
JHRover
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Everything posted by JHRover
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It's like the Leeds game - the sort of 'attractive' fixture that we should be earmarking as a bumper home crowd - there will be a big away following, Premier League atmosphere, with a bit of luck two sides at the right end of the table - in normal circumstances with 6,000-7,000 away fans we should be looking at 23,000+ on Ewood. What will be done to encourage as many home fans as possible to attend? 1) Game moved to a noon kick off - the result being that lots of people will not want to go as they have to travel from afar early doors, can't go for a pint beforehand, the atmosphere will be more subdued 2) Tickets will only be sold to database members - again limiting the amount of people who can buy 3) Charging category A pricing - simply too expensive for a run of the mill 2nd division game 4) No tickets on the day/£3 matchday surcharge - deters anyone from making a late decision to go 5) Ticket only admission - have to buy in advance or queue in the rain for 20 minutes to get a ticket Every single one of the above the club could do something about to make the game more appealing or accessible to home fans and yet they choose to do all the above.
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None of the big grounds in this league are full. The only ones I can think of that get close are places like Brentford and for the odd game places like Millwall and Swansea but they are small grounds. Look around at the rest of the grounds and many have 10,000+ empty seats on average. It would be nice to get another 2 or 3 thousand on top of our current average as that would haul us into average crowd territory and the place would feel much fuller, but you're asking a lot to do that whilst bumping up prices by 17%, shutting home areas and putting in place ticket only admission and £3 matchday surcharges. Make it as easy as possible for people to attend, don't make them jump through hoops just to get in. The average home gate in this league is about 19000 and so we're about 5000 short of that at present.
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Yeah, though they had a similarly poor start last season and ended up comfortably in the play-offs and in the race for the top 2 most of the season. Early days yet. The surprise was the Sheffield Wednesday defeat as their record at Villa Park under Bruce has been exceptional and it is very rare they lose league games there. Cornerstone of any successful side. He's falling victim to the same sickness in English football as all the 50 something old fashioned managers have - Allardyce, Moyes, Bruce, McCarthy - all shown over time to be exceptionally good at what they do yet the media-geared pro-foreign head coach route is pushing them out. No doubt about it that when/if Villa do sack him off they'll appoint some foreigner who highly likely won't do any better than he has done. Would be great if they went for someone like Dyche when they make a change but we know it won't happen.
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Ipswich and Preston are examples of why FFP has completely failed. Two clubs that by most measures are 'well run' financially in that they don't spend great deals, have models of signing players on the cheap and developing them for profit, yet both are now struggling under young managers and coming under immense pressure as they sit in the bottom 3. Meanwhile the cheats who break FFP rules, the majority of which have got away with no punishment for doing so, are sitting well ahead of those clubs after spending multiple millions more this summer. Birmingham one of them. Any news on that points deduction yet?
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Yes there are rules but a bit of imagination and the rules can be got around. It's all about corresponding areas - clubs cannot charge different prices for fans in the same areas of the ground. So if we decide that away fans are based downstairs in the Darwen End then we have to charge the same price as home fans in the equivalent area e.g. Blackburn End lower tier. We could charge less in the Riverside and Jack Walker. If we decided to put them in the upper tier of the Darwen End then we could charge at the equivalent rate to the Blackburn End upper tier. Bolton often put the away fans upstairs where they can charge away fans more than home fans. We decide to give away fans the cheapest or second cheapest zone of seating when we could move them to a more expensive zone if we wanted to. We're blessed because we've got plenty of space and different places to have away fans and upstairs in the Darwen End is ideal on segregation lines and is of ample capacity for most clubs. We don't do this. Either because we're trying to be nice and not upset anyone or because nobody at the club has any interest in these sort of issues and are quite happy for our fans to pay more than away fans coming to Ewood who get the freedom of the Darwen End and who pay less than home fans in the Jack Walker stand.
