2 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

Achieved plenty Mercer but you do like to put some negative spin with anything regarding Rovers. So I am not going waste my time explaining things to you. Utterly pointless

 

Mowbray has said he and his recruitment team scouting him for period of time, so we knew all about him. 

Kindly tell me what tangibles have been achieved?

I take what Mowbray says with a pinch of salt.  IMO, we've barely delivered on what he said in Blues Bar back in Feb 2019 and he promised lots! 

For a start, defenders are coming, defenders are coming.........one permanent signing in Ayala!!!

We are desperate for a left back but our Euro scouting team don't appear to be able to find a left back anywhere in Europe better than Bell and bear in mind we will be far more competitive on wages than swathes of Europe.  In my eyes, what an indictment on their role.

I am not interested in, IMO, what is Mowbray's bullsh1t.  Mowbray can talk the talk but, IMO, he can't walk the walk.

Just now, philipl said:

Still had to have boots on the ground with both the Kaminski and Holtby deals. First to pick up on the vibes then be there to influence them. 

Remember Hotby's tweets about coming to Rovers?- somebody did a great job selling him on coming to Blackburn.

I an very much in the pro-Raya camp but (VERY early days) I am glad we have Kaminski

Any agent worth their salt would have been creating a lot of noise on behalf of Kaminski and Holtby.

Maybe there were not too many clubs that fancied either player.

Let's face it, according to Mowbray, we've lost at least one potential European signing to another club so perhaps you are overplaying the influence.

I think it's great we have a European resource but they need to deliver real tangible results like we've seen with the likes of Brenford and Norwich.  If and when that happens, I would be delighted.

Just now, TimmyJimmy said:

But once found we have to pay for them. Often there's the rub. Too expensive, too big a sign-on fee, too big a wage demand, too many onerous demands to be written into the contract, too high an agents fee ... so many reasons for the player not to appear in the 'signed' column and be visible to us.

The scouts job is to produce candidates, the rest is down to the realities of life. The two players to emerge from the process are good ones and IMO show the network has value and legs.

Be patient and let people do their work. Time is nature's way of stopping everything happening in one big crunch ?

If you really think Holtby and Kaminski are products of our European scouting team then I think you've been taken in by what I think is Mowbray's bullsh1t.

Mowbray and Waggott have to demonstrate to Pune that the cost of the Euro scouting team is worthwhile and if they can attribute any signing from Europe to the set up then they will do.

I hope they turn up a Samba, a Nzonzi etc soon and when they do then they really will be cutting the mustard. 

Just now, blondie said:

In regards to Kaminski's situation, presumably enough gathered info was necessary to evaluate a purchase. 

Come on, it's not rocket science!!!

Kaminski had spent the last four seasons as a number one goalkeeper in the Belgium First Division and had made about 150 appearances as number one including 15 or so in the Europa League.

IF, there had been a Premier League number one goalkeeper available who had made 150 appearances over the last four years and was available at a knockdown price following a bust up between club / player, clubs would have been all over it!

IMO, Kaminski was a 'no brainer' and not a product or 'discovery' of our European scouting team.

11 minutes ago, JoeH said:

Yes and if I didn’t have a d*ck I wouldn’t be a bloke.

Kaminski has signed, he came from Europe.

You can context it however you like but it doesn’t detract from the fact. Your “virtually nothing” is just an opinion. In terms of scores on the doors, they’ve done two. Holtby and Kaminski. 

Holtby was a 'known' player and as I recall a free agent, so I think to attribute his signing to the Euro scouting team is one helluva stretch!  I've little doubt all the spadework was done by Holtby's agent.

I've stated my views that, IMO, Kaminski was not a Euro scouting team 'find'.

I'm pretty certain most fans are looking for our Euro scouting team to find the next Berg, Samba, Nzonzi etc.  At this stage, IMO, they have simply not delivered. 

17 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

 

But it hasn't tho. to put in place such an operation takes time and money. The operation only just started in the last 12 months and when we appointed Bruno Reis as our Chief European Scout to run the scouting Europe Operation. People like yourself expect instant results instead of understanding that this European Scouting Network is here for the long term future of the club. 

