[Archived] Michael Appleton - New Rovers Manager

[Plastics]

Is his head/heart in it though? He was shocking when he played against Blackpool (last game I remember) and he's often pulled out because of his commitment issues. To me that's a waste of money. Appleton doesn't appear to be playing him either, which possibly says a lot.

[jim mk2]

Looks straight up Hughes to me. It is not hoofball at every opportunity. It's grinding out results with a solid defence (like Allardyce and Hughes) but with a mixture of attacking threats. Like I said, I'm not asking to play like Barcelona. I'm simply saying that there is no entertainment at all in the Allardyce model (that's for me personally, as I said, others found entertainment in the result - I can take this entertainment but only when it's necessary, when you are battling relegation and stabalising yourself). What we have seen under Appleton has not been Allardyce tactics. There has been a few hoofs, and this is fine, as long as it isn't your main aim.

Dear Braddock, I'm not the only one who has pointed out many times that there were plenty of entertaining games at Rovers under Sam. I've enjoyed watching some of West Ham's games on TV this season and Bolton under Sam played good football too. From what I have seen so far, Appleton is Sam par excellence. Others fans have said this but you apparently cannot see it. I look forward to you using "hoofball" and Appleton in the same way sentence at the earliest opportunity.

[Plastics]

Dear Braddock, I'm not the only one who has pointed out many times that there were plenty of entertaining games at Rovers under Sam. I've enjoyed watching some of West Ham's games on TV this season and Bolton under Sam played good football too. From what I have seen so far, Appleton is Sam par excellence. Others fans have said this but you apparently cannot see it. I look forward to you using "hoofball" and Appleton in the same way sentence at the earliest opportunity.

1. I said entertaining for me and said I can see that others found entertainment in it. And since I am speaking only of my opinions and what I would have preferred it makes sense for me to speak as I am doing.

2. I have already said that I would currently accept hoofball (though I've not seen much of it yet - certainly not to the extent Allardyce used it) if it got us back to the Prem. Or accept hoofball if we were trying to stabalise our position in the Prem and avoid relegation. I did under Allardyce and I'm grateful that he saved us when he did. I cannot think of another manager who would have been available to us at that time who could have done as good a job as he did results wise. I merely speak of hoofball when it is not required. This is when it is not acceptable. So with regards to Appleton and hoofball, unless he starts using it to the same extent as Allardyce, in a position where we are stabalised in the Prem, or if he is using it to the extent Allardyce did and it not being successful for our club, then i shall not be bombarding him. Just like I didn't Allardyce in his early time.

[DE.]

Go back and find the post where I wanted Sam gone... I do know someone who wanted him gone and said so quite clearly...over to you Jim, October 2010, your u turns are legendary

Lol. Love it when people jump on the bandwagon. We all make mistakes but I never wanted Sam gone nor was I 'anti hoofball' if anything these last two years have highlighted more what a great job Sam did.

Yeah, you're full of compliments for Sam in the following thread you created: http://www.brfcs.com/mb/index.php/topic/24454-sam-allardyce-messiah-or-simply-a-good-manager/ . You summed up your position by saying:

Sam did a good job of keeping us up, but give it another 2 years of purchasing duds and we would be at the beginning of Hughes' reign and that dire squad.

Which doesn't scream "great job" to me, but if you've changed your mind then fair enough.

I had to go back and check some old threads recently for an article I'm writing and trust me Imy, you wouldn't want Jim or anybody else going back to older threads because some of your comments are beyond embarrassing. Nobody is jumping on a bandwagon, people just remember the many ridiculous comments you've made over the years.

[LeChuck]

1. I said entertaining for me and said I can see that others found entertainment in it. And since I am speaking only of my opinions and what I would have preferred it makes sense for me to speak as I am doing.

But this is one scenario where your opinion can be wrong. Like if someone had a taste of two fizzy drinks, one from a Coca-Cola and one from a Tesco Value bottle, and swore the Coca-Cola was much nicer, when in actual fact they were the same drink and they'd been influenced by the packaging. Most people would swear the drinks tasted differently if put in that situation. Their opinion would be factually incorrect, even though they believed they experienced a difference.

