[Archived] Time for 4-4-2?

[Amo]

I know this topic has history, and some have been calling for 4-4-2 for some time, but it's only now that I agree it's time to ditch our current formation. Yes, it's the modern way of playing, and that's because most teams have players suited to it. Our extra man in midfield doesn't give us any advantage, in fact it's a handicap. The lone striker is isolated, we don't keep possession, and teams pass through us with ease. At least, with another striker up front it would support Kalinic or whoever. I'm positive we'd have more of an attacking threat, for the sheer fact that we create bugger all as it is.

We could play something like:

E.Diouf - Grella - Nzonzi - Olsson

Kalinic - Roberts

Two holding midfielders, with Diouf & Olsson running the flanks (would like to see Hoilett taken off the leash too). Roberts running and hold up play will bring Kalinic into the game and get the best out of him. This would, of course, mean dropping Dunn, but from what we've seen so far this season that's no loss.

Now will Sam compromise and allow for this?

Will he ####.

[sweet]

I know this topic has history, and some have been calling for 4-4-2 for some time, but it's only now that I agree it's time to ditch our current formation. Yes, it's the modern way of playing, and that's because most teams have players suited to it. Our extra man in midfield doesn't give us any advantage, in fact it's a handicap. The lone striker is isolated, we don't keep possession, and teams pass through us with ease. At least, with another striker up front it would support Kalinic or whoever. I'm positive we'd have more of an attacking threat, for the sheer fact that we create bugger all as it is.

We could play something like:

E.Diouf - Grella - Nzonzi - Olsson

Kalinic - Roberts

Two holding midfielders, with Diouf & Olsson running the flanks (would like to see Hoilett taken off the leash too). Roberts running and hold up play will bring Kalinic into the game and get the best out of him. This would, of course, mean dropping Dunn, but from what we've seen so far this season that's no loss.

Now will Sam compromise and allow for this?

Will he ####.

Sorry, but whilst I agree we don't have the players for a 4-5-1 to work succesfully, I have to point out you are wrong in your statement that 4-4-2 is the modern way of playing. 4-4-2 is a dying formation, and most teams appy a 4-5-1/4-4-1-1 or 4-3-3. So therefore we rarely have an extra midfield man in the middle.

[Amo]

Sorry, but I whilst I agree we don't have the players for a 4-5-1 to work succesfully, I have to point out you are wrong in your statement that 4-4-2 is the modern way of playing. 4-4-2 is a dying formation, and most teams appy a 4-5-1/4-4-1-1 or 4-3-3.

I WAS talking about 4-5-1.

[B.R.F.C]

Remember calling for this at one point last year possibly...anywho

I'd go 5-3-2 personally...pace at full back to help cover our lack of speed at the back in the middle:

---------------Robbo----------------------

Salgado--Jones--Samba/Nelsen---Givet---Olsson

---------Diouf----Nzonzi---Ped-------------

------------Mame Diouf---Niko--------------

We have used this tactic before and we have the players in the squad to make it work. Olsson proved last year what a good attacking threat he was so lets give him a bloody chance to do so!

[sloth_frattelli]

It doesn't really matter who we play in midfield if we're just gonna lump it over the top of them anyway. From Robbo or any of the defenders to the opposition half seems to be the strategy - hit and hope.

We should play 4-5-1 that can switch to 4-3-3 on the break. For this we'd need speed and stamina on the flanks to provide both attacking support and defending cover.

-----------Robinson-----------

-Salgado--Samba--Jones--Givet-

--------------Grella------------

-----Nzonzi---------Dunn------

Hoillet-----------------Olsson

------------Kalinic-----------

[sweet]

I WAS talking about 4-5-1.

Ahh, sorry, I misread your post. In that case, your post is absolutely correct.

[Sparky Marky]

Grella cannot possibly play for rovers again...He's simply not upto the job...and Dunn? Waste of time that lad is.

[roversfan99]

I think we could work as a 4-5-1 if we want to play that, but its the way Sam is playing, not necessarily the formation. Also players like Emerton, Pedersen and an unfit idea slow us down, give us no protection and leave us lacking in ideas and spark.

We need 2 proper defensive midfielders, this season weve either had a centre back or Pedersen(a waste of space with no idea defensively). Id like to see El Hadji Diouf given a free role, hes been our only attacking force this season of any note and in a free role I think hed be able to support the striker alot more than we are currently. Then id look to use pace down the flanks, why Olsson isnt being played down the left where he was so good last season baffles me, and on the other side i dont mind who is chosen out of Mame Diouf and Hoilett.

Then theres the question of who to play up front. Ideally this is Kalinic and I think if he had the support wed hopefully see a different player. However Sam should consider both Roberts and Benjani if it doesnt work.

Id go for:

Grella Nzonzi

(Mame Diouf EHD Olsson

/Hoilett)

Kalinic

[RibbleValleyRover]

You’re going to get some flack Topman but I have to agree with you.

One of the strongest arguments for not playing a 4-4-2 and instead playing a 5 man midfield is that you:

- Provide more defense for your back four with 5 midfielders.

- You provide more attacking options from out wide (4-5-1 switching to a 4-3-3) or allowing a midfielder to get forward to link up with the lone striker.

Honestly do people feel we look more solid with 5 midfielders? The back four looks under huge pressure even with five in midfield, something that shouldn't really be happening with this formation.

