It took Mowbray 5 years of 'development' to get us to 69 points. That includes 10 transfer windows during which he was only forced to sell Adam Armstrong and had, comparatively speaking, a massive budget.

JDT came in 2 weeks before pre-season started having just lost Lenihan, Nyambe and Rothwell

The way to do this is simple and obvious. It doesn't need someone to reinvent the wheel with clever strategies. It needs price reductions across the board, it needs people to see value in the product and it needs serious sustained efforts at selling.

When it comes to value in the product there are many aspects to this. Selling all your quality players, spending no money, throwing in the academy kids - this is not going to persuade anyone that you have any ambitions or serious intentions. With half the games being midweek, red button, Sky, dodgy sticks, lunchtime kick offs then the price of a season ticket has to reflect this as a large number of people will be unwilling or unable to get to those matches. So you have to have a price whereby it is still worth being a season ticket holder even if you miss all those games.

Preston and Bolton - £250 per adult. So even if you missed 50% of all the games you are still getting the other 50% for a reasonable price that's still good value despite the Sky tv and kick off nonsense.

But at £400 per adult if you miss 50% of the games you are looking at a price which is hardly worth it when the club often offers matchday tickets at £15-25. People will just pick and choose and not be any worse off.

There is also an onus on the club to drive sales. Putting a few tweets out and tacky straplines about commitment or similar isn't enough. You need to engage clubs, schools, previous buyers, get people buying in groups. This takes time and effort. You can't do it overnight.

Too much effort here.

Waggott has got away with his low hanging fruit policy for 5-6 years milking the results of Mowbray getting us back up and protected by Covid and then JDTs good season.

I think he's going to get the results of his ruinous policies very soon. May need to bring forward that retirement date.

No other Championship club has had to sell £25 million worth of players (+ substantial wage reductions) just to keep the lights on

Why have Rovers?

They will try to normalise our situation making reference to annual losses and FFP but it isn't normal. Its unique.

My prediction is a freeze at £399 for adults who are renewing, but a short 'early bird' discount of perhaps £20-40 off that price if you commit quickly.

Coventry announced that they've sold 4,200 for Saturday but have been told they won't be getting a further allocation.

A rare case of Rovers realising how daft they'd look if Coventry sold 6000+ and we got beat again?

Or perhaps with cheaper tickets on offer and in view of the timings with only a couple of days to go they've worked out that it isn't worth the hassle of opening the extra areas, staffing them and getting extra stewards on?

I'd like us to reinvest some of the Adam Wharton, Ash Phillips and Kaminski cash (£25 million+) before we start thinking about selling Szmodics to reinvest cash.

7 minutes ago, Mashed Potatoes said:

Aren't you one of the posters who keeps calling on the club to "Increase Turnover " ? Yet here you call for the club to turn their noses up at the prospect of increased ticket sales ?

So often there's a bigger picture to be had. 

Increased turnover only one element of the overall picture. At this stage of the season, with a cataclysmic relegation to the 3rd division still a possibility and a direct rival coming to Ewood, yes I'd turn my nose up at increased ticket sales if I felt it gave us a better chance of avoiding defeat.

Would be different if we were in Sunderland's position and going nowhere, or virtually safe, but that was never going to be the case when we started selling tickets to them,

Short termism again. 

Lets all congratulate the management for saving on wages by loaning people out and getting rid of loads of experience from the squad. Well done. Increased revenue and reduced expenditure. Job done.

But that could directly lead to relegation and a far greater cost.

4 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

 

just excuses after excuses. There were 7k Sheff Wed fans. That it. How did they ever make it professional if they can't play in front one full stand of away fans. FFS 

 

Playing at home with 7000+ away fans behind one goal filling 25% of the stadium isn't normal. That's the point. Nobody else does it. It's not just a run of the mill situation that players are used to dealing with every week.

So it's likely when we do it is going to have some sort of effect.

We've a young, weak and inexperienced group. Sheffield Wednesday are at the opposite end of that scale. I'd wager the younger ones would struggle more than the experienced ones in such circumstances.

Yesterday was summed up by the substitutions.

We are 2 goals down heading into the last 10 minutes with another 10+ then added in injury time. So if we had anything about us we would have put them under immense pressure during that time and made them work their socks off to preserve their lead, they should have been hanging on for dear life. In the end it was predictable garbage and we barely laid a glove on them. Their keeper could have had a lie down in injury time.

We bring on Chrisene, Ayari and Moran. Stood on the touchline coming on they looked like 3 little boys. Meanwhile the opposition bring on Callum Patterson and Michael Smith. Not exactly world beaters, far from it, but two big bruisers who have been there and done at in professional football.

If I was their manager I'd have been delighted seeing us throwing them on for the last 10-15 and not a couple of nasty giants.

Prior to that it was Buckley and Markanday coming off the bench. Another two who have no physical presence whatsoever and look like little young lads. Wednesday were packed full of size, stature, power.

