[Archived] Centre Back Pairings Under Bowyer

[Rover_Shaun]

I prefer eyes! My eyes tell me the centre back pairing is a sight better than 12 months ago.

30/9/2104 - Rotherham 2 Blackburn 0 - Performance in Rotherham loss not acceptable says Gary Bowyer

Rovers boss Bowyer said: “We gifted them two goals and it was not unacceptable.

Match report - And no surprise, either, that their goal came from a set-piece, as right from the first whistle Rovers found it difficult to deal with corners, free kicks and throw-ins into their box..........Rotherham simply wanted it more.

Rovers: Steele, Marshall, Hanley, Duffy, Olsson, Taylor, Evans, Tunnicliffe, Conway, Rhodes, Gestede. Subs: Eastwood, Henley, Kilgallon, King, Varney, Williamson, Songo’o.

[JBiz]

Excuse me if I'm missing your point Shaun I'm but talking about the few games I've seen at Ewood and on rovers player this season, not the horror show I watched in Rotherham last season.

[Rover_Shaun]

I won't back you up then in future

[JBiz]

That would be all well and good, Joe. If we were winning games, if we were tight at the back, if we were keeping clean sheets, if his captaincy brought organisation and assurance instead of panic and lots of shouting and finger pointing.

How many have we conceded this season so far?

I won't back you up then in future

Ah, hence why I didn't get it

[Stuart]

How many have we conceded this season so far?

Too many. Against poor opposition.

[Rover_Shaun]

Last season 1st 5 games

W2 D1 L2 F8 A10 Pts 7 from 15

This season 1st 5 games

W0 D3 L2 F3 A5 Pts 3 from 15

Roughly half the points, half the goals scored but half the goals conceded though

To catch the class of 2014/15 up after 10 games, and just to stand still in terms of improvement, we need to win 3 and draw 2 of the next 5. And that was including getting mullered at Rotherham last season

[joey_big_nose]

To be fair I thought Bowyer was making a real pigs ear choosing Duffy and Hanley over Killer since the start of the season. But they have both been v good, better than anything from last year. Well done Gaz, and well done Shane and Grant.

However that the pair of them and Conway are the only players performing well is not so good,also if we have injuries at the back we seriously lack replacements...

[grizfoot]

To be fair I thought Bowyer was making a real pigs ear choosing Duffy and Hanley over Killer since the start of the season. But they have both been v good, better than anything from last year. Well done Gaz, and well done Shane and Grant.

However that the pair of them and Conway are the only players performing well is not so good,also if we have injuries at the back we seriously lack replacements...

I was of the exact same opinion at the beginning of the season as well. I however do rate Hanley and when he's on-form he's the best defender at the club in my opinion but do understand the criticism he came under last season because he was woeful at times. Think back to part of the 2013/14 season and I thought he was terrific alongside Dann at times.

The stats in this topics are interesting for example we only concede slightly less goals per game with Hanley/Duffy (1.24 per game) than with Hanley/Kilgallon (1.28 per game) yet the points per game stats are considerably better for Hanley/Kilgallon (1.64 pts per game) against Hanley/Duffy (1.06pts per game).

You could look at the situation two ways, criticise Bowyer for not dropping Hanley or Duffy if you believe Kilgallon to be the better defender, there is evidence to suggest that in the stats. Or alternatively you could say a manager should stick by who he believes to be his best players and make up his best team. This season in my opinion Hanley/Duffy have looked considerably better than they did at any point last season. Hopefully Bowyer will reap the rewards for sticking by these two players. With the lack of any signings at centreback it looks as if he's been prepared to put his faith in these two as our first choice centreback pairing.

I know it's been suggested before but the stats do suggest we should sign Henry, play him alongside Kilgallon and we'll go the rest of the season unbeaten.

[A cup of beans]

Hanley and Duffy have improved on last year, I'll given them (and possibly Craig Short) credit.

However, how good are they in comparative terms? I'd much prefer Kilgallon, a leader who can read danger, with either of the 2 of them.

