I'd agree with that. De Pedro was a funny one too. A great motivator, agressive on the football pitch which was good because we were an attacking side. But he was not full of ideas when plan A didn't work (thats here, Liverpool and Newcastle). He tried a variety of tactics and the only one that worked was the diamond formation he used in 2004. He liked to spend his way out of trouble generally speaking which wouldn't be much use to us now! Overall a good manager but, although Hughes hasn't won any trophies (yet), not on a par with the Welshman in my opinion. But then I guess if we start next year terribly everyone will have a different opinion about Sparky.

Just shows how much talent is wasted in the Premiership. Rovers would take six or seven of those players in a shot. A lot of them are used badly by their clubs and not looked after. I wonder if Bellamy feels that a move back to Rovers would have been a wiser choice.

I would say we could easly get 1m for Mokoena although I think 2m is a stretch. No one in the Prem would be interested in him as anything more than a squad player. The Championship do not have any money. 1m would be good business though. i am excited about Vogel because he allows us to rotate the midfield. Particularly it could allow Dunn to have a crack at left wing and put some pressure on Pedersen. Vogel is a tidy player so pairing him up with Reid could make things quite solid and energetic in the middle of the park, giving Bentley and Dunn good freedom to get forward. One of those buys that could turn out extremely well for us. We should however be looking for a central midfielder in the summer too though.

THeres something vaguely amusing about the thought of a bunch of 50 year olds pileing into each other...

I usually disagree with AESF on most things - and that piece he wrote is more than a little hysterical - but I think he is right about Hughes. First off he shouldn't have been released early - he killed somebody - and secondly he shouldn't play a high profile sport like football after leaving prison. You should pay for your mistakes. I am all for rehabilitation but it just seems a bit perverse that he is now out playing in front of thousands. By all means let him rebuild his life, but not so soon in the public eye.

Ooijer is the sort of player i could see doing well for us for a number of seasons, as long as he is played at centre back alongside another defender with pace. I doubt he will offer much more than cover at right back next season though, so we probabaly need to strengthen there. If Nelsen can recover we are looking at an outstanding array of centre back options: Nelsen, Samba, Ooijer and Zurab. That is pretty impressive. Shame we have the injury problems.

I just wouldn't agree with that. He is a much more consistent defender than bentley or Dunn. He gets his foot in and closes players right down. What will be interesting is that if Pedersen has more licence to get forward Warnock might struggle a bit. He is a very attacking full back so may find the change of approach difficult. One other thing that is worth considering also is that bolton are not a great attacking team post Anelka, and we were at home, so we could afford to throw players forward. It will be interesting to see how Pedersen plays against a decent right winger like Milner, albeit with a rubbish defence behind him.

Thats got to be nonsense. We can't afford it, nor would we want to pay it. I guess the agents angle will be there are some lunatics in the league (I'm thinking Newcastle and West Ham) who might pay that sort of money so he could move on there. In order to do so he would have to turn out some decent performances though. I can see the argument for extending Benni's contract (although not increasing his money). Just cannot fathom why we would increase Pedersen's salary- I would confidently back Hughes to find someone who brings as much to the team for 4m or less.

On overall effectiveness which would people go for out of: a: Gamst---Dunn---Reid---Bentley or b: Dunn-------------Reid---Bentley ---------Mokoena or c: Dunn---Tugay---Reid---Bentley I find it hard to pick one. I guess I would go for c considering we have so few games now that Toogs can get a proper rest between them. Hopefuly Reid's fitness improving will allow him to cover the aging Turk too aswell.

Considering Petrov is a cut above virtually every left winger in the Premiership I'm not sure thats true. How many decent left wingers are there in the the Prem? I can't think of too many at clubs at our level or below. From the perspective of the next few games it might be worth giving Dunn an extended run at the Left midfield spot apart from the problem of how we are going to cover central midfield...

I think Sparky actually has been looking actively to get a player in who can take Pedesen's place: Koumas, Dembele and now Fortune are all left sided midfielders. Its such a shame as if he had a decent run of form we would be a very dangerous side, but we almost utterly rely on Bentley at the moment to provide.I won't be suprised if he drops down a division come the summer.

:lol: That has to be the luckiest escape we have had. Not sure how we were hard done by. McCarthy going down wasn't a penalty. To be fair this season we have had a lot more decisions go our way than against. It might be down to the way Hughes has handled the media to place pressure on the referees when we play them.

My point is we can't do that till the summer. As we only have three round pegs and an axe we are going to have to compramise at some point probably starting with next weekend. Dunn and Pedersen are both suspended...

Our neatest player through the middle at the moment is McCarthy. In light of the fact we have no central midfield I might be tempted to play a line like this if Dunn needs to come off early in a game again, or even just to try something different. ----------Cruz------Roberts Pedersen----------McCarthy------Bentley ---------------Reid Warnock---Samba---Ooijer---Emerton ---------------------Freidal If McCarthy shows the sort of work rate he did against Everton this could not expose us too much defensively. Also out lack of options is such that we need to make the most of what we have (which is lots of strikers and few midfielders!) Benni has the ability to pick a pass and draw out the opponenets defence.

He has been for ages! Only serios target on this front so far has been Huddlestone I think. Ramos seems to like him a lot (played him both in midifeld and defence) so he won't be coming here.

That will depend on wether Ooijer plays right back or not...

