Recently read it and found it very enjoyable although the cliffhangers are so contrived as to be at times ridiculous. Some daft plot lines as well but overall a compulsive read. 'Bloody Foreigners' by Robert Winder is a history of immigration into the UK and despite the title it isn't some of kind of Daily Mail rant but actually is sympathetic to the plight of the many of the refugees to this country. It's interesting to know just how much of what we take to be quintessentially British things were actually created by immigrants to this country through the centuries.

Could this be in part the 'Ashes effect'? Will be interesting to see if crowds increase after the cricket stops dominating all the headlines or whether it is a longer downturn. However, as crowds have been increasing almost every year for a couple of decades there has to come a backlash sometime.

I've no idea where people get the idea that Aussies are bad losers from...

Exactly. This kind of topic comes around every time another sport gets a bit of the limelight, its a bit like the 'declining messageboard standards' topics that come up in the summer only to fall away when the board actually has something to talk about. Yet even now more people are going to watch football games then are watching cricket, yet the popularity must be at a high point for a good twenty years. That said...in answer to the original question, yes...football is a bit crap at the moment. The last two championship sides, Arsenal and Chelsea, lost one game between them over their two successful campaigns. There is little fun in that as it takes the unpredictability factor completely away. Liverpool and Man U in the eighties and nineties used to usually win but there always the outside chance of an upset. However, I rarely believe there is even a hope of one of the top teams (esp. Arsenal and Chelsea) dropping points, never mind losing a game to a lowly placed team. Somehow...just a bit more of a level playing field is needed in the Premiership.

I've no idea how you expect me to respond Paul. You answer my point by telling myself about your personal feelings as a Rovers fan. Fine...but why quote my point then ignore it to just tell me about your own disillusionment? Figures don't back it up. Football is dying on its arse? Tell that to all the new Wigan fans flocking to the JJB, tell that to the United fans who (despite Glazier taking over the club) still number 70,000 strong each home match. The article in the Guardian is interesting and prescient yet is still ultimately an opportunistic piece which is being penned on the back of the Ashes tour. It's the kind of thing that crops up whenever another sport gets a bit of limelight, similar thinkpiece articles abounded about the time of our Rugby World Cup win. Using Rovers as an example of why football is dying is a bit like using Wigan (which I did above !) as an example of why it is in robust health. If you look at the bigger picture...the attendances have been sustainedly increasing for years. Football isnt dying on its arse...it probably deserves to I agree fully and I also concur completely with your feelings of apathy towards the sport but it isnt dying. It's not perfect at the moment but then it never has been. Whatever the nostalgic oldies may say.

There's no way I could actually see a democracy working in China...it is such a huge country with supposedly 1.3billion people (although the actual figure could be anything up to three or even four hundred million more) that it is hard to envision wide-ranging democractic reforms taking place without leading to divisions that don't exist yet. I'd guess to say that most Chinese aren't bothered about democracy...it's taken many years of repression but now the population generally trusts the Chinese Communist Party (CCP) to adminster reforms to help the people. While this has lead to much corruption it does mean that long-term projects can be pursued by the government. The downside is that many people may suffer but on the upside...utilitarianism comes into play and it can work as the greatest good for the greatest number. An example is the colossal Three Gorges dam being constructed on the Yangtze River, the largest dam in the world. It means a terrible environmental cost will be reaped and millions of farmers have to be forcibly relocated but...it will provide desperately needed power for a huge region of central China. In the UK...I could never see this being passed. China certainly does not have anything like an ideal system - a perusal of human rights sites proves that. Yet...it works in its own way...and proves that democracy is not the only way. Indeed, it's not close to being always the best way. China may not have the personal freedoms of the UK...but it's a damn sight safer place to walk down the street at night. It will be the next superpower in time...of that there is no doubt. Economists are predicting 2020 as the year China overtakes the USA as the largest economy in the world. I'm not sure that would happen if it was opened to democratic reforms too quickly...a problem with democracy is that it can polarise and lead to tribalism. A one-party system at least avoids that. On another note...the Chinese government has no worries about cracking down hard on terrorist attacks that have taken place in the more remote, sparsely populated areas of the West of the country. No messing about with bills through government. It's not a price I'd like the UK to have to pay because of terrorists...but it works.