So what have they achieved in 12 months?

IMO, in terms of scores on the doors, virtually nothing as I am pretty certain Kaminski was not their baby but rather a result of a club / player bust up.

5 minutes ago, RoversClitheroe said:

Long term!? It's been in place for 2 years that's pretty long term in this day and age.

What gets measured gets done.

Bottom line, IMO, is we have very little, if anything, to show for this operation.

Holtby last season was 'a known' player - you didn't need a scouting set-up for that one as his agent should have done the graft in alerting clubs to his availability.  As some poster pointed out yesterday (may even have been yourself), Gent would have circulated Kaminski's availability following the alleged club / player bust up and I do not think we would have been scouting Kaminski (undisputed first choice goalie with a Belgian 1st Division club competing in Europe) pre the alleged bust up.

'Near misses' don't count!!!

IMO, we haven't found a single European unpolished diamond within our transfer / wages' budget (which will be very competitive relative to most of Europe) and that is the acid test or bottom line.

3 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

He did. Here Mowbray on Kaminski 

https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/18688278.tony-mowbray-happy-see-european-scouting-pay-off-thomas-kaminski/

Mowbray's also been telling us since Blues Bar in Feb. 2019 that defenders are coming..........................we've made one permanent signing in Ayala!

If you want to hang your hat on every Mowbray statement then that's fine.  Personally, I take everything Mowbray and Waggott say with a pinch of salt!

At the end of the day, I assume someone in Pune asks for feedback on their recently financed European scouting set up and I would think it's quite easy for Mowbray and Waggott to point to Kaminski.

IMO, we got Kaminski more by accident than design and in no small part due to the alleged club / player bust up - without that, I think Kaminski would still be Gent's goalie and we wouldn't have got a sniff just as Wigan wouldn't have got a sniff of Mulgrew if Mowbray and Mulgrew, allegedly, hadn't had a bust up in training following our opening day defeat against Charlton where Mulgrew was captain (captain first match of the season is not indicative of a manager's plans to 'send to Wigan' within days).

You think what you want Chaddy but it's often wise to sit back and reflect with a nice glass or two of your favourite tipple!

16 minutes ago, Paul Mani said:

Hahahah - so let me get this right....we DONT sign anyone from the European network, then the manager and club are useless...we DO sign someone from the European network and it obviously must’ve fallen into our lap!? ?

Your theory about left backs and Bell is a stab in the dark at best!

You couldn’t write it...

IMO, if we were scouting Kaminski BEFORE the alleged club / player bust up, presumably our scouts are rocking up at the likes of PSG, Barcelona, Juve. Bayern and Ajax!!!!

You need to be serious - the fans aren't as naive and gullible as, IMO, Waggott, Mowbray and yourself think.

6 hours ago, Paul Mani said:

I still think a deal for Manning might happen. The guy isn’t even appearing on their bench at the moment...

Agree re the European scouting network and feel the best chance of utilising it again this window is for another keeper. Although, having watched Kaminski four times now, he looks better than Raya and Walton combined and is worth the set up on his own!

Sign one player per window at that age and level and you’re going in the right direction! 

I think you might be giving our Euro scouting set-up more credit than is due.

I think it's more likely Kaminski fell into our lap following a seemingly fall out between club / player in much the same way as we saw Mulgrew 'sent to Wigan' just hours before last summer's window closed.

Are we really scouting for players in Belgian's First Division who are regulars for their leading clubs (playing in Europe)?  Would seem out of our budget (Kaminski price arguably low due to circumstances).

My theory seems borne out by the fact that we don't appear to be able to find a left back anywhere in Europe (within our budgets) better than Bell!

We are on fire.

Confidence and momentum are everything in this league and can take you beyond your dreams.

This is a nailed-on home banker.

At 13/10 a wonderful opportunity to fill yer boots with more to be had with > 3.5 goals in the match at 5/2 (scoring for fun - 11 goals in 3 matches).

