Looks like Rothwell has stretched his groin as a direct result of the pitch. 😡

Yes

Phew!

Let’s hope this isn’t serious

Based on the evidence to date, demographics and age/mortality I think your hardcore support numbers are overestimated. We have 2,500 hardcore right now, while the ST numbers will go up based on the family multiplier effect. Our household has three long-term season ticket holders, no season pass holders and one active iFollow account. Going back next season depends on a number of factors. In no particular order: - Football - Restrictions on who I am allowed to sit with - Restrictions on where I am allowed to sit (we may have the curiosity of certain stands being full and fans shifted) - Restrictions on if and how I can watch, interact, celebrate, enjoy - Price - Whether I think I’m being taken the piss out of I’m a long standing supporter who has stuck by all the was through this Venkyrrhoea but have never considered myself a die hard. I’d like to think of myself as Tier 2 (if hardcore is Tier 1). If I’m wobbling then Tier 3 is a non-starter and Tier 4 (growth) a pipe dream.

That’s exactly what live football is about. 50% of the experience is what happens on the pitch and 50% is who you are watching with (and 0% politics - but that’s another debate). Does a goal matter as much if you can’t celebrate like an idiot with your family or mates? To survive (let alone be successful) without the TV revenue that PL clubs ‘enjoy’ (like drug-dependent addicts ‘enjoy’ opiate) we need those fair-weather hangers on. There just aren’t the numbers of died-in-the-wool fans like there used to be. These floating fans want to be entertained and care about value for money in a way that the hardcore don’t. Mowbray isn’t delivering the former and Waggott isn’t delivering that latter - quite the opposite. If anything the hardcore are being asked to keep digging deeper and deeper and forgive more and more in order to be a committed fan. This is the line coming out of the club. And while we have this entrenchment by the club, pretending all is well and that there is nothing more they can do, nothing is going to change. Embrace the lifeblood (there has been zero reward or incentive for long-standing loyalty under Venkys - unwavering support is taken for granted) and grow the club with innovative and imaginative offers to get bums on seats.

My wife says the same whenever I watch the snooker.

Yes. The Facebook groups are typical of all social media. Virtue signalling over who is the best fan drains out any naysayers who are regularly subjected to verbal abuse so stop contributing. This site may be somewhat the reverse of that but there is certainly more of a split of opinions on here than a complete one-way street. Also if someone abuses someone on here they are swiftly dealt with while on Fb they are roundly patted on the back. Just you watch the shift over there when Mowbray does eventually leave: “his time was up”, “he’d taken us as far as he could”. Dare to say that while he is here though and you are a “stupid c*nt who needs to go and support Burnley”.

Quick snapshot of where we are as of this morning. It will be interesting to see the position by the end of the weekend if we manage to win today.

Great post. I would just change the last word for “Blackburn people” (and I acknowledge the surrounding area ofc). He has never given me the impression that he understands the people he is dealing with. John Williams in contrast got that spot on - even if he did have a better budget.

Fully agree and it’s very sad to see that you feel this way. When you and I agree, it’s very telling of the precariousness of the situation. If Waggott or any of his minions are reading, please take note. He needs to do whatever it takes to get numbers back once it is possible to do so. He says Venkys care about this club? This is the chance for them to walk his talk by subsidising our recovery. Waggott should be front and centre of a campaign to lobby the football authorities to suspend FFP sanctions for three years after fans are allowed to return. In the meantime get (and keep) fans onside by keeping them informed of the progress you are making. People love this club but they are not fools and they will not simply put up with inaction and excuses. Let alone fans themselves being guilted, shamed and blamed.

