100%. A key problem is that the club (as well as a number on here which exacerbates the problem) seemingly cannot fathom that supporters of any club differ wildly in their desire to attend matches and their personal circumstances. Many supporters choose to see this as an opportunity to criticise and berate other supporters, showing a lack of empathy. The club just sees this as an uncontrollable condition that they try and tackle through aggressive committment questioning campaigns.

I don't think he lost his way under Mowbray, it seems the convenient excuse to make him a scapegoat for everything. He has obviously got ability but he often allows games to pass him by from an attacking sense and you even look at some of the games when he does catch the eye, it is often through his energy and enthusiasm rather than creating or providing a goal threat, take QPR at home, he was really important in the win without ever looking like scoring or creating a goal. He is only young so as a member of the squad he offers something for sure and any fee would likely be swallowed up anyway so it is most likely in our best interests to keep him. He needs to try and warrant a regular starting place first and foremost and go from there. He does clearly have raw attributes to build on but he needs to provide more of a goal threat and create more chances which hopefully will come with time, this season our best run came with Khadra and Brereton as the attacking threats, I think Dolan missed a few games with a knock if I remember correctly.

Are there not valid reasons to "moan" or indeed constructively criticise the continuously ineffective pricing and advertising strategies, as seen by the poor sales? I would like to think that Waggott has more of an open mind in regards to the poor sales figures and indeed the criticisms from supporters but based on his actions, seemingly not.

Surely if anything it would make sense that people on here who are "decrying" the terrible sales figures haven't or can't buy one due to the very same pricing and advertising campaigns to which are rightfully being lambasted?

Did Nyambe not initially join up with Namibia before pulling out, in which case I would assume that he doesn't report back on day 1? Either way, I very much doubt that he would report until if and when he did sign a new deal and it was all finalised.

I wouldn't assume that they all would, because if any don't, we are short of players. I would loan Vale to League 1 or 2 and see if he can score regularly there off the back of a poor spell in non league. I think we could have all predicted that they wouldn't bother. Personally looking to schedule? Empty words.

@J*B said similar, there should be two considerations. Firstly, decide what types of companies we would not be willing to advertise. I personally don't why betting companies are not considered (especially if they offer more money as has been I think said by Waggott previously) yet vaping companies are, but it is a conundrum either way. Then pick the best financial deal ignoring any that are not seen as ethically acceptable. I am similar to you in that I don't have any issue personally with vaping companies or indeed betting companies, I don't buy a shirt regardless of sponsor, you seemingly do either way. But many do so the club must consider potential reaction not only because it cannot afford to upset any fans but also because any increased income from advertising deals may be offset by less people willing Whether any sponsor is from down the road or indeed from Timbuktu is totally irrelevant, everything should revert back to generating the most possible money within the moral framework to which we have deemed acceptable.

Who they support is ultimately irrelevant as far as I concerned. But the envelope works is not a valid comparison as there is no moral question there.

I think Dolan is over rated somewhat, he is full of energy but not lightning fast, he is incredibly inconsistent, he is repeatedly over elaborate and his end product is more often than not lacking. That being said, our squad is already very small and Dolan is young and does certainly have talent. I dont think a team would pay more than 2 or 3 million for him and I would be very reluctant to sell as a result, even though I would like a more productive wide men for that left side with Dolan again competing for a place rather than being one of the first names on the team sheet. He certainly isnt Premier League quality.

You already know, I think between 8 and 10 I would say. Weve had this discussion a million times, the difference is because I dont think we can assume that all of the players that you suggested can be assumed to be of sufficient quality because we are short if any arent. We know this difference in opinion and dont need to again have the same debate so you dont need to respond by saying which players youd promote. The quote was: "We know you are keen to know when we will return to Ewood Park and it's something I am personally looking to plan into my schedule this coming season." Doesn't say try but either way, I am not surprised that they couldnt be arsed and didnt bother.