Football isn't dying on its arse at all though...because as the writer says football fans are idiots. Spurs are charging seventy quid a game this season but will they find no takers? Will the heck...the fans will still want to see the big games. They are a captive market. Some people seem to be mentioning Rovers as a good example but in reality if you look dispassionately at our club we are a rather unique case thanks to Jack Walker and the size of our stadium prohibiting any kind of 'must get a ticket quick or I can't go' buzz. The only way football will die on its arse is when fans stop shelling out. It isn't happening yet. Even the example of Newcastle failing to sell out their season ticket allocation (if true) is scarcely relevant as that is in itself more due to failures on the pitch and in the boardroom than with any necessary example of supporter apathy in the club itself. As the reporter states, football fans are idiots...at least, those paying seventy quid a ticket at White Hart Lane or 1800quid a season ticket at Highbury are but...hey...it's their money. A fool is easily parted...

People don't generally vote governments out due to their foreign policy alone. If they think they will be better off financially under Labour they are likely to vote for them. Moan about Iraq all they like but most people will put their own pocket first.

Surely those could be laid at the door of a more secular state of society than 'Christianity'? While religious morality is all well and good as a backbone to a society, too heavy a theocratic leaning of any state serves to hold back progress. Your post seems to compare countries heavily influenced by Islamic government with those previously Christian countries that now have a secular system. It's debatable just how much credit Christianity on its own can take for that.

I'd be happy enough to see the likes of Douglas Hall and Fat Freddie Shepherd getting their just desserts but even if Souness fails and even if they are eventually forced out then they will still walk away from the club with tens of millions in their bank accounts. Sometimes there is no justice in football, shown by managers with average records getting plum jobs, such as Peter Reid. Sacked from his last three jobs and still being linked with more... A player of ours who I was happy to see getting what he deserves was Garry Flitcoft. Cheating on your wife with a nanny and a lapdancer is one thing but spending a fortune on trying to gag the papers from telling the truth is another thing. I'm glad he lost and that he spent plenty of money for nothing. After having a very lavish lifestyle heavily funded by the money generated by football in the media, he should have learned to take the rough with the smooth and hold his hands up and admitted he was a naughty boy. Flitty didn't do that and ended up looking like a laughing stock...and rightly so. If he'd not tried to block the story barely anyone would have remembered such a minor story, so it's his own damn fault.

You lost 3-0 in Montevideo and 20-17 in Sydney. Different sports...but they mattered all the same...

There is a wonderful word from the German language that has seeped into English; schadenfreude. It means to derive pleasure from the misfortunes of others. It's not particularly nice to see someone fail and enjoy it but hey...we are all human. Sometimes people fall on hard times and instead of feeling sorry for them I actually think...sod it, they shouldn't have been such an arse in the first place. After reading about how poor a club on every level we apparently were from some Everton fans when signing Barry Ferguson and, more recently, Craig Bellamy from under their noses I was quite pleased to see them paired with the dangerous Spanish side Villareal in the qualifiers for the Champions League. It'd allow me a bit of schadenfreude to see them not reach their precious Champions League after all their boasting. In fact, usually I'd wish a team in their position well but...sod 'em, arrogant 'big club' rubbish who have been in the shadow of their neighbours for so long that the locals actually physically grow chips on their shoulders during their childhood. For some of the reactions from Everton fans to our signing Bellamy there is some to have a go at here. Mind I do still have a bit of a soft spot for them still, they are a grand old club with a nice old stadium, albeit with a seriously rubbish away end. So I will reserve my wrath for other idiots in football. So...who would you like to see get their comeuppance? Not in a nasty way or anything...but...some people in football are idiots and deserve to have the smug grin wiped off their face. I'll get the ball rolling with an example of a person who, frankly, is getting just what they deserve... 1. Bojan Djordjic Who?!? In case you didn't know this is a young player who had excellent potential. Drafted into United's youth setup and playing for Swedish national youth teams, Bojan had the world at his feet. Unfortunately I have to conclude that he also has his bottom where his mouth should be as that is most plausible reason I can think of for what he talks so much sh1te. After failing at Man Utd and being farmed out to Rangers Bojan decided to make a name for himself during the protracted Barry Ferguson transfer saga in January by shoving his two penn'orth worth, or two krona maybe as he's Swedish. So Bojan decided to deride Blackburn in print...I never understood why he went from Rangers to Blackburn in the first place,” said Bojan Djordjic, colourfully, when asked about Ferguson. “Nothing against Blackburn Rovers, but you don’t leave Ibrox for Ewood Park. I don’t know if you have been to Blackburn but it’s not New York.” To be fair Blackburn wasn't New York last time I checked but even so it isn't nice to attack a place where people live. Unless it's Burnley. As for leaving Ibrox for Ewood...Tugay and Amoruso obviously weren't informed...so where do you leave Ibrox for Bojan, do tell.... Plymouth. Bojan has been such a success at Ibrox that they have cast him off and he has ended up at a team that struggled last year in the second tier, a whole league below little old Rovers. Hope Bojan likes Crown Green Bowling down there...in case nobody has told him, Plymouth ain't much like New York either.... Bitter me? Abso-bloody-lutely Anyone else in football you feel should get what they deserve and why? Oh and I do realise that many Rovers fans a year ago would probably have had Savage and Bellamy down on the list!

