Fans Forum/Roverstore/Commercial Chat

[lraC]

50 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

I have said my part on this to you whilst 2 members of FF have said O2G isn't to blame here but yet you continue this personal witch hunt of yours. I have nothing to add to my original post on this. 

It’s not a witch hunt, it’s you calling it that not me. I just want to know, why the two sets of minutes differ so much and maybe you will also when you get round to reading them both.

[Mike E]

33 minutes ago, lraC said:

It’s not a witch hunt, it’s you calling it that not me. I just want to know, why the two sets of minutes differ so much and maybe you will also when you get round to reading them both.

This is a much better post than was originally being made, which led to my reaction.

I too would like some clarity on why the minutes differed between the three versions.

[wilsdenrover]

1 hour ago, RevidgeBlue said:

Ok but that assumes they're prepared to assume losses of tens of millions of pounds to pocket a few agent's fees.

Im not against anything that can be proven that shows wrongdoing on the part of the owners Im trying to figure out how it stacks up.

If that happened I think it comes under the envelope of Venky's being the real owners but being completely negligent and therefore the Club being ripped off, not for the first time imo. 

My thoughts were based on Venkys being the real owners and the agents taking advantage of how stupid they are.

Many other theories are available.

[RevidgeBlue]

Just now, wilsdenrover said:

My thoughts were based on Venkys being the real owners and the agents taking advantage of how stupid they are.

Many other theories are available.

Agreed.

[lraC]

1 hour ago, Mike E said:

This is a much better post than was originally being made, which led to my reaction.

I too would like some clarity on why the minutes differed between the three versions.

Fair enough. Happy to leave it at that, until O2G has had the time to respond and given us the clarity, you, I and others, request. 

[lraC]

2 hours ago, RevidgeBlue said:

And "the Club" poorer.

Just thinking Ira's theory through - hypothetically if the Club was really owned by agents then you'd have no need to transfer money outside the Club as you already own it.

However if Venky's own it but have given unscrupulous types licence to run it on their behalf then you'd need to get money out of the Club to prosper and that's one pretty decent way, to needlessly appoint yourself as agent for the Club on any sale.

IF any of the above occurred you'd expect the other appointed Club officials to step in and stop it.

Just for Clarity, I post as lraC (Carl) backwards. 

[den]

10 minutes ago, lraC said:

Just for Clarity, I post as lraC (Carl) backwards. 

why not just write it the right way round? Make it easier for some of us (me included. I didn’t realise it was Carl). 😀

[lraC]

3 minutes ago, den said:

why not just write it the right way round? Make it easier for some of us (me included. I didn’t realise it was Carl). 😀

Sorry Ned. 😂

[SuperBrfc]

3 hours ago, RevidgeBlue said:

Im going to "do a chaddy" on this one if you dont mind and refrain from ploughing through those.

It still seems odd to me that any Club would need to employ an agent when selling a player. Surely the CEO/Club Secretary etc should be capable of handling it?

Is it standard practice within the game do we know?

No worries, Rev. I've put the link there so that anybody who has some free time and wants to check it out for themselves can take a look.

I didn't know it was a thing either, but the documents clearly show many agents listed as representing the 'former club' (selling club) in transactions across the game. It appears to be normal practice, but I don't think it occurs in every sale.

I want to know how it comes about, how does an agent get that particular role. Do they offer their services or are they chosen by senior people within clubs?

What has emerged to me from studying these documents and looking at various other things over the last 15 years is a clear pattern. The pattern has been there from the start but took a sharp rise in 2015, oddly enough. I can't think what happened in 2015.

I made two predictions based on that pattern a few months back and told the forum: Karanka is next in and keep an eye out for six clubs.

A week after my first prediction...a friendly hack has Karanka down as the leading candidate, which the club denied. An agent trying to get Karanka (former Boro, former Birmingham) the gig? I think so.

