Almost identical views to mine, albeit more clearly put!

Get what you mean about leaving ourselves short in terms of keeping Nuttall to an extent, especially after Samuels injury, but not Travis, he has mainly played in central midfield, a position in which we signed 3 players yet to be involved that will more than cover that position, and we have Nyambe, Bennett and Reed to cover right back. He isnt needed just to make up the numbers. Why would any buy be a panic buy? Mowbray has talked about lists, which is why I dont really understand why we didnt resort to an alternative, even if it was a temporary one until Bauer and Chapman become unavailable. Not bringing in a centre back and a winger have made a potentially perfect window, only a good window. Dont get where you are coming from at all re Pulis' tactics meaning he will never play. Whilst I would agree with suggestions that Pulis is a bit of a dinosaur, regarding this situation, your comments are blatantly untrue. Firstly, Mowbray only started him once in half a season in a weaker league, and has repeatedly said that he doesnt trust him to start games, so you could argue that he wouldnt play much here. More pertinently, look at his treatment of Adama Traore. He was a player with so much raw pace and natural ability, but one who was untrustworthy and had failed to nail down a regular place or consistently affect games positively, both at Aston Villa and at Boro prior to Pulis' arrival. Under Pulis' management, he turned into one of the best players in the Championship in quite a short period of time and earnt a big money move to Premier League Wolves. Also, more recently, he has given starts to Lewis Wing, a young wide man similarly through the academy, fact of the matter is part of the reason that Chapman may struggle for game time is because he is one of 3 talented, academy wingers at Pulis' disposal, along with Wing and Tavernier. My comment earlier was tongue in cheek, but is this mate the same guy that made that stuff up about Kent and Gallagher and you then initially blocked? Or a different one? A lot of people wanting to pretend to be in the know at the moment (this isnt aimed at you btw) that just take what is already public knowledge and put their own spin on it to get attention.

That was on the 12th! After the permanent window closed.

Obviously that would never happen, but we would have to wait until Jan.

Think its fair to reignite this thread now that our business is officially done, and we have added Brereton, Reed and Rodwell to the deals done of Davenport, Rothwell, Palmer and Armstrong. Are we better than last season? I would say overall, yes, in terms of replacements, directly or indirectly. Palmer has replaced Payne, Rothwell has replaced Antonsson, Armstrong has replaced, well, Armstrong, and Brereton replaces the long term injured Samuel, just leaving Chapman not replaced. Happy with the amount spent, a nice surprise and somewhat of a statement of intent, and also happy with the retaining of and in some cases, new contracts given to of our main players. Hope Mulgrew gets a new deal shortly. Defensively, we have not signed anyone which leaves us incredibly short at centre back, with our only natural cover in Downing carrying big doubts about his ability at this level, and the injury proneness of our first choice duo. If Bauer was our first choice, I appreciate that he was not available at a price we considered to be value for money, but even if as assumed, we will revisit that deal, we should have signed temporary cover in the mean time. In central midfield, we look a lot better stocked than last year in terms of depth than last year, only losing Whittingham who missed large periods through injury. Harrison Reed is someone I think should boost us tremendously in there., from both when I saw him for Norwich last season, and based on what their fans have said. Shame it wasnt a permanent deal. Davenport again comes as a more long term option but hopefully he recovers from injury ASAP as he could boost us short term as well as long term. Rodwell is certainly not someone I would have signed, I hope he is not signed as a defender as basically, he hasnt been one as a professional footballer so it would make no sense. If hes signed from a midfielder, I've still got major doubts as to whether he will be a success, but presumably hes on much lower wages than hes been used to, and weve got more than enough in there to compensate even if he isnt a success, which of course I hope he is. In attacking areas, we were heavily reliant on loanees last season which left us with a skeletal remain of an attack; practically just Dack and Graham. Palmer is definitely for me an upgrade on Payne, both 10s who can do a job wide, Rothwell looks a bright spark to have as an option, Armstrong is a steal as we know what he can do and Brereton is one to definitely be excited about, but there are questions based on his goal record, with his price tag at our level, he will need to have an impact now even if that isnt with the consistency or at the levels that we suspect to be able to see in the future when he has developed further. He definitely boosts us in attacking areas and I look forward to seeing him, theres enough to suggest that he will add to our attack. I am content with our attacking business but the lack of a winger really is an issue and an obvious and quite major flaw in our business, as we dont have anyone who can run on the outside of full backs. Again, like with Bauer, I appreciate that we had a number 1 target in Chapman, but considering we tried to conclude it at such a late stage, surely we could have looked at alternatives? Not keen on Nuttall and Travis stagnating because they will get very limited game time here, wish they had been loaned out. Overall, would say the window has been 7 out of 10. Theres been enough done to be optimistic about, and not to expect a toil in the League, desperately trying to keep our heads above water, and theres an exciting core of players to watch and develop. But we could be affected hugely by injury to Mulgrew or Lenihan, and we are a winger short of having a good, balanced attacking set of players. Very much glad that the window is closed now and we can concentrate solely on the pitch.

