Valérien Ismaël: Former Head Coach

[Tom]

Time to start a new thread for manager speculation? I’ll keep this one open for Ismael chatter 

[M_B]

21 minutes ago, JHRover said:

Hughes - no - his time has been and gone and he's managing in the National League. Wouldn't even get a mention in any conversation were it not for his links. It's almost at the point where I expect Carlisle would be grateful if we did take him off their hands given their faltering promotion bid. 

JDT - ridiculous suggestion after what happened last time around. 

Svensson - know nothing about him but a look at Wikipedia suggests nothing in over a year since a short failed spell at Union Berlin. Not at all sure there.

Wagner - maybe a bit of a huff about not getting the job last year when he was linked? Or maybe he's just a very astute bloke who can see what a disgrace this club is and wants nothing to do with it. 

If I didn't know better I'd say they were prepping the ground work for an extended Johnson spell in charge. That's the cheap and easy option which is what this lot are all about. Some might be fine with that due to ex-player syndrome but I don't think we can be so flippant with our Championship status and that applies regardless of tomorrow's result in a must-win game.

Nixon mentioned something on Radio Lancashire after his ridiculous Souness suggestion about Lee Bowyer - I think he knows something there or has heard something. That's exactly the sort of name we'd be speaking to and he knows it. 

Just because he may be seen as the cheap and easy option, doesn't automatically make Johnson the wrong option.

He's probably the best option right now for all the fan base to get behind. 

[JHRover]

17 minutes ago, JBiz said:

“Ismael won’t be leaving because he’s doing the expected job”

 

You seem to be very excited today Josh in replying to my posts, is that the third or fourth time?

Nothing more constructive to add to the discussion than wanting to prove me wrong, or get me to admit I was wrong, with my prediction that Ismael wouldn't be sacked?

If it makes you feel better about this whole sorry mess then I'll give you what you want.

P.S. we still don't know whether he was sacked, it's a toss up between what the Club and Nixon have said.

[RevidgeBlue]

29 minutes ago, JBiz said:

Exactly - it’s not even realistic shots in the dark. Twitter clickbait shite. Should never be shared here. Same with the supposed “rovers insider”… 

Both examples of universal credit lads with time burning a hole in their pocket.

Tbf, he/she is only recycling what fantasy merchant Nixon has claimed I think.

[JHRover]

Just now, M_B said:

Just because he may be seen as the cheap and easy option, doesn't automatically make Johnson the wrong option.

He's probably the best option right now for all the fan base to get behind. 

I don't think we really need to be concerning ourselves with selecting someone the fanbase can 'get behind'. Results and performances will take care of that.

Minor issues such as 'style' of play, past clubs, nice man, nasty bugger, alignment, all go out the window in an emergency situation.

Johnson has no record as a manager and has shown no appetite to be one. This club is on the precipice of a long, long stay in the lower divisions and probably financial implosion. We need a safe pair of hands, urgently, who can somehow find a way of getting us above a point a game from now until the end of the season.

I don't really know who, much less which would come and work for these buffoons, but that doesn't equate to Johnson being the best option.

[M_B]

5 minutes ago, JHRover said:

I don't think we really need to be concerning ourselves with selecting someone the fanbase can 'get behind'. Results and performances will take care of that.

Minor issues such as 'style' of play, past clubs, nice man, nasty bugger, alignment, all go out the window in an emergency situation.

Johnson has no record as a manager and has shown no appetite to be one. This club is on the precipice of a long, long stay in the lower divisions and probably financial implosion. We need a safe pair of hands, urgently, who can somehow find a way of getting us above a point a game from now until the end of the season.

I don't really know who, much less which would come and work for these buffoons, but that doesn't equate to Johnson being the best option.

I didn't say he was the best option, I said being seen as cheap doesn't make him the wrong option. 

He may lose tomorrow which would see the end of it, but if he wins tomorrow and follows up with a result at Norwich, it would seem extremely risky to me to rush into an appointment, unless it's already done. 