As for the second call...just look at this summer. Who wants ex Sunderland, currently out in India, as the new CEO? That's the first piece of speculation I saw this summer.

Press rumours are press rumours I guess and people might say 'just paper talk' etc but again, there are a lot of coincidences that keep on happening.

Edited 17 hours ago by SuperBrfc

[47er]

4 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

Yet again both Glen Mullan and K-hod have said he isn't at fault yet you continue this personal witch hunt of a very good person in O2G and someone who has been doing the minutes for a very long time for the fans forum. 

Haven't got around to reading them for a range of reasons. Is there a timeline that the minutes must be read by? Must have that one 😁

I know where the minutes are the Rovers website thanks Hasta, don't need a link, I am more than capable of reading them when I can. 

where did I said I have no interested in the reading the minutes? making shit again RF99!!!!!!!!

I will read the minutes when I get the proper chance to sit down and read them. Is that actually ok or are you going to try to force me to read them by yours and other people deadline? Its quite funny and interesting how many of you lot are on your high horses over these minutes. 

In all your years of evasion that post tops the lot.

[47er]

1 hour ago, den said:

why not just write it the right way round? Make it easier for some of us (me included. I didn’t realise it was Carl). 😀

I thought he must be Middle Eastern!

[SuperBrfc]

4 hours ago, RevidgeBlue said:

And "the Club" poorer.

Just thinking Ira's theory through - hypothetically if the Club was really owned by agents then you'd have no need to transfer money outside the Club as you already own it.

However if Venky's own it but have given unscrupulous types licence to run it on their behalf then you'd need to get money out of the Club to prosper and that's one pretty decent way, to needlessly appoint yourself as agent for the Club on any sale.

IF any of the above occurred you'd expect the other appointed Club officials to step in and stop it.

Your last line reminds me of something Alan Myers said in a fantastic interview I heard him take part in. Myers said he once chased an agent out of the building when at Rovers and the MD at the time told him 'it's probably not a good idea if we throw agents out'. It's not related to the theme of your post, but at one time we did have an official who was ready to throw agents out if needed.

That story can be heard at 2:21:25 below:

 

He starts talking about Rovers from 1:58:25 and spends a good 20 minutes or so talking about his time at the club. Really good listen. He speaks fondly about the fans and the staff. Says we are his second club and that we have all been through so much and that he wants to see us back in the Premier League. Also states that the staff were doing the jobs of five people (no change there then?)

At around 2:09:55 he talks about how things were going well, we had a 40 goal striker partnership, then suddenly there were financial issues.

For anybody who hasn't got time to watch it, the follow on to the above is the golden quote from Alan (up until 2:10:40):

"Suddenly there were financial issues and I didn't like the way it was going there...I could see relegation coming...I'm no football professional but I could feel things weren't right...so I resigned, because I'm principled, it's silly and it costs money, but if something's not right you've got to say it, I can't go in and steal a living by just going through the motions".

Alan was talking about 2014/15 with that quote. The same thing applies today in 2025! WTF is going on here? 10/11 years on from the time Alan is taking about and still the same issues persist. Why? Financial issues, cheap punts, relegation vibes. This is all being discussed today as present concerns. We can see where it is heading, just like Myers could back then. Billionaire owners? Piss off. FFP? Piss off. Indian Court case? Piss off.

Top man is Alan Myers. One of the real, genuine good guys that turned up here during this 15 year debacle. I'd love to have him back at Rovers under new ownership and a new Board. A proper professional who wants the club to succeed. It was Alan who was responsible for getting the historic timeline put up around the ground. He states this in the video. He wanted the fans to feel connected to the club again. He gets it. Then we saw what happened with the timelines discarded not long after. Night and day, is the difference between real operators and absolute charlatans.

[lraC]

7 hours ago, SuperBrfc said:

No worries, Rev. I've put the link there so that anybody who has some free time and wants to check it out for themselves can take a look.