I’ve been giving this some thought and it isn’t really clear what the future of stadium viewing looks like for Rovers fans, and for football supporters in general. When the doors do eventually reopen - which, under this government, could be a very long time indeed - what will clubs be left with in terms of a, let’s call them a, Customer-base? Under the current administration, it’s almost certain that prices will increase - again. While other clubs may offer deals or incentives to get people back in the ground IMHO it is hugely unlikely that Rovers would do the same. Waggott has consistently resisted calls for price reductions, genuine match offers* to increase footfall and has instead already shown that price rises for the most faithful fans are the easiest way to raise money. I expect he will of course play pauper and insist that there is no other way and that real fans will rise up and support the club in it’s hour of need. (Contracts to Smallwood and Hart may not come from the same budget but for many fans it is incongruous to suggest that the two are not to be linked). *The last time I recall a league game for £10 was the Oxford game and, despite the opportunity, he failed to capitalise on those numbers and made the mistake of assuming that Championship football was enough of a draw to get players back. So let’s get down to brass tacks. What price point might look like value for money for anyone but the “anypricers”? Yes, we all want to watch but for many fans the post-lockdown financial situation may be precarious. For others disillusioned with Mowbray and out of the habit, there may need to be something in the way of financial encouragement to continue to sign up for a season ticket rather than, say, cherry-pick matches. A Taking Back Ewood campaign could never be more timely. Reaching out to those who didn’t automatically renew for this season. Absolute minimum, holding season ticket seats for any which lapses this season. Right now, for those who didn’t buy a Season Pass, they are paying £10 per game so could watch every league game, home and away, for £460 (not that there are any cup games to worry about). So there’s that. There’s also the potential for clubs to continue to work out a deal with iFollow - maybe all non-3pm games are shown, maybe all of them. It would certainly be a way to get money back in the coffers but would also likely impact ST purchases. Or would it? Anyone who has bought ST or even match tickets tends to do so because of the matchday experience. You could well see fans go to home games but would also be willing to pay for iFollow for away games rather than travel. Maybe a ST deal with an iFollow away subscription could be a sell? Maybe iFollow STs could be available as well as real ones? Although it may not even be in the hands of clubs. At the other extreme is Waggott’s prerogative. This season, with no guaranteed games it was £399 for a lower stand seat (with Riverside and JW the same price - obviously not sustainable). JW Upper was £459 - £499. These will absolutely have to be frozen minimum as I cannot see how he could go any further than that without it being self-sabotage. Even those prices are too high to realistically grow the attendance. With a couple of teenagers thrown in, it could be over £600. With 2,500 fans due a discount of £169. Assuming no games are played, this means a shortfall of £422,500 (and I’d expect most to be adult tickets). On the basis that they may get to 6,000 fans next season (without a change of manager or marquee signing) that means an increase of £121 per ticket to break even - a lower tier ticket (including the Riverside at £520!!!* Add the kids on and it’s potentially over £750. That’s commercial suicide for a club like Rovers. (Remind me how much this guy gets paid again?) **Just for comparison, the breakeven price rise for 7,500 new buyers next season is £56 (target 10,000 ST holders). So that’s still over £450 for a lower tier ticket. That’s ten quid shy of what people paid for every game, home and away, for their whole family. Is this a reasonable post-covid price? It isn’t particularly imaginative. Without a bums-on-seats, longer-term strategy, or without some kind of TV/iFollow tie-in we could be looking at some very worrying income figures indeed next season. Personally I think Waggott will stick to his current modus operandi and put prices up while calling on fans to show commitment. Meanwhile, in parallel, will (allegedly) laugh at fans who suggest a new manager is needed. Covid could not have happened at a worse time or under worse custodians. All the “better fans” can bleat and pontificate all they like but everyone suffers. Worrying times.

Well that smacks of “someone to push the lads” rather than an actual first teamer. Project Mediocrity rumbles on for another season.

I think he would but he might have to hand over to Warren for the half time analysis.

