially as he's received more financial backing than previous incumbents. You might argue that was his reward for winning promotion and establishing us back in the Championship. He still must carry the can for the schoolboy tactics and dubious transfer strategies which threaten to stagnate our progress. However, whenever we speculate about the managers we could attract, I can't shake the gnawing feeling that no matter who comes through the door they are doomed to fail.

I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt. But know this, on this forum when a poster calls us “Blackburn” it is usually spoken by non-Rovers fans - especially fans of local rivals. It’s virtually an insult. Go and type www.rovers.co.uk into your url bar and see which club you get - or @rovers or @onerovers on Twitter. If you persist with calling us “Blackburn” then you are outed I’m afraid.

This is a Blackburn Rovers forum, so we probably won’t think you mean Doncaster if you mention ‘Rovers’, that’s how we refer to the club on here, just like we do in real life. You should have noticed that before you started your trolling and gave yourself away.

That is anything but a 'fact'. I have lived in Scotland for 25 years and people with absolutely no connection to Blackburn ask me things like "Who do Rovers play on Saturday?" or "How did the Rovers get on last night?". You might say "Ah, but they already know who you support" but the truth of the matter is when I'm asked by taxi drivers and the like who my team is, I always say "The Rovers" and the vast majority of people know exactly who I mean. They usually follow it up (in Glasgow) with "Aye, but who do you REALLY support?".........but that's another story. Even that inbred lot call us B*st*rd Rovers not B*st*rd Blackburn.

Actually they do. I always say Rovers and people generally know because we are the original and most successful

Are Burnley "big enough" to survive in the Premier League? Or Bournemouth, Watford etc? What an odd comment.

I expect better from the man who wrote Business Secrets of the Pharaohs.

This is exactly right. We can debate all day long about the manger, the players he picks and the formation. It's all irrelevant when looking at the big picture. I am really worried about the club's future. The longer the Vs are here, the bigger the debt, the worse our prospects, the less chance of turning things around. No point splashing money on players with possible resale value when the foundations of the club are nothing but sand. What happens when they decide to call it a day? Does anyone think they will have any interest in what happens to the club after that ? Bad result and performance at QPR but and it upsets us all but there are far more important things to worry about I'm afraid.

A bit more context needed imo - if we were a club with a very small budget etc. then maybe we'd be punching above our weight and happy to be in this division. However that is not the case. We had one of the best championship squads with Marshall, Cairney, Hanley, Duffy, Gestede, Rhodes, Olsson and Cairney and King and fluffed it. We have had £15 mill to spend in the last season or two with a manager getting to rebuild and are fluffing it. We had a ton of talent amidst our 5 managers in a season and fluffed it. One thing that sticks out is we haven't got the managerial appointment right once - and that is no coincidence. No manager should be stupid enough to break up Rhodes/Gestede to play Brown - but it happened. No manager should be stupid enough to lump the ball long to Rhodes for 90 mins in a cup quarter final - but it happened. No manager should have numerous players regularly playing out of position - but it happens. Bit of a theme eh? Crap managers with no one keeping them accountable for some bat nuts decisions. No wonder we are stuffed. Even Holloway got the asylum that is Blackpool promoted. Watford change managers at the drop of a hat yet have done ok till this season. Newcastle got promoted and have somehow stayed up and got a big name manager despite some farcical decisions. Even basket case clubs can limp along and do ok but not us. So yeah I agree with you, we are stuffed because we aren't doing well when things are relatively positive and we do atrociously when things are bad. The joy of supporting Rovers.

Do you follow our fortunes at all closely? Because that’s not a million miles from our current scenario. For the record, I would take a season in the Premier League, gaining zero points and scoring zero goals and being relegated by Christmas - because it would give us financial security and a possible end to Venky purgatory. We are currently losing millions every year just to maintain mid table mediocrity in the Championship. It can’t continue indefinitely. The only way we can substantially increase revenue is promotion. If we cut costs we get relegated.