I didn't know it was a thing either, but the documents clearly show many agents listed as representing the 'former club' (selling club) in transactions across the game. It appears to be normal practice, but I don't think it occurs in every sale.

I want to know how it comes about, how does an agent get that particular role. Do they offer their services or are they chosen by senior people within clubs?

What has emerged to me from studying these documents and looking at various other things over the last 15 years is a clear pattern. The pattern has been there from the start but took a sharp rise in 2015, oddly enough. I can't think what happened in 2015.

I made two predictions based on that pattern a few months back and told the forum: Karanka is next in and keep an eye out for six clubs.

A week after my first prediction...a friendly hack has Karanka down as the leading candidate, which the club denied. An agent trying to get Karanka (former Boro, former Birmingham) the gig? I think so.

As for the second call...just look at this summer. Who wants ex Sunderland, currently out in India, as the new CEO? That's the first piece of speculation I saw this summer.

Press rumours are press rumours I guess and people might say 'just paper talk' etc but again, there are a lot of coincidences that keep on happening.

Despite it not being necessary to use the services of an agent, as the selling club, Rovers appear to choose to do so. Given that we appear to be cutting back and saving, in almost every other area, I have to question, why they want to spend money on agents, when it can be avoided?

Perhaps there is a logical explanation, but yet again, it appears that Agents are benefiting, when perhaps they shouldn’t be. 

[Waggy76]

The Blackburn deal doesn't sound right, and it doesn't look right," said Whelan, who discussed the takeover with the Rovers directors on Saturday, when the clubs met at Ewood Park. "It is an absolute shame. The trustees want the club to be safe but it doesn't seem to be safe."

[...]

8 hours ago, SuperBrfc said:

Your last line reminds me of something Alan Myers said in a fantastic interview I heard him take part in. Myers said he once chased an agent out of the building when at Rovers and the MD at the time told him 'it's probably not a good idea if we throw agents out'. It's not related to the theme of your post, but at one time we did have an official who was ready to throw agents out if needed.

That story can be heard at 2:21:25 below:

 

He starts talking about Rovers from 1:58:25 and spends a good 20 minutes or so talking about his time at the club. Really good listen. He speaks fondly about the fans and the staff. Says we are his second club and that we have all been through so much and that he wants to see us back in the Premier League. Also states that the staff were doing the jobs of five people (no change there then?)

At around 2:09:55 he talks about how things were going well, we had a 40 goal striker partnership, then suddenly there were financial issues.

For anybody who hasn't got time to watch it, the follow on to the above is the golden quote from Alan (up until 2:10:40):

"Suddenly there were financial issues and I didn't like the way it was going there...I could see relegation coming...I'm no football professional but I could feel things weren't right...so I resigned, because I'm principled, it's silly and it costs money, but if something's not right you've got to say it, I can't go in and steal a living by just going through the motions".

Alan was talking about 2014/15 with that quote. The same thing applies today in 2025! WTF is going on here? 10/11 years on from the time Alan is taking about and still the same issues persist. Why? Financial issues, cheap punts, relegation vibes. This is all being discussed today as present concerns. We can see where it is heading, just like Myers could back then. Billionaire owners? Piss off. FFP? Piss off. Indian Court case? Piss off.

Top man is Alan Myers. One of the real, genuine good guys that turned up here during this 15 year debacle. I'd love to have him back at Rovers under new ownership and a new Board. A proper professional who wants the club to succeed. It was Alan who was responsible for getting the historic timeline put up around the ground. He states this in the video. He wanted the fans to feel connected to the club again. He gets it. Then we saw what happened with the timelines discarded not long after. Night and day, is the difference between real operators and absolute charlatans.

One of few that had his head screwed on the right way good for him resigning and as said not just going through the motions and taking a wage. THATS how you love a club

[Tomphil2]

Again the suspicion of agent(s) representing the club is something iv'e banged on about for years.

