[Archived] New Formation?

[Veevs]

Ok well looks like we may me landing this Chilean and Eucuador chap.. we are looking at a dedicated right back.. and a Right sided midfielder..

But the chilean tends to play more of a free role.. so how the monkeys will we line up next season given we are bringing in extra cover up front i am guessing we are still going to play with two up front?

I am a little confussed as to the formation we would be looking at.. as we are not after an attacking fullback.. hmmm

Cruz - McCarthy

Villanueva

Reid - Bentley (or replacement)

Castillo

Warnock - Nelson - Samba - New RB

Brad (or replacement)

Subs -

GK - Brown

CB - Ooijer

FB/MID - Emerson

Mid - Tugay/MGP (or andrews)

Mid/DEF - Vogel/Zurub/Axe

ST - Derbs

ST - Roberts/Fowler

That would leave our midfield a little week but atttacking wise.. hmm would be rather pretty.. and would allow us to be pretty flexible switching to a 4-4-1-1, ....

Anyone else got any ideas on what old Incey is thinking?

[tony gale's mic]

I'd fancy a 4-4-1-1...

Vogel and Castillo in centre mid and Villanueva playing behind Santa Cruz, who I think could do a great job as a lone striker.

[The Rover of Finland]

I'd fancy a 4-4-1-1...

Vogel and Castillo in centre mid and Villanueva playing behind Santa Cruz, who I think could do a great job as a lone striker.

And Bentley would be very key part in this formation. It´s stupid to count on him. Pennant is good enough for me.

[rebelmswar]

I'd fancy a 4-4-1-1...

Vogel and Castillo in centre mid and Villanueva playing behind Santa Cruz, who I think could do a great job as a lone striker.

Cruz has the strength and jumping ability for that, with a tricky player just behind him it could be a great season.

I would rather have Benni beside Cruz with Villanueva just behind and Vogel to anchor the midfield through defence.

Cruz Benni

Villanueva

Gamst Vogel Bents(hope)

[herbergeehh]

Seconded. From what I can see, Villanueva will need a free role behind a striker, or more precisely - he doesn't look like a player we can afford having as a fourth midfielder.

Bentley, Castillo, Vogel, Gamst Pedersen

Villanueva

Santa Cruz

Castillo being a powerful midfielder, Vogel being a small, clever, a good passer of the ball - and Villanueva looking like a creative spark - behind the strong Santa Cruz and with Gamst Pedersen's and first and foremost Bentley's excellent crossing from wide.

Looks pretty much perfect to me.

[tony gale's mic]

Cruz has the strength and jumping ability for that, with a tricky player just behind him it could be a great season.

I would rather have Benni beside Cruz with Villanueva just behind and Vogel to anchor the midfield through defence.

Cruz Benni

Villanueva

Gamst Vogel Bents(hope)

Our midfield would be too weak then IMO.

[rebelmswar]

Our midfield would be too weak then IMO.

Maybe next on the shopping list is a holding midfielder.

[tony gale's mic]

We've got a perfectly good one in Vogel, was impressed by what we saw of him last season.

Vogel can be the holding midfielder, Castillo the box to box midfielder and Villaneuva to provide the link between midfield and attack. One on each wing to provide the crosses and we've got a lot of bases covered.

[rebelmswar]

We've got a perfectly good one in Vogel, was impressed by what we saw of him last season.

Vogel can be the holding midfielder, Castillo the box to box midfielder and Villaneuva to provide the link between midfield and attack. One on each wing to provide the crosses and we've got a lot of bases covered.

I just hold out hope for McCarthy setting teams alight again.

Fluid midfield into attack would be great viewing with the possible new players.

[LeftWinger]

I reckon it's going to be a 4-2-3-1 most of the time.

Robinson

NEW RB

Nelsen

Samba

Warnock

Castillo

Vogel

NEW RW

Villanueva

Pedersen

Santa Cruz

[AJW]

with the flexability in our squad we could even go

robinson

ooijer samba nelsen

emerton warnock

vogel cassillas

villanueva

santa cruz mccarthy

i dont think the players would be all that uncomfortable with that

[joey_big_nose]

Although he is a big guy with excellent technique and decent in the air Cruz isn't really a target man. He is a guy who likes to get the ball facing (as opposed to having his back to) goal. And he often comes very very deep to collect it and then turns and runs at the defence.

For me our most effective formation including the two new signings (bearing in mind I am not familiar beyond You Tube as to how they will play, so it is all a bit speculative)

-----------------Roberts

Villenueva-----Cruz-------Bentley (or Replacement)

------------Castillo--Vogel

Warnock---Nelsen----Samba---Emerton (or replacement)

------------------Fredial (or replacement)

Obviously Roberts is not our best technical player but he is the only one who harasses the back line like a proper target man should. He also runs the opponents back line to find opportunities rather than dropping into midfield.

If we do sell Bentley and get a bit of cash in the first priority is obviously a replacement, and then a right back. But then after that it should be a proper "target man" striker who will hang on the shoulder of the centreback and create space who is of a higher quality than Roberts.

