The sourness about Venkys massively cutting crowds is a myth. Sort the pricing out and be more proactive and the crowds will go up.

Some players that featured today are just players last season who didnt offer that competition last season. Its easy to get overly excited by pre season knoackbouts against poor opposition. We have good competition in central midfield and will at centre back. Left backs today were both kids for example. You also look at players like Gilnesan and Weston, they arent going to provide real competition. Garrett isnt up to it at this stage either, Leonard could do with a loan.

So the 2 attacking signings we made both had been carrying injuries, Sigurdsson had missed recent internationals and Ennis had an issue from Burton. Both have trained and both have caused further issues and are up against it to be in the first 11 against West Brom. Not good.

Looks like Aaron Ramsey is about to join Cardiff. Big statement of intent.

Thanks for the insight. Bit of a mixed message but always good to get information on the type of player we are getting. You imply that you think he deserves his move and that he will do well if he stays fit, and that is for a team that finished 7th and at least aims to get into the play offs. Yet for a team who has come up and I presume doesnt have huge amounts of money, you dont seem bothered that hes gone and think you can do better which doesnt really add up. Is it purely fitness reasons that causes that swing from thinking he can do well at this level to not being bothered? I think he will be rotated here as we have Sam Gallagher and want another striker on loan so I dont think we will expect him to play every minute. From what I have read, it seems like your fans are gutted that he has left, having read your forums. Its just the injuries that cause concerns.

I do, good to get an insight into a player ive not seen much of.

Hit us towards the end. The points dried up and we kept conceding late.

I think there was a bit more to it than that. The likes of Gibbs White, Awoniyi, Danilo etc are big assets for them now and they also signed some really good experience in Navas, Felipe etc.

Hope so on both. Wharton has to start but I think he would most likely accompany Tronstad with Travis. Captain plus also factoring in a late pre season for Wharton. Not sure id read too much into Saturdays teams with Vale and Markanday over Dolan and Hedges plus no Rankin Costello either.

The way that Forest went about things turned into a very good move.

Could be intertwined with the transfer thread but I know people enjoy the gossip side of things no matter how unsubstantiated, so thought I would do a seperate thread. With half of our business to go likely to be loans potentially after the season has begun, and with the squad/manager away for the next week, as well as other teams, the current squad is likely the choice we will have to start the season, having been here for pre season. What do people think is our best side going into it, and how do people think Tomasson will likely go? Kaminski Rankin Costello Carter Hyam Pickering Tronstad Wharton Hedges Szmodics Sigurdsson Ennis That would be mine, a Batth type, right winger and of course striker would ideally come into that 11 sooner rather than later, but I would personally suggest thats unlikely in the next 3 or 4 weeks. I think Pears, Travis and Gallagher will start over Kaminski, Wharton and Ennis though unfortunately. Just a hunch, hope im wrong.

Did he say anything else? 50 seems unmanageably crazy! Are the games 90 minutes each on Saturday? Maybe it will be 75 each for (most of) 22 of the players and the remaining kids will finish the game, leading to 90 in following games.

Obviously I mean in terms of fees. Every manager ever has signed players, no one would say bloody hell, wasn't Coyle lucky to spend all that money on freebies and loans when he was manager. You've gone off on a massive tangent here. My point was that they both inherited massively different situations, you agreed. Therefore, talk of if Tomasson had 5 years v Mowbray's 5 is moot, incomparable. You could say that he hasn't this season got the team that finished 7th, no Brereton, no Morton, no Thomas, no Dack, no Ayala. At least he had some money to play with last season. The discussion was about Tomasson and his style of play.

His first transfer window was ahead of a League 1 season. Apart from a few good veterans, there was barely any quality at the club when he joined. Obviously their jobs were massively different. Mowbray did a pretty good job, made us much better than when he came in, and moved on. His net spend across those five years can't have been much more than nil. If Tomasson had 5 years, direct comparisons would be futile because the jobs would be from totally contrasting starts. But as I said, it's irrelevant to the point about Tomasson and the style he is bringing in anyway, he has different targets and it is all about building upon those good foundations.

3 permanent players. All replaced by players with fees. Loans allowed to replace those who left. Either way, the states of the club that both inherited are chalk and cheese, therefore Mowbray bashing is an unnecessary aspect to judging Tomasson and the style of play.

Not comparable situations. Mowbray inherited a side full of ageing freebies 2/3 of the way into a season in which we were in the bottom 3. Tomasson inherited a team that had finished 8th, yes 3 players left due to poor ownership but they were replaced with players who we paid fees for. And we signed more loans to replace the ones that left. I know Mowbray bashing is the forums favourite past time but why it can't be a case of Mowbray has gone having left us in a much more favourable place than he inherited and a focus on what Tomasson can do to push us further is beyond me. The question is, will the new style allow us to push on and finally break into the top 6. When the style really bedded in, results actually dipped even though performances improved, so the acid test is seeing if they correlate this season.

You can go through any season and point to what if moments too. The season before, we had Gyokeres scoring a 99th minute equaliser when Nyambe was limping around, Khadra missing a penalty at Sheff Utd and then them scoring a 92nd minute rebound from a corner, Hull postponing a game last minute and winning the replayed fixture, Edun's red card at Peterborough etc.

Hopefully that will be represented in more points this season which will reduce the amount of discussion about how quickly the ball is being released! The post mortem discussed by Broughton suggested that all the "metrics" towards the end of the season displayed progression. It did look better on the eye but the lack of points during that period is definitely a concern.

If we genuinely play solely to try and make players more valuable, rather than with the primary aim of getting results (which will maximise values quicker if we are doing well) and it isn't just cliches and hot air, then we are fucked.

The worry is that although we definitely improved aesthetically in terms of being less ponderous and more confident in playing how we had been taught to play, results fell away. The key is actually whether it will lead to better results.

No pressure then.

There is a modern tactic though where full backs like to naturally float into midfield and help a team to dominate, and he is brilliant at that from right back, so I would be reluctant to move him. He is also just as effective defensively as Brittain is, maybe even more.

The target has to be to better last season, otherwise there's no point banging on about a project ad nauseum. Whether it will happen, not at all convinced. So soon into pre season, business to be done, in and out, both here and elsewhere. Could be a stronger division this year. 3 big clubs coming down. Unsure how the teams above/around us will fare, Coventry have lost Gyokeres but have gained Simms and likely will add more, Sunderland have lost Diallo but have Stewart to come back, Boro seem busy in the market but have lost Archer/Giles, so lots of uncertainty. Just have to hope that we are stronger collectively. If Kaminski goes, we are then weaker in net. If we can get Batth over the line, the defence looks stronger, especially with Rankin Costello an upgrade on Brittain, if he plays there. Hopefully Tronstad and a full season of Adam Wharton can really improve the midfield, the big question mark is up top. We are miles weaker on an already low scoring attack, so all depends who comes in. Ennis looks a curious one, hope he doesn't spend most of the season on the treatment table, and Sigurdsson is a big unknown.

It was the second save that was particularly impressive, when it came back out I expected him to put away the rebound.

Colwill kicked the bottom of Ruiz's boot, foul surely. Doesn't matter anyway.