It depends if it would be better to use something recent or try to find a "club song" to identify ourselves with. The second option works best for the likes of Liverpool and Celtic with 'You'll never walk alone' or West Ham with 'Forever Blowing Bubbles' (feel free to insert blindingly obvious Michael Jackson joke here if you wish) but Rovers seem closest to...er...'The Final Countdown' which may well be fine as far as cheesy Cock Rock tunes go but has nothing really to do with the club. A better alternative would be either 'The Wild Rover' as it should at least get the crowd singing (albeit about Burnley). Otherwise something more modern - must be fast-paced though, something to get the blood pumping and the crowd excited, at least until they sit down again and start singing 'Get into 'em'. 'Born Slippy' is a good choice by Leeds.

Quite recently those anacrohnisms were amended (actually think they were for acts of High Treason and relating to Piracy on the high seas which would also relate to the naval yards ashore) and there is now no offence that carries the death penalty in the UK.

Televised games almost always seem to knock off a few thousand from our gates, some even more than that. As we are on the TV qute a bit less for this first half of the season expect that to improve attendance figures by itself, not by great numbers but certainly enough to counter the threat of Wigan getting larger average gates than us. Out of interest did Scotty ever get his money for that Everton bet?

It seems that Liverpool are likely to be facing the only team who Rovers have ever knocked out in Europe, CSKA Sofia, so long as the second leg games provide no great surprises. As for Everton...their supporters have been whining on all close-season about how they are looking forward to being a big club again now they have qualified for the Champions League. They were disgusted by Bellamy's move to Rovers as it showed his lack of ambition at choosing a little club like Rovers over the chance to play in the Champions League for Everton. Two problems with that... 1. Everton are not in the Champions League. They have merely reached the third qualifying round and the big money only really starts pouring in when the league stage is reached and a further six (at least) games are guaranteed. 2. They have now been drawn against Villareal, the team which finished third in La Liga last season. Similarly upstarts like Everton in reaching their first shot at the Champions League. Yet Villareal finished last season superbly whereas Everton at times were seen staggering towards the finishing line of fourth, fortunately the Liverpool nag seemed to pull up injured and didn't offer much of a challenge at the last few hurdles. Although Everton are a great club with a long, successful tradition I must admit I didn't like the way that some of their fans looked down on us during the Bellamy saga. It's also happened before when we bought Ferguson and when we have been linked for similar players. They seem to have a similar inferiority complex to the Birmingham fans as only the second most successful club in their city, particularly in recent times. So they in turn decide to look down on other clubs. Shame as they are a grand old club that some of their fans have to act all uppity. Regardless...Everton face a very tough task to qualify. Moyes needs his players to pull off two more great performances to cap off their fairytale year.