Ryan Kent or Sam Gallagher?

The rifts such a vague rumour have caused suggest that people understandably still have no faith in Venkys holding firm and doing whats best for the club rather than themselves. Im unconvinced that theyve bid 15m. Goes without saying that we can not sell him at this point in time. Also not naive enough to suggest that he is unsellable as some have suggested, or that West Brom wouldnt be a step up at this moment, regardless of current League position after 5 games. All that said, I do reckon he will be here on Sunday, but also unfit to play a part.

No Armstrong or Dack that I could see in the training pictures earlier. Can't see them featuring.

Burnleys. Dack might get into their team but Ashley Barnes is a very clever player, Vokes started over Wood which for me was the wrong decision but the latter would walk into our team. Brady when fit and Gudmundsson are wide men with excellent deliveries that again would get into our team with comfort. That said, as touched on, their issue this season has being defensive fragilities not seen last season. Dyche does ultimately get more out of them than the sum of their parts. I did criticise him for not taking the Europa League seriously and I stand by that, as Chris Sutton said last night, when will they get that chance again. Saying all that they do have some decent attacking players, albeit nothing special, they are certainly a step up from our squad sadly at the moment.

Tottenham definitely in the group of death with no weak teams in there. Inter have made some good signings in the summer so will be a big threat, and PSV are the weakest side in there but they do have Lozano. United and Liverpool have also got groups that youd probably fancy them to get through in but with Valencia and Napoli as well as the giants of Juventus and PSG, itll make for some interesting games.

Never going to be good enough for us in the Championship, was a bit of his depth really in League 1, with a pitiful goal return. That being said, the circumstances with such a serious injury is never nice to see. Hopefully he goes on to make a full recovery and when hes back fit he joins a club lower in the pyramid to try and make a career for himself.

Apologies, my point maybe wasnt worded well perhaps. My points were that firstly, I agree that is was a buy. We have bought Ben Brereton in the only way we legally can under the current loan window. That said, people were perfectly entitled, and it was neither positive or negative of people to do so, to enquire as to whether that was the case. There was a genuine grey area which needed clarity, which has since been provided. The wording when we announced him said the word "option" which made people unsure if that was the case, as initially rumoured prior to his signing. For example, I think Antonsson had an option to buy (that is rumoured) in his loan deal last year, but only if we wanted to activate it at the end of his loan spell, ie it was temporary with a pre-agreed fee should both parties decide at the end of it. In the end, we didnt. As you suggest, whether he does well, plays rubbish, breaks his leg, scores 20 goals, is worth more, or is worth less when January comes around, it is totally irrelevant. He will be our player REGARDLESS. As you say, its a "contractual obligation," Ben Brereton is for all intents and purposes, a Blackburn Rovers permanent employee. Journalists from both sides have since confirmed it was a buy in all but name, and Mowbray has since been quoted saying that it is a long term deal. It would be like getting to January, and saying we should send Armstrong back to Newcastle, Rothwell back to Oxford or Dack back to Gillingham, all without ever paying a fee. "And if 19 year old long term contract Ben Brereton will have some fans making judgements on his future with us within the next 16 weeks then God help us all." - this was what I disagreed with. People will judge, game by game, his performances like anyone else. As long as people do so safe in the knowledge that if he does poorly, he cant be "sent back" and bare everything in mind, age included, and also note that the "next 16 weeks" is a pointlessly specific deadline as January doesnt make a difference to his long term employment here, then theres no issue with that. Something I presume youd agree with. Sorry if this wordy reply does nothing to clear anything up!

