RevidgeBlue

That tends to be my view as well hence why I said in my original post IF we're still where we are now relative to other Clubs in Jan. If we do our usual under Mowbray and hit a death spiral and are seven or eight points outside the play offs by mid Jan then I think the situation is completely different and I'd probably agree with you. But if everyone is still bunched up in Jan and we're still within touching distance of third you're giving up the chance of a crack at the play offs for what, £1m a player in the cases of RN DL and JR? How much do you think they'd fetch with 6 months left on their contracts?

MP is only fishing, and only pops up after a win. Wasn't much sign of him after the Fulham game. I shouldn't have bitten really..

Agree with your last sentence. Not sure about the rest of your post. Of course we can "replace" anyone. The question is, can we replace them with the same sort of quality? The only one of the 4 I think we possibly could is Lenihan. The other 3 I think to do so you're talking millions in each instance and as RN, JR, and DL are into the last few months of their contracts I don't see anyone offering more than relative buttons for them at this stage. The other thing you have to bear in mind is if they've got deals lined up as a free agent in summer, we can't force them to leave. I might be wrong but I don't see any significant overall benefit from them leaving in Jan at all.

Why, unless Mowbray gets us promoted via the play offs it doesn't prove any such thing. All of the above have had way more success than Mowbray in recent years despite the odd blip. Are we ignoring Mowbray's record at Middlesbrough, Celtic and Coventry then? I'd love Jokanovic here. Could be sensational with this group of players.

Said "conspiracy" would also need the co-operation of all the players.

I wouldn't bother Leftwinger, you're talking complete sense on the issue but no-one seems prepared to listen. Players also have clauses written into their contracts providing for overall pay reductions if relegated. However that doesn't mean they're going out deliberately trying to achieve that end or lose every game either.

1864, I know you are going on the basis of what Waggott has told you and I don't doubt contracts have been offered but in my opinion this talk of a "wage ceiling" is absolute tosh. There's may have been an attempt to impose some sort of ceiling post the recent FFP debacle but there's no way in the world that players like Gallagher and Ayala's existing wages would fit within the notional "wage structure" mentioned and imo players salaries should reflect their value to the Club taking into account their contribution on the pitch, the likely cost of rreplacement and probable value if sold. There has to be a large degree of flexibility, it simply doesn't work otherwise.

Haven't read the recommendations in full but I fear the proposals to levy a tax on PL Clubs will be met by fierce resistance and will only hasten many of them splitting away from the EFL completely and the formation of the repugnant European Super League. Otherwise seem to be some sensible proposals though.

The main problem was SW and TM not recognising and prioritising our main assets and not sorting the situation out at least 18 months ago. Any efforts now are likely to be akin to shutting the stable door after the horse has bolted although there should be a fair bit more wiggle room now with the sale of Armstrong and the accounting exercise on the STC. The fact nothing has yet happened would again indicate the players won't sign for Waggot or Mowbray or both.

Exactly.

Really don't understand your non stop defence of the manager. Travis had hardly played for months before making that solitary appearance at Sheff Utd in which Smallwood was sent off and rumours had been circulating in the local press about him going out on loan. Similarly with Wharton, with the benefit of hindsight, events conspired in our favour. There was no way he was getting a look in without so many injuries. Indeed most on here were of the view that he had no or little future at the Club without ever having seen him play and wanted him loaned out again or sold.

Any sales in January would be cutting off our nose to spite our face and put paid to any outside chance of sneaking into the play offs. The squad is paper thin as it is and we really need net additions not losses. I think we're at the stage where if we can still be where we are now relative to everyone else in January we would be in such an unexpectedly good position we would have to consider rolling the dice by not selling anyone in an attempt to make the play offs this season. If anyone did go, Lenihan is the one that would probably affect us the least if Wharton and Ayala could stay fit. I think we could also just about cope with the loss of Rothwell. The loss of Brereton would leave us absolutely bereft in attack however and we'll never get another RB at this level as good as Nyambe imo. Says it all that Waggott has had one job to do in recent months in getting said players signed up and has so far been unable to secure a single one of them. Well worth £300k p.a.