@1864roverite in regards to your long post. Firstly some of the Waggott jokes are exactly that. That being said, I do think that to an extent that Waggott has pulled the wool over your eyes in that youve started to judge based on what youve heard rather than what has actually been done. No one would ever say that this is the case as youd never know. He seems like someone who has given his time and made a real effort so I can understand why it has happened. It also is likely incompetence rather than anything more sinister that has overseen many of his mistakes. Youve listed the history of Venkys yet seem to be questioning the support of people for being critical of them which I think is totally unfair. You also clearly share low expectations if merely paying the bills/not becoming Derby/Bury (which were totally different situations) is something that warrants appreciation. You seem to be assured based on what he told you that he does understand the ticketing situation and seem confident that he can improve it. Such low attendances, prices towards the top of the Championship in a somewhat deprived area and repeatedly using advertising campaigns that antagonise as well as repeatedly (as seen this week) having to go back on themselves following poor uptake do not show that sense of learning from mistakes. There is a sliding scale between low prices to increase quanitity and higher prices and a sweet spot in between. Waggott repeatedly goes too far towards the latter and has obliterated the season ticket base. You shouldnt need to make an appointment to make a judgement. What has actually happened is what should be judged, not what is said in meetings with fans in which Waggott has pre prepared for and is naturally going to paint things in a positive and ultimately biased light. Plans are necessary but equally worthless until carried out successfully. Repeatedly failing to be specific on the details of why you are so confident coupled with provocative counter arguments essentially asking people to meet Waggott rather than judging on what has actually happened only further aggravate people IMO. You also repeatedly dismiss the value of peoples opinions on here as if we are all claiming to be experts to pass comment on a messageboard yet you still choose to read them anyway.

We cant just assume that all or indeed a majority of that youth will all successfully progress to being Championship standard though, history tells us that. We need a lot more than 3 or 4 signings.

I would be pleasantly surprised if we spent 3m on a player this summer. Twine seems a real talent although it wouldnt make sense to spend so much on someone who operates in a similar role to Dack. Cantwell likes to play from the left so would potentially fit in although as previously stated I dont see that one happening either.

Why does the fact that its a local business with local people (sounds very League of Gentlemen) seemingly in your head outrank and dismiss questions people have about the morals of advertising what Totally Wicked sell?

The expectation/ambition should be improvement and if we finish above 8th there is only obviously one place above that doesn't lead to a top 6 finish. Improvement on Mowbray was the reason that we rightfully binned him. I don't see it at this stage with where we stand but lets see what the summer brings.

You seem particularly keen to defend the club at every single available opportunity at the moment but some of your above list is very questionable. Firstly, is Tomasson a coup purely as a manager? He is an appointment that has us all excited and intrigued but it may be premature to consider it a coup at this stage. Is there any indication that Venkys are bothered? They couldn't be arsed coming to Ewood last season as they said they would. The last year in particular has been full of cut backs with the taps turned on. Merely offsetting losses is something they have to do to continue in situ, not something they do out of ambition. You have twisted the pitch thing, people have rightly criticised their decision to go back on their word and not fund the £2m revamp promised last season, which they can't even hide behind the usual FFP excuse that people seem keen to protect them using. Again this season, that revamp isn't happening. Who said we won't sell 2k season tickets? Your mate Waggott has again got the prices and the advertising campaign dismally wrong, but did anyone specify that we wouldn't sell 2k and if so who? We won't have a budget doesn't make sense, a minus £10-15m budget as seen last season is still a budget. And as I've mentioned, the money has very much dried up in the last year. Lets see how much we spend and how much we receive this summer. A few bits on the manager, again lets wait and see on Tomasson, we didn't get one of the preferred choices of Farke/Carvalhal/Dyche with a proven track record but the choice still seems an exciting one. But did people fearing another terrible appointment surprise you or was it unjustified considering Venkys track record?