34 minutes ago, philipl said:

Terrible thing to say but the injuries are sufficiently long term that Mowbray's options are limited for the next two games which hopefully will bed this brilliant 4-3-3 system in with current personnel more firmly.

The other silver lining is Mowbray tends (not always) not to change a winning team- so carry on winning lads.

Looking at other teams in the division, perhaps Bournemouth are the only club with individuals you absolutely have to account for when setting up a team to play against them. So hopefully Mowbray won't over think the opposition and cripple Rovers in the process which he did in several matches last season.

But if you think Accie Stanley are Real Madrid..................................................

This league is wide open.

A huge test of Venky's ambition and nous.

Two, maybe three, very shrewd signings might, just might get us back into the PL providing our manager doesn't bottle it and revert to type.

Bigger tests to come.  Think Wycombe will be the whipping boys for all teams and Derby are just a shambles.  Having said that, you can only beat the opposition in front of you and 5-0 and 4-0 wins are pretty convincing.

This may well be the season which gives Venky's the opportunity (through promotion) to recoup big parts of their losses.  Waggott and Mowbray MUST get their pitch to them right.

Just now, chaddyrovers said:

who is out of our price range?

Not many in it!

2 minutes ago, Paul Mani said:

I don’t know what his kpi’s are, neither do you.

I accept that his salary is around £300kpa. Which makes sense because that is the AVERAGE salary in the Championship for a CEO. Which kind of ends your theory about his salary being ‘hugely OTT’ right?.

No it doesn't.

IMO, Waggott is not even average, in fact I think he is very, very poor.

In which case, his salary is hugely OTT.

Tell me what value you think he has added to Rovers?

10 minutes ago, Paul Mani said:

You were doing so well until you used the PM for ‘perspective’ a position that pays such a low salary as a signifier of spending the tax payers money. This is the exception to the rule.

I actually like your ideology around incentivised pay but how do you know the £319k isn’t based on salary and bonus?

Other than that, I can’t accept that £320k is excessive for a CEO running a £20m turnover business with 150ish staff? In fact I read an article on average wages in the championship during lockdown which stated the AVERAGE Chairman / CEO in the Championship earns £300k.

Tell me what you think Waggott's key strategic objectives and KPI's are?

Personally, I'm struggling to think of anything he has delivered on other than handing Mowbray and some of the players ridiculous contracts which have cost us dearly.

I would wager substantially that Waggott's base salary is very close to £300k which, IMO and professional experience, is hugely OTT for the organisation he heads up as CEO.

20 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

So the answer was no then? 

Can you tell us any names of these executive director you found?

The answer is not no - are you unable to read and understand?

I will not reveal any names of people I've dealt with on a professional basis.

26 minutes ago, Paul Mani said:

£320k pa isnt a ‘big salary’ for the CEO of an organisation turning over £15-20m a year. The expectation of that role and scale more than justifies the number.

Think you are way off the mark.

You would be surprised at relative salary levels (to Waggott's) for CEO's in 'large' companies and Rovers would not fall into that category.

The big bucks come in terms of what is known as 'executive compensation' comprising share options (typically 3 to 5 times salary levels), long term incentive plans (typically shares given to CEO's if their companies perform and meet their KPI's over a number of years - 1 to 2 times salary levels) and annual bonus (again performance related and typically 50% to 100% of base salary).

IMO, based on experience, Waggott's base salary is at least twice as much as it needs to be.  If I was calling the shots, he would be heavily incentivised to deliver on strategic objectives.

For perspective, our PM runs the UK and his salary is about £150k.  Waggott, IMO, is ridiculously overpaid.

38 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

Look at what someone posted yesterday answers the highest salary point. 

I was more than happy with Mowbray signing that contract. He done very well.here. 

Well you might very well in practice, business and commerce for 40 years and I hope you done well for yourself during that time. Have you ever within a football club structure?

I've had dealings across football clubs (and you would be surprised about some of the people I've come across / dealt with), rugby clubs (both codes) and cricket clubs.

