Our chicken advert was less embarrassing than that

Hoffman goal certainly makes me feel better after seeing his Kanu-esque miss!

Four Four Two agree that we've got a tough start! https://www.fourfourtwo.com/features/championship-fixtures-released-efl-first-10-games-toughest-hardest-easiest-opening-matches

Young lad from PNE?

We got Robbo after a similar run, if I recall. Ended up being a good investment for us, but it took him a while to get the errors out of his game (the contrast with 8 years of Brad probably didn't help him either). Sometimes a change of scene can make all the difference though. Gomes at Spurs looked like he'd never kept goal in his life - goes to Watford and he turns into a different player.

It was uncannily like the Enckelman error in fairness. Also makes you think how much a good singing Peter Enckelmen would be in our current situation!

Big caveat to this is that most of those metrics are hugely influenced by both the quality of the league and that Gent were one of the top dogs. Not a criticism though, love that you put these together!

Think that's right, the little whisperings of information we get, whilst appreciated aren't helping with calming the nerves either. I think we've got about 70% of a very decent team at this level, it just so happens that the 30% we don't have leave holes that are so big that they undermine everything else. As @Wing Wizard Windy Miller puts it, Cunningham, Westwood & a decent centre half and the perspective completely changes.

On the Westwood link (if that's was ever real) there's a lot of talk about compromise on wages scuppering it. Might be true, but perhaps length of contract is going to be an important factor. Clearly he's not going to get anything like the same terms once his contract expires in 12 months, but 2 years at Rovers on a decent wedge (albeit much lower than the 30k he's on) could make a deal much more attractive.

It can go both ways with relegated teams, to be sure. I think I'm thinking back to when we were relegated in 2012, we were picking up good results at the start through teams giving us a bit too much respect & some moments of quality from the players who were up to it; MGP, Rhodes, Gomes etc. Obviously in a couple of months other teams had us sussed & we'd reverted to type! Strange being so gloomy seeing as I think I'd normally be seen a bit happy-clapperish, but I'm a bit taken aback by how many fixtures I'm looking at and thinking they're really tough ones on paper. Hopefully nothing that a brew, goalkeeper and centre half won't solve!

Not sure why we're waiting until Monday if it's reached the point where he's having a medical, but I suppose I shouldn't complain if we're signing an actual grown up goalkeeper.

Hate playing recently relegated/promoted teams that early. Tricky couple of months to navigate before the fixtures get more normal.

Me too in fairness, although reading between the lines it looks as though there's more competition for Marshall than there is for Westwood.

Seems to have been frozen out at Hillsborough originally for non-footballing reasons. If he's at the same level now as he was a couple of years ago, could be a very shrewd signing.

Completely fair enough, and Gally & Brereton have been gambles we haven't been able to afford on their showings so far. My point is that turning the 2.5 million or whatever it was on Dack & Arma into worth about 10 times that is Hughes-esque & exactly what we need for a club in our position, and not making profits (yet - important point when some are well placed to improve) on some of the other players we've paid 50k, 100k, 200k for is acceptable in that context.

I wouldn't want to argue that Mowbray's record is any better than mixed, but not sure that's the best way of measuring success and failure. Spending a few hundred grand on the L1 players did it's job as we got promoted first time. Others could easily fetch a decent profit a year or two down the line. How much would we have got for Armstrong last year? Small profit maybe, but much less than what we should expect now. Nothing to say that Davenport or Rothwell (accept that he's not as young as Armstrong) could put millions on their value after a strong 6 months. Put another way, I don't think the players brought in from Big Sam or Souness would have delivered profits given how much they spent and the age of some of their better signings. TM's successes easily pay for our cash buys which are almost all very small beer apart from the two big exceptions in Brereton & Gally. Obviously they're a different kettle of fish.

Thanks for this Kamy, I don't suppose you've any idea about the Cat. 1 academy fits into this do you?

Not great memories for me! I'm from the Wigan/Standish area so I'd gotten used to seeing Rovers impose our effortless superiority in my most local away game (the Ince 3-0 being an anomaly at that stage!). Coming from 3-0 down to 3-3 was amazing, only for a disgraceful bit of play acting from Ryan Taylor to get Emerton sent off, and at least one offside goal from Marcus Bent take away from one of the great comebacks. I don't even like seeing the Roque Santa hat thing because it reminds me of the rest of the game!

Never mind late thirties, he looks about 90 in some of those snaps! No wonder Noble thought he could run him ragged.

Broadly agree with that, but equally if you're stockpiling 6 or 7 central defenders, you start to ask why this is the lad they've chosen to get rid of. The examples you mention are all fair and there are countless others; O'Connell and Judge not getting a fair chance here, Rudy & Conway arriving for peanuts etc. I'd definitely still take him but being frozen out of Stoke's team does worry me.

I'm slightly wary about getting Lindsay, seeing as Stoke clearly don't rate him. Even so I don't think anyone at Stoke could possibly think that they can say that he's surplus to requirements after one season and at the same time expect to get the same money that they paid.

To be honest I think this is where we get the most out of Evans. His worst spells in a Rovers shirt have been when we've played 4-4-2 and he was expected to get forward a little more. Never really had the legs to do both and games just passed him by. Travis is a different kettle of fish. Has the legs to contribute further up the pitch and still do his defensive work.

Don't know enough about Souttar to have a reasoned opinion about whether or not we should go for him, but at 6"6 he has at least on advantage over the other young lads we have in that position.

Tried and tested managers not the order of the day, it seems. Sure some of these left field choices will pay off, but it makes for a very unpredictable season.

Spoke about Van der Hoorn a few pages back - would be quality but I'm not convinced that he fancies the championship. Dunkley's a decent shout on a free, albeit a downgrade on Tosin.