3 hours ago, Mercer said:

We simply should not be signing footballers who aren't physically fit to give us 90 minutes.

I think the Chapman situation borders on farcical.  This is a player who was fit enough to turn out for Middlesbrough (and Pulis is a stickler for fitness and discipline) in a Jan. FA Cup tie and has now had almost six weeks with Rovers (effectively a pre season!) yet Mowbray doesn't think he's ready!  It's not as though we are a team of supreme athletes who run the opposition into the ground every game.  I think it's just more b 0 l l 0 c k s from Mowbray and IMO, his management of Brereton and Chapman is beyond rational explanation and offers further evidence as to why he is not the man for Rovers.

So who's going to win tomorrow and what bets have you put on? ?

6 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Not fair. I don't think any fan has accepted mediocrity. They are hoping that Mowbray does what he has promised to do and again delivers success in the Championship. Bowyer was great here, but he didn't have Mowbrays past success in the championship or budget. 

The Mowbray/Bowyer comparison doesn't add up for me

Mowbray's one promotion from the Championship came a long time ago and, to give it context, occurred a season before Coyle achieved the same feat.

Just now, arbitro said:

https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/football/rovers/news/17475892.mowbray-on-how-post-january-slump-threatens-rovers-season/?ref=mr&lp=4

On the poor defensive record, Mowbray added: “You’re not telling me anything I don’t know.

“It’s right in front of your eyes. It would be great if we had the old rules of football where you could change the team when you wanted.

“But we can’t. We could throw some youngsters in I suppose but I don’t think is the right environment for them.

“Let’s win a few games and then we can throw them in and we will see how the season unfolds.”

Does anybody understand what he means by 'the old rules of football'?

 

Where the manager takes responsibility, perhaps?

When Mowbray left Coventry he admitted that the team couldn't defend properly.

History will repeat itself if he's not careful.

1 hour ago, Mattyblue said:

Indeed. 

And only two until February, ergo I doubt two defeats from Preston and Wigan will tip the balance.

A repeat of recent efforts in a home game against local rivals will result in pretty loud disapproval and discontentment.

1 hour ago, Mercer said:

I said at the time, IMO, it was madness from Waggott to extend Mowbray's contract to 2022 (think it's 2022).  Just where on earth do we get these CEO's from.  The sensible option would have been to put Mowbray on a 12 month roller with a pay rise reflecting last season's promotion.  I feel certain Mowbray would have bought that as I very much doubt there was a queue forming at our doors for his services.  

Also several have mentioned moving Mowbray to a DOF role.  To me, that would be absurd and pointless given, Dack apart, a poor record on player recruitment.

If Mowbray has to be sacked then Waggott should follow him out of the door.  I struggle to see how Waggott has moved our club forward.

Any CEO of a sports club who signs off a sponsorship deal with a company that manufactures a nicotine based product is a joke.

What's happened to all these great ideas he had when he took up the post (of being Mowbray's lackey)?

23 hours ago, Mercer said:

Seems like some are worried by 'the mighty' Rotherham.

Some perspective needed.

Might be a tad physical but hey ho, it's football and it's the Championship!

We are playing third from bottom of the league! 

Get Brereton in - what is he, man or mouse PhilipL?  He's been bought to fire us some goals.

Can only see a Rovers' win here.  Backed the win at 15/8 and 3-1 at 22/1.  Fill yer boots and have a bit of fun with the winnings!

Just arrived in Rotherham but now tempted to catch the train home ?

I love the optimism, to be fair.

Let's see what transpires..........

2 hours ago, MarkBRFC said:

*Tumbleweed*

Day before a game without a thread, can tell the season is over eh?

Probably around a thousand Rovers fans there again at a guess, 700 sold as of a couple of days ago.

Usually like Rotherham away, but a bus journey between Manchester & Sheffield has put me off this time around.

2-0 Rovers, Graham & Dack to get the goals.

Does anyone care?

I'm going via Leeds to avoid the replacement bus leg of the journey.

Meeting up with a Rotherham fan I met on my jollies a few years ago.

That, & the fact I need the ground, is my motivation to bother.

21 minutes ago, Parsonblue said:

Fortunately, the owners have a different view and like many fans have faith in him, without being blind to his faults, but believe he is exactly the right man for this club at this point in our history.

The owners wouldn't know the right man to manage a football club if their lives depended on it.

They got relatively lucky with this appointment and obviously buy the dream that Mowbray is selling them.

I'm not, but he has earned the chance to try & deliver it.

3 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

totally unnecessary poll and we are where I think some of us would be league position wise. Did people really expect Promotion? 

You have to look a bit deeper than that and see the pattern of results.

Had we arrived at this position / number of points by building steadily after a tough start, (a bit like PNE), it would auger well for next season.

It looks ominous.

19 minutes ago, alcd said:

That sums it pretty well. Very ominous for next season as teams on the slide in the second half of the previous season are prime candidates for relegation. 

Agreed, which is pretty much what I was saying on here the other night.