[ageoftherover]

I view the appointment through the lens of how much of a splash will be made when the manager is inevitably unable to function in this environment. How much of a spotlight will be put on the chaos here as a result of the managers failure? 

VI's leaving being largely welcomed or understandable means the appointment was a failure. Someone like Gerrard would be a 9. JDT probably a 5 (him being willing to come back would be a filip to the regime). Someone like Karanka would be a 2. Wagner/Svennson also pretty low, maybe a 3 or 4. Id have Hughes pretty high on this scale due to his positive history with the club, maybe an 8. Post your own!

I'd love to be able to evaluate key appointments like this through the lens of football. How will a managers style work with the peices we have? How has a manager has performed in similarly pressurised situations? What is his recent track record? What kind of spirit will he inspire in the lads? But thats sadly not where we're at atm and we need to do what (little) we can to get back to a place where that's possible.

Edited 56 minutes ago by ageoftherover

[simongarnerisgod]

we`ve had 4 managers in one season,a bit of stability then 3 managers in 3 seasons,you would`nt believe there are still venky apologists in the stands would you

[JBiz]

23 minutes ago, JHRover said:

You seem to be very excited today Josh in replying to my posts, is that the third or fourth time?

Nothing more constructive to add to the discussion than wanting to prove me wrong, or get me to admit I was wrong, with my prediction that Ismael wouldn't be sacked?

If it makes you feel better about this whole sorry mess then I'll give you what you want.

P.S. we still don't know whether he was sacked, it's a toss up between what the Club and Nixon have said.

Finally an acknowledgment that you talked absolute bollocks with confidence. In all the years I’ve taken the time to read this website, that’s a first from you.

oh and PS - he’s gone. Only a person intent on covering their own shocking takes would break that down to “did he walk or was he pushed”.

Oh and btw, it’s Joe. The reason why this particular element got me was the constant confidence you spiel regarding the deliberate nature of our problems. 
 

If I’d spent weeks forcing a narrative that turned out to be utter bollox, the first thing I would’ve done is say “sorry lads I got that wrong”.!

 

[Tomphil2]

Nixon is really taking the opportunity to gaslight tonight, take no notice of the blimp.

[onlyonejackwalker]

7 minutes ago, JHRover said:

I don't think we really need to be concerning ourselves with selecting someone the fanbase can 'get behind'. Results and performances will take care of that.

Minor issues such as 'style' of play, past clubs, nice man, nasty bugger, alignment, all go out the window in an emergency situation.

Johnson has no record as a manager and has shown no appetite to be one. This club is on the precipice of a long, long stay in the lower divisions and probably financial implosion. We need a safe pair of hands, urgently, who can somehow find a way of getting us above a point a game from now until the end of the season.

I don't really know who, much less which would come and work for these buffoons, but that doesn't equate to Johnson being the best option.

I wouldn't give it Johnson either.

But I'm also not sure about the 'safe pair of hands' you mention. That normally means someone who has failed multiple times. I don't want a Bruce, Mowbray, or Hughes.

We can't score goals. We don't keep many clean sheets. Who can solve that problem?

There is only one manager i would be very confident could quickly solve that riddle. But we sacked him at the very start of this Venky induced nightmare.

I'd rather go down clapping than booing. It won't happen, but I'd like to see Duff given a chance.

He's a ten times better player than any of our squad will ever be, so the players should be respectful and the fans would be delighted. Plus hes got an edge and is tougher / meaner than many realise.

Yes its a massive gamble that might not work. But so are all the other names mentioned.

 

[Upside Down]

2 hours ago, JHRover said:

Every January transfer window in recent memory we have disgraced ourselves.

Mowbray's final season, signing Hedges, Giles and Zeefuik whilst challenging for automatic promotion and the nonsensical claim he had turned down the offer of cash to make serious signings.

