Not going to say we don't need these players but I really would like to know what we intend to do with our "fringe" players. We seem to be heading in the same direction as pre Souness, a big squad of not quite good enoughs on good money. I hope we have a contingency plan to trim the wage bill, it's starting to look a bit like the Brian Kidd era in terms of overall quality and squad size. Worries me a bit.

No more bickering from me. With the exception of the Roger Jones thing

Here's some facts jim, actually one fact. Your "thing" against Souness had buggar all to do with football. Yes, I am going to call you on the mat on this one and expose you for the crock you are. Your sole and only reason for your dislike of Souness had to do with him NOT SAYING HELLO TO YOUR KID WHEN HE WAS MASCOT. Right aren't I jim? So don't come with your oh so frigging smart attitude, also you were asked to name a succesor umpteen times during your 2 year long personal campaign against Souness and you put forward squat. Bloody hell jim you are still stalking him, trying to find reasons to continue ridiculing him. You came in with names for his replacement only during the time when the shortlist had been pretty much sussed out. Those my friend are the facts, I am not an historian but I do remember. As does FLB

Look folks, let me try to set a thing or two straight here. Too many of you are reading between the lines and embellishing what I am trying to say. I am NOT scapegoating Friedal, I an NOT saying he is a liability. IN fact I have ALWAYS rated Brad as a decent keeper, even back before we signed him when almost every last one on here was pulling the "can't be any good he's an American" theory. Well that theory stuffed completely up your arses it's perhaps time some of you got off your high horses and realized your pompous arses don't know everything. Espescially those of you who think it quaint to just respond with little one liners and/or derogatory remarks that have ZERO input into the actual discussion and do nothing to indicate your view. There is one individual on here who has over 2000 posts and I struggle to think of one that actually had any form of substance, just wise ass remarks. Do your kind do that because you think you are humourous? or is it because you are not capable of a thought out response? Are you afraid to actually put your opinion in black and white? do you fear ridicule? are you insecure? The only thing I have tried to say, one last time lads and lasses, Brad's fundamentals need to be improved, they are his weakness, he is an excellent shot stopper who relies on reflexes, reflexes which are slowing a bit perhaps. All you who think he had the near perfect all round game a few years back are merely blinded by some of his fantastic stops or you just don't understand the goalkeeping basics and think that pulling of spectacular saves is all it is about. He was no better back then than he is now, but on the bright side he is a whole lot better than any of you thought before we got him.

Twaddle. Two years ago Friedel was simply sensational and did more or less everything faultlessly. Now, there's no doubt he's slipped a little from those heights since, but you make out he's completely passed it and useless. He's still easily one of the best keepers in the league, he regularly keeps us in games with world class saves (Fulham and Palace both come to mind recently), and rarely makes a mistake. Yet every mistake he does make, you leap on like a scalded cat and seem to take great delight in announcing to everyone how you thought he was rubbish all along. You frequently accuse Jim of having a vendetta against Souness, what's your vendetta against Friedel all about? He's our best player ffs! Sort of like you jump on so many of my posts. I have no vendetta against ANY Rovers player. Neither do I have wool pulled over my eyes because of one seasonof SENSATIONAL SHOT STOPPING. I'll say again and with conviction, his fundamentals have always been suspect. Let's imagine (as you apparently are) he was flawless in that season, does supposed perfection two and three seasons ago mean he is in an unassailable position now. Perhaps in your book but not in mine.

Exactly, with a better defence Brad's weaknesses were seldom exposed. Most of the time he only had to deal with shot stopping. the same weaknesses were there, just not seen as frequently. No he has no confidence with his defence so he sticks to his line. When he had confidence with them and they were pushing up more he came out and closed the players down more. There were times in the season we finished 6th that Friedel was outstanding. Just ask some of the best managers around and they will tell you that. STRONGLY disagree. On both points. Brad was sensational for his shot stopping when we finished sixth. He made a lot of excellent saves. His basics have been evidently benign since he arrived, even in the First Division you could tell. He's never been one to come off his line and he did not cover more of his area when we finished sixth than he did now. Would you not agree the best keepers will shine behind a poor defence. A commanding keeper can help hold the defence together and if he KNOWS he is playing behind a dodgy bunch then he better be ready to come off his line and fast. Skin this cat anyway you want Brad's closing down, positioning at set pieces and coming for crosses are all suspect. We disagree so we disagree. I'll move on now.