You’ve just contradicted yourself. For that exact reason, we aren’t in any way improved, it’s just a lot quieter. Both in the boardroom and in the stands (COVID notwithstanding). You are right though, we won’t change anything. We just have to hope that something does and sooner rather than later, certainly before we are dragged into a relegation fight, otherwise everything good Mowbray has done will be wasted. We are stuck with Venkys until they decide otherwise but in a little corner of Blackburn there is still a bit of green field, with seats pointed at it, for people to watch football - with all of its emotion and drama. Venkys don’t influence what the players do on a match day, that’s down to the manager selecting, instructing and motivating them and the fans demanding the best from them. It doesn’t feel, right now, as though they are being selected, instructed or motivated well enough by the current manager. He has taken us as far as he is capable of, it just depends if Venkys have taken us as far as they want to.

Bet nobody at the club was being paid 10-15 times the average local salary back in those milk-less days though, Gav. The sad fact is that a lot of people have packed it in.

Poor old Marine. If this were a boxing match the referee would have stopped it by now. Some of their lads already look to have thrown the towel in. Has an U23 feel about it rather than a cup tie.

That’s another great point. “He’s no Kean or Coyle” sums up the problem. And it isn’t necessarily their fault - even if they were taken on young, “Venkys Rovers” is the only Rovers they’ve ever really known. Prior to these buffoons, just in my time, the club has had Allardyce, Hughes, Souness, Hodgson, Dalglish, McKay - this is the benchmark, not Kean and Coyle. Sadly those in charge are helping to keep our aspirations and ambitions low and our reality a miserable one - and we should be grateful for that. Even grateful to Venkys. Maybe if they were paying me £300k per year I might! In my life time Rovers have always, always, punched above our weight. Under this lot, our weight is dropping like an Atkins fanatic and we’ve barely got a punch between us - and furthermore we’d better shut up, pay up and like it.

Disagree with the final sentence Kamy. He can’t have ever had a job so secure in his life. He has already given us our worst ever run of games (last season) since the war (I didn’t check back further) and nothing changed. He makes excuses and even at this point I doubt he will think he has done anything wrong. If the only person with any clout with the owners won’t hear a bad word against him where exactly is the pressure to leave going to come from? It certainly isn’t the terraces - even when we are allowed back!

Agree with your post. The thing is that how can we all believe he is the good guy when he has managed to get to this position which he now won’t walk away from. It’s a contradiction. If I were Mowbray and bulletproof at a club that I didn’t support I’d probably do the same thing but I wouldn’t expect people to think I was somehow honourable. The longer he is here the more harm is done as our club sinks deeper into a malaise. When you combine that with Gav’s post, and Waggott’s lack of ability to grow our fanbase rather than squeeze the sponge until it has only air left, it is only a matter of time before our club folds due to a lack of interest.

Strikes me that they see a couple of hundred grand for an U23 player sale as important income and a outgoing loanee as a wage saved. Sad times in the “think small-time” era of our club. I seem to recall Mowbray saying that he had to tell Venkys to keep their money in their pocket while Project Slow Build was the best way forward. Just my opinion but the club seems to be two entities. The club itself run like a League Two outfit (by Waggott) scrimping and saving and getting by (trading youngsters and cutting costs for things like the stadium and pitch), with a separate department for first team matters (headed up by Mowbray). Both separately reporting into the owners, with different budgets and targets. It would explain quite a bit about the behaviours. The trouble is you can’t have it both ways. If money is being wasted on first team failure it is doubly damning for ticket sales. The club seemingly don’t need the money (first team spend/waste) and the quality doesn’t excite fans enough to sell tickets. Meanwhile the prices continue to rise to cover running costs. The first team is everything and cannot be divorced from the rest of the club. They need to get fans onside and you do that by demonstrating that success for the first team is the single aim for the club. That requires holding the manager to account. The manager’s failure to bring that success or at least excitement/enjoyment to the first team directly impacts the chairman’s balance sheet. The former must be responsible to the latter and changes able to be made when necessary, with a single target from which everything else follows. I get that this is a fictional, straw-man, fan-theory argument but it’s just my opinion.

Not often you see the poll this one-sided...

I think ‘bored’ is exactly the word. Between them they’ve taken all of the fun out of it.

Poll now added but suggest keep discussion in this thread.

Not to take away from Tyrone’s thread. Discussion here...