Of course people will make judgements, positive or negative, based on his performances in the next 16 weeks. Like any other player. As you say, the deal is a buy in all but a minor technicality. People were right to wonder, based on the wording, as to whether it was a buy, or a loan with the option. Now general consensus from all around shows that its a buy. So any suggestions of us sending him back without paying a fee for him if he fails would be baseless and moot.

May be wrong but from what I've seen hes a very cultured defender with a good left foot.

@RovingRover presume at this moment that Mulgrew is the excellent CB, Lenihan very good with the potential to join him under that bracket? No way can Rodwell be considered serious back up at centre back. Theres already a massive implied gamble in his signing, so we cant consider him automatic adequate back up in a position hes not played in senior football. Not having a go at you btw, just a general point. Williams has never played right back. Even if the aim is to mainly have wide players cutting in, sometimes a player who can stretch teams will be a crucial option, very few teams in the league dont have a natural winger amidst their ranks. And our primary back up to Dack has to be Kasey Palmer. He is a number 10, the only reason he should be accommodated in a wide role is to get him and Dack in the team together. Don't necessarily disagree with your point about signing a keeper but its a difficult position to fill. Stockdale and Westwood are 2 experienced keepers that arent getting game time but I am not sure why.

I see that Dyche has named a heavily weakened team again, something that I cant get my head around at all. I'd be absolutely furious if we got into Europe and played weakened teams, it defeats the purpose of getting into Europe in the first place. I understand the financial aspect of it, im not naive in that sense but the chance of Burnley going down, even accounting for a slow start, is fairly slim, and not dependant on a potential of 6 additional games in the group stage. And its an example that a manager with even more credit in the bank at his club in terms of the fantastic job hes done than Mowbray, is not beyond reproach in terms of constructive criticism. And I also appreciate that I may end with egg on my face and they may win but to see it as such a second priority as they clearly do is disrespectful, aswell as a clear disregard to a potentially once in a lifetime opportunity. They obviously cant play 11 players throughout the season, but its clear that its 1st team in the League, 2nd team in Europe. For clubs that arent in the top 6, the best memories can be good cup runs/potential trophies (I was very pro Wigan going for that FA Cup a few years ago despite battling relegation, no doubt the best memory in their fans life) and rare forays into Europe, Burnley fans couldnt dream of trips to Istanbul and Athens in competitive games a few years ago.

Goes without saying that Dack cannot be sold, and if Brereton is worth 7m and is relatively unproven, god knows how much Dack is worth. Vela is a very average player too. Doubt theres any truth in either of those rumours at all. In terms of our squad depth, looking at it with 24 hours to go: GK: Raya, Leutwiler - Certainly not one of our strongest positions, the former needs to cut out mistakes quickly. RB: Nyambe, Reed, Bennett - Not ideal to have one natural RB, but Bennett played arguably his best football there last season and apparently Reed had a very impressive loan spell there himself last season at Norwich. Problem comes if we need either elsewhere. CB: Mulgrew, Lenihan, Downing - 2 very good centre backs, an obvious weakness beyond. Downing ok as 4th choice. LB: Bell, Williams - Fine, in that order for now. CM: Evans, Reed, Bennett, Smallwood, Davenport, Rodwell - Much more depth here than last season, but Evans and Rodwell are prone to injury and Reed and Bennett will be needed elsewhere at times Attacking Midfield: Dack, Palmer, Rothwell, Armstrong, Conway, Bennett - The first 4 has plenty of entertainment and flair in it, the latter 2 experienced heads but I wouldnt like to see them in the front 4 too often, in Bennetts case, further back. A pacy winger would top that group off nicely. Striker: Graham, Brereton, Armstrong, Samuel - Good options here. 2 players needed, a pacy winger and a centre back and its a well balanced squad. Hopefully trim the fat by loaning the ones listed below out, giving us a leaner squad. Loan out: Travis, Nuttall, Tomlinson Unneeded: Gladwin, Whittingham, Caddis

Not sure anyone can call him a steal, his goal record is rather poor so we are paying for potential. Hes a big gamble and one who will probably either fulfill what people perceive to be his potential and go on to exceed the price tag, or continue at his current rate of scoring and prove to be massively overpriced. Its one of them, its difficult to judge the fee too much. Apparently Gallagher warrants a similar fee and he is older yet proven to be not very good. You look at Armstrongs price tag and Brereton looks like weve been ripped off, but Newcastle didnt want him. You look at strikers like Grabban, Waghorn, Afobe etc, all of whom are proven goalscorers at this level, something Brereton is certainly not. They are all better strikers now. But the risk with them is if they dont help to get promoted in the life of their contract, then their value hits the floor, Derby, Forest and Stoke can justify such spending, we dont have the same chance of promotion. A lot of mystique and excitement comes from the size of the fee rather than the actual player and his record in my opinion. Its the statement of intent that comes with the price and suggests that we are showing ambition, at a point when we are already doing well. If he was coming for 2m I doubt he would be getting half the fanfare either way.

