Grayson had played for the U23's on Monday evening. I'm sure if Mowbray had known that Rodwell was going to be ill and unable to play, he wouldn't have played on Monday and may have featured last night. However, expecting the lad, no matter how young and fit he may be, to play 2 games in 24 hours probably isn't realistic. Not saying that Brereton played well, but I don't think he was the worst player on the pitch for Rover last night. In fact, we looked much better with him on than Conway, who did very little. Now that may not be particularly high praise, but if you try and forget the fact the price tag and remember that he is only 19, it gives me some hope, as rovers11 said, that he will come good given time. How many players currently in the championship (or even the Premier League) were the finished article, or even featuring in the first team regularly, when they were 19? I think (and hope) that Ben will continue to develop and we will see some real improvement over the next 2 or 3 years. Now, obviously that still raises the question, why pay the money that we reportedly have on him now, if he's not really ready, but Mowbray obviously sees some promise in him and believes he will flourish. If that's true, then £7m may eventually be a bargain considering how much even half-decent English strikers go for in the current transfer market. For us fans I think the best thing is to, like I say, try and forget the price tag and view him almost as one of our home grown youth players. For example Lewis Travis is getting a lot of credit for how he's playing at the moment, but I dare say that 2 years ago, when he was 19, he probably wouldn't have done quite so well. My only hope is that his confidence doesn't get knocked so much at the moment that it stunts his progress going forward.

I thought Nuttall did well, especially in the first 20 minutes or so. Faded a bit as the game went on and I was surprised that he wasn’t one of those who went off, but then he did really well to get himself into the right position to score - albeit a bit luckily. But I remember in games against Rotherham and Norwich, Armstrong getting into similar positions, putting those kind of balls across the box and there being no one gambling on getting in there, so it was nice to see Nuttall doing that, especially from the wide forward position. By no means a perfect performance, or even a brilliant one, but certainly one that showed promise and gives me hope that there’s a decent player in there that can be developed

Can't get into the team? Rather than buckling down, working hard and impressing when you get your chance, just call your club's loan manager and he'll sort you a move out to another club. Seems wrong to me, and surely can't be good for the players longterm development. No wonder players such as Palmer, Izzy Brown & Todd Kane are still being shunted out on loan to clubs rather than having made it into the Chelsea first team (or that of another Prem team) - compare the situation of these loan players with that of someone like Dele Ali, who had to actually impress the manager in order to get himself some game time at MK Dons, and you can see why they don't develop the mental fortitude and determination needed to succeed at the highest level.

But then the argument must be that, if so many of our players are so terrible (as is often suggested on here), we must be performing miracles to even be in with a chance of taking something from games. You’d think, given how crap we are, that we would be getting spanked 3 or 4 nil every week. The fact that we’re not makes me think that we’re not too far away - maybe it is just a fitness issue, maybe a confidence thing, maybe just one or two players away - I don’t know. But I also don’t think it’s quite as bad as it’s sometimes painted as being on here

The other way of looking at it though is that, despite a run of games against tougher opposition, in each game we’ve been in the game and could, and probably should, have taken something from each of them. Of course it’s disappointing/frustrating/unsettling/insert your own verb of choice here/ to keep throwing away leads and conceding late goals, but I think the fact that we were in decent positions late on in each of those games suggests that there’s not a massive amount wrong and, like Mowbray says, it’s just fine margins and a bit more quality (and maybe experience) needed. I know, I know - I’m just a happy clappy, Mowbray apologist and I need to give my head a wobble - but I just thought it might give some balance to the sky is falling stuff that fills 90% of the board

I don’t disagree, but I’m sure you know as well as I do that momentum is a huge thing in football and that’s the reason that 2-0 is often described as a dangerous lead, as if the team behind score 1 they often then go on to get another. As others have said that game was about the most comfortable I’ve seen Rovers in a number of years - we were coasting and the game was drifting, Birmingham didn’t look like creating anything let alone scoring 2. However, a completely needless penalty gave them a foothold in the game, put us on edge and suddenly the momentum was all with them. That’s not to excuse the rest of the team for failing to hold out at 2-1, but Raya’s mistake was the catalyst for the collapse and to my mind that makes him, in the words of Alan Sugar, ultimately responsible for the failure of the task

That’s not what I said, is it? I said that Brereton wasn’t to blame for the goals that we conceded. Do you disagree? Which of the mistakes that led to the goals would Graham have prevented if he were on the pitch? I’m not saying that Mowbray doesn’t get things wrong (although I feel that they are highlighted on here far more than the things he gets right), but to lay the blame for today’s dropped points at his door is just plain wrong imo. Yes, you can say that the players who f**ked up were selected by him, but as I’ve pointed out, they were also the same players that got us 2-0 up and bossed the game for the most part - so it’s not just as simple as saying if he’d chosen other players we’d have won