Even though I was impressed with Henry's brief cameo last season (and I hope we get him back), I'd like an experience CB brought in.

Also, bring back Ollson. His pace is much needed, to cover and relieve pressure.

[mustard]

30/9/2104 - Rotherham 2 Blackburn 0 - Performance in Rotherham loss not acceptable says Gary Bowyer

Rovers: Steele, Marshall, Hanley, Duffy, Olsson, Taylor, Evans, Tunnicliffe, Conway, Rhodes, Gestede. Subs: Eastwood, Henley, Kilgallon, King, Varney, Williamson, Songo’o.

Reading the top comments, it appears the views on Bowyer were the exact same then and now. When you read the criticisms, you'll see they mirror the faults we see today. The man hasn't learnt a thing.

[tomphil]

Most of the faults are still the same as we complained about in the first half of his first full season in charge. Two defensive mids all the time, sit deep and don't press every game, long useless balls at Rhodes, predictable subs etc etc. He got away with it mostly because it was put down to inexperience, quite rightly. Then he did what his strength is and got in Rudy, Conway also Evans and Marshall came back and we finished well.

we thought we'd turned a corner but infact it was just glossing over the normal bowyer stuff from the first half of that season as we've seen ever since. Things are made far more difficult now because of the loss of Rudy & ffp, both feasible reasons but shouldn't be used as excuses. God knows how many players in since first half of that season yet we still see the same old thing as despite the odd foray into other formations he's only really capable of turning out one style of play. That will never change.

[Rover_Shaun]

The LET are really bigging up the two centre backs recently. You'd think we had 13 points from 15 with a plus goal difference and not 3 points from 15 with a minus goal difference.

I wonder how hysterical they'll get if they put in great performances?

[JBiz]

If you went you wouldn't have to read about it in the only paper in the world that doesn't have an editor

[Amo]

Killa did nothing to warrant being dropped, while Hanley & Duffy are an accident waiting to happen. They're both 23, though, so gotta think of that resale value.

[onlyonejackwalker]

If you went you wouldn't have to read about it in the only paper in the world that doesn't have an editor

Personally I struggle to criticise any of the missing thousands from not going. Why should they? Bad habit? Disrespect your customer base, reduce quality and downsize your product offering and I guarantee customers will leave in droves. It's not a football thing. Simply common sense.

[Rover_Shaun]

It has nothing to do with what's on offer O1JW. I'd still be punishing myself if it was an ordinary situation but the problem in question is intrinsically linked

[chris_h]

Personally I struggle to criticise any of the missing thousands from not going. Why should they? Bad habit? Disrespect your customer base, reduce quality and downsize your product offering and I guarantee customers will leave in droves. It's not a football thing. Simply common sense.

Those who no longer attend do so as a matter of choice and that is up to them. Likewise, if they do so as a protest against the ownership that too is fair enough. However, when those stayaways are all over this forum preaching to those who go about how it is, well it beggars belief.

[OJRovers]

30/9/2104 - Rotherham 2 Blackburn 0 - Performance in Rotherham loss not acceptable says Gary Bowyer

Rovers: Steele, Marshall, Hanley, Duffy, Olsson, Taylor, Evans, Tunnicliffe, Conway, Rhodes, Gestede. Subs: Eastwood, Henley, Kilgallon, King, Varney, Williamson, Songo’o.

That Rotherham team sums up Bowyer well. Players out of postion. No pace. King, Henley and Killa on the bench. Crazy result, shoud've been sacked after that.

[chris_h]

That Rotherham team sums up Bowyer well. Players out of postion. No pace. King, Henley and Killa on the bench. Crazy result, shoud've been sacked after that.

From what I saw of us last year, the lack of pace was the most glaring problem for me. Not necessarily pace per se as both Olsson and King played in games I saw but the lack of zip in which we moved the ball. No crispness, sloppy passes barely reaching their target and a sluggish tempo.

Apparently little or nothing has changed in the new season.

