This isn’t intended as a thorough summary of the meeting, but here’s what I took away from it. This is from memory, not my notes, please consider this my observation and interpretations. Transfer Window Disappointing window, what happened? Mowbray disappointed we couldn’t get anyone in. Wasn’t for want of trying. Spoke about the difficulties around this for 25 minutes. Shocked by wage demands and asking prices. Won’t break wage structure. Got close on some deals. Has to field questions from Venkys as to why he hasn’t bought anyone You said defenders are coming, while we got some loanees, why do Venky’s seem reluctant to spend on defensive reinforcements, but happy to spend elsewhere? Mowbray angry We’ve changed goalkeeper, brought in Adarabioyo, Lenihan is good enough to get us promoted, loves Nyambe’s attitude and believes he can make a top player. We can’t bring in an entire new defence, doesn’t know what people expect. Clarified point that it was not a question aimed it Mowbray, it was about long term strategy and a reluctance from the owners, money made available for expensive attackers We aren’t going to find a centre half who can, pass, tackle, head and read the game – they will be in the premier league. Its an important position, seemed to concede we could do with investing there, but stated it is difficult. Walton wasn’t a target, fell into our laps at the end of the window. Others fell away. Knows he makes the odd mistake like all keepers, had the option to replace in January. Are we not going to be back at square one in the summer as loans and contract expire? Yes. Mulgrew has another year (just an inkling, but he didn’t seem overly happy with the Mulgrew situation) Bell has an option in the clubs favour for another year Aiming for 2 keepers Centre halves massively important, would like to work a bit of magic with city and get Adarabioyo on loan again Budget was around £1.3 million, they can always ask for more Are defenders and goalkeepers a priority in the summer window? Yes. Commercial Why do we have a third kit? We are not Man Utd with faceless fans. It is exploitative. Waggott Angry – I would never exploit anyone Grey kit has sold brilliantly Sold out 2 runs of 3rd kit Mowbray looked at Slaven Bilic and neither of them could believe we had been allowed to play in those kits as it was difficult to tell the grey and West Broms kit apart. So many teams in this league play in white, and grey is close to white Didn’t ever want to have to borrow a kit Mowbray doesn’t decide who wears what kit Waggott, the kit men, people from umbro and people from marketing sit down and review kits and decide on them Might use same 3rd kit next year Steve, you made a comment, "We couldn't have done more, where is everyone?" How do you think a remark like that is received by supporters, who already feel they have been treated with contempt for a decade? No disrespect intended – it was meant to be a rallying cry We fell short of the target (10k target, sold just over 8k season tickets, £325k shortfall) Went to bat for the fans with the owners to ensure no price hike Tries to understand economic pressures within the area Oxford game was an event, not a match. People haven’t been back – not core support as highlighted by them going on the pitch Scrap the Waggott tax. Planning around catering People come to watch the game, not because of pies and Bovril. It’s a barrier. And expoits fans and stops spur of the moment decisions I don’t see it that way, we have the 1875 membership, that helps limit the cost of category A+ games Lots of discussion round this – would consider it Can’t make every game a tenner Needs signoff from the owners on pricing issues and initiatives Speaks to people at away games who still wont set foot in Ewood – understands why, hopes to re-engage The 10k giveaway was a bad one wasn’t it? It can’t have lead to a single sale. Yes it was a bad idea. Almost done as an afterthought Why is their primary use of the electronic advertising boards to promote Venky’s brand? What commercial value does this have to the club? Not the primary function Much of the advertising remains unsold so can account for this – it has a value. Same with the Riverside. Answered concisely and well. If and when we sell advertising, we will see less of the Venky’s logo Stadium Can we move away fans into the lower tier? Fans forum have been relentless on this issue Lots of discussion on this – opinions mixed Marginal gains V loss of atmosphere Opposition fans can sometimes seem to suck the ball into the net Looking at getting home fans behind both goals Refillable glasses and greener options Sodexo looking into it. Aware of H&S issues Lack of suitable allergen friendly options, and limited knowledge of catering staff Disappointing. Will raise with Sodexo. Improvements to lounges mentioned in the intro. Finance/Ownership FFP position Over to Cheston – As it stands we are FFP compliant. We don’t have to report this yet, our accounting period is at the end of June so there is time to fix any issues if needs be. Wasn’t giving anything away or getting into specifics. Almost defensive. Clarified the three year period FFP relates to Has there been any talk of a sale/buy back of Ewood? Cheston: No Waggott interjected: Not at all happy! This has come from the fans forum. I’ve been misinterpreted. We said we were aware of all options available to us and suddenly we are selling Dack and selling Ewood. Had to field calls from the EFL as this got out and hadn’t been discussed with them They are aware of the ACV status So while its not imminent, is it something that may be looked at down the line should we need to remain FFP compliant? That’s hypothetical at the moment We’d need to sit down with all stakeholder. There are legal ramifications. We are a long way off that point. I’m very concerned about the levels of debt, and the recent losses reported are unsustainable. The owners are committed. They can’t do any more. We are very tightly audited, and the accounts cause no concern. They have made guarantees to continue funding, no reason to expect