Let's be honest...most people wouldn't care. Season ticket holders are likely to be going to at the very least nineteen home games in any one season so they aren't likely to be too bothered about a home game against a foreign team that very few of them will know much more than the basics about. If Rovers are getting paid to play away from home in pre-season then why bother with a home game which could actually lose them money. How many people do they need to attend such a game at Ewood to break even? The games against the likes of Everton, PSV and Lazio didn't bring out large crowds so far as I remember so Espanyol won't have much chance. A team that is dwarfed by its neighbours at the Nou Camp. When we played them at Ewood and our manager scored the winner with an overhead kick (IIRC) then it wasn't that big a crowd either. If the fans don't come out for Barcelona's world famous giants of a team they won't bother for their lesser known neighbours. So...why bother with a home friendly? The fans aren't that bothered if the crowds are anything to go by and the money doesn't seem to be pouring in either. Added to that is diluting the anticipation of the first home league game slightly, it'd be more of a build-up to have people away from the ground until that first match when they'd be chomping at the bit to return. The pre-season games at Preston, Blackpool and, this year, Grimsby seem much more of interest to the fans than a half-deserted Ewood. So, other than having a trial run of staff and ground for the first Premiership game, then why have the home friendlies at all?

Although harsh, that is a very good point. For a season under Robson they seemed to have lost whatever momentum they had and ended up losing to Partizan Belgarde (after all the hard work had been done) in a Champions League qualifier and once again losing when it mattered most; against Liverpool for a Champions League which eventually ended with Liverpool lifting the damn thing. Robson's side had stalled, or more accurately, even gone backward a little bit. Regardless of that though, there is no way that they should have sacked him so early in the season. Football history is full of many examples of how patience in a quality manager (like Robson) is ultimately rewarded after some trials and tribulations by success. The Newcastle board are too short-sighted to realise this however and the now regular firings of managers in the very-very-early stages of the season (Dalglish, Gullit, Robson and maybe Souness to follow) are indicative actions of a management regime which knows not what it does. If Newcastle are ever to fulfill their potential then they must start clearing out the dead wood...that dead wood sits smoking cigars in the boardroom and has done for years.

I fear the chop - Souey Souness seems to be getting his excuses in early and making sure he dampens any expectations around the Toon, thereby attempting to make his job easier. No doubt a slight (and long overdue) increase in fortunes for the Barcodes will be heralded as a success by our former manager, recalling days when survival was the priority...this after finishing sixth and receiving 20million+ on transfer fees. Souness seems to have taken on a huge challenge and is now setting about reducing expectation. Not good enough for the Geordies that Graeme, may have worked here but... "If I last another 12 months in this job I will have done well," It's kind of bizarre watching a guy in his fifties refusing to learn from his mistakes. Souness has some of the qualities needed to be a great manager; desire, tenacity, spirit, pig-headedness. Yet he is his own worst enemy and seems to destroy whatever team spirit and drive he instills. Without someone to measure himself up to (be it a player, referee etc) he seems lost. Probably why he has assure himself that he has "got to be strong and be my own man"...the daft old fiftysomething still thinks he is in the playground. Still have mixed feelings about Souness, he got us automatically promoted to the top flight which not even Kenny could manage despite throwing Jack's money around. When are we next to have a day to compare to Cardiff 2002? A decade? Two? Shame the guy totally lost it sometime along the way... EDIT - Actually there is another interesting article on the football365 website, this time by Andy Gray, in which the subject of reacting to supporter expectation. Gray suggests that David O'Leary should talk up his side a bit more rather than just waffling on about safety. About fans, Gray says "They want to be told that the club has ambition. They do not want to be told that the manager thinks that staying up or finishing in mid-table will be a successful season. They want to hear upbeat noises and positive energy, not negative vibes designed to keep expectations in check." Sounds good to me, although Villa fans may have slightly higher expectations than ours have as they really do think they are a 'BIG' club. Problem is...if you build up expectations then maybe you just damn well deliver. Still, I would rather have heard that than comments from Souness' preference for eating out on a Thursday night rather than having Rovers play in the Uefa Cup. 'Be A Bit More Like Jose, Mr O'Leary'