Not sure either of us should disagree with the other too hard on this. It's kinda like comparing dog shit and cat shit.

Cornershop - Brimful of Asha

Yes I think so, Sunderland being the prime example. They got through a ton of managers, some of whom had been good before and since their stints there, yet it never has worked out for them. All those managers can't be naff. I would add perhaps it goes in periods rather than forever - for example for quite a while I thought Sheff Utd would fall into this category as a number of managers failed to get them promoted out of league 1, but they seem to be doing alright now! So perhaps it happens in spells? But yeah, our structure is atrocious and is going to hinder any manager even if it is just a sluggishness in the transfer market and zero pressure not helping to push the manager onwards.

They will on here though!!

Blackburn? You're not a Rovers fan then? Preston perhaps? 4 posts so far, 2 on this 2 on Brexit and all very provocative.

It’s not really about what you’re like, it’s more to do with the financial situation which most people in Blackburn find themselves in means paying monthly is the only viable way to get a season ticket because they can’t have £300+ leave their back account in one month.

It all depends on what your opinion of playing well is. The last three games in my opinion, have been, Poor, average, and beyond poor.

Would have to disagree, Williams is a shit left back but Bell is just an absolute disgrace of a footballer. As bad a left back as I can remember seeing.

IMO, the reality with Mowbray does not match the perception! Over his time with Rovers, IMO, he's hung too many players out to dry, particularly younger players at the expense of his established 'favourites'. Always been a bit suspicious about the bloke - to me, comes across as too good to be true at times. His meet the fans at Blues back in February, IMO, put a torpedo through his credibility with his comments on the defence and future player trading plans for the team overall. IMO, being 'too nice' a guy has little to do about his success or otherwise in the world of football. The bottom line, IMO, is he's unable to set up a team properly, he's tactically naive, he fails to get the best out of what he has (consistently far too many square pegs in round holes) and other than Dack, his player trading is pretty poor with Armstrong, Brereton and Gallagher being horrible expensive signings. I do not think we have a playing identity and after three years in charge, I think that is a sad indictment.

Some more cuttings including commentary on the best goal I ever saw at Ewood Park. Bryan Douglas V West Brom Easter Saturday 1963. There's a team photo- who can name all the players ?

As per requested some old Rovers cuttings . Mainly Bryan Douglas.

No self respecting rovers fan calls Kean f@@king Stevie. Jog on lad.

Like I said you are clearly on the wind up. I guess Stevie Kean is one of your heroes is he?

Imagine calling Rangers or Celtic Glasgow, or even saying Rangers have a plumb draw in the Scottish cup and meaning Berwick. Someone is on the wind up and referring to a former manager as Stevie Kean, seems like a term of endearment to me and therefore says it all!!!

Yes. All matchday prices went up by £3 and STs were frozen. Based on Riverside £19 is now £22 £22 is now £25 Then there was the creation of the rip off A+ which is a massive £36 or £40 in the BBE. The emphasis is on improving the value for money of the ST, now worth 10 free games. https://www.rovers.co.uk/news/2019/july/matchday-prices-2019-20/ But if you still can't afford a ST or you will miss lots of games so don't find it worthwhile, it doesn't address the 20K empty seats. That's why sales didn't improve.

I would play Downing as a left wingback.

The Albion = Brighton? Really? Mmmm....only you would really know whether you're being honest with that one but I would hazard a guess that most people would think West Brom, despite Brighton's current premier league status. You very rarely hear BHA being referred to by their full name and therefore I bet some folk don't even realise. Your Bristol and QPR analogies don't really work, by the way, but you probably knew that. Anyway this is in danger of derailing the thread but a pet hate of mine is someone putting an opinion forward as a fact, which is why I interjected. We'll just need to agree to disagree I think.

We have been in the Championship now for almost 10 years but we have never once seriously challenged for even the play-offs. You'd think just by the law of averages we would have got close at least once? So, in summary, I agree with you! We are stuffed.

Who is playing left wing back? Bell? He's utter sh*te. I'd prefer we give Hart a go - he really cannot be any worse. Bell is one of the most ponderous footballers I have ever seen.