33 minutes ago, Neal said:

Yeah I almost expect results to be poor for a while tbh and I agree with much of what you say especially regarding recruitment. As far as his results going on a downward trajectory, I think it's the same for any manager, I just think people are being a little hasty by questioning it now. In our case, a change of manager is a massive risk with our owners and I just don't think the current situation is dire enough to warrant the risk. A lot rests on his transfer business and developing of our prospects. Next season we could be without Dack, Reed and Graham might not be able to do the minutes he has done this season, that's a lot of goals and quality to replace. Add to the fact that the defence and keeper positions need looking at too, he has a big summer ahead. What frustrated me about last night is that it was a prime opportunity to start getting our younger players game time and preparing them for next season. If you can get the likes of Butterworth, Rothwell, Nyambe, Chapman and maybe even the likes of Magliore (is that how it's spelt?) in the first team and learning what's required of them now whilst the pressure is off it might save us some money in the summer. What we don't want to do is sign players who block the path of our younger players who don't turn out to be much better and end up with a massive wage bill too. I just hope Mowbray see's it the same way, he seems to say similar things in the press but then last night benches Rothwell for Conway, I want to see some bold decisions from him now and in the summer. 

Agree entirely &, just to repeat what I said in my previous post, I am absolutely not saying he should be sacked.

I just have a different perspective on what the future may hold to many others I read on social media, and see the forum as a safer environment in which to air my view.

8 minutes ago, Neal said:

I suppose it remains to be seen. He has done it in this league before, so whilst he's here I'm going to place my faith in him to try and do the same. I think it will become pretty apparent when he can't take us any further but now is not that time. Reading should be a big warning to him though that it could all go south quickly if he doesn't get his house in order now and in the summer. 

He did it early in his managerial career, (with WBA), but we've had other managers who could say the same, (*cough* Lambert and Coyle!)

I agree, now isn't the time to judge, but he has previous of results tapering downwards. Coventry being a very good example.

What really worries me is his apparent lack of concern with regards to our defending.

It's clearly a major problem, but he doesn't even reference it in media interviews.

Probably not all Tony's fault, but I do think we missed a trick by not strengthening further in January.

We had turned a corner and results / performances were on the up.

We needed a bit of quality and cover in certain areas.

We didn't get it, and since the deadline have suffered injuries & fatigue to key players, and subsequent poor results.

With little or no chance of a play off push, it's quite possible the current dip will continue for a sustained period.

2 hours ago, Neal said:

I think it's pretty dangerous talking about changing manager. Let him attempt to fulfil what he says he intends to do, if he fails or worse takes us backwards then fair enough but overall a good job all things considered. We have a manager that the owners trust to invest in for once, I think people have lost sight of what state we were in before him and what state we could be in again if we change manager. 

Mowbray absolutely does not deserve to be sacked at this time, and we could certainly end up with someone far worse.

I just don't think he will take us any further, and fear we may already be going into reverse, but hope he proves me wrong.

20 minutes ago, Parsonblue said:

Personally, I'm far from reaching the point where I would want a change of manager.  I think Mowbray has done a very good job thus far and has the ability to take us forward in the long term.  However, as with every manager, it will come down to recruitment and results.  Last summer the stated aim was maintaining Championship status and anything better being a bonus.  I believe we will finish well above the relegation places but some distance from the play-offs which, for me, is a decent season after promotion.

This summer we need to recruit players who will make us stronger and take us to a point where we can be serious challengers for the play-off positions.  It won't be easy as there are clubs with money to spend from parachute payments.  However, it can be done as other clubs have shown over the years.  This is going to be a big summer in terms of recruitment and we have to get it right.  On the plus side we have a number of youngsters who could fill the 'squad' positions so that the money can be targeted on players who are the 'finished article'.

I'm also not at the point where I would want a change of manager.

However,  I'm far from convinced that Mowbray has the ability to take us forward in the long term.

His CV shows initial success at one or two of his previous clubs, then a fade.

I would wager the high watermark of his Ewood reign will be the home win against Leeds, and subsequent sixth place in the table.

We've lost seven of the last eleven games, and clearly have huge defensive issues.

Unfortunately, I'm not sure Mowbray realises these issues exist or has the ability to address them.

Tony's done a decent job in getting us back to where we were under Bowyer.

I couldn't see Bowyer taking us any further, & I feel the same about Mowbray.

I agree with you regarding summer recruitment, and feel next season will be a struggle if we get it wrong, especially if one or two key players move on.

1 hour ago, DeeCee said:

Thought the idea was to build slowly/steadily adding quality at every window for 3 or 4 windows, that's what ToMo's been preaching?

Very easy for Mowbray to say that, much harder to actually achieve.

Has he been able to do that at any previous clubs he's managed? 

I would argue the answer is "no".

Fair play to him for getting us back to where we were pre Coyle.

I see mid Championship as being our level for the next few years, (at least).

47 minutes ago, gumboots said:

Or he might just be meeting him for coffee on his day off?

I remember the instagram pic of Chapman having a coffee with Danny Graham during the last transfer window leading to folk jumping to conclusions, (the latter still living up there).