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ROVERS VS STOKE CITY
JHRover replied to Dreams of 1995's topic in Blackburn Rovers Fans Messageboard
First goal as ever crucial. If we keep it tight and get 1-0 up I can see them struggling as they have in every other game they've conceded in this season. Their manager struggles when his sides go behind and their fans will get very restless too. If they go ahead then we'll struggle as our game plan will be out of the window and we don't look like a side that has the capacity to come from behind away from home. We need to go with no fear and not pay them too much respect although we've already had it this week about what a good side they are and how they'll get going eventually. Wigan went there and won 3-0 not long ago and I doubt Cook was telling their players what a good side Stoke were. A point away will be a decent result and will keep us ticking over however we could do with pulling a win out of the bag rather than keep taking draws. A point here will make it 3 from 3 which 90 minutes into the Villa game would have been a disappointing return. -
Meanwhile over at Deepdale....
JHRover replied to riverkiller's topic in Blackburn Rovers Fans Messageboard
If they go up they'll have to move to a new ground in the summer as they won't be allowed in the Premier League at Griffin Park. As it stands they are due to move into a new 17,000 seat ground in 2020. -
So about 850 short of the stretch target, although if we get say 350 half season tickets sold then we're about 500 short and at 10,000 season tickets. I don't actually think that is too bad all things considered, e.g. the quite significant price hike. There's only so far you can push season ticket holders at this level in pursuit of increased revenues. I don't expect the club to subsidise cheap tickets as they were 10 years ago in the Premier League, but we're past that point - we no longer have cheap season tickets, we've got competitively priced tickets where some clubs are more expensive and others are cheaper. If revenues are the concern then the club has to do more from a sponsorship/commercial point of view. Stock in the club shop running out in mid-September = unacceptable. More sponsors needed although at least it seems efforts are being put in on that front, the question now is whether these deals being struck with companies like Watson Ramsbottom, 10 Bet and Totally Wicked are lucrative going rate sponsorships or are we missing out on what other clubs get? Interesting going to Derby on Tuesday and I look around their stadium and they are awash with large companies sponsoring them. Their digital boards have companies like Greggs advertising, Bavaria beer, Toyota - large national/international brands. I don't understand how/why Derby can attract such sponsors and we cannot. Greggs have 3-4 shops in Blackburn alone. Very few companies based at Guide, Whitebirk or Darwen have sponsorship in place at Rovers. More to be done.
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Meanwhile over at Deepdale....
JHRover replied to riverkiller's topic in Blackburn Rovers Fans Messageboard
Ultimately though it comes down to investment not crowds, although it could be argued that those clubs that attract the rich benefactors are usually those with bigger crowds or potential for bigger crowds. Bournemouth/Watford/Fulham the sort of clubs that don't get big crowds yet they chucked a fair bit of money at it and succeeded. Bolton/Preston have no money or at least owners who won't put serious money into buying decent players so will likely struggle irrespective of whether 10,000 or 15,000 turn up to watch. Brentford very much a special case as their model is so unique that they manage to improve and recruit exceptionally well despite having their best players poached each year. Suppose we're sort of the middle ground. Our owners won't spend on the level some will, yet it seems they have more ability or willingness to spend than people like Anderson at Bolton, Hemmings at Preston or whoever is running Wigan these days. I don't know whether we should be grateful for that or not. I'd like to think had we done what PNE did last season and gone very close to the play-offs that Venkys would have chucked some money the manager's way to try and go one better this season but it seems for whatever reason that hasn't happened at PNE. Hemmings is another 'billionaire' on paper yet it seems most of his wealth is tied up in property etc. He's also knocking on in his 80s so he and his family probably have one eye on what is going to happen after he goes. Davies at Bolton and Whelan at Wigan and even ourselves with the wretched Walkers - examples where popular owners when they pass away or prepare to do their families aren't as keen on funding the football club afterwards. -
Meanwhile over at Deepdale....
