Newcastle fans were willing to give him a clean slate too. As was King Kev. It's clearly worked out well for them.

The tackle at the weekend was a dubious sending off, but if Barton didn't have such a well-earned reputation for being a tw@t maybe he would be treated with a degree of fairness. I'm shedding no tears over it, and there's not a queue of Newcastle fans waiting to back him up.

To survive in this division we do not need Barton. He's the only player I can currently think of who I do not want at this club, at any cost. I was fine with Diouf, Savage, Todd, Dickov... any of our "dubious" players and I don't mind players who wind up other players and have a dig every now and then. Barton is, however, a total liability and as a human being he ranks far below any of the aforementioned. He's a different class of nasty and even though I won't stop supporting the Rovers if we sign him, the club will fall drastically in my estimations. I don't think I'll be able to cheer Barton in the shirt, it'll anger me seeing him in it.

I quite agree. Chances are we'll survive this season without this "rough diamond" whilst his team are heading down. And if you Barton fans want to debate it on footballing terms, then tell me when his last commanding performance was? His best years were in 2005 and 2006 at Man City. What has he done in recent times? Well he's served 74 days in prison. He's been banned for 6 matches. He was out for 8 weeks with a knee injury and then 3 months with a foot injury. In his first match back he gets a red card and another suspension. So tell me - how can you judge he is better than Grella or Dunn? He's played even less than them in the last 2 seasons and that's saying something.

Well said.

Some folk fail to see that you cannot overcome animosity by feeling guilty or by constantly trying to please. I wonder how many of the main complainants used to watch football before Sky and the broadsheets suddenly realised it existed? Not many judging by the tone of most of the recent posts.... "...If Allardyce/Diouf/Barton (delete as appropriate) comes here it will be the last time I set foot in Ewood...there will be a boycott etc...Yours Sincerely, Mr. Permanently Outraged from Loserville, Suffolk (on behalf of all permanently outraged football fans)..."

The premise is laughable. Rovers are not liked by the media and never will be, no matter who we sign. Stop trying to be loved and get over it. Who cares what other fans think of us? Who gives a rats a*** that the press and media hold us in utter disdain because we don't shift newspapers and we don't attract decent viewing figures? Too many of you by the looks of it! We appoint the first black British Premier League manager and draw unprecedented accusations of racism. None of those sports writers would have dared attack one of the so-called bigger clubs in the manner which they did us.

I assume most complainants would have never seen Glen Keeley in action. He was big, ugly and brutal. In a Rovers shirt however - as his elbow swivelled to almost decapitate his opponent or defying gravity to literally launch himself at the ball, flying horizontally in mid-air before before landing on both ball and strikers knee - he was truly majestic.

So Joey Barton slapped a teenager and some gobby posturing French non-entity who apparently squared up to him...gosh! I can think of plenty teenagers in the town that would benefit from being slapped and of several players in our current squad who might benefit from a training ground rumble, just to shake them out of their complacency.

This isn't some sort of government sponsored 'progressive enterprise' insisting on the secularists Holy Trinity of Diversity, Inclusion and Equality before releasing further funds. It's about winning. Nothing else. The club should be bold, not show any sign of weakness as it simply provokes futher resentment and emboldens the snipers. Rovers should hire people who will win us football matches, not pander to a bunch of vapidly fashionable, self-serving posters lining up to to congratulate themselves on being so morally superior.

What a lamentable post. You really appear to have no clue. Pathetic.

I didn't want to see the Axe partnering Andrews in midfield but we did through basic necessity! Beggars cannot be choosers.