May be mistaken but unsure if hes been too prolific at under 23 level? Would make sense to loan Nuttall out, his next acid test would be to score regularly at league level and then with that under his belt after a year or 2, come back and challenge for our first team. Butterworth could then try to take Nuttalls mantle from last season, albeit they seem different types of players, he can become the main attacking threat for the u23s and earn a loan move himself and the cycle can continue. Obviously assuming he doesnt make such an impact to be in a position where we feel its best to fast track him into the first team.

I dont get the Whittingham situation. Overall, with Evans, Reed, Bennett, Smallwood and Davenport I can understand why hes become surplus to requirements. That said, he certainly has more ability than the likes of Hart and Caddis who have been used in squads recently at a time where we are lacking numbers. From what I could gauge pre joining us he seems to be quite a shy and quiet character so id be surprised if hes a bad influence either. Maybe hes injured? I echo others in that we need a leaner squad ideally, and he, Hart, Caddis and Gladwin all out on loan would reduce the squad size without impacting the team at all, whilst the likes of Nuttall, Travis and Tomlinson need regular football elsewhere temporarily to ensure they dont stagnate.

Where do you get the impression that he will be played wide mostly? Listened to Mowbrays interview last night and he said Brereton considers himself a number 9, albeit he did also mention Armstrong and using strikers wide to counter certain weaknesses, often reluctantly. Forest fans seem pretty unanimous that one of the primary reasons for his loss of form was due to being played wide. I hope hes being signed primarily as a 9.

The experience within the team is also critical to our chances, in that we have older players who not only offer know how and leadership to an otherwise young team, but are key players in their own right. Mulgrew is our best defender yet is often overlooked or underrated as people (understandably) praise Lenihan, who is also a good defender, but for me Mulgrew is better at this moment, and the perfect man to play alongside. Hopefully playing with Mulgrew will allow Lenihan to improve on the ball as he has been known to misplace dangerous passes, something Mulgrew rarely does. The 2 however are a good partnership. Graham has been almost universally overlooked in peoples teams due to the exciting signings of Brereton and Armstrong. But for me theres no reason to suggest that Breretons record should indicate automatic selection over Graham, in the short term, whilst unlike Brereton according to Forest fans, Armstrong is just as capable from a wide position as we saw last season. Part of which was down to Graham vacating space for Armstrong to run in behind into. In midfield, we have players in more attacking roles so its important that the experienced players like Evans and Bennett ensure that they provide the knowhow and the intelligence in there to give us a platform.

Is it not incredibly arrogant to use the line "those with a deeper football knowledge or who play the game?" Your line about his goals winning games/points is baffling. He was hardly scoring the 4th in 4-0 wins, we was a team outside the play offs therefore our games were rarely seperated by more than a goal. To suggest hes a flat track bully scoring goals in games wed already won to get his goal tally up is nonsensical. Not convinced by all your quotes regarding the opinions of coaching staff etc. How do you know these? Who said the line about Defoe? As much as his all round game aside from his goals wasnt brilliant, it is also being done a disservice to suggest that it was non-league standard. Back to the point, if Brereton is as successful and prolific consistently as Rhodes was. Weve got a hell of a signing on our hands.

Oh, for a guaranteed 20 goal a season "hindrance" now.

One thing Id definitely say is that I am excited to see how he gets on, and it feels like a statement of intent. There are definitely questions to be asked and concerns lingering. His goal record is very underwhelming, there are questions from Forest fans about his hold up play which is a concern and he was well down the pecking order at Forest. But theres also a degree of excitement in bringing a player highly rated in for money we didnt expect at the start of the summer and we are stronger going forward with him than without him. Another key thing, lets not write off Danny Graham just yet!