JDT's first season, signing Sorba Thomas on loan, the Lewis O'Brien fiasco

JDT's second season, bundling Adam Wharton out of the exit door on deadline day, the McGuire fiasco

Eustace's season, signing Woodrow and Dennis on short term deals and ludicrously claiming to have invested to support the manager.

This season, signing 3 randomers none of which we really needed, I suppose we haven't flogged anyone important (yet).

It is no coincidence that all four managers have thrown in the towel and given it up as a bad job soon after. Mowbray was sulking and clearly wasn't happy, JDT engineered his departure and was offering to go after his first season, Eustace couldn't wait to get out and Ismael seemed keen to be put out of his misery on Saturday.

They all know they've no chance under this regime.

Whoever turns up next will discover the same this time next year.

Meanwhile Derby getting the Szmodics deal over the line, £4.5 million with add-ons. Presumably 'we can't afford' that sort of deal - how much is relegation going to cost us again?

Hopefully it will cost venkys a fortune.

It speaks volumes that when I awoke this morning to see Big Val had been binned I was totally surprised. That's after the 1 win in 15 and him being shite. 

Now we're hearing rumours that he's fallen out with Gestede and that's the reason he's gone. Not the 1 win in 15, not being in the relegation zone and not him being shite. 

Looks like they did the usual and fed him a load of bollocks before decimating the squad in summer and then providing zero support in January. 

Penny to a pound they do the same with the next mon.

[JHRover]

3 minutes ago, JBiz said:

Finally an acknowledgment that you talked absolute bollocks with confidence. In all the years I’ve taken the time to read this website, that’s a first from you.

oh and PS - he’s gone. Only a person intent on covering their own shocking takes would break that down to “did he walk or was he pushed”.

Oh and btw, it’s Joe. The reason why this particular element got me was the constant confidence you spiel regarding the deliberate nature of our problems. 
 

If I’d spent weeks forcing a narrative that turned out to be utter bollox, the first thing I would’ve done is say “sorry lads I got that wrong”.!

 

Glad to know you've spent weeks reading all my posts and then the first opportunity you get to point out I might have been wrong on something you've spent the day repeatedly replying with the same thing to each one of my posts, without even knowing for certain that I am wrong!

"It has been mutually agreed he will step away from his role with immediate effect".

Think you might need to find some more important issues to get your teeth into than my opinions, of which you *might* have found one that is wrong. 

[JBiz]

6 minutes ago, JHRover said:

Glad to know you've spent weeks reading all my posts and then the first opportunity you get to point out I might have been wrong on something you've spent the day repeatedly replying with the same thing to each one of my posts, without even knowing for certain that I am wrong!

"It has been mutually agreed he will step away from his role with immediate effect".

Think you might need to find some more important issues to get your teeth into than my opinions, of which you *might* have found one that is wrong. 

Weeks? Try decades. You never accept the spiel you’ve been spewing is shite.

Your position was that he is a deliberate “gear” in operation dumb down rovers…

Don’t try and spin it as semantics. The manager was terrible and deserved relieving of his duties. You know, you can say that AND still think the Rao’s, Pasha, Rudy etc are all frauds.

Edited 42 minutes ago by JBiz

[JBiz]

9 minutes ago, Upside Down said:

Hopefully it will cost venkys a fortune.

It speaks volumes that when I awoke this morning to see Big Val had been binned I was totally surprised. That's after the 1 win in 15 and him being shite. 

Now we're hearing rumours that he's fallen out with Gestede and that's the reason he's gone. Not the 1 win in 15, not being in the relegation zone and not him being shite. 

Looks like they did the usual and fed him a load of bollocks before decimating the squad in summer and then providing zero support in January. 

Penny to a pound they do the same with the next mon.

What’s the difference between Ismael winning 1 in 15 and being potted and Ismael winning 1 in 15 and falling out with the DOF and resigning?

 

I would die on the hill that the both amount to exactly the same thing!