Then David Moyes is also a mate of his too. Everton were neck and neck with us in the bidding war to get Ferguson which probably also helped inflate his price. Said at the time we paid over the odds for him, believe it or not many on here were advocating going as high as 10 Million. I would not sell him now though unless we could recoup every penny and there is only one man I know would pay that much. What's the thoughts we sell Fergie and make a bid for Parker?

Exactly, with a better defence Brad's weaknesses were seldom exposed. Most of the time he only had to deal with shot stopping. the same weaknesses were there, just not seen as frequently. I'd agree, if I were wenger I would probably rather havve Cudicini, can't see Chelsea wanting to help Arsenal much though.

The only thing that this MGP Soap Opera has done for me is convince me we must never never never, under any circumstances sign another Norwegian player. Bloody hell they just never stop.

I wouldn't say I'm as scared as you but I'd have to agree that set-pieces are Brad's weakness. On the basis that Arsenal's weakness is set-pieces then it's be a bit backwards to sign Brad I don't think we'd get anything like 3M for him either. Nice to know I am not alone in my thoughts. It seems the season where Brad was super human has gained him a position of God like status with some fans. I am dumbfounded how some can overlook his very obvious weaknesses. Goalkeeping's basics are somewhat lacking with Brad, he often plays like he's a hockey goalie, never coming out far from his nets and try's to use his feet too much rather than the huge frame of a body God blessed him with. The Spurs goal against us was another shining example, just a few more steps out of his goal mouth as the cross went to Keane and he could have almost totally blocked out the target from Keane. As it was he chose to stand put, offering Robbie a large chunk of goal to aim at, plus more time to pick his spot. In fact, it is these weaknesses that makes it hard for me to believe Arsenal would ever consider paying so much, they must see it too. While selling Brad may not sit well with a lot of fans I think 3 Million would be an excellent price. A price that if I was Mark Hughes, given our weaknesses elsewhere, I would have to seriously consider.

I don't know why...but it's just hit me how poor our strike force is and how much people are deluding themselves about these two. Bothroyd couldn't even make an impact at Coventry, the excuse so far is 'fallings out with the management' but if he was good enough he wouldn't have been offloaded from there on a free. I think he scored 6 goals for Perugia...that's nothing really, he is undoubtedly a good athlete, but a Premiership footballer? Never. Dickov has spent his entire career in teams either in Division One or not good enough for the Premiership, why at 32 should we assume that he has suddenly become better than that? His workrate is a useful asset to us but should never in a million years be the focal point of our attack. If that is our first choice partnership then we do have the worst strikeforce in the league...couple that with our erratic defence then we really are in trouble. Edit: Didn't actually get as far as USABlue's post before I wrote this...any reason why those two shouldn't be first choice? Jansen has more goals from open play than Dickov since he came back into first team contention (I think) and Stead is still a quality player. Yes Le Chuck. Stead I have no problem with, I like him a lot. Poor Matty however, he will have to show me a lot more to convince me he is on the way back. Granted he has bagged a couple (just) but he seems to offer little else, he has impressed me a bit in the air but that is about it. I don't know, perhaps I am being too harsh, remembering Matty of old and all. As I have said before, his instincts seem to have left him. Stead/Gally or Stead/Bothroyd for the future.

If I am reading correctly we did play reasonably well. I can take encouragement from that since I really expected us to lose. I was very worried about Rouledge and Johnson. Another tough one next week, onward and upward slowly but surely we can pull ourselves out of this. Why did Thommo get 2 yellows, most posters seem to think he was stupid, any details please.

