Venky’s (& Suhail) Out Protest Ideas

[RevidgeBlue]

Think there's far too much hand wringing and worrying going on about whether or not a boycott will be a major success.

We won't know until it's tried but for me if we do nothing the Club dies.

If the take up isn't as good as hoped, never mind, move onto something else and/or try again when conditions are different and take up might be more favourable.

At the very least organising a boycott brings the issues firmly into the public domain even if initially take up isnt as high as hoped.

[Herbie6590]

The biggest issue Rovers fans face in "selling the protest" is Venky's haven't yet failed to pay a bill. There's nothing anyone in authority can do to address owners with no ambition, no empathy, no drive... just so long as they keep paying the bills.

Once staff/players aren't paid, HMRC issues winding up orders, local businesses' bills aren't paid, THEN you get real traction from other clubs & most importantly the media. 

As things stand we are caught in a cleft stick - we recognise the direction of travel but unless & until it results in breaches of regulations/legislation we risk coming across as entitled & consequently will struggle to win hearts & minds of the neutral IMO. 

[RevidgeBlue]

2 minutes ago, Herbie6590 said:

The biggest issue Rovers fans face in "selling the protest" is Venky's haven't yet failed to pay a bill. There's nothing anyone in authority can do to address owners with no ambition, no empathy, no drive... just so long as they keep paying the bills.

Once staff/players aren't paid, HMRC issues winding up orders, local businesses' bills aren't paid, THEN you get real traction from other clubs & most importantly the media. 

As things stand we are caught in a cleft stick - we recognise the direction of travel but unless & until it results in breaches of regulations/legislation we risk coming across as entitled & consequently will struggle to win hearts & minds of the neutral IMO. 

Is it not better though to try and make headway BEFORE we get to the stage where bills aren't paid etc?

[Mattyblue]

Not just the hearts and minds of neutrals, a lot of our own fans too. The long term anti-Chansiri crew only got the rest on board once the wages stopped being paid.

[Herbie6590]

10 minutes ago, RevidgeBlue said:

Is it not better though to try and make headway BEFORE we get to the stage where bills aren't paid etc?

Yes...but as I say, we shouldn't beat ourselves up for lack of traction external to (parts of) our fanbase...

[RevidgeBlue]

1 minute ago, Herbie6590 said:

Yes...but as I say, we shouldn't beat ourselves up for lack of traction external to the fanbase...

Or even within it (initially).

[BlackburnEnd75]

25 minutes ago, RevidgeBlue said:

Think there's far too much hand wringing and worrying going on about whether or not a boycott will be a major success.

We won't know until it's tried but for me if we do nothing the Club dies.

If the take up isn't as good as hoped, never mind, move onto something else and/or try again when conditions are different and take up might be more favourable.

At the very least organising a boycott brings the issues firmly into the public domain even if initially take up isnt as high as hoped.

I agree. Its come to the point where something more drastic has to be attempted. 

[Dreams of 1995]

27 minutes ago, Herbie6590 said:

The biggest issue Rovers fans face in "selling the protest" is Venky's haven't yet failed to pay a bill. There's nothing anyone in authority can do to address owners with no ambition, no empathy, no drive... just so long as they keep paying the bills.

Once staff/players aren't paid, HMRC issues winding up orders, local businesses' bills aren't paid, THEN you get real traction from other clubs & most importantly the media. 

As things stand we are caught in a cleft stick - we recognise the direction of travel but unless & until it results in breaches of regulations/legislation we risk coming across as entitled & consequently will struggle to win hearts & minds of the neutral IMO. 

I have given some ideas to a member who messaged me here but I can't repeat enough that your last point is hugely important to any form of protest movement winning.

There's a PR campaign to be had here. Open letters and calls to boycott are great but they will never really 'go viral'.

Too often the retort to protesting fans are along the lines of

1. Who will buy us?
2. £20m per year investment
3. £200m investment so far
4. We are a small club, small town, small fan base...who will buy us?

These sorts of narratives can and should be challenged on the battleground that is social media.

Since the Venkys ownership, a cursory glance of the accounts show that, based on the accounts and position of Rovers on their purchase, to where we are now, there is around a 460m implied revenue gap. That is the cost of Venky's ownership and it does not even count in the new TV deals, which I am certain in concerted efforts on here we have the ability to produce and show that 'revenue gap' being much bigger had we maintained our PL Status

This sort of simple graphic challenges the "£200m pound" lie easily, without drawn out debate and given its nature has the potential to go viral

You can run all sorts of similar campaigns. A "Uncle Jack's Legacy" campaign could feature, with the well-known quote from Madame heading a series of "before and after" photographs, data or actions which could feature everything from the general state of Ewood, the attempt to sell off Brockhall, the drainage or the demise in fan base and interest

In short I think there's a battle to win hearts and minds, to remind some supporters of what we can be as a football club instead of what folk think we should be and it needs to be social media friendly, quick, graphic and in large volume. From a single series such as the Uncle Jack's legacy you could create dozens of graphics and circulate periodically. And the wider football fanbase are insignificant - these graphics need to be targeted at Rovers fans and if they do reach others great, if not who cares

And if you keep it factual then the Club can threaten all they want but they can't do a thing. Spelling out facts online is not a crime

Edited 4 hours ago by Dreams of 1995

[BlackburnEnd75]

12 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

Not just the hearts and minds of neutrals, a lot of our own fans too. The long term anti-Chansiri crew only got the rest on board once the wages stopped being paid.