Same with Allardyce and Rovers. Your view of the games is obviously tainted by packaging (in this case, the name of the manager) because some of the games and performances were no less enjoyable than those under previous managers. You're telling me the football on offer in the 3-2 game against Burnley wasn't enjoyable?

To be fair you're not alone. Many people can't get past pre-conceived ideas when observing a football match. Still doesn't stop it being bollcocks though.

[DE.]

But this is one scenario where your opinion can be wrong. Like if someone had a taste of two fizzy drinks, one from a Coca-Cola and one from a Tesco Value bottle, and swore the Coca-Cola was much nicer, when in actual fact they were the same drink and they'd been influenced by the packaging. Most people would swear the drinks tasted differently if put in that situation. Their opinion would be factually incorrect, even though they believed they experienced a difference.

Same with Allardyce and Rovers. Your view of the games is obviously tainted by packaging (in this case, the name of the manager) because some of the games and performances were no less enjoyable than those under previous managers. You're telling me the football on offer in the 3-2 game against Burnley wasn't enjoyable?

To be fair you're not alone. Many people can't get past pre-conceived ideas when observing a football match. Still doesn't stop it being bollcocks though.

Good post LeChuck. I hate the idea that many people seem to have that an opinion is infallible simple because it is an opinion, and therefore doesn't merit any criticism.

[Plastics]

But this is one scenario where your opinion can be wrong. Like if someone had a taste of two fizzy drinks, one from a Coca-Cola and one from a Tesco Value bottle, and swore the Coca-Cola was much nicer, when in actual fact they were the same drink and they'd been influenced by the packaging. Most people would swear the drinks tasted differently if put in that situation. Their opinion would be factually incorrect, even though they believed they experienced a difference.

Same with Allardyce and Rovers. Your view of the games is obviously tainted by packaging (in this case, the name of the manager) because some of the games and performances were no less enjoyable than those under previous managers. You're telling me the football on offer in the 3-2 game against Burnley wasn't enjoyable?

To be fair you're not alone. Many people can't get past pre-conceived ideas when observing a football match. Still doesn't stop it being bollcocks though.

I know what I saw.

[LeChuck]

I know what I saw.

Even if stats regarding shots on goal, number of passes, number of long passes etc say that there was no difference to previous managers in some games? These stats exist, I remember looking them up when this was debated previously.

[den]

I know what I saw.

Well I'll tell you what I think Plastics.

I think the football we saw pre-sam under ince, and since sam under the last 5/6 managers has seen us play more "hoofball" than we ever did during his reign. Taking the manager before [ince] and the managers since, we've virtually been footballed to death every time we've played. How many games under these managers have we actually played the better football than our opponents? How many times have we outpassed our opponents? We can count them on one hand I reckon. So, we hoofed it under sam and the football otherwise has been much better?

I don't think you know what you saw. I don't think you know what you see now. I think you see what you want to see.

[Amo]

[Guest Norbert]

Have I wondered back into 2010? If I have, then I shall say that these Indians are going to mess everything up, and we should ignore the result against Liverpool. Kean is a snake.

There you go, now I can prove I was right all along in a few years time.

[imy9]

Yeah, you're full of compliments for Sam in the following thread you created: http://www.brfcs.com/mb/index.php/topic/24454-sam-allardyce-messiah-or-simply-a-good-manager/ . You summed up your position by saying:

Which doesn't scream "great job" to me, but if you've changed your mind then fair enough.

I had to go back and check some old threads recently for an article I'm writing and trust me Imy, you wouldn't want Jim or anybody else going back to older threads because some of your comments are beyond embarrassing. Nobody is jumping on a bandwagon, people just remember the many ridiculous comments you've made over the years.

Where did you get the quote from? I have read the first 3 pages and no sign? I remember starting the thread, key line to take would be 'good manager but no messiah'- but then someone with an agenda would not include that would they? For a laugh could you show me the beyond embarrassing posts that I have made? Certainly would liven up a dull afternoon...

[yoda]

Well I'll tell you what I think Plastics.

I think the football we saw pre-sam under ince, and since sam under the last 5/6 managers has seen us play more "hoofball" than we ever did during his reign. Taking the manager before [ince] and the managers since, we've virtually been footballed to death every time we've played. How many games under these managers have we actually played the better football than our opponents? How many times have we outpassed our opponents? We can count them on one hand I reckon. So, we hoofed it under sam and the football otherwise has been much better?