any change any time soon. Desai made a promise to "absolutely respect Jack Walker's legacy." As we approach the Venky's 10 year anniversary, what is your assessment of her delivery on that promise? Waggott not happy We are working with the trust on securing a heritage grant. This club has great history and needs to be celebrated more. We’ve maintained the statue. Disappointing turnout for a well publicised plea to clean the grave, which Waggott was one of only 10 people to attend. He is all about respect. Part of his ethos. All employees have to subscribe to it. If anyone feels he has disrespected them, please approach him. They can take it offline. I think the disrespect to Jack’s legacy is more around how the we have gone from being the model example of how to run a town club, took us to the top of the pile, and we’ve had a decade of decline and never got near promotion in that time. Can’t comment on what went on before I got here Humble people etc etc We want to get promoted and so do the owners Tony Parkes There was a great deal of understanding around this. Rob Coar and Lynsey Talbot had both been looking at fitting tributes and been in touch with the Parkes family. Bayes did a good job of explaining Tony’s current condition. He has recorded his acceptance speech for the next hall of fame class already. Tony will be at the game tomorrow, and I wouldn’t be surprised if something was announced then. Happily there seems to be a real willingness for the club to do what ever they can for Tony. After the meeting Spoke to Waggott – he was amiable and professional, and as always appeared open to discussion. Stated that a lot of the questions were aimed at Venky’s and they weren’t there to answer. Mentioned links with HSH (see previous posts of Venky’s welcome or not thread) Knows of the three and their links. Understands why this would be a concern. Isn’t a fan of agents. Won’t go above a 5% agents fee and has lost out on deals because of this stance. Always pays them last and prioritises local contractors, PAYE, HMRC etc. Has been pulled up about it in audits but will continue to keep them as last priority. Mentioned a couple of particularly bad agents and deals. If and when the time comes to replace Mowbray (the way he worded it was ‘If Tony comes to me and tells me he’s had enough’) he will go to market, do his due diligence, and get the best man for the job. I pointed out it wasn’t his integrity or judgement I was questioning. Ultimately they are the owners, I’m doing what I can to make this club successful. Spoke about the attendance issue We spoke at length last time about this too. Mentioned the podcast I did with @Herbie6590 on here, and how positive I was after that. There are a small number of fans reluctantly not attending because of Venkys, a bigger number not attending due to league position and falling out of the habit, and a massive number of potential fans who see football as a TV or streaming experience. Its difficult and there is no magic formula. He is aware of a guy on Facebook who has started his own streaming service where he charges people to watch Rovers games. Spoke about Venkys I said their long term view is unclear. There seemed to be a lot of understanding about what had gone on before. He asked if I thought there was anyone still there from those times before he arrived who I was concerned about. I said yes. He asked me to elaborate. I said obviously people like Lynsey Talbot and Rob Coar were fine and part of the furniture... and then there was Pasha. All he really said about Pasha was “I certainly wouldn’t call Suhail a low level employee.” And something along the lines of ‘He is the owners man and long term business advisor’. He keeps trying to get them to come to a game. I was in the minority of one in the small group of fans involved in this chat who thought this was a bad idea. He mentioned that they were reluctant since they get pelted with a snowball, everyone acknowledged the fanbase had softened. There would be some negativity displayed towards them, but they (me included) would likely be shouted down. I said I didn’t feel they were humble. Waggott said they he had told them “They don’t need to turn up in helicopters or a convey of Rolls Royce’s, just a Mercedes 7 seater with blacked out windows, just come in quietly and watch the game.“ Balajio’s son is football mad. He will be the one signing the cheques one day. They want to get him along and involved. He’s the one at Reading Uni. Other bits and pieces that came up Heritage project sounds great – he wants people to get involved Chapman walks around with a hang dog look on his face. Doesn’t want to play for the u23’s… “Well, if Danny Graham can play for the U23’s you bloody well can!” We could do with that pace he brings. Its his head that’s stopping him. We raved about Nyambe and Travis a bit Brereton hasn’t worked out as we’d have liked It would be great to get promoted even just for a season. He’d want to invest in the infrastructure, get a hotel or something at the back of the Riverside – do something exciting with it, not increase the size. Safe standing a possibility Summary From my point of view, I really want to be able to distinguish between them and the club, and Venky’s. I recognise my refusal to buy a ticket is futile. It harms my enjoyment more than its intended target. When I didn’t go the criticism was ‘You aren’t supporting the team’, when I take up the offer of free tickets it’s ‘You aren’t supporting the club’. I don’t like doing either, despite what you may think @Paul Mani My intention is to buy a season ticket again and sit with my family and friends, providing there aren’t any idiotic decisions taken in the coming weeks. In my opinion Waggott and Mowbray are likeable, committed and honest. I think they have the best of intentions, and that’s not something I’ve been able to say about some of their predecessors. So yeah, I need to make that small commitment. Plenty of positives to take away, but plenty will remain unanswered as long as Venky’s remain remote. These meetings aren’t fit for purpose.

