Why would they be trying to spite us?

Why did he have no reason to doubt processes that have hardly led to a successful 10 years?

Mowbray could argue having had full ssasons of promotion in League 1, 15th, 11th, 15th and 8th that progress was made somewhat, as much as I am glad that he has gone. I don't really see the distinction between his journey and the project. Both are doomed to fail because of people above them. Mowbray is a half decent Championship manager, Tomasson so far likewise across the season. A project would involve regular trading of assets and reinvestment and that doesnt happen because of the owners.

Im not sure that we have the players to suit loads of crosses, but we are better as a counter attacking team I think. In Brereton, Dolan, Hedges, Thomas and Gallagher we have players who can get forward quickly and we have Dack who has a good choice of pass and the ability to run in from deep.

Our primary objective is to develop and let leave for free. We have an over-reliance on our academy, as good as it is.

You would drop Vale even though he was "good" on Monday? That team is frightening, Dack has to play. I would struggle to justify dropping Brereton just because as poor as he has been lately, he is still as likely to score as anyone there.

I'm not sure he did, he made up the numbers I think off the back of no reinvestment of the Armstrong money.

Why are Broughton and Senior so different? If Broughton is a "football man" then he hasn't really shown it so far.

Kaminski/Pears Rankin Costello Carter Wharton Pickering Travis Buckley Thomas Dack Dolan Brereton Not an easy pick. Buckley doesn't deserve to play but neither does Morton. Brereton lucky to play but our only striking possibility who scores goals. Dolan deserves a start.

You thought he had a "good game?" He was practically invisible, I think I read that he had 12 touches and I certainly don't remember him doing well with the ball whenever he had it. The Wigan defence had it easy. You mentioned his movement specifically, it is not good. More than once, he clogged up all of the space that prevented Thomas from running into it. He does not deserve the opportunity to play with him, he actually hindered Thomas more than once. Gallagher did nothing when he came on either, I don't doubt his limitations but he has proven at least some use, Vale never has.

Good to avoid lucrative promotions apparently.

By the way, there ws a lot of discussion prior to the game that Vale perhaps at least offered good movement, @JoeH was very strong on that. His movement was absolutely dreadful again and often broke down moves.

Dan Butterworth missed a penalty against Accy Stanley tonight.

I think Pickering is on par with both and I prefer full backs on their natural side.

The return of Brittain now creates a selection dilemma with Rankin Costello playing well. Many seem in favour of moving Rankin Costello into midfield but I dont really agree. His most impressive feature aside from the Birmingham game has been his defensive ability for me. Out wide, he isnt particularly tricky and he isnt quick nor is he a brilliant crosser. The likes of Thomas, Hedges and Dolan have more individuality and speed. He is tidy technically but playing in central midfield is totally different, far more frantic ad Buckley has found who is far better technically. I would choose to keep Rankin Costello in the side and Brittain can wait his turn.

It wont be a successful appeal but it would be interesting to see the announcement should that happen. Surely they would read the room and knock on the head one of the typical stupid videos you often see on social media.

Brereton was very poor and has got a lot of deserved criticism and even questions about his committment. I also agree with the comments about the higher ups not doing an adequate job. But there were times when he was essentially left wing back in a back 6 when we have literally the worst striker in the league up top. Surely that can't be right.

When we were off form, Mowbray was rightly criticised. We hardly invested loads in January, our main signing instantly got injured, aside from that the loan signing of Giles is comparable to Thomas, chuck in Hedges and Zeefuik on loan and its hardly a huge difference. I am in agreement of the flaws throughout the club, Broughton/Waggott and of course the owners all bigger problems than Tomasson but he isnt exempt now from criticism just as Mowbray wasnt. My point isn't that we should be banging in the goals. My point is that we don't look like a team that can attack at all. I am not accepting that our current squad shouldnt be capable of creating more than 1 decent chance at home to bottom of the league Wigan who usually leak goals. We for months havent played like a team that knows how it is expected to attack or works on its attacking. If we created chances and then missed them, maybe the point about the lack of a goalscorer would be more pertinent, indeed we didnt have Dack available last season. Also, why are we not a threat from set pieces? If you genuinely believe that this side is attacking as well as it could do with the personnel we have then fair enough, the manager cant be blamed.

I think your argument isn't helped by the childish opening line, I haven't asked for a managerial change for a start. I have never once defended those above the manager either, the whole club is and always has been dysfunctional. The jury is very much out on Broughton who has not performed well enough in the transfer market, Waggott is a clown and of course the biggest problem will always be the owners. But that doesn't mean that it isn't acceptable in a home game against a terrible team who are bottom of the league has been conceding loads of goals to not create a proper chance after the fifth minute. It's not as if we had a number of chances and failed to take them. We don't look like a team that is well drilled on how to score goals. There surely is enough dynamism at the managers disposal with the likes of Dolan, Hedges, Thomas etc to at least show a bit more urgency. We have Dack who will sniff out chances if we could get near the opposition goal. There is no interchanging between the attacking players, they don't look like they train together. Then there is set pieces, is there a less effective team from set pieces in the league than us. It is drab even beyond any misgivings right at the top.

Really difficult to put together a reasonable team at the moment, can't see a change in the back 4 and keeper although against good attackers I can see plenty of danger coming our way. Travis to keep his place, Dack to keep his, Dolan deserves a start then beyond that, struggling. No Vale involvement under any circumstances. Can only see a comfortable defeat.

What chances? We had one proper one, that is it really. Vale is still considerably poorer than the admittedly limited alternatives. The football on offer last season was far more entertaining than this season which is as dull as anything going back to Appleton, lets see if we finish higher or lower then we can judge comparatively as ultimately the league table is the important thing. Playing the same way? Lacking in seemingly a game plan, lacking in tempo, not creating chances and ultimately not looking overly arsed, creating one proper chance. Tomasson has a point with what he says re the dysfunctional running of the club, make no mistake, but he is not doing his job very well in the last couple of months himself. I can only presume that you are taking the piss. That squad contained Steele, Greer, Brown, Henley, Lowe, Akpan, Guthrie, Emnes, Bennett and Feeney. This one has Kaminski, Wharton, Ayala, Pickering, Buckley, Travis, Dolan, Brereton and Gallagher who all featured regularly for a team that finished 8th last season, added to by Hyam and the returning Dack. How is that core worse than the team Coyle left or performing miracles to be safe from relegation?

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There are a lot of players with flaws and the whole club is dysfunctional. No doubt about it. But these players after a good start are playing far more dysfunctionally than they were last season. Tomasson deserves lots of criticism for how we have been playing especially tonight and there is no excuse for playing Vale.

The Brereton comment is a criticism of our terrible owners. Anyone but Vale. Dolan for one. Brereton central, even bloody Gallagher. Even Leonard. No doubting that he has limited options, Vale is the worst of them. He would struggle in League 2. But even with all that, there is no excuse for such a performance, one of many in recent weeks. We are not improving.

We did enough to beat them comfortably? Most did ok? What game was you watching?