From an attacking point of view our 4-5-1 does not transform into a 4-3-3 when we have the ball, nobody goes forward to link up with the lone man whether its from out wide or a midfielder making forward runs. When on the odd occasion Niko gets the ball there isn’t anyone near him to have any link up play.

I pretty much agree with your lineup there, N'zonzi and Grella/Emerton sitting providing the ball to Diouf and Olsson to make forward runs and crosses. Roberts doing the donkey work and linking up with Niko.

But can you see Sam changing? If we are in the bottom three going into January then we may have to.

[Commondore]

While it would certainly benefit Kalinic, I'm not sure our current squad holds up for a 4-4-2. I definitely wouldn't mind us trying it, but it would be dependent on Grella and N'Zonzi being fit and anchoring up the central midfield and I just don't see that happening... If Goulon turns out to be a revelation we might be in a better situation.

As of now I would rather see us set out our 4-5-1 a bit differently, with central midfielders who actually come forward to support the lone striker once in a while and without our nearly religious commitment to hitting the ball high and long. Also, I really liked the look of the Dioufs manning both wings early in the season. They are both quite irrational and came into the box to support Kalinic well from time to time, I think it should be tried again.

[budha]

Sam played us with 4-4-2 whole spring 2009, and it was only due to Dunn's good form at autumn 2009 we switched to 4-5-1. So I don't think Sam has anything special against a formation. Now that Dunn's form has faded and Pedersen is not delivering anything from behind the striker, I would agree that we have nothing to lose by trying out 4-4-2. Benjani has looked lively and would probably be a good partner for Niko. Couple of defensive minded midfielders in the centre, Diouf + Olsson to wings. That would leave Dunn and Pedersen to bench, but there's nothing else but their reputation that would justify them starting at the moment.

[beerwins]

I dont really care what formation we use as long as we attack more, you play 3 in the middle to control posession, to pick up balls from the defenders hold the ball, give options for passes and support attackers, what is the point in us playing this way when the ball is launched straight over there heads to a lone man with no-one near him.

The way we play is to use the 3 central midfielders to protect the back four while the wide men are supposed to get forward and support the striker which doesnt happen because they are too slow and the ball is played forward too fast, the team ends up sitting too deep inviting pressure onto us. Our main gameplan seems to be get the ball up and around the half way line and win free kicks to set up a launch into the box but when we have no height like yesterday the tactics dont work and that is why we saw the ball being played out from the back along the deck in the second half.

Whatever formation we play I feel we must play with 2 strikers on the pitch because Niko on his own is totally useless and it certainly isnt working.

[ABBEY]

6-0-4

we can sit back and lump it up with a chance of it actually going to a rovers player.

[rigger]

I think that formations should depend upon the opposition for instance agains't Liverpool, I would have gone man for man on Gerrard and Torres with say Nzonzi and Jones, and I would have put pressure on liverpools dodgy central defence by playing roberts and Kalinic. This would have left at the back Salgado, Nelson, Givet, midfield, Dunn, Pederson, Diouf.

[92er]

My short answer is no.

My longer answer is that increasingly during MH's last season with us, he was playing a 4-2-3-1 combination, to both provide more cover for the defence, rather than 4-4-2 and as an effective means of attacking.

What we really need right now is the manager realising he needs to identify those players who he needs to be playing, based both on current form and the success at the end of last season, and then using the most effective means of getting them to perform.

I just do not believe 4-4-2 will be an effective formation for 90 minutes.

[steveo57]

Let's just play football not Hoof Ball ?

[S15]

The system is fine, it's the current style and personnel that isn't working.

[broadsword]

Time for £442 million.

[RIML]

Just a thought - England vs Montenegro. England had plenty of attacking options, two forwards (Crouch & Rooney) two wingers (A Johnson & Young) two wingbacks (Cole & G Johnson) and Gerrard too but they still failed to score.

[des]

if you play the qick long ball then you have to play a 4-4-2

most teams do not play the long quick ball so most teams do not play 4=4=2

4-3-3 work well if you play through the midfield and allow the wide players to move from midfield to attack. However to do this you must play the ball on the floor and keep the ball. Something that at this present time rovers do not do.

[LeChuck]

With Dunny approaching full fitness we have to play 4-5-1, he's a match winner in that free role.

I'd look at a different approach if he's out for a significant period of time again though, Pedersen obviously can't do the same job in his absence.

[Hughesy]

4-3-1-2

Dunn in the hole, behind 2 strikers

[LeChuck]

4-3-1-2

Dunn in the hole, behind 2 strikers

He wouldn't be able to play with freedom though, he'd have to drop back to make up the numbers.

[Hughesy]

He would if those 3 are defensive enough.....Perhaps NZonzi, Diouf & Olsson

I dont see much point in Emerton anymore.

[USRoverME]

why not this....

salgado - 3 of Jones/samba/nelsen/givet - olsson

-------------N. Zonzi -------------------

EH Diouf - M Diouf - Roberts - MGP

5-1-4 in attack. A nice long ball formation. We don't have any midfielders to keep possession anyways, so who cares abotu midfielders. NZonzi only there to clog things up so the fill ins can get back to make up the lines.

in defence drop into a 5-3-2 with EH Diouf and MGP dropping back to cover the mid.

Brilliant football that would be! Surprised Sam hasn't thought of it yet!