Really enjoying seeing these! For me there are some really tough choices. I’d go for Wilcox over Duff, but I’d like to find a place for them both... and Sellars! Gordon Cowans was unreal... but can’t shift Tugay. We’ve had some excellent centre backs, which makes our current indifference towards them all the more frustrating. And while he’s not in the league of some of the strikers we’ve had over the years, I’d love to see Gestede getting his head on Wilcox/Ripley crosses... he’d score bucket loads! Friedel Berg Moran Nelsen Le Saux Ripley Batty Tugay Wilcox Shearer Garner subs: Mimms, Hendry, Atkins, Cowans, Duff, Speedie, Gestede

Thanks for the summary @Wing Wizard Windy Miller. Actually a lot better than I thought. He’s saying the right things in the main, which is a relief. Let’s hope he can put them in to action.

Of course there would have been more positivity... but 4 losses on the bounce, on the back of a disappointing transfer window that failed to see us address some glaring defensive issues, and comments in the press that give the impression that Mowbray is struggling to see any problems where many of us have has led to people asking questions. If we win the next 4, people will be a lot happier, but the majority recognise he can’t walk on water.

The more prominent Rovers tweeters are in the main unswervingly positive. I find my cynicism much more well received here. I’ll be the first to admit to having a pretty pessimistic view, and to being vehemently anti-Venky’s, and sometimes the positivity on there regarding all things Rovers borders on deluded for me. Twitter generally has two functions, to preach or to argue. The self righteous outnumber the stirrers.

We probably made a couple of hundred passes in each of those games pointlessly knocking it about the back 4 til the opposition inevitably close down and we resort to an attempt to hit Graham, or it goes right back to Raya to kick out for a throw in. Sadly that’s what passes for good football these days and plenty of teams do it.

Make no mistake about it, while things have improved while Mowbray has been here, the club is still a basket case. Behind the scenes roles and remits are only ever loosely defined. We’ve witnessed power struggles and infighting before, and while the current set up of Waggot, Cheston and Suhail “international man of mystery” Pasha appears better than the Singh/Shaw/Agnew farce, god only knows what goes on. Our transfer business is baffling, and I’d question how much say Mowbray has had in some of the signings. We have a “head of recruitment” but a pitifully limited scouting network by all accounts - who does he report to? And I still maintain there is something decidedly iffy about our reluctance to sign proper defenders - a constant during Venky’s reign of terror. Whether it’s paranoia brought on by past experiences, I have a tendency to deeply analyse and think about all comments made by the manager... these recent ones down playing our chances of promotion, and in my mind the stature of the club, are irksome. Are they born of Mowbray trying to dampen Venky expectations? Does he really mean it? Is he trying to over deliver? Is it just the common rhetoric these days? I think Mowbray is naturally a pretty straight talker, but I get the impression there is something bubbling under the surface. Personally I think Mowbray gets cut a lot of slack from the fan base as a whole. Last season was adequate. Anything less than promotion would have been unacceptable. While he may get too many plaudits for this, he probably also shoulders blame for things beyond his control at times. There are certainly things Mowbray carries the can for completely that must be improved. Lack of fitness, silly defensive lapses, soft underbelly, pandering to certain players, team selections, limited tactics etc. So he’s far from infallible. If the only reason people think he should keep his job is fear of who his replacement would be, then he probably isn’t the right man for it. It’s a valid concern though. We are all approaching this question with passion, logic and above all else genuinely caring about what is best for the club - stances that will not be taken by Venky’s if and when the time to make such a call arises.

It’s time for Balaji or Suhail to dust off the address book and give every agent in there a bell. We need the names of every unattached centre back out there. Not midfielders who can slot in, proper centre backs. And we need to get one in ASAP.