Well I think he is a high qulaity player, but my point was he is exactly the sort of player we dont need at the moment.

Put this in the intetoto thread which I think is the wrong one... Why I think we are getting pasted: The fact that Coventry felt capable of playing three up front yesterday suggests that how to hurt us is now widely understood to anyone who studies the tapes of our previous ten or so games. Our defence is very exposed, we play two very attacking full backs and our central midifeld provides little protection due to players being injured (Reid) lack pace (Tugay and Dunn) or just average (Axe). Plus our key man and captain has lost two yards of pace and we play a very high defensive line when in possession. So the answer is plain that to hurt us you need to hit us on the counter with bags of speed and width. We cannot cope. I guess the way to sort it out is: 1) Buy a fast striker so we can play deeper and hit teams on the counterattack. Currently we don't stretch defences, our strikers come deep and our wide players lack the raw pace to get behind full backs, so we play a high line and try to pass through other teams. Someone who has that Bellamy ability to get into the channels would be ideal. 2) Get a good defensive minded midfielder who can protect the central defence. Currently we can't close down or cut our the ball enough. 3) Buy a right back with pace whose main priorities lie with covering the centrebacks as opposed to getting forward. We need someone who can help out and give us the solidarity we need. Warnock can continue to get well forward. 4) Get another central defender who is solid and has pace> Ver difficult but if we can it would make such a difference. And really we are sort of doing that. 1) Domi (if he is any good, which Mr E doesn't think he is) 2) Sidwell. 3) Not sure....4) Not sure either- ideally somehow getting the old Nelsen back. Signing a player like Huddlestone - who is undoubtably good and an entertainer - might not help us deal with these fundamental problems as he is not really much of a tackler nor quick. I think we have reached a tactical watershed though. Hughes will start adjusting the way we play. If we adjust our system the bg losers could be Emerton, McCarthy, Axe, Dunn, Tugay all of whom would struggle to meet the requirements

Fact is we are ninth in the Premiership and Hughes has spent virtually nothing. It was a terrible result but to be honest I can't see anyone else to have put us in a position where we are 6 points off fourth in January.

Looks like Pedersen is coming out of the woods now. Only player who had a decent performance yesterday. What is the deal with him only getting good after the winter solstice? Voodoo or something?

I suppose it depends on context. 2m compared to 2.5 for Benni or 3.5 for Rocky (or nothing for Samba and nelsen) and it seems questionable value. But 2m compaerd to the 2m Palace spent on Kuqi it seems a decent deal. As others have pointed out he is too slow to drive through the midfied a la Reid despite some brilliant skills. Can't play on the wing for the same reason. His footwork does win him a lot of space however. Only real future for him I see is either in a 451 where he can get well forward without leaving us exposed or trying to sit deeper in a 442 (as he did in the paring with Savage) and spread the ball around. However while his passing is good you have to wonder whether it has the quality and nous to adequately replace Tugay in the long term. And if Sparky thinks so why were we scouting out Huddlestone? Have been very impressed with his commitment and work ethic on the defensive side of the game. Utterly transformed. For me he has been good enough for 2m and hopefully we will see more when we settle down in midfield a bit.

I can't agree with that. He has been by a distance our worst player yet he remains highly rated. It makes sense to let him go if people want to pay large amounts of money. the only downer is, as he is left fotted, it will be hard to replace him. I am a big fan of him on form, but we have been carrying him for ages.

I am completely behind hughes but I think it is well worth pointing out that in 2003 we had an outstanding squad who had finished sixth and run the top four close. Dunn, Duff, Short, Gresko, Thompson, Cole, Berg, Yorke (who had a very good season 2002/2003), Neill, and (of course) Freidal and Tugay. You could actually easily argue that Hughs has not actually achieved anymore than Souness has yet. By the start of 2004 those same players(with three notable losses in Dunn, Berg and Duff and some less notable additions) were considered absolutely shambolic. Of course poor dealtings in the market were part of it but also a squad that had been largely excellent was now largely poor. Why? It is hard to exactly say. My only point is things change lightning quick in football.

It is a bizarre situation. Touted as the best manager outside the top four by many (including in the media by people who usually don't give much coverage to Rovers) as recently aas a month ago. Then has one o fthe worst runs of four games I have ever seen essentially based on the defence collapsing. I guess the problem could be said to be that our game is very confidence driven, depending on forcing the opposition to sit back and getting the fullbacks forward. Our defence plays high up the pitch and we try to control the game. When the confidence and cohesiveness that sort of approach demands collapses we are very very vulnerable and can get hammered. And our defence has gone from looking heroic to appalling extrordinarily quickly combined wuith oiir firm from our midfield. It will be interesting to see how Hughes recovers. Maybe tme to play depper and tighter? But then we lack the pace to be threatening on the break....

I wonder what Capello will do? He obviously doesn't favour star players, he has dropped plenty of big names in his time. We could see much more emphasis on a team rather than individual performers. We are not going to get swashbuckling football however, more like solid competance which is I think very neccessary to rebuild confidence.Hopefully people will give him a while before the criticism of being too defensive starts coming out as surely it will. Although we have good players we are not Brazil or France in terms of the attacking talent available so we need to get the most of what we have and playing tight will help that. If we start producing a few more Joe Coles and Rooneys (rather than hargreaves and Carricks) over the next two years maybe we can look to be more open and offensive. Its not going to be exciting but it could prove to be very neccessary.