This isn’t intended as a thorough summary of the meeting, but here’s what I took away from it. This is from memory, not my notes, please consider this my observation and interpretations. Transfer Window Disappointing window, what happened? Mowbray disappointed we couldn’t get anyone in. Wasn’t for want of trying. Spoke about the difficulties around this for 25 minutes. Shocked by wage demands and asking prices. Won’t break wage structure. Got close on some deals. Has to field questions from Venkys as to why he hasn’t bought anyone You said defenders are coming, while we got some loanees, why do Venky’s seem reluctant to spend on defensive reinforcements, but happy to spend elsewhere? Mowbray angry We’ve changed goalkeeper, brought in Adarabioyo, Lenihan is good enough to get us promoted, loves Nyambe’s attitude and believes he can make a top player. We can’t bring in an entire new defence, doesn’t know what people expect. Clarified point that it was not a question aimed it Mowbray, it was about long term strategy and a reluctance from the owners, money made available for expensive attackers We aren’t going to find a centre half who can, pass, tackle, head and read the game – they will be in the premier league. Its an important position, seemed to concede we could do with investing there, but stated it is difficult. Walton wasn’t a target, fell into our laps at the end of the window. Others fell away. Knows he makes the odd mistake like all keepers, had the option to replace in January. Are we not going to be back at square one in the summer as loans and contract expire? Yes. Mulgrew has another year (just an inkling, but he didn’t seem overly happy with the Mulgrew situation) Bell has an option in the clubs favour for another year Aiming for 2 keepers Centre halves massively important, would like to work a bit of magic with city and get Adarabioyo on loan again Budget was around £1.3 million, they can always ask for more Are defenders and goalkeepers a priority in the summer window? Yes. Commercial Why do we have a third kit? We are not Man Utd with faceless fans. It is exploitative. Waggott Angry – I would never exploit anyone Grey kit has sold brilliantly Sold out 2 runs of 3rd kit Mowbray looked at Slaven Bilic and neither of them could believe we had been allowed to play in those kits as it was difficult to tell the grey and West Broms kit apart. So many teams in this league play in white, and grey is close to white Didn’t ever want to have to borrow a kit Mowbray doesn’t decide who wears what kit Waggott, the kit men, people from umbro and people from marketing sit down and review kits and decide on them Might use same 3rd kit next year Steve, you made a comment, "We couldn't have done more, where is everyone?" How do you think a remark like that is received by supporters, who already feel they have been treated with contempt for a decade? No disrespect intended – it was meant to be a rallying cry We fell short of the target (10k target, sold just over 8k season tickets, £325k shortfall) Went to bat for the fans with the owners to ensure no price hike Tries to understand economic pressures within the area Oxford game was an event, not a match. People haven’t been back – not core support as highlighted by them going on the pitch Scrap the Waggott tax. Planning around catering People come to watch the game, not because of pies and Bovril. It’s a barrier. And expoits fans and stops spur of the moment decisions I don’t see it that way, we have the 1875 membership, that helps limit the cost of category A+ games Lots of discussion round this – would consider it Can’t make every game a tenner Needs signoff from the owners on pricing issues and initiatives Speaks to people at away games who still wont set foot in Ewood – understands why, hopes to re-engage The 10k giveaway was a bad one wasn’t it? It can’t have lead to a single sale. Yes it was a bad idea. Almost done as an afterthought Why is their primary use of the electronic advertising boards to promote Venky’s brand? What commercial value does this have to the club? Not the primary function Much of the advertising remains unsold so can account for this – it has a value. Same with the Riverside. Answered concisely and well. If and when we sell advertising, we will see less of the Venky’s logo Stadium Can we move away fans into the lower tier? Fans forum have been relentless on this issue Lots of discussion on this – opinions mixed Marginal gains V loss of atmosphere Opposition fans can sometimes seem to suck the ball into the net Looking at getting home fans behind both goals Refillable glasses and greener options Sodexo looking into it. Aware of H&S issues Lack of suitable allergen friendly options, and limited knowledge of catering staff Disappointing. Will raise with Sodexo. Improvements to lounges mentioned in the intro. Finance/Ownership FFP position Over to Cheston – As it stands we are FFP compliant. We don’t have to report this yet, our accounting period is at the end of June so there is time to fix any issues if needs be. Wasn’t giving anything away or getting into specifics. Almost defensive. Clarified the three year period FFP relates to Has there been any talk of a sale/buy back of Ewood? Cheston: No Waggott interjected: Not at all happy! This has come from the fans forum. I’ve been misinterpreted. We said we were aware of all options available to us and suddenly we are selling Dack and selling Ewood. Had to field calls from the EFL as this got out and hadn’t been discussed with them They are aware of the ACV status So while its not imminent, is it something that may be looked at down the line should we need to remain FFP compliant? That’s hypothetical at the moment We’d need to sit down with all stakeholder. There are legal ramifications. We are a long way off that point. I’m very concerned about the levels of debt, and the recent losses reported are unsustainable. The owners are committed. They can’t do any more. We are very tightly audited, and the accounts cause no concern. They have made guarantees to continue funding, no reason to expect