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Yep, and that was us 12 months ago. You need the raw quality for, say, top 4 but an average team can bungle top 6 (like Blackpool and Huddersfield) We just happen to be one of the teams that is on for a poor season unless this squad gels and improves with time. 13th-15th at best. At the end of the day the club is in purgatory, relegation and collapse to League Two like Bolton might be the best thing for the club to shock it out of stasis and force Venkys to sell. I seriously doubt anyone would see a viable business model in the club and actively want to buy it though. Clubs in the South East like Bournemouth, Brentford, Brighton are much better 'franchises' to invest in.

Hmmm pushed a few straight back into the box today - just that Stoke don’t really have a striker with instinct Agree, that I think he’s a decent keeper though, and clearly better than Calamity

He pushes the ball straight back out in front of him. Lucky he wasn't punished today.

I think he's poor. Coin toss between him and Pears. Not the major issue though. Cantwell and Alebiosu apart we lack any real quality anywhere over the pitch. That Emerald Isle Chap who thought Ohashi would get 15-20 goals this season has gone a bit quiet.

Oh god I remember going to those was a weird vibe

He just lacked real pace, apart from that he could have been a regular in thst team. He had a good football brain.

I rate Toth, he has a good knack of pushing the ball out of the danger zone when making saves which is a novel idea that Pears never grasped

"If my Aunty had balls......"

I don’t usually put the boot in on our players, but I’ve slated Kargbo and De Neve this week. Fair play to both. Nice finish from Kargbo today. Another solid performance from Cantwell. Kind of reminds me of when Sven made Beckham captain. No one expected it or really agreed with it, but bought the best out of him. Can see that in TC. Fighting hard for the team. Good to see after he had his critics last season.

Ipswich result stands, referee knows what a penalty is midweek and suddenly you're thinking "we'll be alright this season, but won't pull up any trees".

Toth is a good solid keeper. Hasn't done much wrong

I think Pickering has done really well at LCB when hes played there. Not seen so much of Riberio there.

Wish we had the Stoke keeper, it'd make a world of difference. One of the best I've seen, including the Prem.

Looks more of an overlap player to me.

Pickering and Ribeiro are too small to play CB.

But it won't!

Yep, it wouldn't take much convincing for me to swap managers with them.

Not based on that performance, or quite a few of their recent ones. Robins was excellent at Coventry, time will tell if he can replicate that success at Stoke.

Gudjohansen offers nothing. An absolute donkey with poor control. Ohashi has his limitations but is vastly more effective.

De Neuve totally changed the game. Not been his biggest fan but on that showing deserves to start the next game.

And couple of championship quality players in January...

No we didnt. Apart from the result not standing there were still 10- 15 mins to go.

Stoke don't look anything special. Yet they're third. Just shows a bit of ambition and a good appointment goes far

We definitely needed that point, you can take the positives from the comeback and having a chance to win it, had we got nothing that sinking feeling would have been heightened even more

Under Val we will struggle, but we are not nailed on to go down...Ipswich result stands and it's a different story.