At the moment we are completely reliant on them. I know that. They have put themselves in a position through their own mismanagement where they have to keep ploughing in good money after bad to ensure we remain a going concern. Failure to do so would wipe £200 million off their company value overnight, so it’s not benevolence, it’s sound business strategy for them. Like I stated earlier, these meetings don’t really serve the purpose they were introduced for while they are in the current format. The big question I wanted answering last night was this: Tony Mowbray, Owen Coyle and Paul Lambert are all represented by HSH. All of their appointments were a little strange. HSH has three directors listed with companies house, namely, Stephen Horner, Dave Sheron, and Craig Honeyman. Honeyman is a former director of SEM. Horner and Sheron are both former SEM employees and were named alongside Myles’s Daddy in a lawsuit brought about by Gavin McCann, which suggests they work together closely. Why are these people still having significant influence in what happens at the club, if Venkys have indeed learnt from their mistakes?

Hi Everyone, If you want to respond to Miller11's post, please don't quote it. It's very long and detailed and clogs up the page, particularly on mobile. If you just write @Miller11 and then comment, serves the same purpose and helps keep the thread tidy. Thanks.

I went last night and the fear that many have regarding our finances (including FFP) didn't seem to be a big concern to Waggott and Cheston. Cheston doesn't seem comfortable being questioned but Waggott is quite relaxed and open. He talked about honesty and humility and he came across that way. I have spoken to him previously and he listened and took on board my suggestion. In short I trust him. I spoke at length to another senior figure and he asked me about the negativity towards the owners. I told him in my view they need to explain why certain events happened. I said they need to be contritional if they are ever to regain trust and perhaps reach out to lapsed supporters. He said he would feed that back but in all honesty I can't see it happening. Mowbray is passionate about football and comes across as having real enthusiasm for his job and the players. He gets carried away I feel at times but I can see why players want to play for him. I haven't changed my view that he has taken us as far as he can. I wasn't totally enamoured with Radio Lancashire and Andy Bayes who let certain agenda items drift along. I thought the debate about where away fans are and recycled cups were inconsequential to the meeting and maybe more appropriate for the Fans Forum. All in all it was pretty much as I expected having spoken to people who have been previously.

I’ve got that exact feeling every time I’ve spoken to him. He’s so passionate about what he says too. He’s definitely one of the good guys and a real positive at the club. The circumstances of his arrival worry me, but It has paid off on this occasion. He’s a good fit.

Tony Mowbray, Owen Coyle and Paul Lambert are all represented by HSH. HSH has three directors listed with companies house, namely, Stephen Horner, Dave Sheron, and Craig Honeyman. Honeyman is a former director of SEM. Horner and Sheron are both former SEM employees and were named alongside Jerome Anderson in a lawsuit brought about by Gavin McCann, which suggests they work together closely. Why are these people still having significant influence in the running of the club, if Venky’s have ‘learnt their lesson’?

Does make me chuckle how star struck and proud as punch Paul is just for spending some time with club employees, I thought it was a regular occurrence?