Oh behave! We’ve had Venky’s apparent traditional Indian approach to business used as an excuse for their aloof and arrogant practices since the day they took over. The caste system is still alive and kicking in India, and no prizes for guessing where on the social strata people who slap raja plates on their rolls Royce’s see themselves.

a) Anything less would have been a complete failure b) Blackburn Rovers falling into the third tier was utterly disgraceful. For it to happen again would be unforgivable c) True... but he gets a lot of slack for not being I have been stopped from posting this by moderators. Coyle d) Wigan aren’t a club we should be happy to benchmark against e) People are always going to react to a result and performance like this. Much of the criticism isn’t knee jerk, but well reasoned and perhaps most worryingly things we’ve been hearing time and time again

Problem is they will all be sat there in the dressing room, deflated, pathetic and despondent. Mowbray included. I’d love to be proven wrong and see a reaction, but we lack character. When the going is good and we are winning, they are all happy pissing about and having a laugh together. Need someone in there to crack a few heads and fire them up.

Yeah... it seems to have replaced “one for the future”. Amounts to the same thing.

Absolutely agree, we need to get the signings right. Some seasoned Championship competitors, an older head or two who will drag us up kicking and screaming are what I feel we need. Players who will compliment the good, young talented players we have, and provide a bit of bottle and a hard edge we are severely lacking at the moment.

This new phrase that is cropping up - “project signings” is a big worry for me... We have a top academy that should be about building players for the first team squad. IF there is any desire for us to get back into the Premier League in the foreseeable future, I don’t see how these so called project signings fit in. Are any of them going to be able to cut it in the top flight? Our efforts at the moment should be concentrated on Promotion, and signing players who can help us get there... and before anyone chirps up and tells me it’s unrealistic to expect that this season, I don’t expect it, I’m not saying this season. But I am saying ASAP. Also, let’s not forget it looked distinctly within reach a fortnight ago.

Bennett also helps his own cause with our fans hugely with his use of twitter.

I think it’s important to get a good mix every year. Wouldn’t have defined categories as such, but I’d try and make it look something like this... No more than one from each of the following: Pre-War years 50’s/60’s 70’s/80’s Jack Walker era This millennium Non-player And maybe as a bit of a wildcard someone who made a big impact in a short period.

Claiming that Venky’s were simply badly advised is a case of revisionism, at best born out of hope and love for the club, and at worst of deluded and misdirected blind loyalty. Plenty of reasons to despise Jerome Anderson, but to absolve Venky’s of responsibility is rubbish... idiotic and damaging decisions like employing Coyle were theirs alone. Them providing funding to keep us a going concern makes perfect sense to them from a business point of view and doesn’t make them some sort of benevolent benefactor.

I struggled with a couple of different streams today and missed big chunks of the game, but from what I did see... Our 2 early goals came from putting crosses into the box - Something Brentford have struggled with over their last few games. They’ve conceded quite a few in this manner, and I thought we had it spot on. Dack and Graham linking up through the middle would have played into Kona’s hands, he’s a very good young defender (bought from Charlton is the summer for about 2.5 million) and key for them at the back, but looks far less comfortable dealing with deliveries from wide than when players run at him directly. I can’t really comment on whether we continued to do this between 25 mins in and half time due to the issues with the stream. I’m guessing we didn’t, but we should have been getting it out wide and knocking balls over at every opportunity. I’m convinced that it’s the best way for 80% of teams in the country to play, but that’s another discussion. We have struggled when opposing teams have a decent ball player who sits deep. Evans and Smallwood both tend to sit deep too, and allow such players to dictate. Travis is more box to box and does some of that closing closer to their back four, but he’s also somewhat youthfully naive with some of his play. I haven’t seen that much of Sawyer’s since he signed for them, and in his Walsall days he played a lot higher up the pitch than he did today... but he was pulling the strings this afternoon and we couldn’t cope with it. Raya’s rush of blood to the head was stupid. I’m a big fan of his, but he needs to work on the fundamentals of his game more and cut out these daft errors that are in all honesty becoming too frequent. This in itself is a worry as they should become less frequent with experience. We need to work on our shape and how he distributes the ball too. Far too often it comes straight back due to him rushing. Occasionally it works wonders and we catch a quick break, but we try it every time. Nyambe should have started. I get the argument about sticking with a winning team, but playing someone out of position, who hasn’t excelled in there is needless, and I suspect down to Mowbray liking Bennett character more than his ability to do a job there. While there have been countless arguments lately about nurturing Brereton, Mowbray’s approach with one of our best young prospects is confusing. I’ve often heard how quiet and unassuming Nyambe is... maybe he needs to be less so, because he seems an easy target for Mowbray to drop to accomodate his favourites. Bennet was dire today. We were vulnerable down that side for the entirety of the game. Brereton looked better when he came on today, which offers a bit of hope, however if we are missing Dack or Graham for any length of time our inaction in this window will come back to haunt us. Less said about the defence today the better, and after recent improvements I’m again left thinking we need a proper old fashioned centre half. Conceding 5 is a joke. We also need someone to issue the odd bollocking on the pitch when someone does something idiotic, rather than give them a silly handshake. We are so inconsistent we can go from looking like world beaters to relegation candidates in the space of half an hour. These cheaply thrown away points are getting ludicrous now, and we’re it not for these capitulations of varying degrees we might be talking about automatic promotion, rather than hoping we can sneak the playoffs... which all of a sudden seems a lot further away than it did at lunch time.