I'd be half tempted to throw Sam Hart in there than trying to watch Bell or Williams plod about there again, I have seen enough of them at left back.

It's a strange comment, because Rovers held their own for 17 years out of the first 19 years of the Premiership. 11 of those years being years without Uncle Jack.

A club that has a plan. No room for sentiment or emotion. He did his job, got them up, now it's clearly not working so replace. It is unusual for us sitting here to see such ruthlessness and forward planning. When it was at Rovers we sat in the relegation zone until March then made a change when it was too late. The people running Barnsley have too much sense just to sit back and do nothing.

Adversity is bringing them a togetherness its always been a bit of a different scenario there than here they've been shafted by a sequence of events that can happen to any club these days but more of a natural decent as previous decent owner runs out of money and downfall begins right there. Here we had it taken away by a bunch of crooks and clowns overnight and i doubt there is a club who's fans have had their faces rubbed in it like here for a good number of years. Damage and suspicion is lasting and always just under the surface but there was a bit of a coming together again in league 1 it almost resembled Mackays days again for those who remember. Sadly the club didn't pipe into it and it seems to have slid away again, a one season wonder. Attitude seems to be right we've done the hard work to right the relegation so lets just get back to plodding as before. We were a midtable steady Prem club when this lot appeared and that is the wrong that needs to be righted. Not easy obviously and not all about money but to me they've never ever shown any real desire to do it aside from the first season down out the Prem when they inexplicably and inexcusably let the same snakes who'd took us down blow 50 milliion parachute money plus the rest. Something is missing here and to me it is still that void between Blackburn and India, until that changes nothing ever will. Monthly transfers of money to keep solvent plug the gap and it's a good job it does but it's not enough really. This end is grateful and that end thinks this end should be as it's doing its bit. Where's the human angle ?

Its on record that Cheston went on holiday after the interviews after settling on Warnock with the aid of Lamberts coaching staff. Other dark forces then binned all of that off and appointed Coyle. Those forces are still out there connected with our club. All in my humble opinion of course.

Preston and Burnley unfortunately two clubs with some forward thinking and foresight. Grayson and Howe both did decent jobs there and delivered mid table Championship football without really threatening the top end. Both were poached and enticed away by bigger clubs. Rather than allow that misfortune to send them into decline they used the opportunity to progress and go one better by finding, unfortunately, gems who were both unemployed and on the scrap heap after being sacked from Norwich and Watford. A bit of patience, honesty, proper organisation and support for the manager working under a traditional no nonsense board of directors and the results are there for all to see. They didn't spend their lives bullshitting fans about unrealistic targets or hiding behind every excuse going. Just got on with it. Can you imagine the people running this club having the gumption to appoint a gem of a manager. Last time round they stumbled across Mowbray who to be fair rebuilt his reputation and helped the owners out massively with overall good results. Prior to that they entrusted a managerial search to Mike Cheston and Suhail Pasha who between them turned Neil Warnock down and opted for Owen Coyle after interviewing the likes of Neil Redfearn, Russell Slade and Warren Joyce. Frightening. At least we've now got Steve Waggott who of course was nothing at all to do with Mowbray being here and being popular with the owners.

Neither is Del there to be honest.

I was going to mention before we seem to be in the phase with TM now Preston were with Grayson a few years ago. It you really want to aim for promotion you've got to source and recruit a manager with that kind of drive otherwise if you want to stay safe and have an outside shot of a once in a decade good season you stay with the Mowbrays. Graysons etc etc The ones running, owning, stakeholding in Rovers and their advisers aren't capable of that because it might involve actually poaching a good manger from somewhere and paying a bit of compen. Also those on the ground here running it wouldn't want that they've got a cushty little number going being an average championship club with minimal risk.