You’ve got a point @Bbrovers2288 as did @JoeH several pages back. These meetings are a requirement set out by the EFL, and sanctions can be imposed if they don’t take place. This is the entirety of the regulation around them: 118.1 Clubs shall hold at least two meetings/fans forums per Season to which its supporters (or representatives) are to be invited in order to discuss significant issues relating to the Club. The framework for these meetings shall be documented in the Club’s customer charter, but are subject to the following minimum criteria: 118.1.1 Clubs must be represented by the Club’s majority owner, board director(s) or other senior executive(s); 118.1.2 where meetings are not open to all supporters wishing to attend, the supporter representatives must be elected, selected or invited in line with basic democratic principles; and 118.1.3 individuals cannot be excluded by the Club without good reason (the Club acting reasonably). Again, I don’t feel they are fit for purpose. Our owners and their main man do not attend. The minute the words “we can’t speak for the owners” are uttered, and they are frequently, this becomes apparent. There are always attendees there from Rovers Trust, Ewood WMC group, BRFCS, the Rovers Facebook Group, Ewood Blues, 100 Club. The usual people who represent the action group weren’t there last night, but they may still have been represented. New York Rovers did have an invite too. There are other groups too, not sure exactly who, but there are a lot of faces I recognise that aren’t from any of the above. The club ask that some of the attendees from each group stay the same from meeting to meeting. Each group has its own ideas and priorities (I’m deliberately avoiding the word agenda). I go as part of a group that has for the last few meetings been responsible for most of the questions, both submitted prior and at the time. I’m sure this annoys a good proportion of the room. Most of what we want to discuss is regarding the owners and we have been vocal in criticising the fact that Mowbray is in attendance and Venky’s aren’t. There are a lot of people who have never said a word in these meetings, that’s their prerogative completely. There are also plenty who seem to primarily want a chat with Mowbray at the end. Personally I feel these need a rethink, and so does the fans forum - for me that is where issues like kits and catering need to be discussed. Consultation meetings ought to be about ownership, governance, finances and long term plans. I don’t know where transfers should fall. Maybe they shouldn’t be discussed, aside from overall strategy, I don’t know. Sorry for another long post!

He makes a fair point, to be honest. It wouldn’t hurt for posterity, to check the write up from the last meeting and checked what was promised vs. what was actually delivered....

£1.3m was what was left from last summer, so the budget will be refreshed and also effected by players leaving etc making ‘room’. One interesting pOint by Cheston was on ffp. He stated clearly that ffp is always judged on this years and the previous two years accounts. Meaning that so long as you lose the same amount every year (and accumulatively that doesn’t exceed £39m over the three years) then your budget literally refreshes every season and you have the same spending power. If that makes sense. He also said that whilst our submissions for ffp were due in at the end of the month (feb), but we can make some further adjustments if needed up until the end of June when our accounting period ends. My observation is that a profit sale like Dack for example every three years would make huge dent in our ability to spend as a £20m fee would effectively make us whole for that year which would increase our spending power over any three year period. Interesting also (as I’ve said SOOO many times) that in particular Mowbray said on numerous occasions that failing all else, if he really wanted to spend more Money, the owners had told him he only had to ask. My overriding emotion now following the meeting is that we have a leadership structure who do care passionately about the club. Mowbray is far from dull. He’s passionate, animated, BRUTALLY honest about himself, his players, the market. I can 100% see why the lads including Jonty and Dunny love him so much. He hasn’t got tons of cash sloshing about but he does have a plan on how to use it better. Which he talked to me about openly and in detail. Based off the meeting and my first ever 10 mins with him one to one, he is absolutely the man to take us on for as long as he has that desire!

Appreciate the feedback from all who went but I can’t help feel I would’ve liked one at least who wasn’t so much a mowbray fan, and wasn’t afraid to speak up to question re transfers, brereton, players out of position esp gallagher, why it’s taken so long for nyambe to get that rb position over Bennett if he is so highly thought of, making same mistakes as last year, not pushing for promotion, horrible winless runs, the raya saga- selling without having a replacement, very amateurish. And other gripes which none seemed to really be addressed instead talking about recycling, fans seating and away kits. Don’t think we really care about this do we

How on earth would Clayton and Douglas not fulfil the criteria?! Douggie is a Blackburner, a Rovers fan, was a top England international but still spent his whole career at the club and is still at every single game at a ripe old age. Ronnie was England captain and also spent his whole professional career at Rovers (carried on in non league for a couple of years). He then spent every game at Ewood with Douggie and ran the ground tours for years. Too right they qualify!