Too much smoke this time though, I reckon (& I'm not talking about the coffee).

14 minutes ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

We didn't take much care of the lad last time he was here to be honest. He made his comeback in the reserves on a really freezing cold night. What was the point of that ?

Perhaps we will take a little more care with him when he's our player, i.e. we will have more invested in his long term fitness.

19 minutes ago, benhben said:

Don't get me wrong I'd love to have him back providing the risk doesn't outweigh the cost. 

Having had hamstring trouble myself in the last few years I know how hard it is to full remove the issue. Mentally as much as physically. Saying that his treatment will far outweigh my amateur Saturday league treatment of a cold sponge. 

That's my worry about loaning him out.

Might be better to play him in the U23's, have the option of using him as an impact sub for the first team, and keeping on top of his condition.

He may not be so well looked after at a League One club.

2 minutes ago, oldjamfan1 said:

That's all with the benefit of hindsight though, in both examples, and as far as King goes you were only referring to the FA Cup game as far as I could see from your post?

I can't think of too many storming games King had for us. He was quick, yes, but other aspects of his play weren't great. 

Bowyer preferred Chris Brown to King, (oh dear!) and when he got an occasional outing in a league game, it was usually out of position on the wing.

6 hours ago, JHRover said:

This is the problem. For me our budget and plans shouldn't really hinge on how far off the play-offs we are in early January. The club and owners should have a plan over the medium to long term and a list of players they want to bring in to work towards that, be it this season or next. Whether we are 7th or 17th. They should have faith in the medium to long term job. By all means if we're on course for promotion chuck some more in to try and get us over the line but business needs to be done either way and we'll never get anywhere if they base their budget on what position we're in. 

E.g. if our last 4 games had been Rotherham, Ipswich, Brentford and Reading and we'd picked up 10 points we'd be on the cusp of the play-offs but might have Leeds, Sheff Utd, WBA and Middlesbrough to come in January. Would they seriously increase the transfer pot after a good Xmas because we had a kind fixture list rather than the tough one we actually had which only saw 3 points from 12 collected?

There's too much ifs, buts and maybes. If we're in contention they'll think about making more cash available. Anyone can see we lack depth and quality in numerous areas so the club should be looking to plug those gaps with the right players. What's the alternative? Don't make money available because we're not in promotion contention? Its a vicious cycle.

If the plan is to focus on loans we aren't going to get anywhere. It's just a patch up job until it has to be revisited in July. Need permanent quality players who are going to improve the team not for 6 months before trotting back to their parent clubs but for 2-3 years as we build upwards.

 

Absolutely agree with this summing up.

If we're just signing loanees, the gradual improvement Mowbray talks about will never materialise and the best case scenario will only ever be mid table.

Just as the case was under Bowyer, if you tread water for too long, you will eventually start to go backwards.

5 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

The partnership of Graham and Dack has scored 18 goals between them. Where do you fit this third striker in?

We need a decent back up option, particularly for Graham.

He isn't getting any younger and we would struggle if he sustains a medium / long term injury.

1 hour ago, old darwen blue said:

Whilst I respect the rights of people to have their own opinions on Tony I would just like you all to remember where we were before he arrived and the previous few years of catastrophic disaster on a seasonal basis. Let’s just give a manager at least three or four years before any judgement is cast. 

 

I thank you. 

I'm not advocating that he's sacked, but he's basically just got us back to where we were before the ridiculous appointment of Coyle.

The relegation season was the only one of real catastrophic disaster, (since Kean left).

Let's see if he can turn it back around for the remainder of the season, and restore the momentum that's now been lost.

47 minutes ago, tomphil said:

He must be a Prestoner they have many dual club fans it seems !

Mentioned it before but a guy Preston born and bred used to come into the local with his two kids all with PNE shirts on on a Sat evening for something to eat then they'd all turn up for Super Sunday as it was the day after in UTD tops when they were on telly. And he hated Rovers to boot, odd odd bunch.

If it's a Cantona tattoo, he must have had it done years ago.

Maybe he got disillusioned after his hero left ?

3 hours ago, Oldgregg86 said:

Haha and he's got Luis Figo tattooed to his neck ?

I would say that it is Monsieur Cantona ?

Re the game, I think our lot were still on the international break until 15:30.

Also, a bit rich for Mowbray to be making excuses re Graham and Mulgrew so soon after handing them new contracts.

A bit of reality now setting in, and we will learn a lot more about where we're at by Christmas.

Regardless of modern day boundaries, there is no way in the World that people in Bolton regard themselves as Mancunians.

Bolton is a Lancashire town, like Blackburn, Preston, Blackpool etc.

Some of us are old enough to remember when Radio Blackburn (now Lancashire) covered Wanderers matches.

I couldn't go today so can look at the result quite dispassionately. I would've taken that result beforehand and would've taken the number of points we have and our league position at this stage.

There's lots to work on, (e.g. conceding too many late goals), but the bigger picture looks very healthy indeed.