Q. How many midfielders do we have on the books that would keep Barton out of the team? Be honest now.

You've talked a lot of sense recently but I'm afraid that you, and everyone else on here that wants Barton, is just plain wrong. Firstly this great club is not so pathetic that we have to take whoever is available, whatever their character, whatever they have done. We are better than that and I'm surprised at you of all people for taking that position. Secondly, when was the last time Barton had a really good match? Be honest now - it was years ago. When he played for City. He never turned in a performance for Newcastle that I'm aware of so what has changed now? Finally, I am all for giving people a second chance. But this guy is on about his fifth chance. And not for a bit of mischief either. For serious, violent and in some cases psychotic behaviour. Why does anyone on here suddenly think that will stop? Why does everyone think that this track record will dissipate and he will become a model pro? We'd be lucky to get 10 matches a season out of him. It really would be the wrong decision to sign this tosspot and I think gumboots is actually right - it would send a lot of people to the golf course

we already have 2 midfielders who only play occasionally due to injury. Do we really want to chuck good money away on a knob with zero self control and will be regularly banned? He's already proved he can't or won't change and frankly he's a thousand times worse than any of the other so-called bad boys we've signed before

I really didn't think when I started this topic that we would still not have found a decent replacement for Tugay by the end of 2008. But we haven't - and the difference he made when he came on against Sunderland was akin to introducing an adult into a kids team. Whoever the manager is in January absolutely needs to get us a ball-playing playmaker. I know Nicko has said that Benayoun is on 70k a week at Liverpool but he isn't playing so maybe he could be prised away for less (wishful thinking goggles on!)

Nila in Rawtenstall used to be great - not been for a while

New Thai place in Whitefield, Manchester called The Thai Lounge is excellent - can book online too

Albert's Shed in Castlefield expensive but nice food

Dining Room in Manchester also expensive plus a bit pretentious, but again nice food

What's Heathcote's in Longridge like?

I can understand some of the emotion on here but to me it had to happen some day. I'm sad to see Hughesy leave but at the time Souness left, I didn't think there was anyone better we could get and I was wrong then, so as long as it isn't Allardyce or McClaren I'm optimistic.

I wish him well but I think Hughes is only kidding himself if he thinks his bosses at MC, the fans at MC, us and the media believe that it isn't Second-Choice City and he had his eyes on the bigger prize of Chelsea. It must have been gutting for an ambitious and self-confident individual to find out he wasn't wanted by the man that counted.

As for Man City being a better club than ours - it isn't. It has more money (for now - Thaksin will get bored/deported/asset-stripped at some point) and it's got a bigger fanbase. But then again, over the last decade so have Newcastle, Leeds, Villa, Everton, Spurs, Sunderland etc etc. And as others point out, what happens when City have a bad patch - which they will? Or don't win a cup? Or don't finish top 6?

Stubbed a cigar out in a youth players eye and then attacked the club captain, attacked another teammate from behind in training and now convicted of assault. I'm sorry but we CAN afford to be choosy about morons like this and frankly, if you believe we can't, then you hold the club in pretty low esteem imho. We should have, and I believe we will have, more dignity than that. West Ham on the other hand...

Doesn't look like anyone wants the ball half the time. Add Stuart Downing (and Wes Brown) to the list of players who seem unable to make the step up to international level from the premiership

Oh good - Crouch is on. Even more long ball than the first half. How exciting

Tugay has been one of my favourite players to watch at Ewood - even including the championship winning team and when he went through his "invisible friend" spell! But he's getting on and we need a replacement creative midfielder. Unfortunately, I think we sold his natural successor - not Wee Barry but Dunny. Who would you like to see at Rovers in the role of creative midfielder (that we could afford and would come here). That new fella at West Ham looks decent - but they don't look like they're going down anytime yet!

Well I started this thread 2 and a half years ago thinking we might get another year out of Toogs and I was bemoaning the fact that we'd sold Dunny. He's the best we've got in this role at the moment but I doubt he'll ever recover to the levels he was at. Benayoun was the other player I referred to.

Anyway, here we are in 2008 and although Everton get lots of bodies behind the ball we didn't look like breaking them down. In fact, the only time I thought we did was when Toogs came on. So we definitely need someone in the Summer that can get the ball down and play it. Start looking now Mark!