I don't think you know what you saw. I don't think you know what you see now. I think you see what you want to see.

well said den, more posters should take this character to task imo

[thenodrog]

Yeah, you're full of compliments for Sam in the following thread you created: http://www.brfcs.com/mb/index.php/topic/24454-sam-allardyce-messiah-or-simply-a-good-manager/ . You summed up your position by saying:

Which doesn't scream "great job" to me, but if you've changed your mind then fair enough.

I had to go back and check some old threads recently for an article I'm writing and trust me Imy, you wouldn't want Jim or anybody else going back to older threads because some of your comments are beyond embarrassing. Nobody is jumping on a bandwagon, people just remember the many ridiculous comments you've made over the years.

You are quite correct DE. After his unqualified support for Kean imy's opinions will be forever worthless in my mind. Same goes for the other goon but at least his/her guilt made him attempt to change his/her identity whilst imy just bollockks on regardless as if convinced that most people share the memory retention of an average goldfish.

[imy9]

You are quite correct DE. imy's opinions will be forever worthless in my mind.

Can't say I think much of you as a person if I'm honest, your opinion is not exactly worth much is it?

[DE.]

Where did you get the quote from? I have read the first 3 pages and no sign? I remember starting the thread, key line to take would be 'good manager but no messiah'- but then someone with an agenda would not include that would they? For a laugh could you show me the beyond embarrassing posts that I have made? Certainly would liven up a dull afternoon...

It's further on than three pages, but trust me, you said it. The whole thread is you subtly trying to suggest Allardyce wasn't a good manager, because at the time you were fawning over Steve Kean. And yes, there are quotes to back that up, but I'm not sure you really want me to dredge those up? I'm happy to leave it here, unless you insist.

[imy9]

You are quite correct DE. After his unqualified support for Kean imy's opinions will be forever worthless in my mind. Same goes for the other goon but at least his/her guilt made him attempt to change his/her identity whilst imy just bollockks on regardless as if convinced that most people share the memory retention of an average goldfish.

Kean had my support as every manager has, the owners had my support too. Giving people a chance is my basic philosophy. I didn't look at their faces and decide they were wrong uns, something you have admitted to have done?

Far too many bandwagon hoppers on the board these days which is why I hardly post, having an original thought or a having a well reasoned debate seem to be a thing of the past.

[jim mk2]

Giving people a chance is fine but when it's bleeding obvious after just a few short months they were damaging the club then it doesn't make any sense. You were still wittering on supporting them last season

[Mike E]

Can't say I think much of you as a person if I'm honest, your opinion is not exactly worth much is it?

Not good news for your own opinions then

[imy9]

It's further on than three pages, but trust me, you said it. The whole thread is you subtly trying to suggest Allardyce wasn't a good manager, because at the time you were fawning over Steve Kean. And yes, there are quotes to back that up, but I'm not sure you really want me to dredge those up? I'm happy to leave it here, unless you insist.

I was having a heated debate with TGM about the phrase 'messiah' I was subtly suggesting that Sam was not a good manager by clearly stating that he was a good manager lol

Dredge up all you want, hindsight is a wonderful thing, putting things in context is also something you should consider instead of taking two lines of a post.

Giving people a chance is fine but when it's bleeding obvious after just a few short months they were damaging the club then it doesn't make any sense. You were still wittering on supporting them last season

Your u turns on Sam and JW???

My choice to give them longer, it's called having an opinion Jim, this isn't Stalin's Russia.

Anyway going off topic so going to stop there.

[thenodrog]

Kean had my support as every manager has, the owners had my support too. Giving people a chance is my basic philosophy. I didn't look at their faces and decide they were wrong uns, something you have admitted to have done?

Indeed. That method has always served me well and proved to be very accurate on any number of occasions in the past. You can put my perception down to instinct if you like. I suppose some have it and some haven't.

[T.J.Newton]

I think Appleton wants us to play more the Mark Hughes way(high energy, contain the opposition, direct passing) but the lack of quality in the team means they just resort to what looks more like Allardyce's'style',( solid defence, kickNhope).