JHRover replied to riverkiller's topic in Blackburn Rovers Fans Messageboard
They won a solitary FA Cup in 1938, other than that their other 3 major trophies were way back in the first couple of years of the Football League. -
Meanwhile over at Deepdale....
JHRover replied to riverkiller's topic in Blackburn Rovers Fans Messageboard
Seems to be a bit of controversy around their proposed new training ground at Ingol. They went through a very public and drawn out planning process and rallied supporters behind them to get permission to build over the golf club there with a new training ground and hundreds of new houses yet nothing seems to have happened since. The club insist that things are progressing and it will get built but one or two are suggesting that the priority is on getting the lucrative housing built. I don't see them as a good side. Perhaps not a bottom 3 side but they certainly overachieved last year in going close to the play-offs and haven't really looked like they've strengthened since then. Not sure Neil is as good a manager as some think - he got off to a flyer at Norwich and took them up but the longer he was there the worse they got and again at Preston he inherited a decent side from Grayson, built on that and now they seem to be in a decline. -
Brockhall is probably 20-30 minute drive from Ewood, on the other side of Blackburn. Not an easy place to find unless you have directions or are familiar with the area as it isn't signposted well from the nearby A59. Rovers own 2 sites in Brockhall village. The older site is at 'the bottom' e.g. you go through the village gates through the housing and down a hill. This is today the 'academy' where the juniors and scholars are based and Rovers even own or used to own a few houses down there for the younger lads to live in. This site is actually the largest in area but the building is smaller. The 1st team used this facility up until Mark Hughes was manager when he decided to switch them. The newer site is at the 'top' and can be seen when driving into the village from the main road. It is less well hidden and whilst this was originally designed as the academy is now the senior training centre. This is where the first team are based with the U23s and usually is where the press conferences take place and players new to the club have their photos taken. The building here is bigger and most importantly features an indoor pitch and things like a swimming pool and canteen. Quite an impressive facility I would think by most standards even now at 20 years old. However many clubs have caught up over the last 10-20 years as really we've stood still in terms of investment into our facilities whilst other clubs have spent millions developing new purpose built facilities. The likes of Brighton, Southampton, Wolves etc. have by many accounts superb facilities too. It is interesting though that the likes of Preston, Burnley and Wigan are still talking about spending money on new facilities and lag way behind us in standard. You can see the two sites on google maps if you click on satellite view and search Brockhall Village. The senior centre is to the south of the village where the large white building is, the academy is to the north of the village where the pitches are roughly in a hexagonal layout. One thing I've always been amazed by is how hidden the senior training centre is from afar. The building is a huge white metal thing that should be visible for miles around in the middle of the Ribble Valley yet whenever I go somewhere that way like Hurst Green or Salesbury you can't see it. Must have been part of the planning to keep it hidden away. I suspect the club would like to combine the two sites into one but I honestly can't see how this would be feasible on either of the current sites. Neither is big enough for everything that we need with a Category A academy. We would probably have to move elsewhere onto a new purpose built all in one site for that to happen, though I could see the benefits in terms of managing less sites.
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I personally doubt Mowbray would ever have seen £6 million or whatever it was on one player if that player didn't fit very strict criteria. I think the money was there to be spent only if the person it was being spent on was a sound financial investment highly likely to deliver a return. People say we could have spent £3 million on 2 proven ready made players but the problem there is that the wages would have been much higher and Venkys probably wouldn't have sanctioned it. I'm starting to look at the Brereton signing as the modern day Rhodes. Someone somewhere at Venkys end agreed to chuck a large amount in extra on one player, in theory we might have been better spreading that across 3 or 4 new players rather than bringing in loans but I very much doubt, as with Rhodes, that money was available to spread across a few players.
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Watched the 2nd half of Sheffield United and Birmingham. Sheff Utd were very poor and the last 15-20 minutes was like our first half at Derby with Birmingham all over them and they struggled to put 2 passes together. Sheff Utd seem to blow hot and cold. One week dishing out heavy beatings the next quite a poor side.
