I do apologise for this probably naïve question but I haven't read the thread.

Genuine question. Have we paid any money for Brereton thus far?

On the Smallwood tackle.

Agree years ago it would have not been a red. But even Bremner and Hunter might have been embarrassed by such a daft tackle.

As to the world cup, lack of sendings off and no contact anymore. Well, for a start, players in the world cup aren’t stupid enough to do a tackle like that. Simply brain dead. What on earth is the point? Let’s say he wins it –so what, it’s in a nothing area. Situation of the game? No still daft –they are down to 10 men, why bother? Stopping a certain goal or break away with goal potential? No. Just all round stupid.

Law 12

HANDLING THE BALL

Handling the ball involves a deliberate act of a player making contact with the ball with the hand or arm.

The following must be considered:

• the movement of the hand towards the ball (not the ball towards the hand)
• the distance between the opponent and the ball (unexpected ball)
• the position of the hand does not necessarily mean that there is an offence
• touching the ball with an object held in the hand (clothing, shinguard, etc.) is an offence
• hitting the ball with a thrown object (boot, shinguard, etc.) is an offence

The goalkeeper has the same restrictions on handling the ball as any other player outside the penalty area. Inside their penalty area, the goalkeeper cannot be guilty of a handling offence incurring a direct free kick or any related sanction but can be guilty of handling offences that incur an indirect free kick.

As to formations -we can all play this game and each one would have issues. As has been mentioned, there are plenty of other issues that also need dealing with.

For the record-maybe:-

                             Raya

    Lenihan   Downing   Mulgrew

Nyambe    Reed      Travis         Bennett

                 Dack    Armstrong

                      Graham    

Palmer/Conway/Smallwood/Rodwell/Evans/Brereton/Nuttall?

And to add, it goes without saying that formations mean little if attitude, fitness, desire etc are not present.

TM -talk about deflection. Dear, oh dear.

"It was an Intense football match, two teams who were at it. Sadly I would say the officials had the biggest impact on the game today.

"I think the referee mismanaged the game. He's come from the Premier League to the Championship, thought he'd have a nice easy day and he's guessed his way through the match with his decisions.

"He's upset the stadium, upset our bench and I think he had the biggest impact on the game.

Some astute points already made. Agree with bigdog –most frustrating game this season.

Highly annoying and Mogga’s interview, typically dour but sensible, didn’t help improve feelings in my household. Young side, we’ve just come up and so on –well yes, and before the start of the season I would have been happy with mid-table but some of the positions we find ourselves in with these games, it doesn’t really require genius to manage a game for a better result. The BlueNoses looked dispirited and the worst side I’ve seen here this season –no pressing of the ball, no urgency and some aimless long punts to little effect. So 2-0 up, without doing anything special in appalling conditions and on 76 mins Raya goes crackers rushing out for a ball and gives away a pen. Gardner (who galvanised them a little when he came on before that) duly converts. So 13 mins to survive by intelligent game management. Nah. They now have a little belief (something not present for the previous 79 mins). On 80 mins, can’t remember exactly how but we lose the ball, Gardner picks it up centrally and I lean over to wife and have time to say 3 times “he’s going to slot it inside Nyambe.” All Ryan has to do is make sure that his man is not going to get the ball –he seems to get mesmerised in no man’s land, the ball is duly slotted inside him and they score. 2-2. Cue head shaking from players and fans’ ire.

So:-

Where is the backbone when you need it? The leadership? The game management?  The grit?

At 2-0 nil up you work just as hard if not harder-didn’t happen. Lazy passing, not working as a unit.

Agreed on the new personnel required –odd that such a large sum was used on a player who neither plays, or plays out of positon or doesn’t seem that effective

On Graham –why should a team fall apart defensively when he goes off? Doesn’t account for a stupid goalie rush of blood and brainless right back defending. Agree that it was inevitable that his clockwork/fitness would run down in games and a replacement was necessary. Not sure Brereton is the answer. Looked like a floppy schoolboy to me today but it wasn’t his fault we drew

Armstrong scored but just doesn’t seem interested to me-sulking because he is on the wing?

Reed looked busy and lively and at it-effective centrally I would have thought

Tony’s beloved 4231. No issue with it as such but strange that what is effectively a back 6 can leak so many goals. Perhaps that just comes down to players and ability.

What is absolutely striking to me is the paucity of flair going forward. You could argue that today, in appalling conditions, that it didn’t really matter and was less of an issue and especially when you go 2-0 up. Perhaps that is more for another time, when we are drawing and can’t open a side up.

