Just to stop this topic all too hurriedly departing once again, I'll also recommend 'The Year of the death of Ricardo Reis' by Nobel Prize winning Portugese writer Jose Saramango. An excellent, erudite read that I probably didn't even fully understand because of my lack of knowledge of Portugese history (it is set in the mid-thirties).

Douglas is way down the pecking order...although he has two more years on his contract so might be with us for some time yet.

Lampard is having a pop at Sven now... Too little too late? Why not complain before the World Cup rather than after? Frank's damning Sven verdict

Oh wait...maybe I was thinking of Berwick Rangers, Gretna is just over the border isn't it? Well...maybe we could stand on a hill in England and watch over the border like all those used to watch the games at Ewood on the hill behind the Blackburn End/Riverside.

Remembering our record in Europe...all of them. Actually, remembering our record in Europe, I'm not too confident against any of the teams below us either!

Gretna have been drawn against Derry City of Ireland (although I think they are actually in the Northern Ireland and thus the UK but play in the Irish league because of trouble at games in the past I think?!?) so being drawn against the winner of that might make a good day out for the fans without having to book flights or, in Gretna's case, even leave England. We really should win that too but never there is never an easy game in Europe when it comes to Rovers...

Couldn't agree less, it's the weakest it has been since I can remember and it wasn't a strong league last year. Not one side in that division would do anything but come back down again, except for Birmingham, even Leeds wouldn't be able to spend much if they got back up. Birmingham should come back up comfortably, if not...bye bye Brucie. And rightly so too!

I agree with all that. We may not have replaced the quality of Bellamy with anyone to match him but with Benni and Roberts brought in we have, overall, a better frontline. Bellamy's influence is being slightly overrated on here. Excellent for us yes but from what some on here are saying about him they seem to believe we were a one-man team last year. We weren't.

It is a pretty easy read though despite the length. As I said, I preferred Tai-Pan but that may have been due to having actually been in Hong Kong when I read it which meant I could actually see some of the locations he described. Mind you, they had obviously been transformed in the 160 or so years since the time in which the book was set. Also read recently 'The Beautiful and Damned' by F. Scott Fitzgerald which I liked but certainly not his best. Maybe a bit literary for a holiday read however... As well as that there was 'A Star Called Henry' as I continued reading Roddy Doyle, it is probably the worst of his books that I have read but even so that makes it only average compared to other writers. The character of Henry Smart is, however, a joke and some of his escapes from the Brits are detached from reality. A disappointment from a great novelist. If you haven't read any of his work I'd suggest 'Paddy Clarke hahaha', a moving tale and a great read, not to mention being a thoroughly deserved winner of the Booker Prize.

I'm reading 'Gai-Jin' by James Clavell at the moment. It's part of his Asian sextext (oo-er!) of novels with also includes Shogun and Tai-Pan, the two of his other books I have read. They are rollockingly good reads and interesting from historical viewpoints. Apparentlt quite a bit of what he wrote isn't too authentic (mangling languages, anachronisms etc) but I think they are still pretty impressive as they pack in so much detail and description. Characters are a bit thin and some stilted conversations happen but, all in all, they are good holiday reads. I'd probably recommmend reading Shogun first however (which is set the longest time ago) and Tai-Pan (which is the best of his that I have read).

'The Rule of Four' is another book trying to benefit from the Da Vinci craze but is utterly, utterly awful and I had to stop reading after a hundred or so pages, something I rarely do and for only the most tedious of books. I've also been reading 'The Bush Dyslexicon' by Mark Crispin Miller which is a few years old (it predates the September 11th attack) but interesting in debating the intelligence and slips of America's man with his finger on the button. An interesting read and leaves little doubt where the sympathies of Bush lie - with nepotism and big business, which is after all what got him elected despite apparently receiving less votes in Florida than Gore. Although retaining a liking for malapropisms and comic gaffes, Bush appears as a clever and ruthless political animal. Recommended.

Hey! What about us? Bryan was right...what a badge-whore!

I'm disappointed so few seem to remember this (and worried that it means I must be getting on...)... Spoilt you lot with your (incredibly short but ah well...) European Campaigns, Premierships (well, the one) and meaningful cup campaigns...!

Err...yep! Read it completely wrong sorry philipl. My fault! I'm, as they say in Chinese...feihua!* * = rubbish!

In answer to your speculations I can only say to look at how Fiorentina recovered. As a club they are nothing compared to Juve yet their resurrection was irresistable. Mind you...they did seem to get a wee bit of help thanks to handing out the lire... Nope sorry that is up there with your prediction for United to finish fifth last season...strange you resurrected the Bellamy thread to prove yourself right a year on yet not that prediction league eh? EDIT - If it's any consolation I'm rubbish at all predictions!

If anyone wants to back our new signing with money try here for the Top Goalscorer Odds for next season. 100/1! The eternally optimistic could even have a flutter on Franny Jeffers...150/1.

Even with some outgoing players it is likely Juve would still be by far the strongest team in the league and certainly head and shoulders above this season's champions Atalanta. They wouldn't be relegated but promotion would be tough...albeit not impossible. As a forty-two game season, last season Juve would have needed at least 108 points to be automiatically promoted (Catania were promoted as runners-up with 78 points) however the play-offs feature the sides that finish in 3rd to 6th place. The sixth place finisher last year was Cesena with 66 points, meaning Juve would need 96 points if we are to judge by the last season. They'll be dumping players if this ruling sticks but they are still likely to get over 100 points I'd wager... ...however, I'd also wager that on appeal some things will change. Whether for harsher punishment or more lenient we shall see!

Why is Parker funny? A class act.

Think he is trying to build up the achievement while also saying we could do even better. However...if he remains our "number one striker" then we won't...he's a decent signing but to be challenging regularly for European places you really need something more than just a big bruiser up front. Bellamy still hasn't been replaced, Roberts seems more like a replacement for Dickov. Albeit with quite a few extra inches...at least we won't have the smallest attack in the division anymore next season.

Italy have just appointed Roberto Donadoni, with little previous managerial experience, to replace Marcello Lippi. Why? Well...he's a good coach that's why. It's also what is usually said about Stevie Mac.. ...mind you, didn't they use to say that about Brian Kidd as well?

Do you have any more info on them Phil? To be fair there have been a few...Bent, Johnson, Nugent, the ever-reliable wishes for Dunn and Beattie to return...but generally the prices are prohibitive. How relevant is managing a club side compared to coaching the national team? Jurgen Klinsmann just took Germany to third with no previous club experiece and Beckenbauer won the thing without having managed a club side if I recall correctly, although I believe he did manage Bayern afterwards. Plenty of excellent club managers have fallen on their faces when in charge of a national team. It may be that this is what McClaren is perfectly suited for... ...well, we have to hope don't we?

Yep...thankfully we ended up with Hodgson as manager. Oh...wait a minute...

Seems like they are queueing up to put the boot in... ...bit late now guys...who did anything about it at the time? Guess the true story of really happened during the Northern Ireland game will come out soon. Beckham was very, very quick in announcing his retirement from the captaincy. The very day after. At the time I thought it was just more attention-seeking (added to his crying in the stands the day before) but maybe he knows that without his no.1 supporter Sven he will not be in a strong position anymore? Owen leads the way as players lay into Sven One question...is Steve McLaren really the man to sort out this mess?

Wahoo! I'm the man!

Cannavaro has been peerless, despite not having Nesta next to him. A truly great defender in the old Italian no-nonsense stopper style.