I wonder what the feeling is in Venky towers after that. If recent reports are to be believed, and they were keen on bringing players in only to be talked down by Mowbray, they may well be asking questions.

William Hill offering 2500/1

Feel for Nyambe not making the squad.

@Biz It was Directed at Chaddy too, who claimed the vile abuse was something he couldn’t bring himself to/wasn’t allowed to post on a message board... I listed a load of protected characteristics which it is illegal to discriminate against someone for, you know, things that might actually constitute vile abuse. Calling someone a dick or a shit footballer doesn’t.

@Biz I made no joke about gender appropriation. Not surprised you were mistaken as you seem utterly humourless. I don’t know if you do it deliberately, but you reimagine or misconstrue fundamental parts of almost every post. I agree with you on one thing, it’s not about you being offended... it’s about your steadfast refusal to accept any perceived criticism of anything relating to Ben Brereton.

@Bizthe revisionist strikes again! I pointed out a list of things that would constitute vile abuse... how is this belittling any of those things? The point is there are real issues... things like racism, but by getting all offended by a bit of swearing, and labelling same as vile abuse will only serve to trivialise real issues. Collective crowd groan as Brereton gives the ball away... shocking that!!

Both you and @Biz have heard vile abuse have you? It must have been so vile and abusive that two righteous and upstanding citizens couldn’t bring yourselves to repeat it and report it to stewards, which being so vile and abusive, would have been the right thing to do. You are claiming that is was so vile and abusive you can’t repeat it... give us a clue... was it racist? Regarding his sexuality? Around any physical or mental condition? Maybe they incorrectly assumed his gender and verbally attacked him for it? Don’t tell me the pitchfork wielding, card carrying Klan member sat behind you attacked him for his religious or political views?!?! I expect it far more likely that in a moment of frustration someone has questioned his footballing ability or the value for money he presents... probably with a swear word or two chucked in. I don’t doubt for a moment that someone has said something along the lines of ‘You’re a dick Brereton’... which J*B has clearly pointed out would get you a ban if Brereton was a member of this board... so you can exaggerate this vile abuse issue without getting into specifics, and spin a bit of stick into far more than it is. If it is the case that he’s just got a bit of stick, you really do need to get a grip. You also need to stop running down and vilifying other fans. If Brereton is so fragile, and has such good hearing, that an isolated comment or two when he does something wrong is having such a negative impact on him he might as well hang up his boots.

Stop going on about us being a ‘Newly promoted’ team for gods sake... the fact we were ever in the third tier at any point since 1990 is an absolute disgrace, and thank god it appears it will be an anomaly. After everything Jack Walker did for our club, Venky’s disgraceful mismanagement to inflict that upon us shows how inept they truly are. Anything less than a promotion last year would have been unthinkable, and a number of our squad have got away lightly being viewed as borderline club legends for being part of a promotion squad... despite being there when we were relegated to our lowest position in generations. For all the often nonsensical positivity your posts are tinged with, you do a club of our stature and history a huge disservice when it suits your, frankly, confused agenda.