If you have a third party who has some sort of agreement to be involved in ALL incomings and goings at this club since 2010 then even at a tiny % just imagine how much money that has earned in the last 15 years.

It's something i believe has happened here but that's just my opinion but there are pointers and we know the same lot seem to recruit the managers/head coaches/CEO's etc. 

I also believe this has been tried to be navigated around at certain times by certain different regimes in the club and it's what leads to infighting, power struggles and very odd transfer breakdowns.

[lraC]

On 09/08/2025 at 07:34, philipl said:

If minutes are being substantially altered and not a mere correction of error of fact (and noted as such) it means:

1) There is something in there which is so consequential the person making the alterations thinks it is less damaging to make the changes than to have everybody who attended know that there is something fishy going on/ there is an attempt to manipulate/somebody is in a desperate blind panic

2) It calls the integrity of the whole meeting and meeting records into question

This was a large semi-public gathering and the storm which has resulted is entirely predictable.

What I am reading into this is SS went into the meeting under prepared and over confident and was answering on the fly without considering consequences and certainly without any strategy. Rovers are any extremely public and public-facing organisation and what transpired was a commercial and public relations disaster for the Rovers management and ownership. 

Some people haven’t read them yet, but for those who have, I think they would have to fully agree with your comments. 

[lraC]

2 minutes ago, Tomphil2 said:

Again the suspicion of agent(s) representing the club is something iv'e banged on about for years.

If you have a third party who has some sort of agreement to be involved in ALL incomings and goings at this club since 2010 then even at a tiny % just imagine how much money that has earned in the last 15 years.

It's something i believe has happened here but that's just my opinion but there are pointers and we know the same lot seem to recruit the managers/head coaches/CEO's etc. 

I also believe this has been tried to be navigated around at certain times by certain different regimes in the club and it's what leads to infighting, power struggles and very odd transfer breakdowns.

This is exactly why my suspicions are that agents could well be de facto owners. 

[Tomphil2]

3 minutes ago, lraC said:

This is exactly why my suspicions are that agents could well be de facto owners. 

Well we know they had more influence here than was even legally allowed within football and imo it never went away it just got buried from view.

Going nowhere in the Championship is handy for that.

If i had to stake my last quid on it just my personal opinion i'd say they stitched it up with an impossible to break legal bind right at the beginning OR possibly tipped up a stake towards the purchase, maybe both.

All agreed offshore obviously so in effect someone could be a hidden significant stakeholder, that word we often hear here.

Come to think of it remember Keans contract drawn up by himself and JA where had written in extra bonus payments for seemingly nothing, almost like a dividend payment or something ?

If every manager/player or whatever has that kind of thing written into their contracts to various degrees by the clubs representative then that's how you get your money out without too much questing because it never shows up it's just on the overall wage bill.

Not millions just ten grand here, five grand there. So many players seeing out their contracts now, someone is advising them and it is to some benefit to do so, it must be.

Loyalty bonuses written in is my guess, by who though.

[lraC]

51 minutes ago, Tomphil2 said:

Well we know they had more influence here than was even legally allowed within football and imo it never went away it just got buried from view.

Going nowhere in the Championship is handy for that.

If i had to stake my last quid on it just my personal opinion i'd say they stitched it up with an impossible to break legal bind right at the beginning OR possibly tipped up a stake towards the purchase, maybe both.

All agreed offshore obviously so in effect someone could be a hidden significant stakeholder, that word we often hear here.

Come to think of it remember Keans contract drawn up by himself and JA where had written in extra bonus payments for seemingly nothing, almost like a dividend payment or something ?

If every manager/player or whatever has that kind of thing written into their contracts to various degrees by the clubs representative then that's how you get your money out without too much questing because it never shows up it's just on the overall wage bill.

Not millions just ten grand here, five grand there. So many players seeing out their contracts now, someone is advising them and it is to some benefit to do so, it must be.