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Not sure how bringing in Wells and Hemed can possibly fit in with their upcoming transfer embargo. Unless they've agreed miraculously low wages with Burnley/Brighton or have been able to sign up to big wages.
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We need to become a top-end Championship club then. Rolling over and selling our best players to so-called bigger clubs in this league will get us nowhere.
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Derby vs Rovers post match thread
JHRover replied to J*B's topic in Blackburn Rovers Fans Messageboard
In the end delighted to come away with a 0-0, and it seems so was the manager. The first time this season I was genuinely pleased with a point. Villa and Ipswich were gutting whilst draws against Millwall and Reading left disappointment that we hadn't done more at home and won those games. If you'd have offered me a point at kick off I'd have shook hands on it. At half time I'd have bitten your arm off. My eyebrows were raised at 7pm when I saw the team selection and that turned out to be justified. It is rare that a manager makes a tactical change after 30 minutes especially Mowbray but a goal was inevitable and I suppose it is a good sign that he realised we were on the rack and that he had to do something quickly to alleviate the pressure and it worked to a degree. Second half was better although still a nailbiting and stressful experience to sit through. I worry about our set-piece effectiveness as we rarely seem to cause serious trouble from corners or free kicks (unless Mulgrew manages to hit the target). Last night our primary source of goalscoring threat was likely to be from a corner or free kick yet we didn't cause any problems from them. We've been to Derby a few times in recent seasons and gone down with a whimper so to see us hanging on and seeing the game through and coming home with something was a pleasant change. First half was a horror. Armstrong, Dack, Smallwood and Conway completely anonymous. -
There's positives and negatives to be had. The obvious positives are that we've only lost 1 in 8, defensively aside from the 45 against Bristol City we appear to be as solid as anyone else, we seem to be quite a resolute and cohesive side that is battling in every game and is hard to beat. We seem to have adjusted to life in a higher league quite comfortably, though you could say the same for Wigan and Rotherham. Its early days and I hope that we're not rueing those dropped points v Ipswich and Villa later on in the season. At the moment we're putting a lot into it and have that momentum from last season. Hopefully when the season is reaching the mid-way stage we're not going to run out of steam etc. The critical way of looking at things is that we're not really doing enough going forward - against Derby, Villa, Millwall, Brentford we didn't really create much at all and I still worry we're too reliant upon the Dack/Graham double act with very little coming from elsewhere. Frustrating thing is that if we get a point at Stoke on Saturday people will rightly argue that 3 draws from Villa home and Derby/Stoke away is a very reasonable return, yet we'll be no better off than had we held on for 2 minutes v Villa and been beaten twice this week. So its pleasing to not be losing with regularity but its the wins that separate teams out and if we'd have held out when ahead we'd be sitting pretty now.