any change any time soon. Desai made a promise to "absolutely respect Jack Walker's legacy." As we approach the Venky's 10 year anniversary, what is your assessment of her delivery on that promise? Waggott not happy We are working with the trust on securing a heritage grant. This club has great history and needs to be celebrated more. We’ve maintained the statue. Disappointing turnout for a well publicised plea to clean the grave, which Waggott was one of only 10 people to attend. He is all about respect. Part of his ethos. All employees have to subscribe to it. If anyone feels he has disrespected them, please approach him. They can take it offline. I think the disrespect to Jack’s legacy is more around how the we have gone from being the model example of how to run a town club, took us to the top of the pile, and we’ve had a decade of decline and never got near promotion in that time. Can’t comment on what went on before I got here Humble people etc etc We want to get promoted and so do the owners Tony Parkes There was a great deal of understanding around this. Rob Coar and Lynsey Talbot had both been looking at fitting tributes and been in touch with the Parkes family. Bayes did a good job of explaining Tony’s current condition. He has recorded his acceptance speech for the next hall of fame class already. Tony will be at the game tomorrow, and I wouldn’t be surprised if something was announced then. Happily there seems to be a real willingness for the club to do what ever they can for Tony. After the meeting Spoke to Waggott – he was amiable and professional, and as always appeared open to discussion. Stated that a lot of the questions were aimed at Venky’s and they weren’t there to answer. Mentioned links with HSH (see previous posts of Venky’s welcome or not thread) Knows of the three and their links. Understands why this would be a concern. Isn’t a fan of agents. Won’t go above a 5% agents fee and has lost out on deals because of this stance. Always pays them last and prioritises local contractors, PAYE, HMRC etc. Has been pulled up about it in audits but will continue to keep them as last priority. Mentioned a couple of particularly bad agents and deals. If and when the time comes to replace Mowbray (the way he worded it was ‘If Tony comes to me and tells me he’s had enough’) he will go to market, do his due diligence, and get the best man for the job. I pointed out it wasn’t his integrity or judgement I was questioning. Ultimately they are the owners, I’m doing what I can to make this club successful. Spoke about the attendance issue We spoke at length last time about this too. Mentioned the podcast I did with @Herbie6590 on here, and how positive I was after that. There are a small number of fans reluctantly not attending because of Venkys, a bigger number not attending due to league position and falling out of the habit, and a massive number of potential fans who see football as a TV or streaming experience. Its difficult and there is no magic formula. He is aware of a guy on Facebook who has started his own streaming service where he charges people to watch Rovers games. Spoke about Venkys I said their long term view is unclear. There seemed to be a lot of understanding about what had gone on before. He asked if I thought there was anyone still there from those times before he arrived who I was concerned about. I said yes. He asked me to elaborate. I said obviously people like Lynsey Talbot and Rob Coar were fine and part of the furniture... and then there was Pasha. All he really said about Pasha was “I certainly wouldn’t call Suhail a low level employee.” And something along the lines of ‘He is the owners man and long term business advisor’. He keeps trying to get them to come to a game. I was in the minority of one in the small group of fans involved in this chat who thought this was a bad idea. He mentioned that they were reluctant since they get pelted with a snowball, everyone acknowledged the fanbase had softened. There would be some negativity displayed towards them, but they (me included) would likely be shouted down. I said I didn’t feel they were humble. Waggott said they he had told them “They don’t need to turn up in helicopters or a convey of Rolls Royce’s, just a Mercedes 7 seater with blacked out windows, just come in quietly and watch the game.“ Balajio’s son is football mad. He will be the one signing the cheques one day. They want to get him along and involved. He’s the one at Reading Uni. Other bits and pieces that came up Heritage project sounds great – he wants people to get involved Chapman walks around with a hang dog look on his face. Doesn’t want to play for the u23’s… “Well, if Danny Graham can play for the U23’s you bloody well can!” We could do with that pace he brings. Its his head that’s stopping him. We raved about Nyambe and Travis a bit Brereton hasn’t worked out as we’d have liked It would be great to get promoted even just for a season. He’d want to invest in the infrastructure, get a hotel or something at the back of the Riverside – do something exciting with it, not increase the size. Safe standing a possibility Summary From my point of view, I really want to be able to distinguish between them and the club, and Venky’s. I recognise my refusal to buy a ticket is futile. It harms my enjoyment more than its intended target. When I didn’t go the criticism was ‘You aren’t supporting the team’, when I take up the offer of free tickets it’s ‘You aren’t supporting the club’. I don’t like doing either, despite what you may think @Paul Mani My intention is to buy a season ticket again and sit with my family and friends, providing there aren’t any idiotic decisions taken in the coming weeks. In my opinion Waggott and Mowbray are likeable, committed and honest. I think they have the best of intentions, and that’s not something I’ve been able to say about some of their predecessors. So yeah, I need to make that small commitment. Plenty of positives to take away, but plenty will remain unanswered as long as Venky’s remain remote. These meetings aren’t fit for purpose.