Hard not to take this rumour with a giant pinch of salt, most likely can be categorized as Nixon again talking shite. Typically, the rumour is very non committal saying with the article saying that "the move will be hard to make" allowing Nixon to cover all bases. It also says that "skipper Darragh Lenihan and fellow defender Ryan Nyambe are considering new offers" which suggests that Nixon has not got his finger on the pulse! I would be sceptical in general, he has a year to go on his deal so why would they loan him during that period to another Championship club? Would we be able to afford his wages and would he be interested? On the player, I would be somewhat split but he is a very talented player that could potentially add some flair and real talent to our team. Very inconsistent though, has struggled in the last couple of years and seemingly has baggage and questions over attitude, and Norwich fans are not very complimentary. The article also indicates further budget cuts, again I have no idea how Nixon could possibly know that we have £3m but I would say that if we spent that and recouped £20m for Brereton, it would be another frustrating summer of cutbacks showing a lack of ambition from the owners. It wouldn't surprise me to see such a deficit but lets see on that, I wouldn't take what Nixon says as gospel by any means.

Plenty of questions that could be asked both at Burnley, here at Rovers and at numerous clubs that have decided to change manager and/or personnel behind the scenes. None of which is relevant to my point about their current squad.

Obviously not but they have a transfer window to add to what they have. I wouldnt want Rankin Costello or Brown at right back here but again im sure that we will sign a new right back. My point was that even if Pope and Cornet are sold that there is plenty of quality at this level there unfortunately.

It is, but I am sure that he is also well aware that its best to build a team in a way that gets the best out of our best players. He has a full season to work on the tactical approach so it seems to be to be totally illogical to choose now to start with a 4-4-2 because it is supposedly easier. You could equally say that it would make sense to continue with the 5 at the back that we played for most of last season, or the 4-2-3-1 that we finished the season with. Either way, none are simple in that all will require instructions on various things.

Would you say that any of those assets aside from Cornet, Pope and Weghorst (who hasn't done too well anyway) will likely leave out of interest? I think a lot of those others fall into a category of being potentially excellent Championship players that I am not sure would attract the required interest to make a move back to the Premier League. McNeill and Collins are talented and young but both would require high fees and the former had a poor season whilst the latter impressed when he did play but at times struggled to get past Tarkowski and Mee when they were fit. I think the likes of Taylor, Brownhill and Roberts are all top Championship players but I don't see any of them being picked up by Premier League teams. Burnley unfortunately also seem to have a backbone of Championship experience in Hennessey, Lowton, Rodriguez, Vydra, Barnes and Westwood when fit as well as the others I mentioned so any kids that come in may freshen it up rather than add to an inexperienced team. I am not sure it is always a terrible idea simply looking at historical examples, look at Forest who got promoted with players like Djed Spence and James Garner on loan who were aged 20 at the start of the season as well as Keinan Davis and Max Lowe who are slightly older but the former in particular had not played many senior minutes. Or take the Swansea side with Wilmot, Guehi, Gallagher, Brewster etc from 3 seasons ago that made the play offs. Loans are never ideal and it is difficult to get the better ones with not much to go off when deciding who to target but teams seem to more and more often be able to succeed in spite of having a clutch of kids on loan. I do agree that under 23 football is not very useful and is a terrible barometer for preparing for senior football in general hence why I always think that performing well at that level is far from a guarantee that any player in question can cope at senior level. But senior football has also changed and the standard of the Championship is pretty poor so there are plenty of examples (including at Rovers) of loanees with minimal prior experience standing out at this level. Teams in general seem to have lower average ages and more experienced players who love a tackle seem to be coming rarer and rarer. Burnley as I mentioned above also have quite a few players with serious experience at Championship players so any loanees may be coming into a very good structure.

Why is 4-4-2 more simple than any other? And why would it be the expected choice considering that our best player would not fit into it?

I don't think that it is fair to criticise Waggott and praise Broughton for the managerial search as if anyone could possibly conclude that Waggott messed things up and Houghton came to save the day, the process seemed overly convoluted but had got to/past the final interview stage just as Broughton came in, who even said as such. It seems like we are basing it on Waggott's reputation to judge it as such just to be able to criticise him further. But undoubtedly Waggott needs to be removed for overseeing continuously appalling attempts at fan re-engagement.

Abuse him? Or just play him out of position sometimes. Definitely a genuine case whereby he was poorly used overall but nothing like a bit of hyperbole.

Incorrect. Or as you would describe it, "waffle."