Indeed. That method has always served me well and proved to be very accurate on any number of occasions in the past. You can put my perception down to instinct if you like. I suppose some have it and some haven't.

put up a picture of your're mush then and let us judge you on what we see .

[jim mk2]

I think Appleton wants us to play more the Mark Hughes way(high energy, contain the opposition, direct passing) but the lack of quality in the team means they just resort to what looks more like Allardyce's'style',( solid defence, kickNhope).

Ere we go again....another dunce from the back of the class.

[Mike E]

Ere we go again....another dunce from the back of the class.

Pray tell us how you know otherwise?

[DE.]

I was having a heated debate with TGM about the phrase 'messiah' I was subtly suggesting that Sam was not a good manager by clearly stating that he was a good manager lol

Dredge up all you want, hindsight is a wonderful thing, putting things in context is also something you should consider instead of taking two lines of a post.

It's nothing to do with hindsight, you're just devious in the way you post. You say one thing but mean another. I don't really like it. In most situations I say exactly what I think and believe and by extension I expect people to do the same. I don't think you do.

You often claimed you "liked" Allardyce as a manager, and apparently still do, but were the first to bash him specifically for his transfer dealings, whilst very quickly pointing out how much better Souness and Hughes were. If you do like Allardyce as you claim then apparently your idea of a good manager is someone whose signings would ultimately put the club in a "dire" situation, as stated in your own words. Seems strange to me, but it's your opinion and you are of course entitled to it.

Anyway, a few quotes from the good old Steve Kean thread http://www.brfcs.com/mb/index.php/topic/24308-steve-kean/page-1 you're actually not too bad until we achieve survival at the end of the 10/11 season, then suddenly...

Steve Kean you took over our team mid-season, a difficult time to take over especially under the circumstances.

A team that was 5 points above the relegation zone after 17 games and ended the season 4 points ahead of the drop zone. End of season report? 6.5/ 10- could/should do better.

The team has been inconsistent but when a number of fans were against you and the press have been against you, you have remained dignified and proven in the last 4 games especially that you should not have been sacked after the Fulham game.

I'll be fair here and say you claim you'd fire Kean if you had your way. However you then go on to post...

Are you confident we will stay up next season with Kean?

YES

Do you think Kean has the confidence and respect of the majority of the current squad?

YES

Are you happy with Keans relationship with the owners?

Dont much about it except he goes there for monthly discussions.

Do you think Kean will attract or select players that are quality players or have commitment to the club?

Money talks- if he can get Jones, Samba, Nelsen, Salgado etc to sign extensions then why not others, they will either sign on because of him or the money.

Has he made a substitution that has affected the game yet?

I am sure there have been subs that have made an impact, MGP had a decent 10 minute spell vs Bolton recently.

Have our tactics been much different than Allardyces?

Very different, his major saving grace- we look to play with width- pace and power, with a pre season could be exciting next year.

If you were a fan of a club in a simialar position as us would you want us to continue with Kean or employ a more experienced better quality man?

Probably continue with Kean, I would like an experienced manager.

The answers are yours replying to Plastic Head btw.

Define luck? We got 43 points and were 4 points ahead of the drop zone. There are at least FOUR games that I can think of where referees decisions have cost us badly, so yes we have had luck... bad luck otherwise we would have had a similar tally to last year- but has Kean moaned about it? Dignified throughout. This hoofball you talk about, the way that we played football has fundamentally changed, nothing wrong with goals coming from a long ball as long as that is not your ONLY option.

I have learnt a lot about Kean over the last couple of months and it has been mostly positive. He has changed the shape, tactics etc and made us a difficult team to beat again and I am genuinel excited about next season to see how OUR young players are going to develop. You said it was very very difficult to beat Wolves- we beat them playing in the first half some fantastic football. So what I have learnt Den is that Kean is resiliant, is willing to change and the players are clearly behind him- all positives for next season

The above is probably my favourite quote from you during this period. Nothing to do with hindsight, just a ridiculous opinion that couldn't possibly be shared with anybody that had a working set of eyes and a functional brain.

Anyway, this is a thread about Michael Appleton rather than you so enough. I hope rereading these quotes brightened your dull afternoon.