Waggott told me he couldn’t comment on what happened before he arrived. He acknowledged that he understood why it would be a concern. He told me he doesn’t like agents (I’ll go into detail later). The issue here is with Venkys, not Mowbray or Waggott - I like both of them, though don’t agree with absolutely every decision they make. If it’s of no concern to you, then fine. Coyle was a horrendous and damaging appointment, Mowbray worked out. I’m very concerned about who his eventual successor may be and how he will be appointed.

I’ve got that exact feeling every time I’ve spoken to him. He’s so passionate about what he says too. He’s definitely one of the good guys and a real positive at the club. The circumstances of his arrival worry me, but It has paid off on this occasion. He’s a good fit.

Tony Mowbray, Owen Coyle and Paul Lambert are all represented by HSH. HSH has three directors listed with companies house, namely, Stephen Horner, Dave Sheron, and Craig Honeyman. Honeyman is a former director of SEM. Horner and Sheron are both former SEM employees and were named alongside Jerome Anderson in a lawsuit brought about by Gavin McCann, which suggests they work together closely. Why are these people still having significant influence in the running of the club, if Venky’s have ‘learnt their lesson’?

At the moment we are completely reliant on them. I know that. They have put themselves in a position through their own mismanagement where they have to keep ploughing in good money after bad to ensure we remain a going concern. Failure to do so would wipe £200 million off their company value overnight, so it’s not benevolence, it’s sound business strategy for them. Like I stated earlier, these meetings don’t really serve the purpose they were introduced for while they are in the current format. The big question I wanted answering last night was this: Tony Mowbray, Owen Coyle and Paul Lambert are all represented by HSH. All of their appointments were a little strange. HSH has three directors listed with companies house, namely, Stephen Horner, Dave Sheron, and Craig Honeyman. Honeyman is a former director of SEM. Horner and Sheron are both former SEM employees and were named alongside Myles’s Daddy in a lawsuit brought about by Gavin McCann, which suggests they work together closely. Why are these people still having significant influence in what happens at the club, if Venkys have indeed learnt from their mistakes?

I don’t think they deserve credit for continuing to fund their own mess. It would certainly be easier to, and in all honesty with Waggott and Mowbray, two people who I like and feel are positive and decent, it’s getting closer. Unfortunately the issues with Venkys I believe remain. I do t think they have learnt a thing.

I answered a question honestly. Like I said, other people in the room were in the same boat but didn’t fancy the hassle. Again, I’ve been consistent and open about it publicly for a long time. Did I stand up, or was that an exaggeration for effect? Yes, I’m sure Jonty or someone else would shower you with tickets. But your 0.005% of Brereton’s fee a year is a small price for the particular piece of moral high ground you like to stand on.

Massive lie. I never stood up. I’ve told him that at previous meetings and he knows full well my thoughts and reasons. I didn’t proudly do anything... if you remember, Waggott mentioned he spoke to people regularly who went away and never went to Ewood. Bayes then asked if a person who previously mentioned they wouldn’t set foot in Ewood at a previous meeting was in the room. They were, but took a load of abuse last time, so they didn’t say anything. I’ve been pretty public in my stance for a good few years. I want to go to games, I don’t feel comfortable financially supporting a regime I despise. If not stumping up £300 a year makes me not a fan in your eyes, I won’t lose any sleep.

I’ll give a more in depth post tomorrow, but my opinions after tonight: My issues are with Venky’s. In its current format there is no opportunity to glean any insight into what their plans or motivations are. Many of the questions posed were directed at them and couldn’t be answered by the spokespeople, and they seemed to annoy them. “I can only speak for what’s happened in the last two years” was a common answer. Much of this was an extension of what the fans forum raise. Waggott and Mowbray both come across as decent and honest. They are clearly trying their best under some difficult circumstances. Some unpopular choices have been made, but they genuinely believe they are for the best. We as fans won’t know we are in a mess with FFP until it happens. So while I’m not sure these meetings are fit for purpose, Mowbray and Waggott were both reassuring.

Don’t entirely agree or disagree with this. I think there is definitely a certain amount of self preservation. Anyone who has spoken out even in the most minor way against Venkys has been quickly relieved of their duties. Towing the line is far more important to them than competency. I don’t think your assessment of Mowbrays character is fair. I’m sure he thinks he is helping us progress as best he can. That said I’m very dubious about the circumstances in which he arrived at the club.