Totally disagree! We have no urgency for a 3 year plan. We talk of long term build and slow and steady progress which is fine in theory - until it all has to be scrapped every 3 years! This means there is no long term build (it's undone every 3rd year) there can't be slow and steady progress because the progress keeps getting reset. So no the club isn't on top of it because their strategy is totally at odds on and off the pitch. To be on top of it the aim has to be promotion in 2 seasons of build OR lower costs to an extent that long term progress is able to happen because it doesn't need to be undone/redressed every third year. Neither option is easy and the latter not that palatable but this current approach will never work unless we get very lucky.

Massive lie. I never stood up. I’ve told him that at previous meetings and he knows full well my thoughts and reasons. I didn’t proudly do anything... if you remember, Waggott mentioned he spoke to people regularly who went away and never went to Ewood. Bayes then asked if a person who previously mentioned they wouldn’t set foot in Ewood at a previous meeting was in the room. They were, but took a load of abuse last time, so they didn’t say anything. I’ve been pretty public in my stance for a good few years. I want to go to games, I don’t feel comfortable financially supporting a regime I despise. If not stumping up £300 a year makes me not a fan in your eyes, I won’t lose any sleep.

well what can I say that you doesen't know already cockers? things are bad for our team Holtby out for the rest of season what a luck we have!!!... know I'm divided about that cause i trust Tony and actually he's a top manager without any doubt he has being taking some important points with a very depleted roster against the one that he had at the begging of season... Buuut it is true aswell that something wrong has to be happenig with part of staff I mean players are not straight enough to face a complete season is true we are not very deep roster and i know it's hard to try to maintain fresh or recover quick to our players if we need almoust all of them weekly but since this year started and since the last part of 2019 actually injuries is such a common thing nowadays in Blackburn.... Now we are in a very hard fight to finish on top 10 maybe a little higher than that but with the current players without a natural "brain" in the middle of park could be even harder I trust in our young lads specially Costello and Buckley but even Chapman could be the answer ...they will have to do their best to grab this golden but sad oportunity...but even if they have some mistakes let's support them cause is not easy to play when every body is waiting for you to be a heroe or something like that Dack and Holtby are great players with top quality at least Dack could be playing on premier (before his injury) and to try to cover they won't be easy for our young players... difficult times got to say but I'm sure that we can turn this into an oportunity I trust in young Rovers blood. #ImRoversTillIDie #COYB #TheMexicanRover #Top10season

Cheers Miller, much appreciated (I’ve not quoted your looonnnggg and detailed post for the 5th time ).

Hi Miller11.. A good effort Miller11 on what was said. A good write there. Well done. You obviously have a great passion for the Rovers, bury the hatchet and get yourself a season ticket. You will be much happier. Let the past go and support Tony and the team. We need good fans like you... Cheers Doogs

Great stuff ,thank you. A lot of positive stuff and it does seem to me like Waggott and Mowbray are ,by far,the best set up we have had since Venkys took over I don't focus on negatives and I think some of it geared towards Walton is excessive, but when he says that deal fell in our lap, what would we have done if it didn't and why did we need to rely on that happening?

Club still run in a corrupt manner but they have wised up to working out of the spotlight a bit more. Anyone doubt the are running the show them answer this: what were the odds of both Coyle and TM being appointed Rovers managers? Neither had recent (or much) success whatsoever and were a million miles from a championship job. Coyle I believe was linked with the Blackpool job the summer he joined us - nowhere near championship wuality.. So for both to be appointed at such unlikely odds with unlikely pedigree - far too much of a coincidence not to be string pulling. Factor in Lambert as well (although on paper a good appointment - recent success with Norwich and had managed in the Prem recently with Villa) and the chances of such appointments are just too uncanny to be coincidence. The parasites still rule the roost at Ewood. So until Venkys go we won't be rid of them. Which is a catch 22 as I'm pretty certain Venkys continue to own us to prevent any dodginess from being uncovered. Sad times.

I'm not sure it's THAT funny. I didn't find it in the least bit funny that he was allowed to continue his job for far, far longer than he was allowed to through continuous failure that has potentially irreparably damaged this club. You've clearly forgotten this, or of course your ignoring it to make your point. Awkward was having my nuts felt by the doctor this morning, your retort was just mildly irritating like most of your posts.