One other thing –Raya cost us the game? Nope. He gave them some hope and it was 2-1 with 13 to go. That’s when you need the leadership and grit I mentioned above from all your players. Didn’t see it and the inevitable happened.

OnePhilT

Bannon played through our 2 holding players (Evans/Smallwood) all day long to Reach/Jaoa.  Something I would dearly wish we could do. Previous to yesterday, time and time again you would see our  back 6 look up from our own half for that 20 yard ball into the hole but nobody is there. And if Dack or Graham finally manage to get there, they are usually well outnumbered and without an instant lay-off option. Still, yesterday it mattered a bit less since they weren't great defensively and Conway offered so much out wide.

Some interesting pre-match comments, that were, ahem, somewhat wide of the mark. Let’s just say that Conway would have been my MOM. Agree though, that he is not a saviour either.

Ditto the nonsense posted that we “pasted” them or they were “abysmal”. They controlled a lot of the game in the first half after our goal. And they looked dangerous for most of the second half. They also taught us a lesson in midfield triangles (but of course that’s not everything.)

Very enjoyable game. Great open game from both sides. Loved the interplay of some of their players in the second half, particularly the diminutive number 10 who controlled much of the game strangely.  Cracking 2^nd goal from them (Joao) and they looked as though they could easily draw level. But in their openness to create they left us room and we kept on scoring at the right time. Our third goal (I think) started with a square crossfield Conway pass that was a little dodgy and left Smallwood (?) with a 50/50. It was one of those that if their player had won it they would have caught us and be in on goal. Ditto the other way round. If it had been me, I would have just remained goal side and played safe. Smallwood, aggressively decided it was going to be his, won it, and on we go to score.

Clear right from kick off that high press and work hard were in the team talk. We were at it from the off –that makes a nice change. My immediate thoughts then were a) will we fade late on and b) can we score in this hot 15 mins? Answer, yes on 11mins to b) and yes a little on a) but we kept on managing to score again just as they looked likely to get back in it. Did enjoy Dack’s clever pull back for Graham’s tap in for the 4^th. Earlier in the season, he would have taken that on himself and had the goalie save.

So, good win and a very enjoyable game. It’s probably not a day to bring out some glaring issues (not least his love of 4231 and the personnel) but they haven’t gone away. Does he know his best team and formation? As usual, overreacting works both ways.

Ewood ace

We concede a hell of a lot goals considering how we line up, with 2 holding midfielders

That is something I also find very interesting. Mowbray loves 4231. So effectively a back 6. What I think happens (not necessarily today, which seemed quite an open game), is that those 6 often cautiously sit deep (a reason for our slow starts?) whilst the forward 4 are adrift upfront (the 2 wide players and Dack behind the striker). This means that opposing teams have effectively got easy control to my mind of the midfield and thus play.

Yawnsville.

Standouts? Hmm. Their defender kicking the ball over the stand. Dack prone on the floor with his hands out appealing for a foul when he had thrown himself over. Graham looking at a defender as he backs in, making a pathetic jump and then falling over expecting a foul. The crowd getting all agitated with the ref who was so biased that he, er, gave us a questionable penalty at the end. Their goalie rushing off his line near the end of the game to remonstrate with the ref, complaining that we were time wasting. 2 teams doing their level best to create a 0-0. Countless times we were in comfortable possession but just did not have the nous/creativity/pace to open up a side who were content to sit in their shape.

Otherwise? Well, we won although really did think they were going to sneak a 1-0. Lenihan was commanding at times and Williams too (his weaknesses are less obvious at centre back). And er, that’s it I think. ?

WIR second coming.

LOL

Talking of cliches –here’s a few tired and tiresome tropes. Why, oh why is reffing so poor in this country and why can’t we have consistency? And an absolute cert on any phone-in is moaning about ‘biased’ refs, ‘cheating’ refs, refs that cost us the game, the league, my marriage, the end of the world……

Perhaps not the right space to raise this but since the notion of bad luck with reffing decisions has arisen, I thought it might be worth it.

The first thing that occurs to me is that only the weak blame refs. The next is that, since the quality is so poor according to many, then perhaps some on here should apply for the job. Maybe some ex pros should do it –I wonder why not?

But really, why would anyone with any sanity volunteer for the job? At grassroots level, the lifeblood for future refs, psychological and physical intimidation is rife, ranging from aggressive parents threatening to stab refs or sort them out in the car park, kids threatening to destroy changing rooms and screaming coaches. Thousands of UK officials — from grassroots level to top-flight — admitted they regularly experience verbal abuse. In the 2014/15 season, 100 incidents of criminal assault against men in black in the UK were recorded.