And with your ninth post would you like to actually offer something other than an insult to a poster, go on you know you can do it. Would you perhaps like to offer a rebuttal that effectively negates my complaint that the standard of refereeing has gone down the toilet over the last several years. Mmmm? I am waiting, yes there are a few that know how footy is supposed to be played but, my insolent comrade, there are many more dancing to the tune of Soho Square and FIFa than not. Usual tripe from the locals. BTW. there is a handy little feature in the top right hand corner, its a little box with the word "Quote" in it. Might help you for future empty meanigless posts

Oh yes right oh, I'll have some of what you are smoking.

Hahhahahahahahahahahahaha deep breath.... hahahahahahahahahaah. Officiating is a pure joke, it's an absolutely summation of incompetence and inconsitancy. If you look up inconsistant in the Dictionaty there is a picture of a football ref there. Yeah, the FA will do something about it. They will back the idiots 100%. It's the FA got them as stupid as they are. They are killing the game man just killing it.

Having just watched Palace I was going to give my 2 cents but I think you have mirrored my thoughts exactly. I don't think we stand a chance. Palace are well drilled, 100% commitment from EVERY player and have pace upfront, they whipped in some terrific crosses. I see a hiding coming actually. If we try to go through them at the back, no chance. I think our best chance to get at them is to go wide and come in behind, they look a bit dodgy if you come at 'em from the wings. Scary one this, I will be most surprised if we come away with anything.

Are you on a mission from Sparky Lee? Ooops almost forgot the whole point of the thread, Centre Half, with leadership abilities. defensive Midfielder. No point have a scorer if we can't stop the goals, not point having a scorer if we can't breakdown the opponents attack, no point having a scorer if we can't win possesion in the middle of the park. The best goalscorer in the world would struggle with the number of chances we create. The platform had to start at the back, middle. Shore up that, allow our creators to create, provide opportunities for our striker. That should do it.

i would say friedal has been under preforming this season I HAVE BEEN saying Friedal has been underperforming for some time. At Fulham I actually saw him come off his line to narrow the angle and thought "oooh good someone is teaching him some basics". Saw the Spurs game and I am not so sure, he is always stuck within a yard or two of his goal line.

I really hope so, if not before then very soon after. We are rapidly approaching the levels of squad players at the club prior to Souness being here, albeit with perhaps a tad less quality and less balance.

He might if he was exceptional, not neccessarily in his own play but in a leadership role. If we could find a CH who was truly a defensive General to help organise, bite some heads off, bark some orders it would be helpful. I think it is one of the reasons we are so poor defending set pieces, no one really knows their role is we have no one in the defence who really tells others what they ought to do. We play with four defensive minded individuals rather than as a defensive unit.

Funny that someone who shall be nameless just recently had a go at "Americans" for not reading the threads. I am sure even all my American friends might have grasped the "no names" and "only two players" part of this thread.

Would someone please explain that theory to David Moyes, preferably before we have to play Everton.

Well are we predictable or are we predictable. This is the biggest disappointment of the season so far for me I feel totally gutted with this loss. Infuriated even.

Did not realise Spurs had to play in the Cup. Let's hope for a gruelling encounter with extra time and Spurs winning on PK's. Perhaps then they will have one eye on the next round and be knackered too.

No predictions, just a few comments. We all are well aware of Rovers habit of the big let down after good performances, right? Well, to me this is a real acid test for Mark Hughes, have we really turned the corner? Make no mistake this is a big big game for us. I have no doubt the stay away fans who are borderline at the mo', their eyebrows are beginning to raise and they are saying to themselves " Mmmm, maybe this lot have something going" It is imperative, absolutely vital that we do not suffer a let down this weekend. This will be the third week in a row we have been on telly, one was a stirring comeback, one was a sound and emphatic beating of Fulham. We must win this, the armchair Rovers fan watching on the box may just get stirred up enough to go and watch. If we blow it he will pop another can drop back in his comfy chair and say " Aaah I knew it, same old bloody Rovers"