Since when we've dropped nine places (along with the equivalent prize money) and lost a few thousand season ticket holders along the way. We were also in the Uefa Cup that season (albeit not for long but a full house and TV against Celtic can't have hurt) as well as reaching the semi finals of the League Cup, with a couple of full houses against Man Utd. Has our turnover, under the stewardship of Williams, actually decreased in the last few seasons? philipl - why did you say that AESF's questions have already been answered when you could in fact only respond to them with speculation? AESF asked if Williams had seen his salary rise by talking about his relative pay to other Premiership CEOs. Maybe of interest but still tangential. AESF asked if Coar had received a payrise and you responded about only Williams and Finn being paid members of the board. Not what AESF asked, so what does Coar get from his service to Rovers? Does this means he works for free? Am I wrong to wonder if Coar actually made a fortune through the rebuilding of Ewood? Is this his philanthropic service to the people of Blackburn? To his question five you answer "probably", which means three of his five questions are not answered, making a nonsense of your "most answers are already available on this MB" as I certainly haven't seen them answered elsewhere on here. If they are to receive pay rises at a time of falling league performances of the last two seasons and lower gates. While we may have finished fifteenth twice we did in fact attain less points this season. I'm also unsure about your praise of Coar...you are essentially saying he did a good job by doing bugger all? As for receiving credit from the footballing authorities...that is generally related to longevity rather than necessary talent. As explained further in Simon Inglis' excellent book on the history of the Football League. While I'm not anti-Wiliams at all I still believe they if they are to receive the praise when we improve then they should also have to shoulder the criticism when when we go backwards. Why two finishes of fifteenth should be rewarded with a "well-deserved rise" I'm not so sure. philipl - You have more of a business mind than I do so if you can explain why our new Chairman receives a rise when the club seems to be performing worse than in previous years then I will be grateful but I don't understand it just now.

Nothing disrespectful about noticing we don't live in England so you're ok there! Doesn't really matter though...I'd personally rather the ground wasn't renamed. Unless we were offered shedloads of money that is... Besides we could just say that we still play at Ewood Park in the 'Air Jordan' Stadium or whatever. It's not ideal obviously but...money talks, especially in this league.

EIT - I'd agree with your reasoning if there was actually any point in renaming the stadium. Could we actually attract any company to pay decent money for it? There is no point getting a sponsor just for the hell of it, we need money. If we can attract the right kind of high-profile sponsor willing to be "committed" as you say then all well and good but it's getting, assessing and then attracting the right willing and generous enough sponsor that is the problem. You say there must be many family-oriented companies that would be interested but I can't think of any that would necessarily wish to be associated with us in particular. Mind you, it's not our job to make Rovers a respectable investment proposition I guess, it's that of the new 'slimline' board. No way should we be rebranding a ground known as Ewood Park since 1882 as 'The Ginsters Cheese & Onion Slice' Stadium or whatever for half of one week of Craig Bellamy's (or whoever's) wages. The sponsor has to be both right and they have to want to invest plenty in the club. An example of a perfect combination of sponsor and club are Bolton Wanderers and Reebok. A local company (or at least one which did have local roots) and the two have been connected for well over a decade now if I recall correctly. Surely the board have been searching for this kind of sponsor for years? Can't see them just suddenly having success in finding one now. So I'd expect it all be as 'as you were' for at least the near future.

Long-term goal for the Independent Supporters Association = getting a member onto the board? It's happened at other clubs. What better way to get the opinions of the fans across to the club?

Are there any actual sources suggesting Whelan would ever have been prepared to invest in Rovers? It's always seemed a bit of an urban myth to me. Why would Whelan be accapting of a no-mark backstage role when his history in business seems to revolve around him being the driving source? I'm interested to know if there was ever that chance or whether this is just wistful/wishful thinking.

So we don't actually have a CEO anymore? Will the buck stop with the chairman now? Anyone know if this will affect Coar getting onto the Premier League Chairman Panel (or whatever it is)? Maybe philipl, Jan or anyone else who knows about these things can tell us whether this will actually make much difference.