We all know where the reason for this comes from, saving cash and doing things on the cheap. 3 kids on loan coming off the bench to save our skins. How sad.

3 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

I haven't mentioned Waggott once in my post Abbey. 

of course the Sheffield Wednesday player would say that, 

So if it affect them yesterday then how do you explaining winning at Leeds in front of 37k fans or Sunderland then if they aren't play in front of 7k sheff wed fans FFS? 

Its a completely different scenario Chaddy. You can't simply say that because we won an away game that there is no issue in giving away teams vast allocations at Ewood.

You go away to Arsenal, Liverpool, United in the Cup and play infront of 60-70,000 you expect your team to rise to the occasion.

It is completely different to hand over 1/4 of your stadium to the away team, who are in a must-win situation, and have them making all the noise. The Ewood atmosphere is poor at the best of times.

There's an age old concept in football of 'home advantage'. It is why teams since Victorian times have preferred playing on their own ground rather than going away. It is partly, though not wholly, because they prefer being surrounded by their own fans backing them whereas the away team is having to play with a small number of their fans.

Yesterday home advantage went out of the window from where I was sat. It was a decent atmosphere yes, but the Wednesday fans made a huge amount of noise and I am sure that the Pears calamity show in the second half was at least partly brought about by jitters from having their fans right behind him.

Control the controllables. We can't control what goes on at Leeds or Leicester, but we can control what goes on at Ewood and make sure in must not lose games we aren't giving the opposition any advantage whatsoever.

1 hour ago, Groundhog said:

For the first time in 30 years of watching Rovers with my 76 year old Dad, he's suggested not going on Saturday and just going for a walk instead and turning his phone off, it's that bad. He's usually pretty pragmatic and optimistic even at the worst time, always siding with the players, but I think that second half finally did for him. After the match we both just stared into space over our pints. 

Not felt this low for a very long time, it's a different kind of feeling - think it's the lack of hope or trust in anyone at the club from players to board level, feels like a truly lost cause. 

 

With you 100% there. Its the feeling of hopelessness, and betrayal.

Over the last 12 months or so I've felt not frustration, hope, optimism for the club, but feelings ranging from dislike to outright hatred. I'm ashamed to even be associated with it.

It's tough. I certainly have had to do a lot of soul-searching and will again this summer, it certainly isn't normal peaks and troughs of supporting a football club, it certainly isn't enjoyable or healthy. But I'm not one who can just switch off my emotional investment in the club and walk away (yet). So I'm in this limbo zone which I suspect many others are where I keep going, keep coming on here, keep thinking about it, but just feel numbness and disgust and weary resignation.

Its almost like a state of civil war. There's an enemy within that needs defeating and destroying before we can even begin to think about anything else, and peaceful coexistence with that enemy is no longer an option in my book.

Birmingham have a track record over the last 4-5 years of pulling out results at the death to save their skins. With floundering Huddersfield up next then a game against a Norwich side likely to be resting I expect they'll get at least 3 points, if not more. 

We're at home. we need a result and a drastic improvement after today, they're just coming to terms with a heartbreaking and exhausting 130+ minutes at Wembley and also have a tough game against Hull on Wednesday, just over 48 hours before they come to Ewood.

They've lost 3 of their last 4 in the league.

They're 9 points off the top 6 with 12 points to play for so lose on Wednesday and their league season is over.

If this manager and squad had anything about them they'd be relishing this one to prove people wrong after today.

Sadly we don't operate like that and we will relinquish any advantage we may have. Waggott will be hoping they buy loads of tickets so we can give up home advantage again.

If we go down then Eustace gets summoned to India, comes back with a budget and enhanced power, probably an improved/extended deal. Broughton gets sacked and Eustace heads up recruitment.

If we stay up Eustace and Broughton stay and we continue on the trajectory of the last 2-3 years, sales, cuts, shite.

2 hours ago, Cuppliance said:

A lot of the teams down there play each other in these last few fixtures so not all of them can win all their games. Saying that, there is a still a formula for Rovers to get relegated. Avoid defeat against Wednesday keeps us up I'd like to say. That opinion comes with us having at least 50 points on the board which will smash the highest points total for a relegated team and Birmingham City and Huddersfield Town playing each other in the penultimate game.

Not sure what result I prefer in the Plymouth Argyle vs Stoke City game yet. A draw is possibly the best outcome for us?

50 points wouldn't smash the highest points total for relegation, we went down on 51 in 2017.

But yeah this year I'd like to think that 50 would probably be enough, but it would be uncertain and uncomfortable.

First off it would mean Wednesday would have to win both their last 2 games for them to have a chance of finishing above us. They've still got West Brom home and Sunderland away so unlikely.

It would mean Huddersfield would need at least 7 points from 9 against Swansea, Birmingham and Ipswich.

