I am not saying that they can have the opportunity to finish the job off of earning promotion or relegation. I am well aware that financially and logistically it is impossible to do so, you dont have to keep replying to every one of my post stating as such. I know and have acknowledged it and have never said that they should or can finish the season. I am aware of why teams have games in hand, but why is irrelevant, they do and its one of many reasons I have listed above as to why you cant maintain fairness and integrity by extraoplating the results of an incomplete season. Therefore the only fair alternative is to scrap the season. Its harsh on all teams in terms of work they have done but ultimately none had finalised any achievements and PPG is flawed in so many ways as listed above.

The option of completing the season may aswell be left out of the debate, clearly not an option. It seems to have split people as to the fairest choice between PPG and scrapping a season. Here are the reasons why: - None of the teams had fully earnt their promotions or relegations. - Things can change, if it had have been stopped a week or two before or after the situation would have been different. Things would have undoubtedly changed between now and the end of the season. - Teams hadnt played the same amount of games. I appreciate that PPG factors that in but its crazy for example that Wycombes game in hand could have either put them level on points with 2nd or left them in 7th. Shows how flawed PPG is. - Teams have massively different difficulties in terms of teams faced. Teams have therefore accumulated points against varying difficulties of teams which is totally unfair. I know the Championship is being finished but you look at the average position of teams remaining fixtures, Millwall are 2 points off 6th place PNE but have a far more favourable run in. - Teams have also got different numbers of home and away games left. - You mention that whichever 3 teams are relegated from the Championship deserve it and will have fully earnt it. But the 3 promoted teams wont have done. How you can have such inconsistency when the EFL claims one of their primary objectives was consistency beggars belief. I appreciate that hard work goes to waste but thats not reason enough to use a formula to extrapolate results in an unfair and flawed way. Thats literally the only reason to use PPG and it not a valid or strong reason to do so. The season was not completed therefore it for me is as simple as that.

If you take a quick look at his twitter page, you will see how much of an attention seeker he is. Answers a million tweets a day from people like yourself to Nixon about transfers teasing cryptic clues.

Another thing that I would point out, of course people understandably look to the powers that be and the bigger clubs to bail out the smaller ones. The problem is firstly I am not sure that there is a pool of money available at the FA or similar that could come close to filling the hole that will be created should next season or part of next season be BCD, I am sure I read on here that testing is £5m per club for this small period to finish the season. I might be totally wrong on that but if it is the cost across a large chunk or a full season would be extortionate even before looking at loss of earnings. Of course the smaller and more in need clubs should be prioritised so I dont see how that is possible. You then come onto the big clubs, who of course should have a duty of care to the smaller ones. But you look for example at Chelsea spending these multi million transfer fees and it does leave a bitter taste. Ultimately that money however is not coming from the club, who like all clubs will have been impacted in terms of the financial hit of the virus solely in terms of income and costs generated from business activities. The money is coming from the back pocket from a Russian oligarch who has money to burn. He should have a duty of care as the owner of an English football club but I just dont see barring an incredible gesture how he could be enforced or could ever decide himself to go, actually no ill chuck that money into the lower leagues. Sadly would never happen.

Ultimately if what happened is what should have happened,ie the season was incomplete and therefore discarded, then he would have been in League 1 anyway. Aside from finishing the season which was impossible there was no outcome that would have led to anything other than that, either the flawed PPG or null and void. He is a right attention seeking idiot though to be fair. One silver lining for him will be the additional media attention.

The problem is that there might be no choice but to start 20/21 behind closed doors, it might be the same choice that we have now, that or nothing. If theres a second wave and if the government advice forbids sports played in front of a crowd going into late 2020 and into 2021, a fair possibility i would guess, then I cant really see much hope for the lower leagues, no plan could IMO prop them up for another year.

Absolutely 100% on the money. And Coventry and Rotherham havent earnt promotion yet.

He may well be but at the momemt he has yet to prove that he is capable of Championship football. Of course he is only young and he has only made a couple of starts and a couple of sub appearances but he made no impact in any of those games and seemed a little overawed and I was unable to see what he had that made him such a prospect in that limited game time. But he is only young so time is on his side and the same with Buckley.

I agree! Haha

Just because this season hasnt been finalised doesnt mean we cant consider and discuss the potential of what will happen next year either.

You keep using the fact that they have voted as final proof that the right thing has been done. I keep saying that the vote (your scenario only provides an example of how clubs will vote dependant on how they will be affected) is IMO passing the buck and not fair, because teams have natural biases and I disagree with the options permitted, one of which is inherently flawed. A valid comeback to that argument is not "but they have voted." You are just repeating what has happened which is what I am contesting. Your scenario about Rovers only emphasises the fact that teams are voting from varying positions of bias. I would like to think that I can be neutral about Rovers, for example when you suggest that every refereeing decision should have gone our way I try and be fair. But I may well want PPG in that scenario naturally but that doesnt make it right or fair, quite the opposite. Id be biased. You keep talking about the financial inability of teams in Leagues 1 and 2 to complete the season but thats not something ive ever pushed for, I know its not possible. Its obvious that teams hard work will be wasted but that is not reason to assume and extrapolate to give teams rewards and punishments (promotion and relegation) that they have not yet earnt. Its just an unfortunate reprocussion of the situation.

I have stated that voting doesnt automatically make the outcome correct, fair or agreeable and youve repeatedly ignored the points I am making in order to repeat totally irrelevant points that I have in many cases accepted so lets leave it there.