A mate told me that last night in San Carlo restaurant in Manchester, Morten was dining with Sven

It's funny - I really dislike Allardyce but I'm starting to feel some sympathy for him. Frankly, managing Newcastle is becoming the joke job of the premier league - like Citeh was a few years back. Apart from the fat payoff you can look forward to after your 3, 4, 5 or 6 month go! You really get the sense that maybe Ossie Ardiles would be the best manager for them - when he managed Spurs and played his revolutionary 4-0-6 formation they were really entertaining

Watching them on Saturday - the first time I've really done so this year - it seemed to me he is trying to create another Bolton, with Smith as his Kevin Davies and Martins as his Anelka. Unfortunately, Smith isn't as good as Davies at that role and Martins isn't as good as Anelka, despite what the Geordies think. And, he doesn't have the dull-yet-reliable defenders and midfielders that Bolton had! He has players who think they are better than they are (take a bow Mr Barton!). The one mistake he made against us was not playing Viduka - as long as I can remember Viduka has scored against us.

I'm not sure that environment is one to cut your managerial teeth in but if Shearer does do it then he'll have his work cut out!

Although in Neill's final season at the club his performance were well below standard you can not argue that he wasn't a key player in our defence.

In his seasons leading up to the 2006 WC (2003-2006) his performances for Blackburn were as consistent as any Rovers player.

Agree, but so far I still think we got the better deal with Warnock. Anyway back to Benni; yes it is a little disappointing that top players only see Rovers as a stepping stone to the big 4 but frankly nowadays they see every premier club as that. Think how bad it must be to support Spurs or Villa or Newcastle or City where you have REAL delusions of grandeur Benni is a class act and if his head is straight it can only be good for us

I remember the Norwich game a fantastic tribute to a fantastic man, to see on the big screen various players paying tribute and accompanied by the song Time To Say Goodbye, it wasn't just the women who were crying on that day.

Everytime I hear that song the hairs on the back of my neck stand up.

Agree totally - that day my wife and I were in tears and so were most around us.

I hope the club arrange a minute's silence, or a minute's applause - perhaps Lee can tell us?

1-0 at half-time and Richard Keys says "The pressure was on, but not so much now" Shows how far we've come really

If Mourinho leaves I think Benni is all Rovers'.

Yeah, but then we have to start worrying about Hughes

we got the 3 points we needed, but the performance was crap, Mclaren should resign, he is not getting the best out of the players and should walk away now.

The FA should be ashamed of themselves for selecting him to be the manager of England, he might be a good number 2 but he's never going to be a good manager

Spot on. It's actually quite sad as the man is clearly and comprehensively out of his depth, as every sensible football fan predicted when he was given the job. The real villains are the idiots in charge of the game at Soho Square who made such a hash of replacing Sven and panicked into appointing McClaren.

I've just heard the England Manager, captain and vice-captain (total salary for the week c£150,000+) use the following excuses for taking 70 minutes to score against a butcher, baker and candlestick-maker (total salary for the year c£60,000)

- conditions

- confidence

- two banks of 4 behind the ball (erm, you mean just like the premiership )

- diving and rolling around (no hint of irony Steven Gerrard, after that shocking embarrassed-to-be-English penalty dive you tried)

Shocking, and a demonstration of the contempt in which they hold the fans.

Sky commentator actually used the phrase "McClaren has come through it" and despite evidence stretching back years, and the fact that Gerrard clearly played better without Lampard tonight, Ray Wilkins patronised everybody by stating that "football people" knew that Frank and Steve could play well together.

And Rooney looks like he is going to kick a big lump off the next player who gets in his way given the way his temper is going, so I hope the ref on Saturday doesn't bottle it when he does.

So overall, another evening spent shouting at the TV and swearing more than is good for me

Mmm, I'd disagree a bit with that I think it's been the players, losing the Cup, the Maschawotsit and Tevez debacle, uncertain ownership and a large dose of the players having the big time charlie attitude. They acted like they'd made it. I'll be pencilling them in for a win on the 17th though

I agree, but the point I'm making is that it seemed to me Pardew who turned them (or allowed them to turn) from a team of journeyman playing as well as they could into a bunch of big-time charlie's who believed their own hype. His Capt Smug attitude can't have helped that.

He was poor against Pompey, heh heh here's the funny bit, I thought he had a stinker in the second half, didn't even hear his name then I found out he was pulled at halftime for illness dummy me.