[onlyonejackwalker]

Those who no longer attend do so as a matter of choice and that is up to them. Likewise, if they do so as a protest against the ownership that too is fair enough. However, when those stayaways are all over this forum preaching to those who go about how it is, well it beggars belief.

The fact they still post and follow every little piece of news simply shows the love they once held or still hold for the club.

A normal company or club would be working very hard to get these disaffected fans back on board.

We are all proper fans. The fact I didn't travel to Brighton doesn't affect that.

[chris_h]

The fact they still post and follow every little piece of news simply shows the love they once held or still hold for the club.

Quite right. That's why I check this forum first thing in the morning before I make a brew to see if there's any news.

As I can't get to games however, I restrain myself from lecturing others about the crapness or otherwise of the current team, the managers tactics or the centre half pairings.

[windymiller7]

From what I saw of us last year, the lack of pace was the most glaring problem for me. Not necessarily pace per se as both Olsson and King played in games I saw but the lack of zip in which we moved the ball. No crispness, sloppy passes barely reaching their target and a sluggish tempo.

Apparently little or nothing has changed in the new season.

Correct Chris, pace isn't necessarily about having one or two blokes who can run fast, it's about how quickly you can turn defence into attack and the quickest way is by moving the ball.

Players making space to be available for the ball, fullbacks overlapping their widemen to keep the attack momentum going, a forward who can hold the ball up (and I don't mean after it's fired at his head like an exocet missile), lay it off to a midfielder and get in to the box, whilst that ball gets moved to the wing.

It's simple attacking football but I don't think it's something that Gaz and his crew have ever seen, let alone know how to implement. Pace to Bowyer means Usain Bolt and nothing more.

Now I'm not saying it's not handy to have a few players with genuine pace, but it's not the be all and end all of fast attacking football.

[Blue blood]

Interesting this whole defense debate. Regardless of how well Hanley and Duffy are developing serious questions have to be asked about why Killa dropped. He did nothing wrong. Surely if a player performs he should be in the team. Likewise Olsson had one bad game (and none of the rest of the defense looked that hot in the game) yet is now out of the side.

Now when our best two defenders are out of the team for no, or very little reason, it's worrying. Not just for the fans, but how do you think the players feel? And not just the two dropped unreasonably.

Poor GB criticized for chopping and changing AND for sticking with players - only problem is that he does both incorrectly. Those who should be in based on good performances like Olsson and Kilgallon, and I'd warrant Barrow in that mix too, are chopped and change when playing well. However favourites such as Hanley, Lowe and Marshall all retain their places despite having long periods of poor form (admittedly Hanley's was last season.) At no club is this the right way of doing things.

To me this makes such threads so frustrating because we're not actually debating who is best, but who is best pals with Bowyer. Tactics, selections, post match comments all seem to have very little focus on getting results and much more with self-preservation and increasing squad value (for self-preservation reasons.)

I may only be 31 but even then I've seen some pretty crap football from Rovers. Souness loosing the plot at the end, that season in the championship under Kidd, the Paul Ince Wigan debacle. Now I'm sure some older posters may say it's not the dark days of... but regardless, it's been poor. Only thing is in each case you knew the primary aim was to win games. Ok, the managers had lost the plot or never had it, but you knew what the end goal was. Under K**n and now under Bowyer, the primary aim seems to be something else - self-preservation at the moment through increasing squad value.

Maybe this is the wrong place to post it. But when we're debating who our best defenders are, and it clearly won't happen for reasons that aren't to do with winning games, it makes you wonder what on earth the point is.

[tomphil]

Don't forget to add throwing the young keeper into the mix after all the fuss of buying Steele to be the new number 1.

[Leonard Venkhater]

The fact they still post and follow every little piece of news simply shows the love they once held or still hold for the club.

A normal company or club would be working very hard to get these disaffected fans back on board.

We are all proper fans. The fact I didn't travel to Brighton doesn't affect that.

Well said.These are passionate fans of BRFC that are staying away. The important questions are:

What does that mean? What is going on here? What should the owners do?