Mowbray did pick them and they got us into a comfortable 2-0 lead with 15 mins left to play. If these players were as bad as some on here are making out then surely that would never have happened - we should be getting rolled over week in week out if you believed the pundits on here, since we have no decent full backs, no proper wingers, no central midfield, no creativity going forward, no commanding centrehalf - it's a miracle that we not 20 points adrift at the foot of the table really ? Raya cost us two points today - not Mowbray, not Brereton, not a mentality of sitting back or anything else. It was a brainfart moment from the goalkeeper which gifted them a way back into a game that was all but won up to that point. And if anyone thinks that Mowbray didn't read him the riot act after the game then they obviously don't sit as close behind him as we do - he was absolutely livid on the touchline in that second half

I’m not convinced that Mowbray or his tactics made Raya come charging out and give away a ridiculous penalty, nor made Bell and then Evans give the ball away cheaply and Smallwood completely sell himself instead of covering round. And, for however poorly Brereton did when he came on, he too had no effect on those things either. And without them we’d have cruised to a comfortable 2-0 victory - maybe Mowbray should get credit for coaching us into such a commanding position in the first place

Exactly. Hence the phrase ‘I think...’ - it’s not rocket science is it? As to your other points - Armstrong played wide in virtually every game I saw last season, which was most of them. But I do agree he looked good at times. And, whilst winning more than we lose is not in itself an argument for playing Armstrong out wide, it is an argument to say that Mowbray is getting things generally right and perhaps deserves more respect than posters on here saying he’s lost the plot or implying he’s stupid. Anyway, I’ll leave it there. I only came on to get a sense of how we’d played as I had to miss the game and I got riled by the disrespect shown to,imo, a decent manager. But I guess it’s just further reinforcement of why I no longer come on here as much

I’d argue, once again, that you are confusing your opinion for fact. Since football is a team sport, and since we’ve won more games than we’ve lost this season, I think it’s a bit of a stretch to say that playing Armstrong wide is a ‘failed experiment that isn’t working’. By all means state that you don’t like Armstrong playing out there, or that you think someone else could do a better job, but be clear that that is your opinion and not a fact. And be clear also that 100 times out of 100 I’d choose the opinion of a man who has been involved in professional football over that of a nomark on a messageboard. Btw, I think the dropping of Armstrong for Conway is more down to attitude than level of performance. Mowbray was very critical of the team as a whole for their attitude on Wednesday and he knows, as do we all, that Conway will always give 100% effort, even when he’s not playing particularly well, and - especially with Bennett missing - I think that’s why he was chosen rather than it being an admission that we need ‘proper’ wingers.

I’d suggest that 29 points from 20 games, sitting just 5 points outside the playoffs at the start of December, arguably a better start than most of us expected this season, means that it must work to some degree, no? Add that to my earlier point about Armstrong being our most threatening attacking player in at least 2 recent games and maybe it’s less a discussion of ‘an experiment that just doesn’t work‘ than ‘something blueboy3333 off of BRFCS doesn’t like’. There seems to be a dislike of Mowbray from a few on here (and you’re the most vocal) that I just can’t fathom. After the last 6 or 7 years he is like a breath of fresh air and has more than surpassed my expectations, but yet a number of posters on here seem to delight in bashing him when we lose and belittle his involvement when we win. To read some of the comments on here you’d think we were battling relegation, getting hammered week in week out, with a manager trying experimental formations that no one else is ‘stupid’ enough to try. But thank God it’s not negative on here, eh?

I don’t want to rain on your ‘Mowbray knows nothing’ parade, but just a couple of points that I think need making: 1) Conway’s last appearance was against Derby (I think) where he was, rightly, taken off halfway through the first half. I don’t recall many on here (including you) demanding his reinstatement to the team following that game 2) Whilst it’s true that Armstrong isn’t a natural winger and he has struggled at times, he was also arguably our best player in the games against Leeds and Rotherham playing from that left wing and, again, I don’t recall many on here demanding he be dropped or moved from that position following those games.

I was counting the 2 games this week as ‘one’ occurrence - I can’t yet bring myself to accept that we were that shit twice! Also I can’t agree on the Rotherham game. The result was disappointing, but I thought overall we played quite well and created enough chances to have won the game comfortably. Had we taken one of them and won 2-1, I don’t think anyone would have been suggesting that it was a poor performance

The difference being that this was a one-off (hopefully), or very rare at least, whereas under Dumb & Dumber it was a weekly occurrence

Maybe, but my point is that you don't have to buy it - as many people have pointed out, they haven't and aren't really missing out on anything. Increased ticket prices, and even the surcharge to some extent, are more of an example of the club trying squeeze fans - as the match ticket is a fairly essential part of the whole fan experience - but the membership scheme isn't. It is a add-on, something that people will buy if they feel it is good value and won't if they don't, and ultimately it's something that won't massively affect your experience either way.