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Darwen End Closure / New Singing Section
JHRover replied to pk1875's topic in Blackburn Rovers Fans Messageboard
Sadly I'm leaning towards agreeing with you on this. It seems a real opportunity has been missed. Dress it up however you want but to have 26000+ home fans on vs Oxford to having 11,000 a week on in the league above suggests something has gone wrong somewhere. Nobody in their right minds ever expected those people to all return this season but for 15,000 to have seemingly disappeared into the ether tells me an opportunity has been missed. Even if we had tempted 1 in 6 of that lot to return this season we'd be looking at pushing 14,000 home fans a week which would be decent. I'm not interested in historical statistics or what we were doing 30-40 years ago at this level. Break it down into simple terms - we had 26000+ home fans on vs Oxford, and now we're getting 11,000-12,000 in a higher league. We haven't captured many, if any, of those people and enticed them to come back. Unfortunately when you put prices up across the board you are immediately limiting your capacity to sell more. 17% hike, an increase on 1875 club membership and the piece de resistance of not only retaining but then increasing the matchday ticket surcharge to £3, as £2 wasn't enough, has to go down as one of the most insane and unjustifiable things I have ever seen. -
Darwen End Closure / New Singing Section
JHRover replied to pk1875's topic in Blackburn Rovers Fans Messageboard
I've never spoken to Waggott and don't expect to as I don't get involved with that sort of thing but I'd be very interested to hear his views on the away fan attendances and how those stack up with his reasoning for shutting the DE to home fans to enable larger away followings. So far we've had pitiful away followings from Millwall, Brentford and Reading (amounting to about 1000 between them) and a decent 4000 from Villa (which would have been higher had the game not been on TV) and those 4000 could easily have been accommodated in the DE without the need to close it to home fans. We've also predictably got Leeds and Preston at noon kick offs which everyone could see coming and will almost certainly knock a couple of thousand off each away following. Preston will bring about 4000 possibly less if they are struggling as their big day out at Ewood is no longer a novelty. Genuinely interested to see/hear which clubs Waggott is expecting to bring 4000+ between now and the end of the season. Possibly Stoke or Middlesbrough if going well for promotion but not many others. I'd have preferred it if he was just honest and said that it was being done to save money/hassle by condensing home fans and not needing to open the DE each week. Couple of interesting things I've seen recently. When we played Villa on Saturday Rovers opened the DE upper tier for 20 odd Villa fans. Despite there being hundreds of empty seats in the lower tier. God knows how much it would have cost in stewarding, cleaning and catering to open the upper tier for just 20 odd people but it was completely unnecessary and likely cost the club money. I notice Wigan play Hull tonight and are advertising cash only turnstiles are open in 2 stands. Any reason we can't do similar rather than ticket only with a £3 surcharge on matchday? I wonder who will get more walk-on fans? -
Bournemouth, Huddersfield and Cardiff the next 3. I think they need at least 6 points from those games or they're in serious trouble. Even if they got 6 points they'd still only have 7 points from 8 games which is likely to be relegation form especially given the kind fixtures they've had. I'll be delighted if they get 3 points or less out of those.
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No wins in 16 for the Clarets.
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Meanwhile over at Deepdale....
JHRover replied to riverkiller's topic in Blackburn Rovers Fans Messageboard
A lot of unhappiness at a lack of investment into the playing squad. Same thing happened a while back when Moyes and Davies had them knocking on the door of the Premier League and they ended up walking out and they sold most of their decent players and ended up sliding into League One. I was surprised how well they did last season, this season was always likely to be more of a struggle. Neil is one of those managers who seems to set off doing really well and then it starts to unravel. Same thing happened for him at Norwich. On the flip side if Hemmings is getting ready to sell he might be able to market them as a relatively well run, debt free established Championship club with a new training ground approved and a decent little stadium. £70 million is pie in the sky stuff but if he reduced that they might attract interest from wealthy people. Other small clubs like Barnsley and Wigan have managed to attract foreign interest despite hardly being attractive clubs to get involved with. -
We had a spell at Bolton where we couldn't go wrong and ended up regularly winning there. In recent times however our results there have been atrocious (though our results against all our local rivals seem to have nosedived recently). Bad, bad memories of that place. Allardyce's last game getting beat with 10 men, getting done 4-0 under Bowyer, our late defeat under Lambert when their players weren't even being paid, their Emile Heskey inspired turnaround, the injury time defeat 1-0 on a Tuesday night. Yes it has been a succession of misery there. The most recent happy memory was Jason Roberts' last minute winner way back under Hughes' management. We seem to be a different animal these days so hopefully that will come to an end but certainly have grown to dread heading to that awful stadium.
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Derby County vs Rovers, Tues 18th Sept
JHRover replied to Mike E's topic in Blackburn Rovers Fans Messageboard
Derby away is one of those games. We never seem to take that many, and for some reason (intentional?) we always seem to go there midweek. Last 3 or 4 times now we've only had 500 or so there for the midweekers. As you say I think the majority of those 500 are the ones who go to every game or most games regardless of the ticket price, weather, tv coverage etc.