Hang on it was you that said because he’s so passionate, ‘he can stay as long as he wants as long as he has the desire’. I’m glad the club is more sensible and sees results as number 1 priority, it should always be so.

I swear to God, we are the only club that doesn’t judge a manager on this metric....

He didn’t blame the fans and he didn’t say there was nothing they could do about ffp. Quite the opposite actually. He said they have ‘several options’ available, none of them seemed drastic and he stressed that they hadn’t sold any of their assets and was dismissive of the potential of selling the ground and leasing it back. I couldn’t help seeing it from their side when they’re so open and then fans (who are very demanding) can’t even find it in themselves to buy a ticket. Maybe that was just me...but all Venky hate aside, I think the wider cultural issues and acceptability that you don’t need to contribute to something you care about is so sad. I couldn’t get behind Coyle Or Kean. I despised what they stood for. But I am in no doubt about the integrity of this leadership team, coaches and the players. So I’m more than happy to do my bit. Even if it’s 0.005% of a players salary.

He is a passionate football man, I’ve always liked that about him. As usual his charisma at these meetings come in handy for Waggott and Cheston. But he is only ‘absolutely the man to take us on for as long as he has that desire’ if he gets results, his ‘desire’, his ‘honesty’ , ‘his passion’ are not how he will be judged (or shouldn’t be).

That's happened at Ewood before now when we loaned a club our away kit for a League game after the ref ruled against the away kit they had brought with them. It would appear that it was Mowbray who wanted the third kit because they found the away kit was not always suitable for some colour clashes. Once again, I thought both Mowbray and Waggott came over very well and clearly have the best interests of the club at heart. I thought Mowbray's comments on transfer policy were detailed and open and clearly he has a large say in that area of the club so it was quite right for him to cover that part of the agenda. The meetings illustrate that the different groups in attendance have different views on certain things so it's not easy for those in charge to find compromises. Some supporters fully agreed with Mowbray with regard to putting the away fans as far away from the pitch as possible whilst others felt atmosphere was more important and wanted them in the lower tier. I suspect, and would hope, that Mowbray's view would be the one we follow. At many away grounds you are either in a corner or upstairs - out of the way - so the noise impact from away fans is reduced.

Well it's a new level of honesty to just outright say we only had £1.3 million to spent. It's good to just be upfront like that.

https://www.ipswichstar.co.uk/sport/ipswich-town/big-ipswich-town-interview-bartosz-bialkowski-1-6500191 Some brutally honest comments from Bialkowski about Paul Hurst's time at Portman Road: On Lambert and the season post-Paul Hurst: On Mick McCarthy: Quite rare to hear a current player speak to openly and candidly about recent events. Hurst sounds like a total buffoon. Lambert comes across as a positive person but without the answers to change a really bad situation. No surprise to hear Mick was loved by the players and it's obvious the players were hurt by the way the fans turned on him.

Selling your top talent for that kind of money is a false economy, how do you replace them? As you aren’t getting like for like from the Academy or in the transfer maket if you are spending pennies. So, loans, as we’ve seen with Raya. How do we then improve (which surely is the whole point) if we aren’t getting proper value for our star players? Makes the whole ‘model’ a waste of time.

With the top 6 opening up, if we’d have been playing a bottom half side I’d be near certain of not picking up 3 points. Against the better sides at Ewood we often raise our game, so who knows.

We have been here many times in the venkys era, expect the most meek performance you have ever seen and a 2-0 defeat.

Great result for the chasing pack...

I don't know huge amounts about his time at Celtic either but it's generally accepted that it was a bit of a disaster. His career as a manager had been on an upward trajectory up until that point, but it was then that things began going downward for him and obviously the lowest point was being at Coventry. He was fortunate to get the Rovers job but to be fair he's done better than I would have expected overall. I don't think he's done a great job but he hasn't done a bad one either. Just somewhere in the middle, fairly similar to Bowyer. Maybe that's the limit as long as Venky's own the club. As far as his stint at WBA goes I can't place too much stock in it due to it being so long ago - things have changed a lot since then. Even Owen Coyle was able to get a club promoted during that period so I don't think the difficulty was as high as it is at present. They did drop straight back down but again I wouldn't necessarily judge him on that - even the likes of McCarthy and Warnock have struggled to keep teams in the PL and I think most of us would have been delighted if either had turned up here in the past few years. Overall I think Tony has the right general vision and ideas for the club, but not necessarily the abilities to execute those ideas properly. Imo he needs help, particularly in the recruitment department, and until he gets that I doubt we'll get very far.