[Veevs]

Maybe next on the shopping list is a holding midfielder.

I thought that was Casilio's role..

[jny]

Brad (I wish)

New RB/ooijer Nelsen Samba Warnock

Vogel

Castillo

New Rw Pedersen

Villanueva

Santa cruz (hopefully)

Subs: Emerton, Mccarthy, Derbyshire,Tugay, Olsonn, Roberts, Ooijer (if we get a good new RB)

I have always thought Pedersen would make a good forward, anyone?

[joey_big_nose]

I have always thought Pedersen would make a good forward, anyone?

How? No pace, no power, average movement, admittedly good in the air. I think a good centre back would murder him.

I think Pedersen is a solid player but if this Villanueva is coming in to play on the inside left his days could be numbered.

[Lathund]

I'd rather play RSC as the lone striker than Roberts, as a lone striker doesn't have to be a typical target man. United have played Rooney, Tevez and Saha there. Torres isn't your typical Duncan Ferguson either. Now playing one up front when it's not a target man requires more of the midfield, in that the two wide players have to know when to come inside and support, it also requires some good passers in midfield as they'll need to pull off more through balls.

I'm a big fan of the 4-2-3-1 though, as I like the flexibility of it. It allows you to utilize attacking full backs very well, as you have two holding midfielders. In the blink of an eye you can go from 4-5-1 to 4-3-3. The attacking midfielder can push further forward and essentially make it a 4-4-2. Sure, it requires flexible players, but it's a great way to play if you have one of those real flair players; a Ronaldo, or hopefully a Villanueva.

It really allows those players to utilize their skills to the max. You have attacking wide players, you have holding central midfielders. It allows the free role player to go deep and collect the ball to act as a playmaker, it allows him to play more as a striker and look for through balls. If he drops deep, you push the wingers inside and have the fullbacks go forward to provide width. If he's further forward you have more of a 4-4-2. But perhaps the real beauty of having a player who can shoot, dribble and pass, is that when he gets the ball inbetween midfield and defense then whatever the defenders do, they do the wrong thing and will have to rely on skill alone. If one centre half closes him down, the striker will be 1 on 1 and they'd be vulnerable to a through ball sending him clean through. Or the AMC will beat his man and it'd be a 2 on 1 in the centre. If they fall back, he can either run at them or get a clean shot. Likewise if they both cover the striker. And so on; basically a player like that creates mismatches, and forces you to put a player on him at all times, and when he does get the ball put two guys on him. Which will give the other team more 1 on 1's, and noone can shut down a good player completely.

Basically, if you have the players for it it's a great formation. But despite what I said in my first post, I'm not convinced Roque can play that role up front. Roberts can do some aspects of it, but he's limited. Benni could do it if we had a better midfield and he stopped dropping deep. Derbs can't do it yet, and Fowler can't anymore. I hope they prove me wrong though.

If we were to fit a player like Villanueva in a 4-4-2 it'd be as a winger in an assymetrical formation, which of course is an option. Man U with Giggs and Beckham is one example of it.

The other option, as some have suggested already, would be to play a 4-3-1-2. That would rely on the fullbacks providing the width. The downside of this is that I'd ideally want a Tugay or Pirlo type of player as one of the three in midfield, and we only have a 38 year old version of that.

Enough rambling now; The short version of this post would be; I have no idea how we will, or should, play.

[trueblue]

The short version of this post would be; I have no idea how we will, or should, play.

I think at this moment in time only P.I knows the answer to that one

[joey_big_nose]

I'd rather play RSC as the lone striker than Roberts, as a lone striker doesn't have to be a typical target man. United have played Rooney, Tevez and Saha there. Torres isn't your typical Duncan Ferguson either. Now playing one up front when it's not a target man requires more of the midfield, in that the two wide players have to know when to come inside and support, it also requires some good passers in midfield as they'll need to pull off more through balls.

The reason that Man Utd can play without a Drogba/Van Nistlerooy/Adebayor is the quality up there.

They essentially line up:

Ronaldo---Rooney---Saha/Nani/J Sung Park

and they all swap round. The essential ingredient is pace - they don't need a "target man" because they can get behind the defence with speed and trickery from all angles. Even then they are now looking for a proper Target Man - hence the offer for Berbatov.

For us to play without a guy to spearhead the attack would mean we would need a lot of pace all round. Villenueva appears to provide that, Cruz has decent pace and I guess when Bentley goes we can invest in a speedy player to replace him.

I still think we would be better off with a high quality out and out striker for the others to work off though, someone who can make defenders sweat on their own. Either an extremely big, skillful and powerful guy (Ashton would be perfect but that is dreaming) or a smaller faster fellow who will force back the defensive line by running the channels.

As it is with Cruz up top the remedy is simple for the opposition - play a high defensive line against Rovers and your sorted, no one to force the line back and little pace to get behind it on the counter.

