We were never interested in him and still aren't?

Why are you trying to justify your position on this by twisting JH's words round? Bottom line is we have been promoted and the squad is barely any stronger than the one which finished last Season. In my personal view we needed 5 players in specific positions who were good enough to come straight into and improve the first team. We've got one of those so far, Armstrong. Even in TM's own words he has spoken in terms both of bringing in up to four more players than what we have now, and bringing in Championship experience. Neither of which has happened to date. We've supposedly had offers in for various players all summer none of which would appear to have been accepted so if you accept that money was available all along and the strange practice of making public large bids when it was too late to get the deals done in any event wasn't all smoke and mirrors then seemingly something has gone sadly awry with our recruitment this summer, either in terms of completely misjudging the level of the market initially or merely in terms of getting deals over the line.

As far as I know There's no cameras up yet and the signs have been for deterrent value only to date but that doesn't necessarily mean that wardens won't suddenly turn up tonight or before one of the other games and start dishing out tickets!.

I wouldn't have thought it was anything whatsoever to do with the EFL or the Premier League. Clubs can insert a clause making the move permanently binding on both parties or not. It's entirely up to them. Have to say it's all coming across as one excuse after another and has done for quite some time. Then at the end of the window we can claim we gave it "a right good go" but were beaten by circumstances beyond our control etc. I'm not blaming TM as he seems to be a man of integrity and I don't think he would intentionally lead the fans down the garden path. Between Waggott and the recruitment department though they don't half have to get their act into gear .

Yep. Not sure what's happened this summer as we seem to be completely incapable of getting deals over the line. It sounds completely bizarre that We're only now considering the implications of something That's been mentioned on here many times, I.e. is a loan with an option to purchase binding or can either Club pull out? As someone else said, this surely isn't a difficult concept, either it's written into the deal that the transfer is a binding obligation on both sides or it isn't. It seems equally bizarre that it only now seems to be dawning on us that it is an extremely risky proposition waiting until the last minute hoping that Premier League Clubs will let their youngsters out on loan. Reading between the lines of the article we've decided to move on from Brereton and the best we can hope for before the weekend is someone in on Loan. Better not be bloody Cameron Jerome.

Hope it stays as it is, in fact closes before the season starts. There's no actual reason why Clubs can't get their business done in time no matter when the window starts and finishes.

That would just about put the tin hat on this pretty dreadful transfer window. Strongly linked throughout the loan period with the purchase of an £8m star of the future and end up with a washed up has been or in fact "never was". Would remind me of the signing of Nathan Delfouneso.

Semantics apart that's what I meant by "a loan with a view". Still don't see the attraction from the selling Clubs point of view. Why not keep the player in the interim then just strike an agreement to sell in January?

Spot on. The general consensus was it was a poor permanent window and we haven't signed anyone yet. I still can't see any attraction for selling Clubs in letting players go on loans with a view although in Forests case with Brereton I suspect We're getting close to paying significantly over the odds for the privilege.

I think everyone is getting way too hung up about the potential fee for Brereton. Firstly a headline fee of £8m would have a very strong element of performance related add ons incorporated in I think you have to trust the manager's judgement on the player and if he turns out to be a success it wouldn't really matter whether the fee was 6m, 8m, 10m or 12m, we'd still be able to sell him at a profit. It's a bit optimistic to hope that Brereton will be the next Shearer and we would be able to sell him for 5x the purchase price if required. However if he were to sign does as well as Jordan Rhodes for us and scores a goal every other game for 3 seasons and we can also sell him at a mark up it'd still be fairly happy days.

Yep, completely agree I remarked a month or two back he's "a bit Besty". I would hope any release clause put into his new contract is sufficiently high to deter interest from all but the biggest Premier League sides.

Not this again. Not getting drawn into it other than to say that having other inadequate players like Jason Lowe pretending to be a midfielder held us back far more than Rhodes and Gestede ever did.

Good post. I wasn't at the game yesterday but you reflect nearly all my thoughts on the season to date. I agree with you on Evans, I think him and Smallwood are too similar as a pairing but out of the two I prefer Smallwood. Not quite as much of a fan of Graham as you are, I think he's very in and out and doesn't have many inbetween games, his timing is either spot on and everything sticks with him or he has days where he looks way off the pace and he ends up playing the opponent rather than the ball. Twenty or thirty minutes at the end of games might actually suit him very well.

Raya? Nyambe? You're having a laugh.

2nd goal of the season for Rhodes away to Sheff Utd. Other than when he plays us would be good to see him back to form.

Pleased Armstrong wasn't dropped after scoring 2 goals. Not so pleased with the return of Evans Smallwood and Bennett. Let's see if TM got it right.

I do think we need 2 strikers personally. That said I would also regard at least one wide player as being of equal priority. Maybe TM sees Armstrong and these two as being able to come in from wide positions. Quite surprised we haven't started shifting our deadwood out on loan as well.

No one in today, another self imposed mini deadline missed. Hope We're not bemoaning the same thing on loan deadline day.

Doubt they'd be able to survive until the end of January! ? We seemingly weren't able to persuade Clubs to sell players to us during the permanent window and I can't really see the situation has changed much, I personally don't see the attraction for selling Clubs in letting us have the use of their players for several months before we buy them and they receive a fee but nevertheless we need to try and make something happen. We can't risk drawing another blank like we did in the permanent window, our survival could potentially depend on it.

With all due respect to those concerned we heard all this sort of talk during the permanent window. We need players in in certain positions, it isn't curing cancer or pioneering time travel it's signing two or three football players in positions we need. We don't need to hear ad infinitum once again how difficult it is to bring players in, we just need to read that the players we need have signed on the dotted line. That's only half the battle anyway, if we do bring players in There's no guarantee they'll be a success but That's a debate for another day.........hopefully.

Wouldn't have thought Sharpe meant it literally or intentionally. It would be pretty poor form to infer TM was a miserable so and so who never willingly volunteered any info etc.

Not much sign of the loan player we were more or less promised before the weekend. Looks like the loan window is moving with the same well oiled efficiency as our dealings during the permanent window. Get ready for us to make a last minute bid to loan someone with an option to purchase for 10m when it is too physically late to complete any deal on deadline day incidentally it was very strange terminology used when Sharpe ran the story on Monday whereby TM "admitted" there'd be another signing before weekend. Almost as if it was being done against his better judgement. You'd usually save that sort of terminology for bad news I.e. TM "admitted" player X would have to be sold to balance the books etc. Presumably just a slip of the pen by Sharpe. Doesn't appear to be happening anyway.

It's surely no more or no less risky than any other permanent transfer completed during the permanent window. It works both ways as well, if either Club had the option to pull out of a deal at an agreed price, the buying Club could get screwed over if the player had a storming loan period and the selling Club decided to pull out.

and panic!

If We would have to pay big fees for either, I would chance most youngsters over Gallagher as we alreaky know he's ordinary at best in my view.