Spot on . Football made highly complex by this clown . Where do you see the top sides making changes to personnel or to systems the way this bloke does? Pick the team you want and think is your best 11 and stick with it and let the opposition worry about us . By we spend to much time over thinking the opposition and building them up to be Barca. Is it really a surprise to us that we are short defensively? Defenders are coming , he signs Tosin who after 12 games has barely been sighted through a telescope and tries to persuade us that Lenihan and Williams are the solution . Lunacy. Then we have a makeshift right back who he makes captain !! After that it really is tombola time further forward with the squandering of £12million on 2 non scoring strikers- job losing decisions in any other all of life. ive never been more disillusioned tbh - going absolutely nowhere when in reality we have individuals who with a good manager would be hunting the top 6. the sad thing is we all knew deep down this was very very likely to happen once the window shut and the lies were laid bare . new identity/ playing style my ass . Sell by date passed a long time ago . Thanks for your efforts Tony but time to say goodbye. Quick quiz question: who is most confused ? 1) venkys 2) Mowbray and Venus 3) the players 4) the fans Answers on a bloody postcard!!!!

Ah, someone else has seen the light, welcome jim. The trouble is, we needed real quality in that position in summer to replace Graham but ended up spending £5m on Gallagher who proved he wasn't much good the last time he was here and who if anything appears to have gone even further backwards in the interim. Why would you spend big (ish) money on a striker you've already seen isn't much good? It should be a lucky escape not a signal to open the cheque book. I really don't understand it.

It’s muddled thinking in my opinion. He wants to have options to play different styles and formations according to who we are playing or what mood he is in. problem is that some players suit a certain brand of football and others don’t. So they often get put in places that aren’t going to get the best out of them. You can achieve a lot if you have a team of players that know they’re roles in the side and are comfortable playing in it. You can have one player playing a role that’s not there best of you’ve got 10 other players that do. But we have no consistency week to week, it’s very frustrating (eg watching Armstrong drift into the centre in between the lines) I think Mowbray over values certain attributes like Versatility for example - he likes these players because they are flexible for him to crowbar in many positions and because he can’t decide what we are and what they are. The problem we’ve got now is whatever team and whatever shape he wants us to be/have we are lacking in a certain area. you want to play 3 at the back? Well we don’t have wing backs only have 3 centre backs In the squad and how do you fit Dack into that. Want to play 2 up front instead of forcing one striker to play out wide, how do you fit in all those players who seem to be no. 10’s like Dack, Downing, Holtby. Wants to bring young players through, who is next of the conveyor belt? Buckley, Butterworth, JRC, Davenport and he’s stacked the squad with players that play in those positions. Want to play a pressing game? Well then you can play then it doesn’t suit some of them want to play a possession game passing out from the back?Then why have spent money on forwards when we’ve got defenders and midfielders who can’t play that style eg Lenihan and Johnson. why spend all your money on a striker who can win headers when you have nobody in the squad who can put a damn cross into the box let alone have a proper winger. If we are meant to be believing we are building towards a playoff push then I don’t see it with Tony anymore. Not this season or next, he has had money in transfers and importantly wages and I can’t see what he’s trying to achieve, can we afford to let him have another transfer window? I’m not sure we can.

The partial report is by the great Alf Thornton in " The Last Sports ".

Love how they completely exiled Rollins and Wyatt from Raw and saved the "highlights" of the match for the very end of the show, lasting about 30 seconds. They know they fucked up really badly this time - the only question is whether they just drop the whole thing or try to restart it when people have had a little time to calm down. As an aside Raw was boring as usual. I'm at the point where I may just stop watching it and stick with Dynamite/NXT going forward.

I smell a Dingle. How many times have Bristol Rovers or Doncaster Rovers ever won major honours. Thought not. Try harder lad.

Anyone but Bell.? Lord save us.

We had much more than that

Literally the worst possible player to get injured, as our only remotely decent left back.

Players look confused and rudderless to me. I've never seen a manager send handwritten notes to players during the match like Mowbray on Saturday. Burnley show how it should be done - same formation every week with players slotting in and out into a system where everyone knows what their job is.

It should, indeed, be the Bell end.