Why are talking about Kean in this thread as it has nothing to do this particular meeting. Thanks to @Paul Mani and @Miller11 for their summary. seems plenty of positives going forward. Waggott seems to be doing the best he can and Mowbray IMO seems to know where he gone wrong in the transfer market and will rectify this in the summer. Looking forward to rest of the season and the summer recruitment of players already

A very interesting post for which many thanks. Waggott does emerge well from this - comes over as a decent man trying to do what's best for the club in sometimes difficult circumstances, something for those shouting for his removal to reflect on.

We still recall his defence of Kean, one of his fellows from the same stable. Pulis was another(from the same stable) who came out in support. Many of us had read the Guardian piece about SEM's role at Bolton and Rovers. So, when Coyle said he had never heard of SEM, that said plenty. Later, he went one stage further before one of the supporters' meetings, as he sought to distance himself from the cockney wide boy." What's his name again?" I guess there were some, who believed him...... And so..to HSH....

The bigger issue with this really, is why on earth are the owners still apparently using the services of these people when they have distanced themselves from the likes of JA in the past? Plenty of fans have suggested that Venky's have learned their lessons and were just badly advised, which if true, begs the question, why would you keep going back to the same stable then? When you look back at the very suspicious activity surrounding the take over and occasions when certain respectable members of the media (Nick Harris being one) were asking, who is running Blackburn Rovers? you have to wonder what is still going on. The most dubious signing we ever made was one Myles Anderson, who the fans were accused of hounding out, yet has he ever made it anywhere? If these forces are still lurking somewhere and the only answer we are given by the current regime, is we can't comment on the past, then where does that leave us?

The problem we have here, which is going to only get bigger as more time passes, is that we have allowed Mowbray the manager to build the club and direct the club on and off the pitch exactly how he wants it, in his image and with his close input. This goes beyond appointing the coaching staff, scouts, CEO, Venus as Head of Football, it also reaches every corner of recruitment. Now all that is fine as long as the results keep coming along and we keep making positive progress. I think the vast majority of fans would agree that our trajectory has been overall positive under Mowbray and that we are in better health football wise now than we were under the wretched Coyle. Clearly the central component of this was getting promoted back at the first opportunity. But the flip side is that there will now be a reluctance to make a managerial change moving forward even when it might be necessary for the benefit of the club. Why? Because Mowbray's departure would leave a gaping chasm at the club and probably see things unravel on and off the pitch. Because of that people at the club and in the fanbase treat such a notion as something horrific and to be avoided. It shouldn't be like this. Changing a manager, whilst not ideal or enjoyable, is necessary at all levels in football. Yet we have hamstrung ourselves by building a Championship football club on the manager's shoulders.

Your right and I completely agree with you. The question is can Mowbray over achieve which is what we all desperately need and want. Unfortunately the answer is a resounding no. ive met tony and been to these things before and heard the same waffle spouted two years ago, almost identical in fact. Heard the same drivel from coyle and bowyer to. Nobody I know or heard doesn’t like Tony the man but he has to be judged on his transfer policy , his tactics, team selection and results . There is no doubting his current results are good but like last season, to many poor team selections and negative tactics will see us fall short. Like you say he needs to over achieve and be smart in the transfer window to do this , three defensive loans and 7 million on a Dud won’t get us out of this league. That’s isn’t smart, logical and doesn’t show the hallmarks of someone who is going to over achieve. the Mis use of nyambe, Rothwell, Gallagher has Been at times criminal. To over achieve you need a clear and decisive plan and to build year on year to achieve it. Tony talks a good game and has all the passion in the world but re signing the likes of gladwin, Smallwood etc on contracts when we have a small budget isn’t smart business and the money needs to be put to better use to give Us half a chance at over achieving. Its the minute details that helps clubs over achieve . Aging players and no goalkeepers plus the same defence as the one he inherited at the start of next season don’t show me or put faith in me that this honest likeable man can be the ruthless , savvy wheeler dealer we need to get us where we not only need to Be but belong.

If managers aren't judged on results, why did Coyle get sacked?