But many referees say the figures are much higher as the sickening violence goes unreported — out of fear or because officials have lost faith in the ability of county Football Associations to punish offenders quickly. There is plenty of footage out there of referees being kicked, punched and battered on the pitch for nothing more than giving a yellow card.

And take any game that you watch live or see on Match of the Day etc. and you can clearly see a variety of abuses. A ball goes out for a throw, a full back doesn’t like the way it’s given –and you can clearly see (or hear if you are pitch side) – “never lino, you f*****g c***, you cheating t**t!.” and that’s just a throw-in and you can clearly see that the full back is clearly wrong, not even close! Ditto, plenty of things to the ref. But of course, it’s just ‘industrial’ language that men use. Bo***cks! :-)  Doesn’t happen in rugby, cricket, basketball.

Then of course there is the issue I mentioned elsewhere recently. The officials' ability to make decisions at the top tier is exceptional. I suspect they get 90% plus of decisions correct. It’s obvious they are going to get plenty wrong in a fast moving game with a split second to make a decision. But then armchair specialists and teams of ‘experts’ sitting in studios watching every decision in ultra 4K, super slo-mo and from lots of angles make their pronouncements and decide that the officials should be shamed. Cue radio phone-ins for sad individuals to take out their inadequacies on the ‘bas***d in green.’ And the amusing thing is, after all the endless replays, the experts disagree anyway. How many times have you screamed at the ref live or at the TV, only to be shown the replay to see that you were entirely wrong. Or here’s a classic –home fans screaming at an opposing player who is in their opinion feigning injury, only to see the poor sod carried off with something serious.

So, refs. If you want infallibility forget it. If you want close to it, then give them the tools –VAR at least (that works and not the nonsense we have at the moment –but that is another issue). Pay them more. Train them more. Give them more respect at all levels. Sin bins. Zero tolerance of backchat. Let’s face it, refs provide a useful social function, a safety valve to vent all that anger, a focal point for all the resentment, bitterness and spleen of a community come Saturday. Hell, give them a medal.

LOL. A rant against the 'obvious' injustice and 'cheating' of a ref and 4 mins later a retraction.

Focus on what you can control-better defending, fewer stupid mistakes, more clinical finishing, game management to kill teams off.

Not joking. The gif proves nothing really.

First pen, clear foul by Lenihan. Second pen, trip by Rodwell -no complaints from Rovers players.

Evans had a good game, plugging gaps where needed and was missed. Nyambe has a hamstring.

Need to start better, defend better and take chances. Would still have taken 13th at this stage of the season.

If you're stupid enough to pull a shirt in the box.....

Poor wall set up. On the free kick given away -if Danny gets his body in the way and is fouled in the same situation, would the Rovers fans be wave play on? More grit and savvy needed to close out a game.

My feeling too Mr E.

Thrown away when we have clearly been better side. Where did 5 mins injury time come from?

Game management -stupid tackle from Reed. Also, Brereton putting in no challenge on right just before.

Game management time. Nervy last 10. Sitting deep not our strength?

Great stuff by Reed and Mulgrew on right, nice flick on by Brereton and deft little touch by Dack. Just as well, Villa were beginning to believe in themselves. eg Lenihan slipping again and being made a fool of by Abraham.

Can’t agree with poor officiating –the usual bleating of home fans. The linesman can’t see Hutton from his side so it’s the only decision he can make. The penalty involved definite contact but the player was already falling –enough to give doubt –could have gone either way. At the speed these officials have to see it, they do pretty well without the hindsight of several TV replays afforded to armchair pundits (and even then you can get differing views on decisions).

Typical Rovers at mo. Dominate first 30, almost predictable that they might get some daft soft goal out of nothing-cue Lenihan slipping/messing about and pen should have been given. Player was falling but Smallwood definitely caught him. Ref evened up after Dack’s ruled out? - (very close offside but Hutton looked to be playing him on.)

Footballers are also human beings who live in a community.

‘Happy’ to survive this season? Yes. That is, I would take it now.

‘Happy ‘–well not exactly – I would be ‘happy’ to get rid of the Venkys, have new sheikh owners who are billionaires and love football/Rovers/Blackburn community and put in millions in players/infrastructure and help us get promoted.

Obviously, you aim as high as you can but realistically? Survival followed by consolidation .