When I'm ill, all I get is a paracetomol

Sorry, I'll get me coat...

Seen him in Wilmslow twice now - although was on the phone so didn't say hello. Appeared to be looking at a house which would suggest he may be staying in the NW

I believe that Alan Pardew is to blame for West Ham's current predicament, and in my mind he'll be the first manager to be responsible for 2 clubs going out of the premiership in the same season.

As for Lucas, what says everything about the man is the interview he gave. He was smiling ffs He might have said the right things but he was nearly smirking as he talked about the mess they are in. Contrast him to that young lad Noble who was in tears. Unbelievable

Well I think that pretty much guarentees West Ham's relegation. I know there's still a fair few points to play for but from the games I've seen (rovers and on tv) charlton are a poor outfit. And if they can't beat charlton ina game of that magnitude they might as well give up.

Whilst I like the club, as others have commentated having a club with such financial backing not competing against us next year - both in the league and transfer market - would be very advantagious. Looking at how close the championship is at the moment, west ham may well struggle to get back out, especially when considering the exodus of talent that inevitably follows relegation.

Whilst it won't be too nice for lucash to get relegated i'm hardly thinking it'll be sweet revenge on the chap. He'll just jump ship to somewhere else and get another big payday, which is pretty sickening. Still his marketability and reputation must have sunk a few notches and i'm not sure too many big clubs will want to take on a player with such a reputation as a mercenary.

Having watched MOTD it is absolutely clear that 7 or 8 West Ham players clearly have no stomach for putting the effort in. It makes you appreciate the work ethic here even more, even when we think Rovers aren't trying they are miles ahead of this bunch. So I think you are right. It's a shame - I liked Curbishley but maybe it is a case of a manager who is great at getting the best out of not-quite-good enough players who give their all not being able to step up to taking on the big-time charlie's and lots of cash? For me, the most surprising comment is on MOTD when Hansen said they should never have sacked Pardew - it appears to me he's the one who generated this situation and Curbishley will probably get the sack for it too.

As for Lucas, he has shown he is motivated by money alone so I doubt very much he will care what happens to West Ham and I believe he'll be at Liverpool next year with his tail between his legs...

I don't know how much these boards cost to set up and run but it seems an awful lot of trouble to go to given the number of boards he already posts on (google "vinjay blackburn"). Having said that, most of the replies seem to be off the "____ off" variety so perhaps that's why. Maybe he should set up a petition on the downing street website

The issue at hand is being slightly lost here - and its not an issue that purely effects fans of the English national side. All football fans will immediately look to blame the manager in times of crisis - because the manager is just 1 man, and can be sacked an replaced within days. It's a hell of a lot easier to bury your head in the sand than it is to look at the deeper issue, which is far more often the playing squad, and their lack of quality and/or bad attitudes.

Almost every England manager in my short lifetime has suffered this curse - it just amazes me that otherwise intelligent and rational people fail to see this when the subject of the national team arises.

I don't think people do fail to see it.

A club manager has a responsibility for much more than just the footballing performance of his first team. He is often involved in coaching, scouting and buying players, selling players, youth policy, fitness, wage negotiations and a host of other things. Heck, I hear Wenger was even involved in the design of the facilities at the Emirates.

An international manager has 3 basic responsibilities. Selection. Preparation. Tactics. Therefore, more often that not, the buck stops with International Managers a lot quicker than club managers. I do not subscribe for one minute to the view that England players have a bad attitude or a lack of quality. Supporters of McClaren are the ones burying their heads in the sand by spouting that old chestnut. What I consider the England first team are all excellent players who play at the highest level and are very effective at what they do. Can they win a World Cup - with luck, possibly. Should they qualify for every major tournament and group stage. Absolutely. And they used to - the same players, different manager. Which of course rings us back to the manager. Preparation and tactics. I include motivation in preparation and frankly a wet blanket non-English manager appeared to be able to motivate FANS and players more than our current manager, which leaves tactics. And that appears to be our strategy - to leave tactics well alone.

So, blame the players all you want. But they're all we have so a better approach would be to get a manager who can get the best out of them. I think everyone knows that isn't the current incumbent.