Further proof of how flawed PPG is! And how you cannot realistically extrapolate the current rate of points. Millwall are 2 points off 6th place Preston but a much more favourable run in. They would have been penalised for the order in which their fixtures were created. It would be really interesting to see the League 1 and 2 equivalents.

Whatever, a different governing body then. Swindon and Crewe hadnt earnt promotion. I am not saying that the season should finish, I have repeatedly said that i know it cannot be finished so stop coming back to me with stuff about unfurloughing as its irrelevant. Ergo the 2 choices are to extrapolate and formulate to assume that the teams would have all carried on at the exact same pace in terms of picking up points which they wouldnt. Of course its unfortunate that teams have put in work but if it cant be completed it cant be completed. The fact that the teams voted DOES NOT make it 100% foolproof. Firstly these teams all have conflicts of interest, different league positions etc. I am criticising that they have even been given the option to choose PPG. Surely the teams at risk of relegation from the Championship should also get a say considering they will be relegated on merit and replaced by teams in a good position but far from achieving promotion. @Hasta mentions that they seemingly werent given the option to null and void and that is right but I would go one step forward and say the PPG option shouldnt have been there. Allowing a vote makes the EFL shirk responsibility rather than being a positive move, they should have evaluated whether the season can be finished, and upon realising it couldnt, called it a bad job and null and voided the season. Its not ideal but its better than the flawed shite as a result of passing the buck that has resulted. If a few weeks earlier this had happened then Wycombe might have gone up as you say so it just shows how crazy it is to essentially use the league table as it stands well before its supposed conclusion. The frustration is you arent driven by and dont clearly state your own opinion, you act as essentially an EFL spokesperson and dont directly address the points made to you which is ironically what the EFL would do.

Not sure about how you know about Chapmans training performances and the rest is speculative but have Buckley and Rankin Costello really shown that they can cope in the Championship? Buckley has looked physically incapable and quite a bit of the standard in each game apart from at Charlton where he played as a 10 and did well. And Rankin Costello played only a few games but looked a little overawed and couldnt have an impact. Not writing either off or anything, both are very young but so far they havent proven that they are Championship standard.

Of course the only truly fair way is to complete the season and that is not an option. Its unfortunate that teams that have put in the work of much of the season but the season has not been completed for reasons out of our hands. It goes without saying that things could and would change before the season and it is inherently flawed to extrapolate and formulate results of an incomplete season against teams of varying difficulties (some teams will have remaining games easier than others etc) to then promote and relegate teams. The season has not been completed therefore whilst teams have all put in lots of work, none have yet fully EARNT their promotions or relegations. Youve used an extreme example, so could I. Wycombe have a game in hand which they could have lost, and they were outside the play offs. Theyve shot up 4 places on the assumption that they would pick up points in that game. Conversely if they had won theyd have been level with 2nd. So tight.

Youve again not addressed my point, just reiterated the fact that it was voted on which I stated was not necessarily indicative of the best way. Votes between teams involved in the situation is not final proof that PPG promotions and relegations are the correct way forward. Unfurloughing players is irrelevant to the discussion at hand because I have also accepted that these divisions cannot finish. I am not saying that they should finish it because its impossible, financially and logistically. My whole argument is against the fairness of extrapolating the results from an incomplete season to determine promotions and relegations, especially into the Championsip which WILL be finished. Its unfair, as far as im concerned, if the season isnt finished, if a team hasnt fully earnt promotion or fully earnt relegation, then it shouldnt happen. Theres no need to promote and relegate teams in incomplete seasons. Forgot the FA's point of view, or indeed the possibility of a democratic vote between teams involved. From a totally neutral viewpoint, what would in your opinion have been the best conclusion from the 2 possibilities, cancel the season or promote and relegate based on formulaes?

There are an equal number of winners and losers regardless. And the fact that it is as the result of a democratic vote of teams all of whom have various conflicts of interests does not make it righteous. It should never have been an option to vote on. It should have been a case of can we finish the season, no? Well the season is not completed, therefore no promotions and relegations have been earnt.

As far as I can see, it is essentially a case whereby unless something remarkable happens, ultimately nothing can be done should BCD be the only option for a substantial period of time. It all depends on how long it will last. The double whammy is the extortionate cost of the regular testing required relative to the financial size of these clubs and the lack of income. Their fortune lies in the hands of the pandemic really. Ideas of loans are fanciful but both unlikely and even if they were granted, many of them clubs couldnt cope with an additional chunk of debt, theyd probably need a grant. And a salary cap is a nice idea but essentially pissing in the wind at this stage.

I suppose though that although there may be some logic to thinking that our home advantage is diluted or not as prevalent as other teams due to our attendances, our home record is better than our league position so I suppose that doesnt ring true. 4 "home games" left and 5 "away" so suppose there is a slight advantage.

"Today’s outcome ensures that the League and its Clubs remains as faithful as possible to the previously agreed Regulations and that there is consistency in the approach adopted across the EFL in all divisions if required." I do particularly enjoy this quote by Rick Parry. The consistency of relegating teams having played all games and promoting teams based on an incomplete season and a formula.

Absolutely ridicilous. Potentially Championship clubs relegated after a full season and replaced by teams who havent. And needlessly shuffling teams between Leagues 1 and 2, neither of which are finished! If you are just playing the top 2 leagues, stop relegation from the Championship down. If you cant finish the leagues then you cant promote and relegate teams. If they genuinely think they have any integrity then they can shove their PPG formulaes up their arse.

Exactly the scenario I had in my mind. Interesting that he even had a reputation in football in terms of his character.

Also Cunningham is back training with Cardiff and Neil Harris seems to want to have a look at him so a return might be a non starter.

Might be difficult to sign long term players this summer to be fair.