Let's get those ducks in a row now.

Relegation and a failure to pay the bills and a few will want to jump on board. The question is then, will the venkys ever let it get to that amd would they just have to put their hands deeper in their pockets? 

I also think calling a boycott now highlights and gives credence to those us of who have already taken this stance (for example me and my group since the summer). Otherwise its too easy to pass it off as shit support when in reality if you changed the ownership and made imo basic attempts to reengage with supporters you'd quite quickly get a lot back (albeit some who are out of the habit will take longer to come back).

 

[davulsukur]

Results will play a part as well.

We have some tough and also some critical fixtures between now and the Watford game:

Millwall - Tough

Middlesbrough - Tough

Sheff Wed - Critical

Wrexham - Critical

Charlton - Critical

Ipswich - Tough

Swansea - Critical

Watford - Boycott

I don't see us picking up many points across those whole set of fixtures but there could be some devastating losses in there. If we're in the bottom 3 by the time Watford come to town, we might very well get a lot of fans boycotting.

[Exiled in Toronto Mk2]

7 hours ago, Herbie6590 said:

Harry Berry nails it on Twitter

That’s more like it: a compelling fact-based argument that everyone can get behind.

[CrouchingNunhiddenCucumber]

16 hours ago, 47er said:

Only way to deal with Chaddy is to ignore him.

The amount of attention given to someone with views that are diametrically opposed to ~80% of posters on here and clearly lacks the intelligence to understand the nuances of opinion, blows my mind 

[wilsdenrover]

5 hours ago, davulsukur said:

Sorry, just to be clear, is Harry Berry saying that we're £80m in profit from transfer sales across 15 years?

Thinking about it, i'm sure I saw a stat somewhere, maybe last year that had us and Swansea (?) at the top of a chart regarding profit made from transfers over the last few years.

 

Venkys London accounts since ownership until 31st March this year reveal:

Total profit on transfers of £92,859,896

Only two years of net losses on transfers (2013-2014 and 2014-2015)

 

[Tomphil2]

26 minutes ago, Exiled in Toronto Mk2 said:

That’s more like it: a compelling fact-based argument that everyone can get behind.

At last a well respected Rovers die hard blue and white spectacle historian telling it like it really is.

That transfer 'excess' covers about 5 years at least running costs it's one big money go round on the books of the VH group and some in the middle are making money that's why it continues.

A massive borrowing facility in India secured on land and serviced by the club turnover/platey sales and the VH group, with middleman/men creaming a few million a year off, whilst it serves against a bit of tax on the companies portfolio makes more sense when you think about it.

[wilsdenrover]

1 hour ago, Dreams of 1995 said:

I have given some ideas to a member who messaged me here but I can't repeat enough that your last point is hugely important to any form of protest movement winning.

There's a PR campaign to be had here. Open letters and calls to boycott are great but they will never really 'go viral'.

Too often the retort to protesting fans are along the lines of

1. Who will buy us?
2. £20m per year investment
3. £200m investment so far
4. We are a small club, small town, small fan base...who will buy us?

These sorts of narratives can and should be challenged on the battleground that is social media.

Since the Venkys ownership, a cursory glance of the accounts show that, based on the accounts and position of Rovers on their purchase, to where we are now, there is around a 460m implied revenue gap. That is the cost of Venky's ownership and it does not even count in the new TV deals, which I am certain in concerted efforts on here we have the ability to produce and show that 'revenue gap' being much bigger had we maintained our PL Status

This sort of simple graphic challenges the "£200m pound" lie easily, without drawn out debate and given its nature has the potential to go viral

You can run all sorts of similar campaigns. A "Uncle Jack's Legacy" campaign could feature, with the well-known quote from Madame heading a series of "before and after" photographs, data or actions which could feature everything from the general state of Ewood, the attempt to sell off Brockhall, the drainage or the demise in fan base and interest

In short I think there's a battle to win hearts and minds, to remind some supporters of what we can be as a football club instead of what folk think we should be and it needs to be social media friendly, quick, graphic and in large volume. From a single series such as the Uncle Jack's legacy you could create dozens of graphics and circulate periodically. And the wider football fanbase are insignificant - these graphics need to be targeted at Rovers fans and if they do reach others great, if not who cares

And if you keep it factual then the Club can threaten all they want but they can't do a thing. Spelling out facts online is not a crime

Brighton’s first year in the PL resulted in a broadcasting revenue increase of £102.5 million.