Argh come off it mate. The words “it’s a results business” were mentioned on multiple occasions last night. The reason we signed Walton, Tosin and Cunningham on loan was because we wanted better players than we could afford to buy. Which proves that a huge metric being applied is based on results. But also, why can’t people accept that results can be mitigated by lots of things like available finance etc. Our budget (fees plus wages) is Mid to low in the championship. (I think 11th in the last published stats). So what makes any of our fans assume that we should get in the top 6? Our results are pretty much where they should be. The question is if Mowbray can overachieve...

He seemed to suggest naming each of the training pitches after former players. That’s basically a label on a piece of A4 paper on a Brockhall notice board. Surely he isn’t that crass? Tony Parkes is not just a “former player“. He is bigger than that, he is one of very very few “Mr Blackburn Rovers“. As we will all see on Saturday...

Giving him the benefit of the doubt, if he means the training complex, I.e. ‘The Tony Parkes Senior Training Centre’, ok, that’s an idea. A ‘pitch’? He can feck off and delegate this to fans groups who should decide. It’s OUR club who will be here long after he’s pitched up somewhere else.

'Defenders are coming' became 3 players on loan, one of which is a keeper inferior to the one we sold. It is now nearly 12 months since Mowbray promised defenders and come the summer we will have Lenihan, Nyambe and Williams as our senior contracted defensive players. We've made no progress there, other than Nyambe improving his game and Lenihan clearly being very important to us. We can debate whether Tosin and Cunningham represent improvement on last season, I accept they probably are, but the reality is not enough to get us where we want to be and unlikely to be back. The GK fiasco is a major concern. Mowbray now talks about signing 2 keepers in the summer. But why should I believe that after what happened last year? Time and time again he's made these sort of promises to the fans and then what actually happens falls some way short. I don't see a medium term plan. I see a club operating on 12 month cycles trying to manage as best they can with what is allocated by the owners. There remains a clear and obvious policy of not spending on the defence or goalkeeper positions, preferring to make do with loans for 6-12 months, whilst allocating all our resources on projects up front.

£1.3 million was budget in Jan. That makes a mockery of talk of buying players for 2 - 4 mill. Forget it. Self imposed wage cap. Will not break it. Many Champ players on £50K and ours are on a quarter.... that's £12.5K so don't believe that myself but the general point stands. Emphasis on the kids and academy (from Steve) from financial solution POV. Conflict is Tony needing men ready for Champ. Warton will be re-assessed in summer but some weeks he gets bullied at Northampton so still needs to improve to be ready for Champ. Defenders did come. Walton, Tosin, Cunningham. Accepted back to square 1 in summer. Sounded like no appetite to actually buy a defender...none really identified who we can afford and fits criteria. We will bring in 2 x GKs in summer. (remember same said in summer). Tosin - no chance to buy (£18 mill or something) but will try to get another 6 month loan from City. Walton was not the GK we wanted. Last minute after Raya left. Nearly sent back in Jan but Tony likes him and wanted give him chance and support him. Personally I am OK with that.

Hi Miller. I was at the meeting. I respect your views while not agreeing to them. Isn't it time to put to bed the whole Venkys thing. A lot of water has gone under the bridge over the years. We must remember that Venks now fund the club as stated last night.

Not sure that tonight really takes us any further than we've been at the last couple of meets. Seems to be 'business as usual' with very much the same stuff coming out. Owners are committed, manager and CEO only want to be judged on what happens whilst they are here, money available but not being spent (heard that one before). I agree with Mattyblue that the slip from Waggott about the academy is potentially concerning if you interpret these things at face value. Clearly if there is a view to ending Category A status this is completely at odds with the recent proclamations about developing youth and FFP worries. As we've done to death on numerous occasions, academy expenditure is exempt from FFP calculations so if there is a reduction in funding to the academy that will be entirely of Venkys own volition. Strange thing to do if they are desperate to invest. Then again maybe just a poor choice of words from Waggott. Not sure re-use of pint glasses and concerns about contamination or the location of away fans during games are really issues that should be dealt with at these meetings. These are bi-annual precisely because they should cover much more than the usual gripes and matchday preferences.

I’d like you to go , I trust your judgement more than most on here, next time, take one for yourself. Please

You didn’t “go for yourself”, you represented BRFCS. @J*B please don’t let this guy go again.

I think if you go on behalf of a group, the forum in this case it’s expected you would report it back to that group.

I trust I'll be forgiven, but I've signed too ! ?