[Tomphil2]

People saying Duff are forgetting Henning Berg.

If we are going to be sentimental it might as well be Mowbray or if it's the 'one of us' mentality - which Duff forfeited celebrating like a twat every time he scored against us - it might as well be Ainsworth.

 

[JHRover]

5 minutes ago, JBiz said:

Weeks? Try decades. You never accept the spiel you’ve been spewing is shite.

Your position was that he is a deliberate “gear” in operation dumb down rovers…

Don’t try and spin it as semantics. The manager was terrible and deserved relieving of his duties. You know, you can say that AND still think the Rao’s, Pasha, Rudy etc are all frauds.

I'm not even sure that was my position but hey ho.

I agree that he was terrible, I'm sure I've posted at various times that he shouldn't have got the job in the first place and certainly should have gone much earlier than this. 

I don't think Ismael himself was a deliberate gear in operation dumb down, I think I said that I expected them to keep him in place because he was doing just what they wanted which is getting on with doing the job quietly whilst they stripped the squad bare. I think until very recently that was the case.

It seems in the last few days or weeks that has changed. Nixon says that there was a bust up over recruitment which fits with Ismael's 'complicated' comment on Saturday and taken with the fact that the two before him both left for non-results based reasons suggests he might have gone for similar reasons than just him being a poor manager. 

Anyhow, I'm pleased that after 'decades' you've finally found the 'proof' you needed that the 'spiel' I've been 'spewing' is shite. I'm sure a potential sacking of Ismael - not described as such by the club - proves that everything else I've said going back 'decades' is shite.

[Jimmy612]

9 minutes ago, JBiz said:

What’s the difference between Ismael winning 1 in 15 and being potted and Ismael winning 1 in 15 and falling out with the DOF and resigning?

 

I would die on the hill that the both amount to exactly the same thing!

My instinct would be to question the motives of his employers. Were they happy for him to underperform so long as he towed the line? If so, why?

Edited 29 minutes ago by Jimmy612

[onlyonejackwalker]

2 minutes ago, Tomphil2 said:

People saying Duff are forgetting Henning Berg.

If we are going to be sentimental it might as well be Mowbray or if it's the 'one of us' mentality - which Duff forfeited celebrating like a twat every time he scored against us - it might as well be Ainsworth.

 

Ah ok, so anyone with any link to Rovers is purely a sentimental choice?

Mowbray has enjoyed two promotions in 20+ years. I don't want his boring rhetoric and inane ramblings all over again.

Henning Berg is statistically our worst ever manager. Weird reference.

Ainsworth? Please.

Anyway, you might get your wish. Mowbray 2/1 favourite.

[RevidgeBlue]

12 minutes ago, JBiz said:

Weeks? Try decades. You never accept the spiel you’ve been spewing is shite.

Your position was that he is a deliberate “gear” in operation dumb down rovers…

Don’t try and spin it as semantics. The manager was terrible and deserved relieving of his duties. You know, you can say that AND still think the Rao’s, Pasha, Rudy etc are all frauds.

I think you're being very harsh on JH.

No-one's banged on more than me about Ismael needing to be replaced but when I went to bed in the early hours of this morning I had no idea it was going to happen.

I HOPED it was getting an increasingly odd look for Gestede and Pasha not to sack him but I didn't REALLY believe it would happen.

Perhaps you'd better let me have the Euromillions numbers for tomorrow night with your enhanced psychic powers! 

🙂

 

[RevidgeBlue]

7 minutes ago, onlyonejackwalker said:

Ah ok, so anyone with any link to Rovers is purely a sentimental choice?

Mowbray has enjoyed two promotions in 20+ years. I don't want his boring rhetoric and inane ramblings all over again.

Henning Berg is statistically our worst ever manager. Weird reference.

Ainsworth? Please.

Anyway, you might get your wish. Mowbray 2/1 favourite.