Let me start by saying that I agree with you that Rovers have got there pricing wrong for 1875 membership and, like you, I haven’t signed up this year after being a member last year. But - I don’t think I’m particularly missing out or being inconvenienced in any way by it so I’m not sure what the point of moaning about it is. Ultimately it is like anything else, it has a price and people will decide whether or not to buy depending on how they assess its value. For instance, I’d love a new iPhone, but I can’t justify spending £1000 on one so I won’t buy it. If the pricing of the membership is wrong not many people will buy it and it’s the club who miss out and so might reassess for next year. Having said that - if you were not a ST holder, couldn’t buy tickets in advance for whatever reason, and were likely to come to at least 6 games, then you’d actually save money by paying the £15 membership fee, plus get extra money to spend at the club shop and a few extra perks too - so maybe it is worth the price Genuine question here - has anyone on here actually been affected by the surcharge? Turned up on spur of the moment and had to pay it? Or been put off from attending because of it? Or are we all getting upset on behalf of the hypothetical family who might decide at 2pm to stroll down to Ewood? I imagine that in reality the people most affected by it are away fans - and that it is actually in place to deter late sales, as they need extra stewarding etc. I know last season there were a couple of away games (can’t remember which ones) where I thought about going after my sons game was called off in the morning, only to be put off by a surcharge in one instance, and a refusal to sell tickets on the day in the second!

It would be so easy to solve if there was any real appetite to do so, but ultimately time wasting only really negatively affects the paying public and we all know that the authorities don’t care one jot about them. 2 quick suggestions - 1) when the ball goes out of play you have 20secs to get it back in play again. Failure to do so means a booking for the player closest to the restart. Goes for throw-ins, goal-kicks, corners, free-kicks. Any action to impede the restart, e.g kicking the ball away, picking the ball up and walking away etc is an automatic yellow card 2) For substitutions you have 30secs before play starts again. If your player is still walking off or the sub isn’t in position, tough. For both the time could be displayed as a countdown on the scoreboard/screen, in the same way as the NFL have the play clock, so that it is completely transparent and not down to the refs interpretation. Both would be fairly simple to implement and both would improve the current situation imo

You do realise that Smallwood only went in goal because we’d already made 3 subs and so we couldn’t bring on Leutweiler, rather than TM just preferring to chuck a CM in goal, don’t you?

I'm not sure it's fair to say we were particularly poor in the first half against Forest. We started slowly, and obviously could have been behind from the penalty, but from 20 mins onwards we were clearly the better team, and but for a couple of good saves, a wonder clearance off the line and the width of the crossbar we could have been 2 or 3 goals to the good at half-time. Also I keep reading about how Mowbray has been given funds and how we've spent a good chunk - obviously compared with recent times we have spent a decent amount for us, but considering we're starting from a net spend in the region of -£30million over the last 5 years or so, and teams in this league have squads that cost upwards of £60million to put together, I'm not sure that spending roughly £10million over 2 years is being 'given funds to build a much deeper squad' - to put it in perspective, Forest spent more than that on 1 player this summer, as did Boro last summer.

I expect us to finish comfortably mid-table, but think that Mowbray and the team are targeting the top end of that, around 8th or 9th, in order to set us up for a proper push next season - similar to what Sheff Utd did last season and so far this

I agree that we missed Nyambe last night. Not just defensively, but his willingness to get forward and give us width on the right is crucial to the way we play too. Bennett, for a supposedly attacking player, was incredibly negative from rb last night. Very rarely looked to play forwards, unwilling to overlap and I can’t remember him trying to go past a man. It all meant that we had no attacking threat on that side of the pitch, especially in the first half. In fact the only positive moment came when Reed and Bennett briefly switched positions and Reed picked out a great through ball inside the fullback for Bennett to run onto. I wonder if it might have been an idea to start those two the other way around down the right.

I agree to an extent. Our current team is hardworking and functional, rather than exciting and free-flowing, but I don’t think that is Mowbray’s natural or preferred style. I have a mate who is a WBA season ticket holder and he raves about Mowbray’s team there - the way they passed and moved, kept possession and tore teams apart. If you look at some of the players that he has signed - the likes of Rothwell, Davenport, Palmer etc, I think ideally he wants us to play a more possession based style - but he obviously doesn’t trust the players to implement it yet. He spoke early last season about changing his plans and playing a more counter-attacking style as the team suited it more. Plus, the current system seems to be getting results so he’d be a fool to ditch it too quickly, but I do expect that he will try for a slow evolution, especially once we’re safe and I imagine that next season we might be a different looking team

Second half we switched formation and matched them up in a 3-4-1-2, with Armstrong playing more centrally with Graham. We did actually look better like that, although Armstrong actually looked worse through the middle and Graham and Dack were both off the boil all game, so even though we looked more comfortable we never looked like we would create anything. After they went ahead, we switched again to a 4-4-2 with Dack wide right and Armstrong and Brereton through the middle, but we looked even worse than in the first half and there was only ever going to be one winner. Hopefully it’s just an off night and we’ll be back firing again on Saturday. Incidentally, the way that Sheff Utd set up and played with 3-4-1-2 and the wide centre backs stepping forward to create overloads out wide, is the way that I think Mowbray would ideally like us to play. I wouldn’t be too surprised to see some variation of 3-5-2 on Saturday

Genuinely can’t believe I’m reading this. Rewind two seasons to when clownpants was here and we’d have been delighted with finishing mid-table. What has changed to make you believe we should be challenging for promotion? I know we’ve spent a bit of money, but nowhere near the likes of Villa, Middlesbrough etc. No - the only reason that we can even begin to dream about promotion is the man whose head you’re calling for! As someone else said - get a grip!!