I can tell you I've found Executive Directors / Senior Managers (across the four sports) to have a very wide range of competence and nothing surprises me at all.  

1 hour ago, Madon said:

There you go Swag, that's how you do it! 

I would buy one tomorrow and consider it a done deal for the 21/22 season. 

Indeed!

So simple and effective.

Well done PNE.

24 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

who says its Waggott?

less than 2 years left on his contract isn't a long contract Mercer

The accounts show we have four directors: Waggott, Cheston, Babu and Coar.

Three of these are 'executive' directors with, presumably, Coar the non executive director.

The cost of benefits for the three 'executive' directors in the accounts to June 2019 was a staggering £570,158 with the highest director costing £319,329 (which can only be Waggott).  So these three (not so very wise men, IMO) earn more than the Prime Minister, Chancellor of the Exchequer and Foreign Secretary put together!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

IMO, it is a scandalous waste of money on three individuals presiding over the decline of a once great football club.

As for Mowbray, he signed a new three and a half yeat contract in Nov. 2018 and if that isn't a long contract then I've been missing the point of my 40+ years in practice, business and commerce.  He should have been given a 12 month rolling contract with strong rewards for getting us back to the PL because, in reality, that's the bottom line and all that feckin matters. 

13 minutes ago, Tom said:

It’s a shame there’s no sort of financial reward or incentive to get promoted 

Waggott and Mowbray should have a basic salary with big incentives for results - the biggest one to get us to the PL.

It is a results driven business and Waggott collects his £300k pa (according to the accounts - that's the salary of the highest paid director) irrespective, IMO, of how he performs and he's, IMO, nowhere near cutting the mustard.

Same, IMO, with Mowbray, big salary, long contract, no pressure.

Waggott and Mowbray, IMO, are on 'Easy Street' and need a feckin rocket up their arse - preferably one that takes them away from Ewood Park.

Waggott:

“We have reached a precarious point in the club’s history and, right now, every penny counts, as we try to keep moving forward against a backdrop of uncertainty and challenging circumstances.”

Think this thread needs closing as regards incomings - autumn sales are on.

2 hours ago, Paul Mani said:

Missed the point completely.

Not at all.

You offered up missing out narrowly on Harrison Reed as one of the reasons for Rovers failing to get promotion.

Think you know there was virtually no chance that Reed would be back at Ewood for the reasons stated in my post.  IMO, Mowbray's management of Reed whilst he was here was appalling and because of that, we very likely missed out on an excellent player at Championship level who showed his worth at Fulham last season.

2 hours ago, Paul Mani said:

You’re taking yourself down a dark, murky hypothetical hole there. Let’s get it right, there is no one reason why we didn’t go up last season. But if you are going to hang your hat on replacing Raya with Walton then why not the season ending injury to Cunningham? playing him over Bell would’ve netted us 7pts surely? Or what about narrowly missing out on Harrison Reed to Fulham? Surely he could’ve carried us home? The list is exhaustive.

The elephant in the room here is Dack. Our best player by miles! If we HAVE to play this game then his season ending injury is surely the reason we didn’t reach the top 6, right? He’s the most likely Rovers player to effect any game and he was out for 50% of the season.

The answer is of course that no one facet is the reason we fell 7pts short. But for you to point out that the loss of a VERY inconsistent Keeper for another VERY inconsistent keeper is THE reason for us not getting in the playoffs is...well... just wrong.

Walton conceded less goals than Raya did in the season before and had more clean sheets. Fact.

Rovers missed out on promotion for a whole host of reasons. Not replacing a decent goalie with a better one was a contributing factor, but 100% not the primary one.

IMO, that was never going to happen and pure window dressing.

If Mowbray really wanted him then surely he would have made his move when the window first opened and not left it until the window was virtually shut!

I also very much doubt Reed would have touched us with the proverbial sh1tty stick - who the hell wants to be told to learn their trade from Evans and Smallwood and played out of position nearly every game.