Possibly one option, as someone else has pointed out, is to play Villeneuva and Cruz side by side up front in a 442. Villeneuva's pace and trickery could create tons of space for Cruz. But then he would have to be happy not dropping deep! Which from the looks of him is precisely what he does

Oh well. I don't know either! But I expect another striker to turn up before September, possibly with Roberts leaving.

[tcj_jones]

Personally, I cannot see a young manager, new to the Premier League experimenting with fancy new formations. I can see him sticking to a 4-4-2 or a 4-5-1, depending on the quality of the opposition.

Of the current crop of players, I could see him lining up with a formation of:

Friedel

Emerton / Nelsen / Samba / Warnock

Bentley / Vogel / Dunn / Pedersen

Santa Cruz / McCarthy

Of that XI, I can see Emerton being replaced with a new right back and Dunn by this Chilean ace. Of course, if we lose Bentley and Friedel, we will have to replace them as well.

[Amo]

Personally, I cannot see a young manager, new to the Premier League experimenting with fancy new formations. I can see him sticking to a 4-4-2 or a 4-5-1, depending on the quality of the opposition.

Same here. As much as I'd like to see Villanueva playing off the front man, I don't think it's gonna happen.

[rebelmswar]

Same here. As much as I'd like to see Villanueva playing off the front man, I don't think it's gonna happen.

Should we start a Facebook campaign?

[Blue n White Rover]

Formation next season will be a very interesting one. It looks as though we've got this chillean superkid in the bag which is excellent news.

Friedel may be on his way out along with Bentley. Other than that I think the rest will be staying, so that does leave us with a very strong squad next season.

Freidel/ Robinson would be without a doubt first choice keeper next season.

The defence: It did look very shakey last season at various points, especially against Brum int he last game of the season. Too many errors especially defending the "ball over the top", which caught us out many times last season.

New right back looks to be on the agenda for Ince and I think that was one of our weak points last season. Most teams attacked Emerton as he isn't the best of defenders, however going forward he did a good job. Ooijer at RB was another decent shout, however the lack of pace did let him down. A warnock type RB and i'll be happy.

Leaves us with New RB - Samba - Nelsen - Warnock

However, Oojier was outstanding last season, I would say he was our best defenders after Warnock. His ability to read the game was brialliant but again the lack of pace let him down. Zurab could be the suprise inclussion next season. He was very solid last season when he did play in the absense of Nelsen/Samba. So I think we are very well covered in the CB department.

Moving onto the midfield. The whole Bentley saga, will he stay or will he go?

Most Rovers fans are resigned to losing him. Segundo Castillo and Carlos Villanueva are the new arrivals. Most likely a new Right Winger to replace Bentley. I would p[refer if Ince started with a 5-man midfield which consisted of New RW - Castillo - Dunn/Reid - MGP, with Villanueva playing that free role ahead of them. Would like to see Vogel come on during the game if we are protecting the lead. To be honest I don't see a place in the team for The Axe. Tugay will have very limited games and may take on a more coaching role within the side.

The midfield didn't look the strongest last season with the injuries to Dunn and Reid. We struggled in the centre and with the arrivals of Castillo and Villanueva, hopefully that problem will be sorted. MGP was finding his feet again towards the end of last season and hopefully that will continue next season.

that leaves us with the strikers. Roque HAS to be a starter, McCarthy,Roberts and Derbs will play more of a substitute role next season I feel. Maybe when we are trailing games Ince will bring them on replacing Castillo or Dunn/Reid to give us a more attacking option.

Overall, the team is looking strong. Hopefully Ince will get the right players in to strengthen the RB position and we could all look forward to exciting times again next season!

[Jan]

Oh great. ANOTHER thread giving lists of players, some of whom we don't even have yet. Can we have a separate board for "pointless speculation about what formation we may use/what is our best ever team and for discussion about a new kit which SHOULD only be worn by footballers but will end up "adorning" the rather larger bellies of supporters!"

[LeChuck]

...............Friedel

[new] Samba Nelsen Warnock

.........Castillo...Emerton

...Bentley Villanueva Pedersen

.............Santa Cruz

That's what I'd like to see anyway, I think it makes the best use of those players. I really hope we have Bert Mk3 next season, he looked great in centre midfield.

[DavidMailsTightPerm]

...............Friedel

[new] Samba Nelsen Warnock

.........Castillo...Emerton

...Bentley Villanueva Pedersen

.............Santa Cruz

That's what I'd like to see anyway, I think it makes the best use of those players. I really hope we have Bert Mk3 next season, he looked great in centre midfield.

I don't think that is too far of the mark, maybe Robinson for Friedel. If Bentley goes - maybe Emo for right wing, with either Reid or Vogel alongside Castillo.

For me the interesting thing, will be the lack of European players in the team. This will mean that we will need to very much play a squad game. Be interesting to see how Ince keeps everyone happy. A better position to be in than last season when the team (exlcuding the odd bit of tinkering) basically picked itself.