I cannot believe for a minute that he changed his mind about wanting to bring in defenders. It’s not just Mowbray either... there is a pattern. I can’t believe he had 7 million burning a hole in his pocket but decided after the window had closed he wanted to spend it all on Brereton to then hardly ever play him.

It’s a big ask, but it’s not impossible. The problem with gradual improvement and small steps is it can’t carry on for more than a couple of seasons. If we are feeling the pinch due to FFP this window, as appears to be the case, it’s likely the squad will be broken up sooner rather than later. For that reason I’d like to see a bit more urgency. It looks as though we may well fall into a cycle where every three years the squad is decimated as part of a cost cutting exercise, and a slow rebuild begins. It gives us a very narrow window at trying to get promoted, and means another relegation could be on the cards in the not too distant future. I may be miles off, and there is an assumption that Venky’s have anything more than sporadic knee jerk interest in our fortunes. We can’t afford any more bad luck on the injury front. Nyambe, Travis, Armstrong, Downing, Lenihan and Adarabioyo are key players for us now. It’s took longer than some of us wanted to phase out some of the older heads for these lads, but we are now seeing the benefit. We need all of them firing, as well as one or two of the fringe players to step up and make an impact. With a little bit of luck, it’s possible. I should add as well, if Mowbray was to get us in the top 6 it would be a remarkable achievement given the constraints he has to work under. I know I’m in the minority but I think he takes far too much blame for failings in our transfer policy.

There will be plenty. The club make sure of it. These meetings are a requirement set out by the EFL, who as you’d expect are vague enough to allow clubs to do as they wish in regards to how these meetings are structured. Rovers push the boundaries each and every time. The purpose of the meeting is to discuss “significant issues relating to the club”. The representatives they send aren’t wholly appropriate either.

Couldn’t agree more. These meetings are usually attended by the same old faces, and it’s invariably the same old voices asking questions. Be good to see some people from this board there this time round.

No, I mean Venky’s who continue to run is into the ground. If they weren’t here we’d be solvent and likely in the Premier League.

Twitter and BRFCS in absolute meltdown, along with every other social media platform I presume. Mowbray getting absolute pelters, yet hardly a single mention of the word VENKYS. It’s about time people concentrated on the cause, not the symptoms.

I don’t know a great deal about him. Geordie’s aren’t exactly gushing with praise though... https://www.nottinghampost.com/sport/football/transfer-news/forest-transfer-news-atsu-newcastle-3796922

That doesn’t necessarily mean it couldn’t go on transfers. Any fee we paid out would go out in instalments too. Cash flow isn’t the issue. Apparently Venkys are desperate to spend, so £5 million unexpected income should move us £5 million further away from the FFP threshold. Ultimately its three months losses covered, or it could easily earmarked for a signing, it’d just effectively leave us exactly where we are now financially. Depends what way the wind is blowing 7,000 miles away.

That’s a couple of new ones! I just need Efe Ambrose and Pavel Pogrebnyak for a full house at transfer window bingo!

I heard they did from what I would consider a very reliable source. Well placed and without any motive to make mischief. I did some digging and couldn’t find any link. Double checked with said source who confirmed he was just going of what he had been told and didn’t know for sure. I concluded there was nothing in that, but a little bit of digging threw up far bigger concerns.

I don’t think he’s worth £3 million at this point in time. But in a market where Gallagher is being heralded as good value, he is worth 3 times that. If Brereton is any indication of the market I would be wanting about a billion for Rothwell.

Can we stop pretending that we have benevolent and competent owners, and that if it wasn’t for Tony Mowbray we’d be signing a whole host of brilliant footballers. Problems in transfer activity go well beyond the manager. If that wasn’t the case he’d be out of a job.

There are so many factors as to why a young kid will or won’t ‘make it’, and the margins are so fine. It’s a long time since I watched a lot of games below first team level, but in the late 90’s I did. We had an exciting crop then with Duff, Dunn, Taylor, Johnson all coming through in the space of a few years. At that time we were also buying young lads to go in at that level. Two names that really spring to mind for me are David Worrell and Anthony Williams. Both looked the real deal, Williams in particular. I saw him play for Wales U21s and I’d honestly say it was the best goalkeeping performance I’ve ever witnessed. Both went on to have careers in football, but at nowhere near the level I thought they were destined for. Maybe things could have been different, but there isn’t a magic formula.

I believe I have the answer to this, and it’s not a pleasant one.

You say Venky’s were badly advised. How would you feel if it turned out they were still making key decisions based on the recommendations of those responsible for said bad advice? And what if those people who did the bad advising were still profiting from their involvement? Be really interested to hear yours and others thoughts on this.