 

[RevidgeBlue]

1 hour ago, Exiled in Toronto Mk2 said:

That’s more like it: a compelling fact-based argument that everyone can get behind.

Boiling it down to this summer's activity, we spent roughly £10m on 10 players.

Alebiosu you'd imagine you could sell for a tidy profit.

Gudjohnssen has potential for a tidy profit but not there yet imo.

Moreshita might just about get money back or a modest loss.

The rest you'd think you'd be struggling to give away.

Edit: So likely another trading loss if push came to shove but more importantly our Championship status in severe jeopardy.

 

Edited 1 hour ago by RevidgeBlue

[wilsdenrover]

2 hours ago, RevidgeBlue said:

Think there's far too much hand wringing and worrying going on about whether or not a boycott will be a major success.

We won't know until it's tried but for me if we do nothing the Club dies.

If the take up isn't as good as hoped, never mind, move onto something else and/or try again when conditions are different and take up might be more favourable.

At the very least organising a boycott brings the issues firmly into the public domain even if initially take up isnt as high as hoped.

The only time you fail is when you stop trying.

[JHRover]

14 minutes ago, RevidgeBlue said:

Boiling it down to this summer's activity, we spent roughly £10m on 10 players.

Alebiosu you'd imagine you could sell for a tidy profit.

Gudjohnssen has potential for a tidy profit but not there yet imo.

Moreshita might just about get money back or a modest loss.

The rest you'd think you'd be struggling to give away.

 

I think the club (regime) would be quite happy with that. If the profit on the top 2 can clear the cash paid out / committed to be paid out on the rest then the job is just about done, and that's before we factor in the sales from last summer covering most / all of the initial outlay and what should amount to a significant wage saving in the process.

It isn't hard to see why the chief stooge and his mates are able to tick the boxes when it comes to the Indians. So long as we can limp our way to Championship survival they will be happy, and it seems so will a large chunk of the Rovers' support base.

[Tomphil2]

If just another 20 million of that player trading excess had been used to hire a good CEO and manager and invest regularly across the team like they did with Armstrong for example we'd be in a way better place now.

Maybe the Prem or more likely with parachute money to make us competitive.

I know hindsight is a wonderful thing but how many plans, journey's, resets, projects have there been in the last decade only for them to be pulled to bits again within a season or two ?

Resulting in pay offs, wasted wages and reduced income swallowing up every spare penny and more. 

Their cack handed ignorant ambitionless way of running the club with those who've seeked for it to serve their own pockets etc has led to where we are now on and off the park.

People out there need to take in the full picture before they jump to their defence and find excuses or blame fans.

There has NEVER been a real plan other than wing it season to season even when a few well meaning managers or whatever have tried to install and work to one.

it's ALL on the owners and their minions and its finally entered the terminal phase now whether they'll acknowledge that or not.

Anybody who gets pacified again by them suddenly installing a CEO - to oversee bugger all - is a fool to be blunt.

[TheRoversGRL]

Thank you Katie for speaking to Elliott Jackson today. 

https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/comments/25708464/

[Uddersfelt Blue]

Hypothetically speaking.

Venkys decide to throw the towel in and put us up for sale but no one is interested in taking us on? What then? Do they continue to fund us or let us slip into administration which could be disastrous for employees? 
 

 

 

[Rogerb]

2 minutes ago, Uddersfelt Blue said:

Hypothetically speaking.

Venkys decide to throw the towel in and put us up for sale but no one is interested in taking us on? What then? Do they continue to fund us or let us slip into administration which could be disastrous for employees? 
 

 

 

The rumours of a toxic workplace and general churn in employees suggests it's already disastrous.

[rigger]

3 minutes ago, Uddersfelt Blue said:

Hypothetically speaking.

Venkys decide to throw the towel in and put us up for sale but no one is interested in taking us on? What then? Do they continue to fund us or let us slip into administration which could be disastrous for employees? 
 

 

 

Usually if something up for sale doesn't get sold, it is because the price is too high. If the club goes into administration, then the administrators will sell it of for the best price they can get. In the great scheme of things the employees are of little consequence to them. All hypothetical of course. 

[glen9mullan]

3 minutes ago, Uddersfelt Blue said:

Hypothetically speaking.

Venkys decide to throw the towel in and put us up for sale but no one is interested in taking us on? What then? Do they continue to fund us or let us slip into administration which could be disastrous for employees? 
 

 

 

My understanding is their cash imput is limited to £20m, not a penny more and if it can be less, those charged with running it have fullfilled the remit given to them.

The owners if they could shift it (i.e a buyer rolls in to ewood with proof of funds to both buy and sustain the club) they'd sell without hesitation. Will they actively state "its for sale" absolutely not, but the reality is, every club is for sale.

 

[...]

Just yhink we need to be in the loop with the next thing.

what happens agter Watford? Is this now continual until change?