Are they the same people who were more than happy to see championship football when we were in the PL - based on the football being more exciting and us being more competitive down there?

Cas looked really good tonight.

Plenty thought it was the way forward.

We've always had fans who thought selling our best players and replacing with cheaper versions was the way forward - and in fact "it's something we've always done". It IS astonishing though, that after everything that's gone on over six and a half years, some fans STILL believe it's a method that could bring success. How long does it take to sink in?

Yes mate. That's where the good manager comes in.

Fair points. I'm arguing to Parson that there are reasons to doubt it will work here. The important point in any way of working, is to appoint a good manager. For rovers, the focus is more on the provision of players and that is always hit and miss whoever is bringing players in. There are no guarantees that any player will work out, at any club. The owners seem to think that teaming the external provision of players with more or less ANY decent coach will bring success. It hasn't worked and it won't work. Maybe they've changed stance with Mowbray, but for me, if they think he's a good manager, then I would let him bring in his own players that fit into his system, his way of playing. If Senior is going to deny him his choice of player and push his own choice on him - as I think he will (moneyball and all that), then we are going to struggle. i would get rid of Senior and simply back Mowbray. That avoids any possible conflict of personalities, or indeed conflict of interests.

There are plenty of reasons why it might not work here Parson. Shebby, SEM, Anderson have all supplied players for our "coach" for the last 6 years. Now Senior has stepped in, denied Coyle his signings and thrust Joao on us. I can't believe how naive some people are to the dangers. Appoint a good manager, let him decide who he wants to bring in - and back him.

You're completely right about keeping clean sheets being the be all and end all, no matter where the clamour for attractive football has come from in the past. We kept two clean sheets against Newcastle, - result -6 points. The double against the best side in this league. You only need to score one goal in that scenario and most teams concede at least one in a game. That should tell us everything we need to know.

It just means we continue with the idea of players being provided to a coach, with the aim of developing them and selling for profit.

They won't know what to make of it. I doubt they could have done more than what they did, but they still lost. England defended lay manfully and when they were asked questions, they always had the answer. This is a special England side.

A very good win. There's a bit of toughness to this England squad - and it was needed today.

Cook resigned from England Captaincy. it was coming.

Just bought tickets for the lancs/yorks T20. Two years ago an adult ticket was £15, now it's £25. The powers that be need to be careful with this trend. A big part of the attraction was entertainment at a good price. having said that, family stand prices are £20 for an adult and £5 for an under 18. These tickets are only available in one stand though as far as I'm aware.

We need wins. We've so far this season, managed to win 6 games out of 27. Put another way - in a very poor league we've played on 21 occasions when we couldn't win the game. It's a good job we got very lucky twice against Newcastle. For us to survive from this position entering February, we need to hit a run of unbeaten games, containing a sprinkling of wins. Draw one, lose one just won't get us anywhere near to what we need. No matter what Coyle says, the situation is quite bleak.

Did they say what the rule is now?

I didn't think Root should have been given out either. If I understand the rules correctly, the catcher has to be in control of the ball on disposal, which he clearly wasn't.

All the hallmarks of a relegation team are there. Relegated sides don't play badly every game. They play reasonably well for at least parts of most games. BUT......... they struggle when sides hit on the break - and inevitably they fall away the longer the game goes on. Seen it so many times.

Blimey...... Anyone seen DE and Bob Fleming in the same room? If so, are they twins?

The guy in the white shirt second pic looks like Ray Pointer.

Not saying I agree with that decision Gumboots. BTW, latest forecast is giving a lot of rain in Manchester tomorrow.

Can't see that being the reason Gumboots. Think it's just that England are rubbing the Pakistanis in it by making sure it's them that bat last on a wearing wicket. There's loads of time left and that's why they've done it.

Ah, the Ponderosa

ha ha, very good Phil.

Nor me. He could have got a better club than us at present.