Saying someone is a "sentimental" choice is saying they're a bad choice which is clouded by sentiment so effectively they're agreeing with you.

BTW your pre season prediction we'd finish above Derby and "greedy" Eustace is looking worse by the week.

[Tomphil2]

10 minutes ago, onlyonejackwalker said:

Ah ok, so anyone with any link to Rovers is purely a sentimental choice?

Mowbray has enjoyed two promotions in 20+ years. I don't want his boring rhetoric and inane ramblings all over again.

Henning Berg is statistically our worst ever manager. Weird reference.

Ainsworth? Please.

Anyway, you might get your wish. Mowbray 2/1 favourite.

My wish certainly isn't Mowbray but it's a more logical choice than Duff to anyone who actually stops and thinks about it for 3 seconds.

[JBiz]

16 minutes ago, JHRover said:

I'm not even sure that was my position but hey ho.

I agree that he was terrible, I'm sure I've posted at various times that he shouldn't have got the job in the first place and certainly should have gone much earlier than this. 

I don't think Ismael himself was a deliberate gear in operation dumb down, I think I said that I expected them to keep him in place because he was doing just what they wanted which is getting on with doing the job quietly whilst they stripped the squad bare. I think until very recently that was the case.

It seems in the last few days or weeks that has changed. Nixon says that there was a bust up over recruitment which fits with Ismael's 'complicated' comment on Saturday and taken with the fact that the two before him both left for non-results based reasons suggests he might have gone for similar reasons than just him being a poor manager. 

Anyhow, I'm pleased that after 'decades' you've finally found the 'proof' you needed that the 'spiel' I've been 'spewing' is shite. I'm sure a potential sacking of Ismael - not described as such by the club - proves that everything else I've said going back 'decades' is shite.

JHR we’ve had these discussions plenty of times over the years, you have this way of weaving the worst case scenario, and when (like this afternoon) it’s proven to be way off, you just move goalposts. 
 

I’ve grown tired of intervening with any comment and it’s rare that even read your posts these days (taken the advice of our resident mod mate to just scroll on), but I just found it poetic today that the first post that sat on top of my feed when texts of “vals gone” came through my phone, where JHR attempting his regular attempt to convince everyone in your familiar tone, that the powers that be are “happy with Ismael”.

Response to being wrong on that? He walked away because of a bust up… despite the fact he should’ve been sacked weeks ago.

[Upside Down]

1 minute ago, JBiz said:

JHR we’ve had these discussions plenty of times over the years, you have this way of weaving the worst case scenario, and when (like this afternoon) it’s proven to be way off, you just move goalposts. 
 

I’ve grown tired of intervening with any comment and it’s rare that even read your posts these days (taken the advice of our resident mod mate to just scroll on), but I just found it poetic today that the first post that sat on top of my feed when texts of “vals gone” came through my phone, where JHR attempting his regular attempt to convince everyone in your familiar tone, that the powers that be are “happy with Ismael”.

Response to being wrong on that? He walked away because of a bust up… despite the fact he should’ve been sacked weeks ago.

If he should have been sacked weeks ago then why wasn't he?

[onlyonejackwalker]

2 minutes ago, RevidgeBlue said:

Saying someone is a "sentimental" choice is saying they're a bad choice which is clouded by sentiment so effectively they're agreeing with you.

BTW your pre season prediction we'd finish above Derby and "greedy" Eustace is looking worse by the week.

I keep letting you get away with this selective stupidity to avoid embarrassing you.

I've had enough. Lets nip it in your little bud.

When Eustace left you got all hissy and upset when i suggested he left simply for an extra 15k a week. It really upset you for some really weird reason. 

He left in February. Three months before the end of last season. Who in their right mind would predict results for the following season????

Certainly not me. So either put up or shut up. Show me these posts you keep referencing in my name.

And when you can't, have the courtesy to apologise.

Why you constantly insist on being the class clown i have absolutely no idea.