That would require them to take at least a point or three off Birmingham, which would mean Birmingham could reach a maximum of 52 if they won their other two against Rotherham and Norwich.

Even if those things happened you'd still have Stoke and QPR needing 4 points or more from 9 to finish above us.

So I think unlikely, but possible, and I'd much rather grab a win at home against the 2nd worst team in the league so far this season to finish it off, rather than going up against bogey side Coventry or to Leicester knowing we could still go down.

Trouble is we don't tend to deliver when the pressure or expectation is on. Away at Leeds nobody gives us a hope, no pressure or expectation. But at home, against a struggling side, most will expect a Rovers performance and win. We struggle with that.

Simple explanation for it is that all other clubs have one eye on factors other than immediate cash flow. Factors such as positive atompshere, growth, medium to long term consequences of decisions, footballing concerns.

Here we have a charlatan masquerading as CEO employed to take the focus off the owners and cut their expenditure. With that remit he will do whatever he needs to do to keep his figures looking well, and as we've seen with some of his 'policies' to date there's nothing off the table in pursuit of that. Last I heard one was renting out Ewood for Liverpool and Man Utd legend events, a clear sign to anyone just what sort of people we are dealing with here.

Eustace's has won 2 of his 13 league games in charge, and picked up 13 points from 39.

JDT won 10 of his 28 league games in charge, and picked up 33 points from 84.

Neither get credit for the 3 points against Stoke as neither picked the team or prepared for the game.

JDT won games more frequently than Eustace has. Eustace has lost games less frequently than JDT did.

If we go down then the season will have been 2/3 JDT and 1/3 Eustace. If we win 1 or more of our remaining 3 we are safe. If we don't then Eustace finishes the season with 2 wins in 16 league games, which I'm sure everyone can agree is an abysmal win return.

JDT's points return had us on track for survival (whoop dee doo) hence we were never particularly close to the drop zone under him.

This is the problem we have and it will not change for the foreseeable future.

The only way this season will be considered anything other than a decent one for Waggott is if we get relegated.

Anything other than that, whether it be 7th or 21st, matters very little. Another season in the Championship, blame JDT, sold a few players for £25 million, academy model vindicated with Ash Phillips and Adam Wharton going for millions, no significant impact on results as we continue to be a mediocre Championship side. Wage bill cut again. Another 8000-9000 season tickets sold.

Bonus time as the owners don't need £15 million of share issue next year, we can just use the Wharton cash instead.

What's not to like?

34 minutes ago, Ossydave said:

Look up the stats for % of the ground being filled, we're rock bottom. Most teams literally couldn't offer that many tickets for away fans, without not leaving enough for home fans.

Yes I know we are rock bottom.

So what's the solution? Just hand over the ground to whoever wants it and shrug shoulders?

Or make the effort to get more home fans in, and fill the ground up a bit that way?

18 minutes ago, Parsonblue said:

Why wouldn't you?  Football is a business and if 7,000 people want to give Rovers 30 quid we are no position not to take it.  If the argument is that the players will be impacted by it then I really don't buy that argument - the Leeds, Sunderland and Newcastle games would suggest they are more than capable of handling it.

'Football is a business' has led us to having the most expensive season tickets in the division and with it stagnation on attendances.

All delivered by people who have no idea what they are doing and no regard for the long term consequences, all in the name of increasing revenues but in the longer run is clearly doing significant damage to our attendances and with it future health as a club.

We are one of a very small number to have had no growth in the last decade. Local rivals have drastically increased their numbers.

Sometimes you have to look at the bigger picture than just an immediate cash boost.

As I said last week, where would you draw the line?

We usually gey 10,000 ish home fans on. So if the away club asked for 20,000 tickets and we were able to give them that with no police objections and condense all the home support into the Jack Walker stand, be outnumbered 2:1 at Ewood,

You'd support that because we'd make more money off it?

11 hours ago, rovers11 said:

There surely can be no excuses for not spending money this summer. We are told that Venkys can now send money across, barring some small "minor technical challenges"; we sold Wharton for £22m; are getting circa £4m for Raya; more TV money to the tune of around £2m; and Sammie will go for around £10-12m. That's £40m+ in revenue. I know most of that is paid in instalments but we can also pay transfer fees in instalments too.

I fully expect a summer of spending buttons, making administrative 'mistakes' on any transfer involving a fee, and signing non-entities like Telalovic, though. We are now purely all about developing young players and have been for some time. There's no ambition to get promoted. 

All correct which is one of the reasons they employ a snake oil salesman as CEO. He can earn his corn making up excuses about why we still can't invest after raking in £40 million, feed little bits to the Telegraph and Fans Forums and unfortunately a large chunk of the gullible ones will swallow it all as fact and truth. 

Nothing more we can do, let's rely on the kids.

Nobody else in the country gives the away team 7000+ away tickets at the drop of a hat to make some extra money 

Apart from fake club MK Dons 

Why do Rovers?