Loyalty bonuses written in is my guess, by who though.

You think along similar lines to me and that is my view on why they keep on insisting the club is not for sale and batting away anyone, who asks if they would consider selling

Look at the proposal made by the two Ian's all those years ago and how much money and grief that would have saved them, yet is was dismissed out of hand.

 

[JHRover]

1 hour ago, Tomphil2 said:

Again the suspicion of agent(s) representing the club is something iv'e banged on about for years.

If you have a third party who has some sort of agreement to be involved in ALL incomings and goings at this club since 2010 then even at a tiny % just imagine how much money that has earned in the last 15 years.

It's something i believe has happened here but that's just my opinion but there are pointers and we know the same lot seem to recruit the managers/head coaches/CEO's etc. 

I also believe this has been tried to be navigated around at certain times by certain different regimes in the club and it's what leads to infighting, power struggles and very odd transfer breakdowns.

This is the sort of thing that would make a lot of sense with the 'admin errors' and last minute collapses in transfers into which an enormous amount of time and work had been invested by some.

Deals that certain people along the chain weren't happy with and scuppered. 

[JHRover]

There are similarities in the situation at Rovers and those at Sheffield Wednesday and until recently Reading. We seem to operate in similar ways to them.

I suspect all three have operated on a similar basis and have been run in a similar fashion over the years. 

All three taken over by random Asian conglomerates. Big question marks on why, big question marks on third party involvement. Big question marks on why they don't sell despite none of them getting any benefit out of continuing to own struggling 2nd division clubs. 

All sorts of issues along the way with huge losses every year, FFP problems, embargos, in some cases points deductions, short term borrowing, high turnovers in staff and players. 

Almost as though all three were basically figureheads to sit abroad, pay the bills, reap the benefits whilst others dealt with the recruitment/management side of things in their absence. 

I call it the 'Lucas Joao connection' but more to it than just a player appearing for all three IMO.

[roverblue]

Could the agent involvement be an explanation for our ridiculous wage costs after years of slashing players? Or would this be shown in a different area on the accounts?

[Tomphil2]

5 minutes ago, JHRover said:

There are similarities in the situation at Rovers and those at Sheffield Wednesday and until recently Reading. We seem to operate in similar ways to them.

I suspect all three have operated on a similar basis and have been run in a similar fashion over the years. 

All three taken over by random Asian conglomerates. Big question marks on why, big question marks on third party involvement. Big question marks on why they don't sell despite none of them getting any benefit out of continuing to own struggling 2nd division clubs. 

All sorts of issues along the way with huge losses every year, FFP problems, embargos, in some cases points deductions, short term borrowing, high turnovers in staff and players. 

Almost as though all three were basically figureheads to sit abroad, pay the bills, reap the benefits whilst others dealt with the recruitment/management side of things in their absence. 

I call it the 'Lucas Joao connection' but more to it than just a player appearing for all three IMO.

Agreed and the one thing that sets Rovers apart from those was the fact V's had a better line of liquidity due to their successful operation in India.

It's only that money flowing through the pipes that has kept this club from a complete disaster of their and their friends making but why would you keep on doing it unless you either have no choice or there are benefits somewhere along the chain and all is not as it seems.

However the Indian govts involvement - If it's actually genuine and not another smoke and mirrors job - now threatens to eventually send us the way of those other clubs.

Because the only thing that's kept it going the last couple of years is player sales liquidity and that is almost at an end.

[lraC]

2 hours ago, roverblue said:

Could the agent involvement be an explanation for our ridiculous wage costs after years of slashing players? Or would this be shown in a different area on the accounts?

I don't know where it would show, but there is something highly suspicious about the wage bill, that never drops, despite the players seemingly being signed on lower wages. 

That again, cements my thoughts about the reason they do not want to entertain a sale, as the prospective buyers would see the payroll and maybe people on there would raise a few eyebrows.