The way I remember it is that we had been lowballing Clubs all summer and had failed to land anyone at all of note. Then it appeared as though TM panicking and under pressure to sign someone, went back to the owners for more money towards the end of the window and separate bids of £7m and £5m were made for Brereton and Freeman respectively 48 hours before the window shut. Brereton got over the line, Freeman didn't. Then as you would expect for a Club of our then size, Mowbray mothballed his £7m asset for 18 months. 🙄

Really enjoyed last night. I thought the Sheffield Utd performance was the best of Mowbray's tenure at that point due to the use of genuine wide men in their correct positions and last night probably topped that. And the best thing about it for me apart from the result and performance was it came from all eleven of the starting line up being OUR own players and them excelling. In fact in terms of a starting line up being easy to get behind and identify with, for me that was by far the easiest during Mowbray's time here. - All our OWN players and no messing about trying to shoe horn loanees in to try and keep parent Clubs happy - Everyone contributing fully and no professional lead swingers in the side because they're amongst the manager's favourites like Evans and Bennett - No - one over the hill in the side because they're amongst the manager's favourites like Graham in his last season and a half here or Downing in his second season here Thought Pickering, Wharton and Dolan were particularly impressive. I've been banging the drum about Wharton since we saw him last season but what a player he looks. Thank goodness a severe injury crisis forced Mowbray's hand into grudgingly giving him a chance last season and that he now looks like he could be a mainstay of the side for years to come as opposed to being the new Jack O Connell. Echoes of Smallwood getting himself sent off at Sheff Utd. when we looked poised to send Travis out on loan. So where do we go from here? Technically we're in a great position, three points behind third, with one of the "big 3" misfiring badly. Like mustard I still don't think Mowbray is the man to take us into the play offs but I'm similarly here ready waiting and eager to consume lashings of humble pie if he does. We need to find a lot more consistency and go to Stoke on Saturday and lay down a marker and come away with a thumping win. Not worry about what the opposition are going to do and put in a first half no show like at Ashton Gate.

Spot on. Absobloody- lately.

Couldn't disagree more. JRC isn't fit to lace Nyambe's boots at full back and if it's fair to say that Nyambe is somewhat injury prone then JRC has been an absolute crock. (So far) My guess is that if the roles were reversed and JRC was in the team but refusing to sign a new deal up to press then you'd still be toeing the Club line and saying you preferred Nyambe to make it look as if the failure to tie the player down on a new deal wasn't a big issue.

Why are you asking him for hard evidence when you won't provide any for your assertion BB was a "Balaji purchase"

Well, we would be "an average Championship Club" if we didn't have multi billionaire owners and Mowbray would have had to contend with "limited resources" had said owners not put in c £20m p.a. in during his tenure. Our total income including the owners input is well above average but we are performing like a relative minnow due to having a substandard manager and coaching staff.

Great post, and to compound it all, Bennett got really precious if anyone took him to task on his performances

Just off the top of my head, West Ham? Watford? Look at the number of times that the admirable Steve Gibson at Boro has had to try and roll the dice to achieve success over the years. We're currently above them in the table, I wouldn't say that makes Venky's better owners than Steve Gibson.

Quite correct. Like I said, you will never succeed with a poor manager no matter how good the owners, or no matter how much money you throw at it. As a point of order I didn't say our owners were "excellent" owners, it would be hard to argue that on their track record to date. I do believe however they are genuinely committed to the Club and they do seem to have a remarkable capacity to inject as much money into the Club as is currently permissible under the regulations. That is not something you dismiss lightly and you discard it at your peril imo.

I don't watch them every week but personally I don't think it's anything to do with Ronaldo. Solskjaer seems an all round nice bloke but isn't a very good manager to put it mildly. The players obviously had no faith whatsoever in him or his methods. It's a miracle he's survived there as long as he has. I bet even Cardiff wouldn't take him back given the opportunity.

United players falling over themselves today to admit it was their fault Ole got the sack. Is there any more nauseating sight than highly paid professionals who have just got their manager the sack by failing to perform over an extended period queuing up to self flagellate in the media once it's too late. Do it on the bleeding pitch then!

I agree whole heartedlywith you that whilst I (unlike most) am prepared to sit back and wait for a reasonable period to see if these "whispers" come to fruition, the continued employment of Waggott and Mowbray seems to run directly contrary in that regard to any hope of improvement or change. So if "hyperbole" is what it needs to shift him, so be it. You'll never succeed with a poor manager, even if you have excellent owners.

Sorry, couldn't disagree more, there must be tens of players at all levels throughout the Leagues who could run about a bit and chip in the odd goal without costing £5m and costing £20k p.w. in wages. Or anywhere near that. If you were debating buying him today you'd struggle to make a case out for paying £500k for him.